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Official Rumor Thread--Kings Rumor Mill XI

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Old
02-14-2011, 05:57 PM
  #376
nki
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Originally Posted by Shellz View Post
Zherdev to LA. WOO HOOOOOOOOOOOOO


woo hoooooo?

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02-14-2011, 06:03 PM
  #377
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If I'm Philly I do that Versteeg trade any time. Losing a pick from 20-30 hurts them in no way. Their NHL roster is nearly full, it's going to be hard for somebody else to break in.

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02-14-2011, 06:08 PM
  #378
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Seeing how players like Versteeg and Fisher who produce 40-50 points are able to garner 1st round draft picks in trades, I think it is safe to say that Lombardi will have to surrender a 1st along with other assets if he plans to acquire a 20-30 goal scorer who can post 50-60+ points.

Penner, Hemsky, Booth, possibly MacArthur are trade candidates. Then there are not so glamorous options like Kovalev or Michalek.

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02-14-2011, 06:10 PM
  #379
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Originally Posted by Orenji View Post
Jesus christ, the Maple Leafs have a new 'Speculation: Brayden Schenn' thread. When will they just give up on him becoming a Leaf?

They're throwing out that Versteeg as a main piece of a deal is worth giving up Schenn; saying that his cup experience will help us in the long run over Brayden Schenn's inexperience.
Stumbled upon this thread earlier and glad you mentioned it here, but the crap that they were saying was epic laughable. Hilarious stuff!

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02-14-2011, 06:16 PM
  #380
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Anyone who thinks a first rounder is a high price for guys like versteeg Or Fisher need to pay more attention to the trade deadline. This is totally status quo.

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02-14-2011, 06:19 PM
  #381
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Anyone who thinks a first rounder is a high price for guys like versteeg Or Fisher need to pay more attention to the trade deadline. This is totally status quo.
Status quo for teams that think they have a shot at the cup.

Not sure what NSH thinks they are doing.

Philly is just another five-hole goal away from utter disappointment in the playoffs, but great teams don't need goaltending I suppose. We'll see what Bob can do in the playoffs. It's going to be some mighty fine comedy if the Flyers' goaltending lets them down again.

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02-14-2011, 06:27 PM
  #382
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Status quo for teams that think they have a shot at the cup.

Not sure what NSH thinks they are doing.
Nashville thinks they want to get better. Whether a team has a shot at the cup or not has nothing to do with the trade value asked for at the deadline, which is consistently a 1st round pick for anything above a good third liner/2nd pairing dman.

Cup contenders are just the teams that typically end up making the trades. Are they cup contenders so they can give away theirs firsts? Or always being willing to pay the price for talent what makes a team a cup contender?

A little from column A... a little from column B.

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02-14-2011, 06:35 PM
  #383
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Nashville thinks they want to get better. Whether a team has a shot at the cup or not has nothing to do with the trade value asked for at the deadline, which is consistently a 1st round pick for anything above a good third liner/2nd pairing dman.

Cup contenders are just the teams that typically end up making the trades. Are they cup contenders so they can give away theirs firsts? Or always being willing to pay the price for talent what makes a team a cup contender?

A little from column A... a little from column B.
If you don't have the talent to be a cup contender in the first place these deadline deals where overpayment occurs isn't the way to get there. I am happy that NSH is trying though. It means a kid that could be playing and contributing to their team in 3 or 4 years will being playing in Ottawa instead and what will NSH have to show for it.

Given the way the Kings' scouting department has picked kids lately, I don't want to surrender a 1st round pick for a player the calibre of Versteeg or Fisher.

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02-14-2011, 06:43 PM
  #384
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Originally Posted by Live in the Now View Post
If I'm Philly I do that Versteeg trade any time. Losing a pick from 20-30 hurts them in no way. Their NHL roster is nearly full, it's going to be hard for somebody else to break in.
You do? Why? What hole is Versteeg filling for them?

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02-14-2011, 06:47 PM
  #385
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Originally Posted by KINGS17 View Post
If you don't have the talent to be a cup contender in the first place these deadline deals where overpayment occurs isn't the way to get there. I am happy that NSH is trying though. It means a kid that could be playing and contributing to their team in 3 or 4 years will being playing in Ottawa instead and what will NSH have to show for it.

Given the way the Kings' scouting department has picked kids lately, I don't want to surrender a 1st round pick for a player the calibre of Versteeg or Fisher.
If Versteeg or Fisher fills the right hole (which they wouldn't in our specific circumstance), then you go for it, even if you are hovering around 8th.

At some point now has to become more important than the future.

Certainly you never want to totally ignore the future, but this is the year the Kings really need to make that shift from putting most of their eggs towards the future to putting more into their present. Have to start somewhere.

Also don't discount the effect trading a first for a good player (versteeg and fisher are good players, not great, but good... you're never going to get a great player for just a 1st round pick) has on a club's mentality. Letting the players in the locker room know that you care more about playing in May and beyond than you do about drafting in late June is important. You don't think the players know the difference between picking up scraps for future considerations or conditional picks and giving up something valuable? It has an effect, which is why every single last damn contending team at some point, BEFORE they become legit contenders, makes a bold move or two by taking a gamble on risking some future prosperity for present success.

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02-14-2011, 06:48 PM
  #386
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You do? Why? What hole is Versteeg filling for them?
The hole that you can never be too deep or too good.

Versteeg > Nodl on the third line.

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02-14-2011, 06:49 PM
  #387
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Originally Posted by KINGS17 View Post
If you don't have the talent to be a cup contender in the first place these deadline deals where overpayment occurs isn't the way to get there. I am happy that NSH is trying though. It means a kid that could be playing and contributing to their team in 3 or 4 years will being playing in Ottawa instead and what will NSH have to show for it.

Given the way the Kings' scouting department has picked kids lately, I don't want to surrender a 1st round pick for a player the calibre of Versteeg or Fisher.
The Nashville deal is very basic. They pick up one of the few players in the NHL who really wants to be in this hockey backwater. Kudos to Ottawa for making it happen- a truly class act. And, best to Carrie who seems like a genuinely nice person.

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Old
02-14-2011, 06:50 PM
  #388
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You do? Why? What hole is Versteeg filling for them?
He doesn't necessarily fill a hole but he gives them a great luxury of being able to roll three lines full of players who could all play a first line role and first line minutes. Injuries will definitely not be a problem this year for PHI. He's another PP option as well. He's also a better playoff fit than a player like Zherdev. They were going to trade their first round pick and given how good they are, the lack of sellers, and how low the pick is sure to be, I don't believe they could find a better forward. And with Zherdev a UFA at the end of this season, now they don't have to worry about paying a premium or messing with their salary scale for a top 9 forward in July.

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02-14-2011, 06:50 PM
  #389
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You do? Why? What hole is Versteeg filling for them?
Like someone said on the main board, Homer can't keep it in his pants.

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02-14-2011, 06:50 PM
  #390
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The problem I see here is that DL is not going to want to part with a 1st, meaning its prospects and/or roster players that go in any deal.

There is such a thing as playing too conservative. I think that is where the pendulum has currently swung. And with DL at the helm its likely to stay there for a while too.

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02-14-2011, 06:51 PM
  #391
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The Nashville deal is very basic. They pick up one of the few players in the NHL who really wants to be in this hockey backwater. Kudos to Ottawa for making it happen- a truly class act. And, best to Carrie who seems like a genuinely nice person.
Oh yeah, I get that part of what NSH was thinking. I just don't get the trade a 1st round pick for Fisher brand of thinking.

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02-14-2011, 06:53 PM
  #392
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Originally Posted by DIEHARD the King fan View Post
The problem I see here is that DL is not going to want to part with a 1st, meaning its prospects and/or roster players that go in any deal.

There is such a thing as playing too conservative. I think that is where the pendulum has currently swung. And with DL at the helm its likely to stay there for a while too.
Fine with me, we have more defensive prospects then we will ever be able to retain, lets make use out of them.

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02-14-2011, 06:54 PM
  #393
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Oh yeah, I get that part of what NSH was thinking. I just don't get the trade a 1st round pick for Fisher brand of thinking.
The worth of a top six player = 1st round pick

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02-14-2011, 06:56 PM
  #394
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Not sure what NSH thinks they are doing.
Can't blame them for trying to win their first playoff series in the history of their franchise. Not sure if they would have made the deal if Matt Lombardi hadn't been injured.

Preds got a bit of a bonus when the Devils tanked as they have our 2nd rounder from the Arnott trade. The pick is likely in the 34-40 range. If the talent level drops off after the top 15 as some think, I could understand them trading away a pick in the 15-20 range if they think they'll still be able to walk away with a comparable prospect with NJ's 2nd.

If combined with the Arnott trade:

Arnott (1 year remaining at 4.5 mil), 1st rounder (15-20) for Fisher (2+ years remaining at 4.2 mil and only 7 million total), 2nd rounder (34-40), and Matt Halischuk

For a team like Nashville who probably can't attract a ton of free agents, that's pretty good asset management.

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02-14-2011, 06:57 PM
  #395
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If Versteeg or Fisher fills the right hole (which they wouldn't in our specific circumstance), then you go for it, even if you are hovering around 8th.

At some point now has to become more important than the future.

Certainly you never want to totally ignore the future, but this is the year the Kings really need to make that shift from putting most of their eggs towards the future to putting more into their present. Have to start somewhere.

Also don't discount the effect trading a first for a good player (versteeg and fisher are good players, not great, but good... you're never going to get a great player for just a 1st round pick) has on a club's mentality. Letting the players in the locker room know that you care more about playing in May and beyond than you do about drafting in late June is important. You don't think the players know the difference between picking up scraps for future considerations or conditional picks and giving up something valuable? It has an effect, which is why every single last damn contending team at some point, BEFORE they become legit contenders, makes a bold move or two by taking a gamble on risking some future prosperity for present success.
Don't discount the effect of keeping the 1st and taking a very good player with that pick either. Also letting the players know (especially Kopitar, Doughty, Johnson, etc.) that it is on them to get this thing done sends the right message.

Look in the mirror boys.

Now as I have said before, if Dean can swing a deal trading from a position of strength (say Martinez/Muzzin and a 2nd) for something we need (many names possible, but for example Raymond or a similar young winger) then go for it. No need at this point to do it any other way.

Wait another couple of years when Kopitar is 25 and Doughty is 23, and I bet Dean will have changed gears somewhat.

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02-14-2011, 06:59 PM
  #396
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Originally Posted by Brodeur View Post
Can't blame them for trying to win their first playoff series in the history of their franchise. Not sure if they would have made the deal if Matt Lombardi hadn't been injured.

Preds got a bit of a bonus when the Devils tanked as they have our 2nd rounder from the Arnott trade. The pick is likely in the 34-40 range. If the talent level drops off after the top 15 as some think, I could understand them trading away a pick in the 15-20 range if they think they'll still be able to walk away with a comparable prospect with NJ's 2nd.

If combined with the Arnott trade:

Arnott (1 year remaining at 4.5 mil), 1st rounder (15-20) for Fisher (2+ years remaining at 4.2 mil and only 7 million total), 2nd rounder (34-40), and Matt Halischuk

For a team like Nashville who probably can't attract a ton of free agents, that's pretty good asset management.
As always, some excellent points.

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Old
02-14-2011, 06:59 PM
  #397
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Originally Posted by DIEHARD the King fan View Post
The problem I see here is that DL is not going to want to part with a 1st, meaning its prospects and/or roster players that go in any deal.

There is such a thing as playing too conservative. I think that is where the pendulum has currently swung. And with DL at the helm its likely to stay there for a while too.
You are accusing DL of being too conservative when you don't even know who is available or what the asking prices are!

There are very few sellers right now and there is no doubt that they are asking a premium for their players.

Are you advocating overpayment? If so, let me know b/c I've got some things I'd like to sell you...

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Old
02-14-2011, 07:00 PM
  #398
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The worth of a top six player = 1st round pick
Is Fisher really that much better than Stoll, cause I wonder.

Is Versteeg a top sixer hands down?

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02-14-2011, 07:03 PM
  #399
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Glad we didn't get Versteeg, if we were even trying, but not because of the return he got but because he's one of the worst puck hogs. Too many Kings fans get annoyed with Dustin Brown and the one-on-one moves. I can't imagine what would happen here if Versteeg were a King.

Move makes sense for Philly. They're going for the Cup and they will, probably happily, lose Zherdev in the off-season. Versteeg will fill that gap.

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02-14-2011, 07:03 PM
  #400
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Is Fisher really that much better than Stoll, cause I wonder.

Is Versteeg a top sixer hands down?
Neither of those guys is a top 6 player for teams still playing in May.

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