HFBoards

Go Back   HFBoards > NHL Eastern Conference > Atlantic Division > Montreal Canadiens
Mobile Hockey's Future Become a Sponsor Site Rules Support Forum vBookie Page 2
Notices

Andrei Scapegoat Kostitsyn

Reply
 
Thread Tools
Old
02-03-2011, 03:25 PM
  #101
KristoLeblanc*
 
Join Date: Oct 2010
Location: Canada
Country: Canada
Posts: 1,441
vCash: 500
Kostitsyn is soft.

I think its most stupid thing I've read about him on the Habs board.

Kostitsyn is better than Ryder.

Their wirst shot are similar and Kostitsyn is stronger along the board, can puckhandle and stickhandle while Ryder's only move was a fail toe-drag.

The hate toward him was well deserved last year, I agree. But this season aside for may be 2 weeks, even when he is not scoring, he is not hurting the team defensively and plays well in all 3 zones.

People says he is overpaid and need to produce more for his salary... 3.5 millions is a fair price for him.

He is outproducing Brian Gionta, who is paid 5 millions per season, Gionta has been soft and lazy on a lot of goal this season but nobody is whining on him, he is playin 19:29 versus 15:44 for Kostitsyn. So with 4+ minutes of ice time per game, he can't outscore AK46. Same for Gomez.

KristoLeblanc* is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
02-03-2011, 03:27 PM
  #102
KristoLeblanc*
 
Join Date: Oct 2010
Location: Canada
Country: Canada
Posts: 1,441
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by No Team Needed View Post
Andrei: 29 points in 51 games, much of it playing with Hab leader Tomas Plekanec
Higgins: 18 points in 38 games, not much of it playing with Panthers leader Stephen Weiss.

11 extra points in 13 games. If Andrei was on the third line all year like Higgins has been in Florida, do you think he'd have 29 points? I'm betting it'd be a lot more similar to Higgins' 18.
Higgins last 10-12 games he played with Weiss... He had 9 of his 18pts in those 10-12 games. Playing between 17 and 20 minutes a game.


Your post fail.

KristoLeblanc* is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
02-03-2011, 03:58 PM
  #103
sarie67
Registered User
 
Join Date: Oct 2010
Posts: 85
vCash: 500
AK's most overlooked asset is his passing ability. His tape to tape hard passes create numerous scoring chances. I think he's actually a better passer than scorer.

His biggest weakness, in my opinion, is that he doesn't crash the net enough. He's around the net but often too far or he turns away when he should stop and plant his feet and bury rebounds.

Would you trade him straight up for Kaberle? How about Beauchemin? We'll throw in a healthy Ron Wilson as a bonus.

sarie67 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
02-03-2011, 04:00 PM
  #104
tinyzombies
Registered User
 
Join Date: Dec 2002
Location: Calif via Montreal
Posts: 11,462
vCash: 500
Not a playoff player. Chris Pronger plays that side of the ice for half the game. This is not the guy I want at right wing come playoff time.

The guy at right wing should be short and fast like lightning. The guy at left wing, big and tough and net crashing.

I'm picturing April and we're on the ice against the Flyers. Do I want to see AK out there? No.


Last edited by tinyzombies: 02-03-2011 at 04:14 PM.
tinyzombies is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
02-03-2011, 04:25 PM
  #105
Stradale
Registered User
 
Stradale's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2006
Posts: 10,000
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by tinyzombies View Post
Not a playoff player. Chris Pronger plays that side of the ice for half the game. This is not the guy I want at right wing come playoff time.

The guy at right wing should be short and fast like lightning. The guy at left wing, big and tough and net crashing.

I'm picturing April and we're on the ice against the Flyers. Do I want to see AK out there? No.
Actually, I think having shorty like Gomez, Gionta, Cammy and Plekanec are more of a concern if we play the Flyers.

Stradale is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
02-03-2011, 04:34 PM
  #106
sammy d
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jul 2009
Posts: 602
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Lestriker View Post
What's that player's name? What's his salary like? And more importantly, how do we acquire him?
How do we acquire him...well duhh, I'll give you a hint...how about trading AK 47 for him.

For all you guys that keep bringing up his hits could you please compile a list of coaches, players, GM's who are shaking in their boots and or skates in fear at playing against the hulking, brutal demi-god AK 47. Thank you.

sammy d is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
02-03-2011, 04:41 PM
  #107
Stradale
Registered User
 
Stradale's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2006
Posts: 10,000
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by sammy d View Post
How do we acquire him...well duhh, I'll give you a hint...how about trading AK 47 for him.

For all you guys that keep bringing up his hits could you please compile a list of coaches, players, GM's who are shaking in their boots and or skates in fear at playing against the hulking, brutal demi-god AK 47. Thank you.
So you think a GM will trade a perfect top 6 player with a cheap contract, that gives his all on every games, every shifts, that will score on 25 goals a season, without having any slump, that will drop gloves to defend his teammates.. for a AK? A guy that for you is pretty much useless? This is not NHL11 buddy.

Stradale is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
02-03-2011, 04:43 PM
  #108
m00ks
Registered User
 
m00ks's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Posts: 7,887
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Turboflex View Post
Andrei is what he is. Talented stickhandler, mean wrist shot, heavy frame & good speed. Good production at 50 or so points for 3.25 million.

But he has downsides, the guy is a total space cadet which makes him very frustrating to watch. He plays like he is stoned!! He has the puck constantly rolls off his stick and is slow to make plays resulting in turnovers.

I can see how he has become a scapegoat in the super emo Montreal market. His flaws are very noticable (when he whiffs on shots haha) so any boob fan (lots in montreal!!) can harp on them, and there are such high expectations on him from the 2003 Draft when he was picked ahead of about 10 all-stars.

Personally I have made peace with his flaws and can live with them because overall you aren't gonna 4 high calibre wingers in your top 6, and he is a decent deal as a top 6 filler.

He has recovered from his brutal 2nd half last season, and is more implicated in the play this year.

Andrei is what he is, people need to learn to accept this, he is just not sharp enough or high enough hockey IQ to become the 40 goal star some people expect. If he can produce 20-30 goals/40-50 pts and his salary doesn't go above 3.5 to 3.75 it is OK.
Very nice. Andrei K to the T.

m00ks is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
02-03-2011, 04:56 PM
  #109
tinyzombies
Registered User
 
Join Date: Dec 2002
Location: Calif via Montreal
Posts: 11,462
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Stradale View Post
Actually, I think having shorty like Gomez, Gionta, Cammy and Plekanec are more of a concern if we play the Flyers.
I agree. But a wuss doesn't help either. Gomez and Kosty give the puck up way too easily.

The Flyers are great in the neutral zone, like all Laviolette teams, so by the time we get to their zone, we're always outnumbered and outmuscled.

This problem is not going away because Pronger is on the ice half the game. We need a third line, especially.

tinyzombies is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
02-03-2011, 05:05 PM
  #110
Stradale
Registered User
 
Stradale's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2006
Posts: 10,000
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by tinyzombies View Post
I agree. But a wuss doesn't help either. Gomez and Kosty give the puck up way too easily.

The Flyers are great in the neutral zone, like all Laviolette teams, so by the time we get to their zone, we're always outnumbered and outmuscled.

This problem is not going away because Pronger is on the ice half the game. We need a third line, especially.
I agree. That's why I wouldn't mind a big guy like Arnott to complete our top 9. If we face the Flyers in the playoffs again with the current line up, they will kick us out of the playoffs for the 3rd straight time.

Though I dont mind having a big guy like AK to complete our top 6 even if he's not the most physical player out there.

Stradale is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
02-03-2011, 05:35 PM
  #111
tinyzombies
Registered User
 
Join Date: Dec 2002
Location: Calif via Montreal
Posts: 11,462
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Stradale View Post
I agree. That's why I wouldn't mind a big guy like Arnott to complete our top 9. If we face the Flyers in the playoffs again with the current line up, they will kick us out of the playoffs for the 3rd straight time.

Though I dont mind having a big guy like AK to complete our top 6 even if he's not the most physical player out there.
Arnott is not a hungry player anymore, but he is a big body that MIGHT gain us a bit more zone time. Might.

Longterm, I think guys like Kost are easily added (if necessary, and at a much cheaper price) once the proper core is established. And probably to the third line. He cannot be a marquee player on a winning team. I'd rather have Kovalev for the same price as a rental in the lineup come playoff time.

tinyzombies is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
02-03-2011, 05:40 PM
  #112
Kimota
Nation of Poutine
 
Kimota's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2005
Location: La Vieille Capitale
Country: France
Posts: 21,792
vCash: 500
Andrei is not a scapegoat, he just sucks. He basically is not progressing.

As far as scapegoats the fans and media are on Gomez' throat more than Andrei K. The media were just waiting for the fans to start hating Gomez and when they saw Gomez being frustrated by the action of their fan favorite Subban, they jumped on him. The press licked their lips as in saying "finally!" and Gomez became a periah. Same thing happened with Koivu. Remember when he fought Ribeiro, suddenly a few fools started to boo Saku. And after that he was fair game and the Montreal media jumped on his throat in a disgusting display of character assassination as i've ever seen one.

Kimota is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
02-03-2011, 06:15 PM
  #113
Stradale
Registered User
 
Stradale's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2006
Posts: 10,000
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kimota View Post
Andrei is not a scapegoat, he just sucks. He basically is not progressing.

.
AK doesn't suck. He is what he is. An inconsistent player that has ups and downs. He's underachieving a bit this season but he's not the only one. He still manage to outproduce Gionta and Gomez despite having the less icetime and PP.

So when the guy is amongst the leader in goals, pts, =/-, GWG, hits and people still say that he sucks... then yes, he is the scapegoat.


Last edited by Stradale: 02-03-2011 at 06:21 PM.
Stradale is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
02-03-2011, 06:27 PM
  #114
guapo23
Registered User
 
guapo23's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2005
Country:
Posts: 2,474
vCash: 500
In other Kostitsyn related news,
Sergei is 2nd in points with Nashville.

Sergei Kostitsyn
GP G A P AVERAGE ICE TIME / GAME
47 12 16 28 14:20

He has 28 points while playing only 14 min per game.
That is the same amount of points as Gionta.

guapo23 is online now   Reply With Quote
Old
02-03-2011, 08:00 PM
  #115
Kriss E
Registered User
 
Join Date: May 2007
Posts: 23,593
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by guapo23 View Post
In other Kostitsyn related news,
Sergei is 2nd in points with Nashville.

Sergei Kostitsyn
GP G A P AVERAGE ICE TIME / GAME
47 12 16 28 14:20

He has 28 points while playing only 14 min per game.
That is the same amount of points as Gionta
.
While playing 5min less a game.

Kriss E is online now   Reply With Quote
Old
02-03-2011, 10:09 PM
  #116
Jakomyte
Registered User
 
Jakomyte's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: Toronto
Country: Canada
Posts: 2,128
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by guapo23 View Post
In other Kostitsyn related news,
Sergei is 2nd in points with Nashville.

Sergei Kostitsyn
GP G A P AVERAGE ICE TIME / GAME
47 12 16 28 14:20

He has 28 points while playing only 14 min per game.
That is the same amount of points as Gionta.
Zomg!! Other players in the league have more points than our players.... WE SUCK!!!!

Seriously, this thread is ridiculous...

Jakomyte is online now   Reply With Quote
Old
02-03-2011, 10:10 PM
  #117
nyhabsfan
Waiting for #25.....
 
Join Date: Jun 2005
Location: Connecticut
Country: Canada
Posts: 5,844
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Stradale View Post
AK doesn't suck. He is what he is. An inconsistent player that has ups and downs. He's underachieving a bit this season but he's not the only one. He still manage to outproduce Gionta and Gomez despite having the less icetime and PP.

So when the guy is amongst the leader in goals, pts, =/-, GWG, hits and people still say that he sucks... then yes, he is the scapegoat.
His major issue is between his ears, and that's why he shows up 1 game out of 5 .

All you have to do is watch the 3rd period of the Florida game, Eller was busting his butt all over the ice while AK as usual was out for a Sunday skate.

At one point Florida had a breakout and Eller PASSED AK on the back check!!!!

Bottom line, he is another head case who has maxes out and HOPEFULLY will not be re-signed.

I'd rather take the $3.2 and sign Patches to a 3-4 year deal or get Wiz under contract!!!

nyhabsfan is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
02-03-2011, 10:19 PM
  #118
nyhabsfan
Waiting for #25.....
 
Join Date: Jun 2005
Location: Connecticut
Country: Canada
Posts: 5,844
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by mikekomisarek08 View Post
AK's most overlooked asset is his passing ability. His tape to tape hard passes create numerous scoring chances. I think he's actually a better passer than scorer.

His biggest weakness, in my opinion, is that he doesn't crash the net enough. He's around the net but often too far or he turns away when he should stop and plant his feet and bury rebounds.

Would you trade him straight up for Kaberle? How about Beauchemin? We'll throw in a healthy Ron Wilson as a bonus.
His most overlooked flaw is his ability to receive a pass, more than half of them trickle of his stick. I've never seen a player who has a worse time tracking the puck. Just count how many times he loses the puck in his skates and and can't find it!

I'd trade him for either D straight up.

nyhabsfan is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
02-03-2011, 10:20 PM
  #119
Stradale
Registered User
 
Stradale's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2006
Posts: 10,000
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by nyhabsfan View Post
His major issue is between his ears, and that's why he shows up 1 game out of 5 .

All you have to do is watch the 3rd period of the Florida game, Eller was busting his butt all over the ice while AK as usual was out for a Sunday skate.

At one point Florida had a breakout and Eller PASSED AK on the back check!!!!

Bottom line, he is another head case who has maxes out and HOPEFULLY will not be re-signed.

I'd rather take the $3.2 and sign Patches to a 3-4 year deal or get Wiz under contract!!!
You don't know what hockey is You always use the "one game out of 5" cliche like the morons on Antichambre always does when talking about Kovalev. If you do watch the game and have some knowledge about hockey, you will notice that AK is not that bad. You're one of those that think AK can't be streaky, he's just lazy right?


Between Danny Dube who said AK played well in his last 2 games and you, I think i'll believe Dube.. But again, its not that hard to see that AK is playing well. He's actually the best player on that line but I bet you cant see that.

Stradale is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
02-03-2011, 10:33 PM
  #120
nyhabsfan
Waiting for #25.....
 
Join Date: Jun 2005
Location: Connecticut
Country: Canada
Posts: 5,844
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Stradale View Post
You don't know what hockey is You always use the "one game out of 5" cliche like the morons on Antichambre always does when talking about Kovalev. If you do watch the game and have some knowledge about hockey, you will notice that AK is not that bad. You're one of those that think AK can't be streaky, he's just lazy right?


Between Danny Dube who said AK played well in his last 2 games and you, I think i'll believe Dube.. But again, its not that hard to see that AK is playing well. He's actually the best player on that line but I bet you cant see that.

I know more about hockey than you if you think he showed up in the last 2 games means he's a top 6 forward!!!!!!

Eller was better than AK in that last period when it mattered! But you keep watching those
replays and convincing yourself that AK is a top 6 forward!

Of course you were probably leading the " bring Kovy back" rally in the summer!!!

Looks like you never even played the game, because if you did you wouldn't this head case on your
team!

Seriously who let's these Leaf fans on the board.

nyhabsfan is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
02-03-2011, 10:36 PM
  #121
Ginu
Registered User
 
Ginu's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2009
Posts: 3,701
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Stradale View Post
You don't know what hockey is You always use the "one game out of 5" cliche like the morons on Antichambre always does when talking about Kovalev. If you do watch the game and have some knowledge about hockey, you will notice that AK is not that bad. You're one of those that think AK can't be streaky, he's just lazy right?


Between Danny Dube who said AK played well in his last 2 games and you, I think i'll believe Dube.. But again, its not that hard to see that AK is playing well. He's actually the best player on that line but I bet you cant see that.
I agree with you that he's not that bad, but he's not a consistent enough scorer for the top 2 lines. Unless he starts scoring 25-30 goals regularly, he won't be considered a bonafide offensive player, but a borderline 2nd liner and glorified 3rd liner, much like Mike Fisher is in Ottawa. He's just not steady enough for a top 2 line role, but when he's on, he's ON. You have to do it consistently if you're going to stay there on a contending team.

Ginu is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
02-03-2011, 10:43 PM
  #122
Vanek20
Drive for 25
 
Vanek20's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2006
Location: Montréal
Country: Canada
Posts: 2,270
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by nyhabsfan View Post
I know more about hockey than you if you think he showed up in the last 2 games means he's a top 6 forward!!!!!!

Eller was better than AK in that last period when it mattered! But you keep watching those
replays and convincing yourself that AK is a top 6 forward!

Of course you were probably leading the " bring Kovy back" rally in the summer!!!

Looks like you never even played the game, because if you did you wouldn't this head case on your
team!

Seriously who let's these Leaf fans on the board.
Man, you should be a rangers fan and leave us alone. If you cant say that AK played good the last 2 games (and more id say), u know ***** about hockey. The guy is forechecking like a beast, hitting, taking the pucks out of the corners, he shoots, he does lots of things, works hard since he talked to JM and you (people who bash AK) still have to hate AK because you dont like him. Yeah ok, maybe he does some turnovers, but who cares, its part of hockey. FYI, love a player and analyse a player's play are two things completely different and for most of the time, people tend to mix those two things. We need Andrei Kostitsyn on our team, thats a fact. It's great to have size and depth on our team and I don't have any problem with him. But I guess, when someone hates a player, he's gonna hate him for the rest of his years wtv happens.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ginu View Post
I agree with you that he's not that bad, but he's not a consistent enough scorer for the top 2 lines. Unless he starts scoring 25-30 goals regularly, he won't be considered a bonafide offensive player, but a borderline 2nd liner and glorified 3rd liner, much like Mike Fisher is in Ottawa. He's just not steady enough for a top 2 line role, but when he's on, he's ON. You have to do it consistently if you're going to stay there on a contending team.
They guy is maybe not consistent, but the results are still there. He has more points than Gionta who is giving his all every single game. I agree with you he is not very consistent, but i still want him on our top 6. Would you take, Laich, Knuble, Perreault before Kostitsyn? I won't. And they are all top 6 players with the Capitals. We should calm down a bit with AK. If he gives us 50 pts as a 2nd liner, its not that bad.

Vanek20 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
02-03-2011, 10:52 PM
  #123
Stradale
Registered User
 
Stradale's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2006
Posts: 10,000
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ginu View Post
I agree with you that he's not that bad, but he's not a consistent enough scorer for the top 2 lines. Unless he starts scoring 25-30 goals regularly, he won't be considered a bonafide offensive player, but a borderline 2nd liner and glorified 3rd liner, much like Mike Fisher is in Ottawa. He's just not steady enough for a top 2 line role, but when he's on, he's ON. You have to do it consistently if you're going to stay there on a contending team.
Of course we all want AK to be consistent but he is what he is. If he's a consistent player, he would be our best wingers and getting paid 5-6M$ but he's not. So at 3M$, for a guy that can pots you 20 goals+, he's not that bad. He's not hurting our team or our cap space unlike Gomez, who gets paid to much for his contribution.

Its not like every teams has 4 perfect wingers in their top 6 that scores 25-30 goals regularly, under 4M$. No doubt that AK can give us more if he's a consistent player but he isn't yet. So you get what you pay for.

Stradale is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
02-04-2011, 09:52 AM
  #124
neofury*
 
Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: Montreal, PQ
Country: Canada
Posts: 20,277
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Stradale View Post
Of course we all want AK to be consistent but he is what he is. If he's a consistent player, he would be our best wingers and getting paid 5-6M$ but he's not. So at 3M$, for a guy that can pots you 20 goals+, he's not that bad. He's not hurting our team or our cap space unlike Gomez, who gets paid to much for his contribution.

Its not like every teams has 4 perfect wingers in their top 6 that scores 25-30 goals regularly, under 4M$. No doubt that AK can give us more if he's a consistent player but he isn't yet. So you get what you pay for.
The consistency argument is laughable at best. Out of all the offensive forwards in the league by HF standards 10 are consistent. By some still unrealistic peoples standards 30 players are.

By the more realistic peoples standards at least 50+ players are consistent.

Consistent doesn't mean you produce 82pt+ seasons guys. Sure Andrei isn't putting up exactly a 1.2 points every other game and he has streaks, most forwards in the NHL are streaky not everyone can be Crosby so stop faulting AK because he isn't Crosby. He is what he is, a 50pt guy who is streaky. That doesn't mean he isn't showing up and is lazy. Like I said earlier mass assumptions.

Are you AK's best friend? Do you know he's taking a Sunday afternoon stroll or whatever stupid cliche term you guys are using that was spewed off Antichambre this week? No you don't, and unlike you I don't make stupid assumptions about people I don't know. Is it fair to assume he is putting in the effort? It's almost notoriously more fair to assume the better in someone than the worse. In the case of Andrei who has the stats relative to his teammates to back up the fact of what we are saying, I'd say the assumption that he isn't lazy is more than fair.

There's a big difference between assuming a player who has the 3rd highest stats on his team is playing well versus a bunch of anti-Euro haters assuming he sucks because their biased view of the kid affects the way they see the game compared to people who aren't Euro haters. Plain and simple.

Yeah 90% of you are hating on him cause he's Russian. I live in Montreal I know the way people around here talk about "the Russians", wasn't born yesterday so don't even try to deny there's a lot of people around here who blatantly hate on Russians and European players or blindly favor Canadians.

neofury* is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
02-04-2011, 10:01 AM
  #125
Andy
Registered User
 
Andy's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2008
Location: Montreal
Country: Canada
Posts: 18,225
vCash: 500
The only thing the case of Andrei Kostitsyn shows is how powerful the media can be in regards to perceptions of a player.

Andrei Kostitsyn is a regular top 6 forward. Just like every other one(even the ones we want from other teams like Penner, who people seem to have a hard on) he is inconsistent. This inconsistency is the reason why they are top 6 forwards and not top 3 or franchise players. Take Andrei as the top 6 forward as he is and his play is adequate. He's improved his game to no longer be a liability and still provides decent offense. Hos defensive game is better than Cammalleri's that's for sure, but Andei gets more flak.

Andy is online now   Reply With Quote
Reply

Forum Jump


Bookmarks

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off



All times are GMT -5. The time now is 12:10 PM.

monitoring_string = "e4251c93e2ba248d29da988d93bf5144"
Contact Us - HFBoards - Archive - Privacy Statement - Terms of Use - Advertise - Top - AdChoices

vBulletin Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
HFBoards.com is a property of CraveOnline Media, LLC, an Evolve Media, LLC company. ©2014 All Rights Reserved.