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Spezza to edmonton

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Old
02-07-2011, 08:18 PM
  #126
Wondercarrot
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Originally Posted by Jamin View Post
that worked so well for ottawa...


Last time spezza had 100 points he played in Binghamton which correct me if im wrong is not the nhl. If we go close to 100 points its 2007.

So in every ottawa thread hemsky is labelled as injury prone. Based on this year and last compared to hemsky spezza is injury prone except makes over 7mil instead of 4
ahh. i see its to be a technicality then.
fine, clearly its a waste of time talking to you.

if your argument that you are unsure about him playing a full 82 games fair enough, if you are arguing that he wouldnt have put up over 100pts in those 3 seasons had he played the extra 10 games then you are an idiot.

clearly he has 100pt plus talent but if you want to dismiss those seasons due to a few games he missed so be it.
why dont you post a list of guys that played at a 105pt or so or even over 100pt pace over three seasons over the past 10 -15 years (say minimum 70 games roughly, although take any number of games you want over 3 seasons if you like) and we'll see what names you come up with.

i think we'll all find the results quite fascinating.

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02-07-2011, 08:29 PM
  #127
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Originally Posted by Jamin View Post
enough what?
Sorry, for the visually impaired, the bolded items from the quoted identified all of the arguments that shoud apply.

As an Oiler fan, please trade Spezza to Calgary. Better fit for the trade, fewer arguments.

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02-07-2011, 08:31 PM
  #128
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You say its mind boogling but to me I see Hemsky, Penner, Eberle, Hall, Omark, Gagner, Petry, Smid, Dubnyk needing re-signing which is only negatively affected with spezza and his huge long term deal
4 years is hardly longterm given the 8-12 year deals handed out these days.
and if you think all of those players are going to get huge dollars, especially given how deals after the ELC are now stuctured, you really dont know what you're talking about.
Spezza got his deal right before everyone started handing out super longterm deals as a way of lowering cap hit.

so your young players (assuming everyone of those players pans out AND require big paydays all in the same year AND all your UFAs decide top stay) will still likley be pretty manageable.
and frankly if you see keeping Horcoff at 5 whatever million he's making as a good idea over spezza at 7 million then we probably dont need to continue this conversation.

out of curiosity how much do you think all of those players are going to get on their next contracts?
more than say Datsyuk, Zetterberg, Lidstrom, Franzen, Raflaski, Filpula, etc etc?
but because spezza makes a million more than datsyuk all of a sudden nothing is affordable?

heres another thought, you know that 1.5 million dollar player playing on your 3rd or 4th line, jettison him and play a rookie on your 4th line.
what do you think is more valuable, Spezza anchoring your top line or not having Spezza so you can solidify your 4th line RW position if it came to that (which it wouldnt)

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02-07-2011, 08:42 PM
  #129
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Originally Posted by Jamin View Post
that worked so well for ottawa...


Last time spezza had 100 points he played in Binghamton which correct me if im wrong is not the nhl. If we go close to 100 points its 2007.

So in every ottawa thread hemsky is labelled as injury prone. Based on this year and last compared to hemsky spezza is injury prone except makes over 7mil instead of 4

errr....yeah as i recall i did work out pretty well. we had the most exciting team in hockey, made it to the Stanley Cup final and would have contended for years had our star winger not been a mental case in the end.

what's your point?

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Old
02-07-2011, 08:46 PM
  #130
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1. Thing is Ottawa doesn't have to trade their 26 year old #1 center (which they BADLY NEED by the way, more than even Edmonton) to land the 1st pick overall. They have just as much of a chance to pick 1st overall as Oilers do. They are virtually a lock to be picking top 5 even with an epic run. Besides Spezza Ottawa has ZERO star quality young forwards either at the NHL level or in the system...maybe outside Silverberg in the SEL. Hence Ottawa covets Spezza more than anyone despite what some might think. It would take major overpayment even when his value is the lowest it will ever get like it is right now.

2. Ottawa does not want/need Adam Larsson (I don't think anyway) even if Oilers were a lock for 1st overall. They got 2 of the best dman prospects outside the NHL looking to make the team next year in Rundbland and Cowen and of course 20 year old all-star Erik Karlsson on the team. They will most likely go for Landeskog, Couturier, or Nugen-Hopkins probably in that order. Hence no need what so ever for 1st overall if the cost is Spezza. Oilers would take Larsson 1st for sure.3. If Spezza is traded for futures then Alfredsson has to be traded as well, no point in keeping him with a basement team for the next 2 3 years at least. Fisher too and maybe even Michalek. Gonchar is a given.

Keeping Spezza allow Ottawa to draft an impact forward either of Landeskog or Couturier, and sign an impact UFA forward or 2 this summer with the huge cap space and be in the hunt as soon as next season. They can retool ala Flyers style. You already got impact young players like karlsson and Spezza to build around, add Landeskog and Runbland and Cowen, sign Richards this summer and a stop gap UFA goalie i.e. Bryzgalov and you are contending team next year.

Oilers should just keep their pick 1st, 2nd, or 3rd whatever it turns out to be, especially if it is 1st cuz they need to draft 1 or 2 impact potential #1 dman as there are none in their system. For them to do that they need to land Larsson this summer and suck at least a year or 2 more. They are still lacking 2 potentail impact #1 or #2 dman types and same thing when it comes to impact top end centers.
Ahh I beg to differ you sound like the bruins fans last year Oil will take Seguin for sure I say they have RNH or Couturier in their wish list The need a num 1 c as much as Senators need to retain Spezza And this will become much clearer if Penner or Hemsky are moved for a dman at the trade deadline

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02-07-2011, 09:02 PM
  #131
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Ahh I beg to differ you sound like the bruins fans last year Oil will take Seguin for sure I say they have RNH or Couturier in their wish list The need a num 1 c as much as Senators need to retain Spezza And this will become much clearer if Penner or Hemsky are moved for a dman at the trade deadline
No one is going to give you a cornerstone or even potential #1 type young dman for Penner/Hemsky. If you want those guys you must draft and develop them.

Oilers would be idiotic to not take Larsson if they got the chance, he is probably BPA in the draft just edging some of the forwards like Landeskog/Couturier. Plus Oilers have a huge need for a franchise type #1 dman.

I think in reality Oilers would even move their 2nd this year if there is a team a pick or 2 ahead of them that threatens to draft Larsson.

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02-07-2011, 09:13 PM
  #132
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Originally Posted by 4thliner View Post
No one is going to give you a cornerstone or even potential #1 type young dman for Penner/Hemsky. If you want those guys you must draft and develop them.

Oilers would be idiotic to not take Larsson if they got the chance, he is probably BPA in the draft just edging some of the forwards like Landeskog/Couturier. Plus Oilers have a huge need for a franchise type #1 dman.

I think in reality Oilers would even move their 2nd this year if there is a team a pick or 2 ahead of them that threatens to draft Larsson.
Larsson is not being pegged as a franchise Dman and Penner and Hemsky would easily retain a good Dman prospect such as Bogo in Atlanta or Tuebert in La we have a number 1 in Whitney, I think you should stick to you're team you build with a center and you're nuts if you think they move up a pick for Larsson and a good d prospect is easier to attain than a legit num1 c . Look how you're fan base covets their regressing Spezza . But dont worry Ottawa picks first or second if they lose the lottery had you guys pegged dead last at beggining of the season and you will finish there

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02-07-2011, 09:18 PM
  #133
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Originally Posted by newoilburnsclean View Post
Larsson is not being pegged as a franchise Dman and Penner and Hemsky would easily retain a good Dman prospect such as Bogo in Atlanta or Tuebert in La we have a number 1 in Whitney, I think you should stick to you're team you build with a center and you're nuts if you think they move up a pick for Larsson and a good d prospect is easier to attain than a legit num1 c . Look how you're fan base covets their regressing Spezza . But dont worry Ottawa picks first or second if they lose the lottery had you guys pegged dead last at beggining of the season and you will finish there
Larsson is being pegged as a franchise D.

Whitney isn't a #1D, he's our #1D.

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02-07-2011, 09:21 PM
  #134
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Larsson is being pegged as a franchise D.

Whitney isn't a #1D, he's our #1D.
What he said!

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02-07-2011, 09:23 PM
  #135
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Originally Posted by dnicks17 View Post
Larsson is being pegged as a franchise D.Whitney isn't a #1D, he's our #1D.
Scouting reports I have read says might not be a franchise Dman but will most likely be a number 1 And he is not even ranked number 1 in all scouting reports So with You're Reasoning Landerskog Couturier RNh are all Franchise forwards as well . And mark my words Edmonton picks up good dmen prospects at deadline Larsson is not in their sights

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02-07-2011, 09:29 PM
  #136
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Guys, stop trying to defend Spezza to these clowns. Everyone in the league undervalues Spezza because he has no one, as a playmaker, to work with. On top of that they haven't gotten to witness the evolution of his game from a one-dimensional offensive talent to a well-rounded superstar.

Anyway, Ottawa's woes this year have put a severe damper on any of the players value except maybe Karlsson. Let these clowns talk all the **** they want. Spezza isn't going anywhere, for any trade.
The only thing "superstar" about Spezza has been his contract. He has gotten better defensively(he couldnt get worse), but you'll never hear "Selke" and "Spezza" in the same sentence.
I seriously doubt the Oilers would be willing to give up a potential 1st overall pick for any player making 7+ million a season and who's production has steadily declined over the past 3.5 seasons. It makes zero sense for n organization who's said straight out that rebuilding is the way they are headed

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02-07-2011, 09:46 PM
  #137
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Penner - Cogliano - Smid???

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02-07-2011, 09:50 PM
  #138
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Originally Posted by newoilburnsclean View Post
Larsson is not being pegged as a franchise Dman and Penner and Hemsky would easily retain a good Dman prospect such as Bogo in Atlanta or Tuebert in La we have a number 1 in Whitney, I think you should stick to you're team you build with a center and you're nuts if you think they move up a pick for Larsson and a good d prospect is easier to attain than a legit num1 c . Look how you're fan base covets their regressing Spezza . But dont worry Ottawa picks first or second if they lose the lottery had you guys pegged dead last at beggining of the season and you will finish there
Tuebert isnt't even close to a potential #1 all around dman in the NHL. It wouldn't even take Hemsky and Penner.

I don't think ATL gives you Bogosian, even with his major offensive and defensive regression.

Neither of these 2 have Larsson's potential and make up.

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02-07-2011, 09:56 PM
  #139
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Tuebert isnt't even close to a potential #1 all around dman in the NHL. It wouldn't even take Hemsky and Penner.

I don't think ATL gives you Bogosian, even with his major offensive and defensive regression.Neither of these 2 have Larsson's potential and make up.
Well Atlanta has been scouting our last Three games and they have Buff and Enstrom as 1 2 right now and he would be the only player Oilers would be intrested in attaining, They might like kane but Atlanta does not move him and makes no sense for Edmonton, Check back with me at deadline

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02-07-2011, 09:56 PM
  #140
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Scouting reports I have read says might not be a franchise Dman but will most likely be a number 1 And he is not even ranked number 1 in all scouting reports So with You're Reasoning Landerskog Couturier RNh are all Franchise forwards as well . And mark my words Edmonton picks up good dmen prospects at deadline Larsson is not in their sights
Nugen-Hopkins I think is risky. Couturier can develop into franchise center but there is a question mark how high end his quickness and skills are (as far as the skill I thing it is more of a function of him committing to 2 way game...Jordan Staal fears). One thing is for sure though, none of the 2 have anywhere near Landeskog's drive and heart. And he does not lag in skill as well. It is a no brainer. Even scoring below ppg in the NHL like 70 pts, Landeskog could still be considered franchise potential player for an NHL team if Mike Richards is one in Philly. Only Landeskog is bigger and faster skater and the better finisher.


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02-07-2011, 09:58 PM
  #141
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Originally Posted by 4thliner View Post
Tuebert isnt't even close to a potential #1 all around dman in the NHL. It wouldn't even take Hemsky and Penner.

I don't think ATL gives you Bogosian, even with his major offensive and defensive regression.

Neither of these 2 have Larsson's potential and make up.
I agree with this, Tuebert looks like he will be a second pairing guy who can bring it physically but not offensively. Like a Jason Smith type?

I think Larsson's downside is a second pairing guy. Like a Dan Hamhuis I think his upside is a franchise type of defender.

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02-07-2011, 10:05 PM
  #142
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Originally Posted by 4thliner View Post
Nugen-Hopkins I think is risky. Couturier can develop into franchise center but there is a question mark how high end his quickness and skills are. One thing is for sure though, none of the 2 have anywhere near Landeskog's drive and heart. And he does not lag in skill as well. It is a no brainer. Even scoring below ppg in the NHL like 70 pts, Landeskog could still be considered franchise potential player for an NHL team if Mike Richards is one in Philly. Only Landeskog is bigger and faster skater and the better finisher.
I agree, my point this whole year so far is that there is no clear 'franchise' guy and if there isn't a 'franchise' guy, why wouldn't you go with the greatest area of need with the highest potential of franchise skills?

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02-07-2011, 10:09 PM
  #143
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Nugen-Hopkins I think is risky. Couturier can develop into franchise center but there is a question mark how high end his quickness and skills are (as far as the skill I thing it is more of a function of him committing to 2 way game...Jordan Staal fears). One thing is for sure though, none of the 2 have anywhere near Landeskog's drive and heart. And he does not lag in skill as well. It is a no brainer. Even scoring below ppg in the NHL like 70 pts, Landeskog could still be considered franchise potential player for an NHL team if Mike Richards is one in Philly. Only Landeskog is bigger and faster skater and the better finisher.
I say Couturier is risky his skating is average ala Daigle Boinsignore ring a bell Hopkins has all world skating to go with puck skill better formula for success

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02-07-2011, 10:16 PM
  #144
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I say Couturier is risky his skating is average ala Daigle Boinsignore ring a bell Hopkins has all world skating to go with puck skill better formula for success
He's been said to have similar wheels to that of Spezza, Getzlaf, Staal and others like that. Its not a dynamic stride but its strong and above average in his league.

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02-07-2011, 10:34 PM
  #145
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Nugent-Hopkins is not a risk at all, he has probably progressed more than any of the top prospects. He has put on close to 20 pounds this season, so he is at 170, which is not far off of guys like Duchene at their draft. He's also began to shoot more, he is much more confident with his shot. He scored 5 goals last week alone, and is starting to look really good. If the Oilers get that first overall pick, and they don't pick Nugent-Hopkins, it will be the equivalent of the Blues picking Erik Johnson instead of Jonathan Toews.

And regarding Landeskog, I won't complain if we draft him, but which winger do we trade to get a center if we do pick Landeskog, because we need to fill that hole now.

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Nugen-Hopkins I think is risky. Couturier can develop into franchise center but there is a question mark how high end his quickness and skills are (as far as the skill I thing it is more of a function of him committing to 2 way game...Jordan Staal fears). One thing is for sure though, none of the 2 have anywhere near Landeskog's drive and heart. And he does not lag in skill as well. It is a no brainer. Even scoring below ppg in the NHL like 70 pts, Landeskog could still be considered franchise potential player for an NHL team if Mike Richards is one in Philly. Only Landeskog is bigger and faster skater and the better finisher.

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02-07-2011, 10:50 PM
  #146
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Nugent-Hopkins is not a risk at all, he has probably progressed more than any of the top prospects. He has put on close to 20 pounds this season, so he is at 170, which is not far off of guys like Duchene at their draft. He's also began to shoot more, he is much more confident with his shot. He scored 5 goals last week alone, and is starting to look really good. If the Oilers get that first overall pick, and they don't pick Nugent-Hopkins, it will be the equivalent of the Blues picking Erik Johnson instead of Jonathan Toews.

And regarding Landeskog, I won't complain if we draft him, but which winger do we trade to get a center if we do pick Landeskog, because we need to fill that hole now.
I cant see the oilers passing on Larsson.

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02-07-2011, 10:51 PM
  #147
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Edmonton is not going to give up the assets required to land Spezza. They're on the cusp of being the next Chicago/Pitts/Wash and now they're going to blow their load on Spezza? Yeah right.
No they aren't.

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02-07-2011, 10:53 PM
  #148
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No they aren't.
You can see the future?

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02-07-2011, 10:55 PM
  #149
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Penner for Spezza

Penner has brought his value up since the Heatley trade, what has Spezza done? okay, Edmonton adds a pick or Cogliano.

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02-07-2011, 10:55 PM
  #150
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No they aren't.
Your right the Leafs are going to be.

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