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Old
02-01-2011, 01:30 PM
  #126
JustinCider
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3 years ago, I thought this guy was going to be our energy/pest guy, but it doesn't look like he has it in him to do that job. Good luck Zach, I hope you can find your game where ever you end up.

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02-01-2011, 01:31 PM
  #127
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Originally Posted by Replacement View Post
What stats would he be horrible at? He's holding his own in +/-, isn't getting scored against, is leading the club in hits/game, many of them damned good hits.
He's even popped in a few goals and has had his nose around the net for greasy goals. On some shifts he's now even been giving the Penner screen assignment.

I know you don't like the player but he's playing well this year. The only stats you could cite are some of the weirder ones like Relative Corsi and the like. In any of the actual counting numbers JFJ is doing well.
I'm going to wager a guess he means 136 GP, 8G, 7A, -32

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02-01-2011, 01:31 PM
  #128
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I'll agree there, but what percentage of those fights served any purpose? Most were just the staged style.
Far fewer staged than most 'heavyweights' out there. It wouldn't surprise me if he was top 3 in majors the last 4 years in the league. The problem with our big heavyweight, just like our last true heavyweight is that the other team will be kicking the crap out of our team and so he'll fight Parros. MacIntyre isn't going to to go after the lesser weasels that other teams have that do the real damage.

As I said before this team has gone from soft to melted ice cream soft.

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02-01-2011, 01:32 PM
  #129
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Originally Posted by Beerfish View Post
No problem, applaud like a trained seal after Hall, EBerle, Omark, Petry gets their heads driven through the boards because we have no one at all that will even answer the bell. ***** all you want about him but he got involved, stirred things up and was often the center of attention when he was on the ice, good or bad.

Softest team in the league, gets softer. Good for teams like Calgary, Vancouver and Minny who love to abuse our players.
i think the skill guys will get hit less now, before if you cranked one of them you got to kick stortinis ass as well so you looked double cool to your coach,

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02-01-2011, 01:33 PM
  #130
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Originally Posted by Tillain View Post
I'm going to wager a guess he means 136 GP, 8G, 7A, -32
come on man, he hugged other teams d listers so hall doesnt have to

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Old
02-01-2011, 01:35 PM
  #131
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Originally Posted by Tillain View Post
I'm going to wager a guess he means 136 GP, 8G, 7A, -32
Is there a reason we'd be looking at an older sample instead of what is happening this season?

I say this because Fraser has been helpful to JFJ's development. He's a reasonable supporting player for JFJ. Why not see what he can accomplish with this support?

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02-01-2011, 01:35 PM
  #132
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Originally Posted by s7ark View Post
Good. it is far better to keep Omark and Reddox around than Stortini. Love his heart, hate his ability. It's time to go with the best players, not the ones higher-ups like the most.

JFJ and Fraser should be next.
Agreed 10000000% Beerfish - having Storts(huggabear) waived does not make us "softer", unless you equate hugz with toughness.

lol.

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Old
02-01-2011, 01:38 PM
  #133
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its too bad

i didnt like him, he was a liability on the ice and he couldnt fight worth jack

however i appreciated his effort level even though it never yielded the best results

best of luck storts

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02-01-2011, 01:38 PM
  #134
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Originally Posted by Beerfish View Post
2006-2007: Stortini was 3rd on the team in majors with 7 but that was only in 29 games. (The leader had 9)

2007-2008: Lead the team with 23 majors, next best was 5.

2008-2009: Lead the team with 25 majors, next best was 8.

2009-2010: Lead the team with 17 majors, next best was 8.

2010-2011: Leads the team with 8 majors, next best is 5.

Say what you will about his fighting ability or lack there of the guy answered the bell consistently during his time here. Pretty well the only guy on the team to do so and be willing to at least grapple with just about all comers.
And maybe if he was still playing like the guy in 2007-2009 he'd still have a place here. This season he's been god awful at every aspect of the game.

If he isn't claimed, maybe he'll regain his form in the A and earn a one year deal to try again next season. But this year we lose nothing by waiving Stortini. And we gain a roster spot.

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02-01-2011, 01:41 PM
  #135
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Originally Posted by Arpeggio View Post
With regards to Penner, generally he doesn't fight for his teammates, except with Omark. He's stood up for Omark twice already after Omark got belted into the boards. It'd be nice if he would do the same for Hemsky a bit more often.

And Smid, Vandermeer, and Peckham are are all capable of jumping a guy, they should be the ones counted on to step up after a dirty hit, considering one of them is often on the ice.
I think Penner does alright. It wasn't just Omark that he defended. He didn't hesitate to jump in when Doughty hit Hall, Jack Johnson hit Gagner or when Exelby hit Hemsky.

He's our best goal scorer and I don't want him fighting too often. He steps in when he has to and 2 or 3 fights a season is good enough for me.

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02-01-2011, 01:42 PM
  #136
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Originally Posted by Replacement View Post
Is there a reason we'd be looking at an older sample instead of what is happening this season?
It's a larger sample?

Quote:
I say this because Fraser has been helpful to JFJ's development. He's a reasonable supporting player for JFJ. Why not see what he can accomplish with this support?
Point is, "good" JFJ has a ceiling of an average/below average fourth liner. It's a low bar to hurdle, yet its taken our boy more than 100 NHL games to clear it and only then with the help of another player who can be charitably described as superfluous.

JFJ is what he is and if this team ever gets good again it'll be in part because it won't have players like him taking up space on the roster.

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Old
02-01-2011, 01:44 PM
  #137
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Nice guy but in terms of on the ice I won't miss him at all. He cant fight at all and gets mocked in every fight he does. Throws some punches and then hugs. Has no offensive ability, can't play defense, not a great skater, and isn't a great fighter. Adios Stortini.

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Old
02-01-2011, 01:47 PM
  #138
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Originally Posted by Beerfish View Post
2006-2007: Stortini was 3rd on the team in majors with 7 but that was only in 29 games. (The leader had 9)

2007-2008: Lead the team with 23 majors, next best was 5.

2008-2009: Lead the team with 25 majors, next best was 8.

2009-2010: Lead the team with 17 majors, next best was 8.

2010-2011: Leads the team with 8 majors, next best is 5.

Say what you will about his fighting ability or lack there of the guy answered the bell consistently during his time here. Pretty well the only guy on the team to do so and be willing to at least grapple with just about all comers.
Thats not necessarily a good thing. Take his last fight for example vs Dallas. He dropped the gloves and immediately held on for dear life. What was the purpose of even dropping the gloves if thatís all heís going to do? It almost looked like he was trying to secure his spot in the lineup by looking willing, be he forgot about the able part.

Its hard as a fan to watch your tough guy take on all comers and consistently get his ass handed to him. I cant even imagine how disheartening it is for his teammates to watch that. Hopefully he clears and improves his game in the A. I think most of us gave up on Reddox, but heís seemed to improve his game down there and found himself a roster spot.

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Old
02-01-2011, 01:50 PM
  #139
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Little Fury View Post
It's a larger sample?



Point is, "good" JFJ has a ceiling of an average/below average fourth liner. It's a low bar to hurdle, yet its taken our boy more than 100 NHL games to clear it and only then with the help of another player who can be charitably described as superfluous.

JFJ is what he is and if this team ever gets good again it'll be in part because it won't have players like him taking up space on the roster.
A guy that hits at the same rate as NHL hit leaderCal Clutterbuck, is hard on the forecheck, is a solid NZ presence, is now rarely scored against, and that knocks home some goals in very limited action is "taking up space"? He's one of a few players on the team that hasn't been buried playing against his NHL peers.

The ceiling is this becomes one of those rare players we are actually looking for. Theres no reason not to wait and see for a few mths and see if the good play continues. Why walk the plank now?

This could easily be another Glencross mistake.

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Old
02-01-2011, 01:50 PM
  #140
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Is he even the best fighter on the team (not counting Smac)? I think Vandermeer and Peckham throw more punches in one fight than Zack throws in a whole season, and they can fight the guys who actually need the punches to the head instead of just the other team's enforcers.

I think his lawyer is fighting against him being waived tho. I saw some dude with a briefcase turtling at the provincial court.

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02-01-2011, 01:51 PM
  #141
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Guaranteed that if someone picks him up, he scores on his first visit back to Rexall!!

He became a liability.... if there was a scrum and Zach was on the ice, the refs sent him to the box regardless or whether he deserved it or not. I wish some of the guys showed as much heart as he did (or he had as much skill as some of the others.....)

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02-01-2011, 01:58 PM
  #142
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Originally Posted by Oi'll say! View Post
Is he even the best fighter on the team (not counting Smac)? I think Vandermeer and Peckham throw more punches in one fight than Zack throws in a whole season, and they can fight the guys who actually need the punches to the head instead of just the other team's enforcers.

I think his lawyer is fighting against him being waived tho. I saw some dude with a briefcase turtling at the provincial court.
No of course he isn't there are probably at laest 5 guys if not more better than him. The difference is he answers the bell and will engage unlike anyone else on the team including our heavyweight. See the fight stats I posted in this thread.

We have Hemksy hurt again, Eberle is just getting back after getting hurt. We have some very good young players with more on the way and we are keeping the likes of Fraser and JFJ over a guy that will actually intervene if someone starts picking on our players.

This team has tried the old 'team toughness' and it doesn't work. We'll just get run out of the rink by the likes of Minny, Van and Calgary even more than normal.

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02-01-2011, 02:01 PM
  #143
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Fraser will be next. He'll clear. His extra year on a one-way guarantees that.

When healthy:

Penner-Hall-Hemsky
Paajarvi-Gagner-Omark
Reddox-Horcoff-Eblere
Jones-Cogliano-Brule
Jacques-Mac

You could actually roll 4 lines for a change.

Clearly they need to address the 4th line this off-season. They could try to move Cogliano or Brule and add a bigger body before or at the deadline.

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Old
02-01-2011, 02:02 PM
  #144
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i hope he clears and spends the rest of the year in okc improving his quickness and learning to pk. if he can play 12 minutes a game and make a marked improvement over the remainder of the season i think he could be a very useful 4th liner next year.

if he is picked up i wish him luck. i absolutely hated him for the first couple of years but have grown to appreciate his effort level.
Please try to keep the talk about Gagner to the threads about Gagner.

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Old
02-01-2011, 02:05 PM
  #145
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he might get picked up but i doubt it.

our fourth line has not been good this year. All of them need to get their act togeather or they will all be looking for a job. Add Brule to that list as well

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Old
02-01-2011, 02:06 PM
  #146
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Originally Posted by Seedling View Post

LMAO! I luv the old NINTENDO Punch-Out theme song!

Anybody have the Vandermeer fight that was talked about.. I missed that one?

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Old
02-01-2011, 02:09 PM
  #147
Booya42
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Beerfish View Post
No of course he isn't there are probably at laest 5 guys if not more better than him. The difference is he answers the bell and will engage unlike anyone else on the team including our heavyweight. See the fight stats I posted in this thread.

We have Hemksy hurt again, Eberle is just getting back after getting hurt. We have some very good young players with more on the way and we are keeping the likes of Fraser and JFJ over a guy that will actually intervene if someone starts picking on our players.
This team has tried the old 'team toughness' and it doesn't work. We'll just get run out of the rink by the likes of Minny, Van and Calgary even more than normal.
Problem with what you posted is that Hemsky was more than likely hurt by that puck to the head, or accidental stick to the head he recieved - not due to a goon roughing him up. Ebs was hurt when he went down awkwardly after a legit hit. So how is lkeeping Storts going to help prevent those situations?

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02-01-2011, 02:18 PM
  #148
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Originally Posted by Booya42 View Post
Problem with what you posted is that Hemsky was more than likely hurt by that puck to the head, or accidental stick to the head he recieved - not due to a goon roughing him up. Ebs was hurt when he went down awkwardly after a legit hit. So how is lkeeping Storts going to help prevent those situations?
We don't know how Hemksy got hurt. Eberle got taken down by a guy that should have no business rubbing out one of our players on the boards at all. Clean checks or not teams should know that if you mess with our young players, clean check or not someone is going after you. That's what keeps your young players alive and gives them room to move.

Watch other teams in this league if one of the Sedins got just rocked by a huge open ice hit would the Canucks applaud and say, clean check! and do nothing? Half of their team would be pounding on the perp.

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Old
02-01-2011, 02:24 PM
  #149
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We have Hemksy hurt again, Eberle is just getting back after getting hurt. We have some very good young players with more on the way and we are keeping the likes of Fraser and JFJ over a guy that will actually intervene if someone starts picking on our players.
I wouldn't have been upset if they had waved any of the three guys on our 4th line. For me, none have been consistently effective. Start with Storts, and eventually get rid of the other two. Are the Oilers a softer team today? Probably. Did having Storts in the lineup the last few years prevent teams from running at Hemmer, etc. No. So I don't see how losing him will make teams take more shots at our stars. They already take enough. We badly require tougher guys on the 2nd and 3rd line that can actually play the game a bit. Guys like Ott.

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02-01-2011, 02:24 PM
  #150
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Originally Posted by Hemsky4PM View Post
Fraser will be next. He'll clear. His extra year on a one-way guarantees that.

When healthy:

Penner-Hall-Hemsky
Paajarvi-Gagner-Omark
Reddox-Horcoff-Eblere
Jones-Cogliano-Brule
Jacques-Mac

You could actually roll 4 lines for a change.

Clearly they need to address the 4th line this off-season. They could try to move Cogliano or Brule and add a bigger body before or at the deadline.
If healthy I see little reason to break up Jones-Cogs-Brule.

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