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ATD 2011 Draft Thread IV

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Old
02-13-2011, 10:35 PM
  #126
monster_bertuzzi
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I agree with 70's, Gainey's offensive ability (or lack thereof) is even worse in an AT simulation.

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Old
02-13-2011, 10:40 PM
  #127
Leafs Forever
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BraveCanadian View Post
That depends on if we're talking fantasy land hockey where you can have 3 finesse guys who were 100 point scoring lady byng winners taken at face value on a front line, or if we're talking about realistically built hockey clubs.

Those finesse guys would get murdered by my front line.

So for Gainey it depends on who he plays with and who he plays against. He can do those things for finesse players he is playing with and he can negate the other teams best player if he is matched up power on power.

Winning board battles, creating turnovers and winning loose pucks is "chipping in" offensively.
I'm not saying that you don't need that kind of stuff on your scoring lines. I'm saying that there are guys who can provide the kind of services Gainey does (though not his level of defense- which you really shouldn't need to the degree Gainey has for scoring line) for a scoring line that are much better than Gainey is offensively(thus making them much more suitable), since Gainey is one of the worst forwards in the draft draft as far as pure points kind of offense goes.

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Old
02-13-2011, 10:40 PM
  #128
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Quote:
Originally Posted by monster_bertuzzi View Post
I agree with 70's, Gainey's offensive ability (or lack thereof) is even worse in an AT simulation.
If we already know when everyone "should" have been picked, and it has already been decided how every player is going to impact fantasyland before we even see who he plays with and the type of team he is on.. what is the point of what we are doing?

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Old
02-13-2011, 10:42 PM
  #129
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Leafs Forever View Post
I'm not saying that you don't need that kind of stuff on your scoring lines. I'm saying that there are guys who can provide the kind of services Gainey does (though not his level of defense- which you really shouldn't need to the degree Gainey has for scoring line) for a scoring line that are much better than Gainey is offensively, since Gainey is one of the worst forwards draft as far as pure points kind of offense goes.
Yes but the point is that top 6 as scorers and bottom 6 as muckers isn't written in stone when building a team. Or it shouldn't be.

A line doesn't have to be a "scoring line" or a "checking line". In a lot of situations if you have a line that is mixed up it makes it more difficult for teams to line match you and you don't need to worry about who they are sending over the boards because you are flexible and not easily exploited by any single weakness.

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Old
02-13-2011, 10:43 PM
  #130
monster_bertuzzi
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BraveCanadian View Post
If we already know when everyone "should" have been picked, and it has already been decided how every player is going to impact fantasyland before we even see who he plays with and the type of team he is on.. what is the point of what we are doing?
Huh? I didn't even say Gainey was a bad pick, but Nighthawks should definitely use him on the 3rd line and set up an extremely effective checking line. TBH if he dropped to 200 I was thinking of taking him and *** *********, both 3rd liners.

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Old
02-13-2011, 10:44 PM
  #131
Leafs Forever
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BraveCanadian View Post
If we already know when everyone "should" have been picked, and it has already been decided how every player is going to impact fantasyland before we even see who he plays with and the type of team he is on.. what is the point of what we are doing?
Just because we know one's relative offensive ability does not mean we know where they should be drafted...

It hasn't been decided how every player will impact the ATD with full certainty, since we always find new stuff.

The only thing that is going on here is people knowing Gainey sucks offensively in this context. Which he does, as he makes by far the least offensive impact of any forward drafted thus far and will make less than a lot of forwards to come. That's fine. That's not his job. But it's a minus that some (such as myself) question, question it to the point they wonder if he should be taken now/should be used on any scoring line role.

Quote:
Originally Posted by BraveCanadian View Post
Yes but the point is that top 6 as scorers and bottom 6 as muckers isn't written in stone when building a team. Or it shouldn't be.

A line doesn't have to be a "scoring line" or a "checking line". In a lot of situations if you have a line that is mixed up it makes it more difficult for teams to line match you and you don't need to worry about who they are sending over the boards because you are flexible and not easily exploited by any single weakness.
You certainly have those kind of blends, but then Gainey is so one-dimensional (as in, so debunk of offensive ability) that I don't think a good blend line can be made around him. Just like how no line with, say, a Bure is really ever going to be a "blend" line as you speak, since Bure is so one-dimensional towards offense. Gainey's place, to me, is really likely on a very primary checking line (which can have some two-way ability, but it's probably not going to end up with much).

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Old
02-13-2011, 10:48 PM
  #132
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With the 176th pick in the 2011 ATD the New Haven Nighthawks select, Tommy Phillips, LW/RW.

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Old
02-13-2011, 10:52 PM
  #133
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Trade to announce:

To New Jersey Swamp Devils: Tommy Phillips, 414, 547
To New Haven Nighthawks: picks 251, 310, 491.

TDMM to confirm.

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Old
02-13-2011, 10:54 PM
  #134
TheDevilMadeMe
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Nighthawks View Post
Trade to announce:

To New Jersey Swamp Devils: Tommy Phillips, 414, 547
To New Haven Nighthawks: picks 251, 310, 491.

TDMM to confirm.
Confirm.

Already posted in the trade thread. I was impatient.

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Old
02-13-2011, 11:00 PM
  #135
EagleBelfour
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Tommy Phillips is definitely one of the most complete hockey player available at this point in the draft. My reaction is mixed as Phillips is now in my division: I think it's an awful lot to give for Phillips, but again, he's probably worth it.

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Old
02-13-2011, 11:14 PM
  #136
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Leafs Forever View Post
Just because we know one's relative offensive ability does not mean we know where they should be drafted...

It hasn't been decided how every player will impact the ATD with full certainty, since we always find new stuff.

The only thing that is going on here is people knowing Gainey sucks offensively in this context. Which he does, as he makes by far the least offensive impact of any forward drafted thus far and will make less than a lot of forwards to come. That's fine. That's not his job. But it's a minus that some (such as myself) question, question it to the point they wonder if he should be taken now/should be used on any scoring line role.
Thanks for saving me the time.


Quote:
You certainly have those kind of blends, but then Gainey is so one-dimensional (as in, so debunk of offensive ability) that I don't think a good blend line can be made around him. Just like how no line with, say, a Bure is really ever going to be a "blend" line as you speak, since Bure is so one-dimensional towards offense. Gainey's place, to me, is really likely on a very primary checking line (which can have some two-way ability, but it's probably not going to end up with much).
You show your youth when you misuse words like this

not a criticism, just a commentary.

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Old
02-13-2011, 11:30 PM
  #137
TheDevilMadeMe
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Not sure I'm putting them all together, but if I do, would Tommy Phillips - Henri Richard - Maurice Richard be the fastest line in the draft?

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Old
02-13-2011, 11:34 PM
  #138
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Originally Posted by TheDevilMadeMe View Post
Not sure I'm putting them all together, but if I do, would Tommy Phillips - Henri Richard - Maurice Richard be the fastest line in the draft?
Most teams hasn't finished building their first line, so it's a bit early to ask. It's definitely a very fast line though

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Old
02-13-2011, 11:35 PM
  #139
TheDevilMadeMe
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Quote:
Originally Posted by EagleBelfour View Post
Most teams hasn't finished building their first line, so it's a bit early to ask. It's definitely a very fast line though
True. Stupid question at this point.

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Old
02-14-2011, 12:09 AM
  #140
BenchBrawl
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Very surprised to see Gainey getting picked so early , especially when you consider some his teammates are still undrafted and clearly better player.I guess his defensive play is really appreciated that much.Personally I think defensive play alone is overrated.It's good to have with something else , but when it's almost your only weapon...

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02-14-2011, 12:49 AM
  #141
TheDevilMadeMe
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Some quick facts on Tommy Phillips aka "Nibs":

-One of the inaugural members of the Hockey Hall of Fame, and he didn't have to die as a player to do it.

-2 x Stanley Cup Champion (1903, 1907)
-5 x Stanley Cup Finalist (1903, 1904, 1905, 1907, 1909)

-Selected to The Hockey News’ pre-NHL First All-Star Team (in other words, THN considered him the best LW to play the game of the pre-NHL era)

Ultimate Hockey awarded him:
“Best All-Around Player” of 1900-1909
“Best Defensive Forward” of 1900-1909

Scoring:
5 x Top-3 in Points (1904, 1905, 1906, 1907, 1908)
2 x Stanley Cup Challenge leading scorer (1905, 1907)
3 x Led his own team in Cup Scoring (1904, 1905, 1907)

Quotes via Dreakmur:

Quote:
Originally Posted by Total Hockey
He could skate, shoot, and stickhandle, and was considered the best backchecker in the game…was generally regarded as the best player in hockey
Quote:
Originally Posted by legendsofhockey
He showed himself to be a speed merchant on the blades and had no peer as a backchecker
Quote:
Originally Posted by Lester Patrick, on choosing Phillips as the game's best LWer in history in 1925
My opinion is based on consistency of players over a period of years, and the fact that men selected possessed nearly all the fundamentals of an ideal player - physique, stamina, courage, speed, stick-handling, goal-getting ability, skill in passing, proper temperament and, above all, hockey brains
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hockey Hall of Fame
Hockey Oldtimers who could recall the game as it was played in the early 1900s agreed that he was perhaps the greatest hockey player they had ever seen…He had everything a good player should have: whirlwind speed, a bullet-like shot, stickhandling wizardry, and was regarded as being without peer as a backchecker
Quote:
Originally Posted by Honoured Members
Out west, he was often called the greatest player in the game
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ultimate Hockey
Virtually overnight, he was the talk of the hockey world. Stories were told of a speed demon from out west, a hockeyist “game” to the core. This man had a vast repertoire of skills, each of them polished to a glimmer. He controlled the puck exceptionally well, possessed a deadly shot, and had a knack for defensive pursuits, most notably the backcheck… He had a devastating shot. His blasts were often referred to as “cross fires”. At a tme when hockey fans argued on behalf of the (3 undrafteds redacted) as hockey’s top player, “Nibs” was easily the all-around pick of the litter

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Old
02-14-2011, 12:57 AM
  #142
seventieslord
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ReenMachine View Post
Very surprised to see Gainey getting picked so early , especially when you consider some his teammates are still undrafted and clearly better player.I guess his defensive play is really appreciated that much.Personally I think defensive play alone is overrated.It's good to have with something else , but when it's almost your only weapon...
I don't think he has any undrafted teammates who are clearly better, or better at all.

Quote:
Originally Posted by TheDevilMadeMe View Post
Some quick facts on Tommy Phillips aka "Nibs":

-One of the inaugural members of the Hockey Hall of Fame, and he didn't have to die as a player to do it.

-2 x Stanley Cup Champion (1903, 1907)
-5 x Stanley Cup Finalist (1903, 1904, 1905, 1907, 1909)

-Selected to The Hockey News’ pre-NHL First All-Star Team (in other words, THN considered him the best LW to play the game of the pre-NHL era)

Ultimate Hockey awarded him:
“Best All-Around Player” of 1900-1909
“Best Defensive Forward” of 1900-1909

Scoring:
5 x Top-3 in Points (1904, 1905, 1906, 1907, 1908)
2 x Stanley Cup Challenge leading scorer (1905, 1907)
3 x Led his own team in Cup Scoring (1904, 1905, 1907)

Quotes via Dreakmur:
http://www.hfboards.com/showpost.php...&postcount=329

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Old
02-14-2011, 01:23 AM
  #143
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I have a couple lists (DoMakc & LL), can anyone take em?

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Old
02-14-2011, 01:38 AM
  #144
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Stoneberg View Post
I have a couple lists (DoMakc & LL), can anyone take em?
Sure, I'll be on and off the Internet for the next 8 hours.

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Old
02-14-2011, 01:58 AM
  #145
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The Riots select center Joe Thornton.



3 time All-Star
2005-06 Art Ross and Hart Trophy Winner
Top 10 in assists 7 times (1,1,1,2,2,7,8)
Top 10 in points 5 times (1,2,3,5,8)

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Old
02-14-2011, 02:13 AM
  #146
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Quote:
Originally Posted by monster_bertuzzi View Post
I agree with 70's, Gainey's offensive ability (or lack thereof) is even worse in an AT simulation.
I think you guys are being a bit harsh on old Bob. It was a crime back in the day when Gainey would get taken in the top-100, but the guy does have the full package defensively, and he is a Conn-Smythe winner. I think he'll chip in offensively if he's on a strong line, at the very least by going to the net and hacking at loose pucks. He's not going to create offense, but he can contribute something. I figure Nighthawks drafted him to play the digger role on the GAG line, for which he seems pretty well-suited.

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Old
02-14-2011, 03:02 AM
  #147
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I'm very happy with my Fernie Flaman biography. He's my first selection where I now believe he's a good notch better than I thought he was. I knew he was tough, but never taught he was THAT tough and rough. I also taught of him as an one way, stay-at-home defenceman only, where I discover he could definitely chip in offensively with some good passes from time to time. The 1950's were definitely a strong era for defenceman, when you have to compete with Doug Harvey, Red Kelly, Bill Gadsby etc.. every years for honour, it's very difficult to distinguish yourself, and he did it more than I thought.
-----

Again, if you have any other information you wanna share, post it in here or PM it to me and I will add it to the biography.

The uncensored version can be found on the biography thread.

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02-14-2011, 03:03 AM
  #148
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With our fifth selection, the 157th overall in this year All-Time Draft, the Detroit are very please to select Monsieur Ferdinand Charles Flaman



Nickname: Fernie, The Bull
Height: 5'10''
Weight: 196 lbs
Position: Defense
Shoots: Right
Date of Birth: January 25, 1927
Place of Birth: Dysart , Saskatchewan, Canada

Stanley Cup Champion (1951)
Stanley Cup Finalist (1957, 1958)
EAHL First All-Star Team (1945, 1946)
Second All-Star Team Defense (1955, 1957, 1958)
Played in NHL All-Star Game (1952, 1955, 1956, 1957, 1958, 1959)
Team Captain (1955-1961)
Team Assistant Captain (1955)
Rhode Island Hockey Hall of Fame (1965)
Northeastern Hall of Fame (1989)
Collegiate Hall of Fame (____)
Saskatchewan Hall of Fame (____)
Hockey Hall of Fame (1990)

- Named the #88 best Toronto Maple Leafs players of All-Time by the book Maple Leafs Top 100: Toronto's Greatest Players of All Time. He played 3 1/2 seasons (228 games) with them


SeasonsGPGAPTSPIM
17910341742081370

Top-10 Scoring Among Defence (4th, 5th, 5th, 10th, 10th)
Top-10 Goalscoring Among Defence (3rd, 7th, 7th)
Top-10 Assist Among Defence (3rd, 5th, 6th, 8th)
Top-10 Penalty minutes (1st, 3rd, 3rd, 5th, 6th, 6th, 7th, 8th)
Top-10 Penalty minutes Among Defence (1st, 1st, 2nd, 3rd, 3rd, 4th, 4th, 5th, 9th, 10th)


PlayoffsGPGAPTSPIM
963481293

Top-10 Playoff Assist (10th, 10th)
Top-10 Playoff Penalty minutes (2nd, 4th, 5th)
Top-5 Playoff Scoring Among Defence (2nd, 3rd)
Top-5 Playoff Goalscoring Among Defence (1st, 3rd*, 3rd*)
Top-5 Playoff Assist Among Defence (1st, 4th, 4th*)
Top-5 Playoff Penalty minutes Among Defence (1st, 2nd, 3rd, 4th)
*Achieving these results with one goal or one assist


Awards Nomination:

James Norris Memorial Trophy:
1954-55: 3rd position (Doug Harvey) (-78.2%)
1955-56: 5th position (Doug Harvey) (-93.0%)
1956-57: 3rd position (Doug Harvey) (-78.0%)
1957-58: 3rd position (Doug Harvey) (-88.9%)
1958-59: 5th position (Tom Johnson) (-63.1%)

Fern Flaman Norris record without Doug Harvey on the ballot: 2nd, 2nd, 2nd, 4th, 4th


Quote:
Originally Posted by Legends of Hockey
Basing his game on discipline and a strong physical presence, Ferdinand Charles Flaman was one of the game's top stay-at-home defensemen in the 1950s. Although he contributed to his team's transitional game when needed, it was as an open-ice bodychecker and for his ability to clear opponents from around his goal that Flaman acquired his reputation.

Despite the load of players they acquired in exchange for Flaman, many Bruins observers panned the deal as a detriment to their club. Flaman fitted in with his new club and became renowned for his hitting. Later that spring, he played an integral role on the blue line when Toronto won the Stanley Cup.

During his second stint in Beantown, he took on a greater leadership role than previously.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Joe Pelletier's Greatest Hockey Legends
Ferny Flaman, the Scott Stevens of his day.

Flaman was a rugged, no-nonsense defenseman with the Boston Bruins and Toronto Maple Leafs for 15 National Hockey League seasons. He scored just 34 career goals, but Flaman was known more for his vicious body checking, his aggressive play and his uncanny shot blocking ability.

After establishing himself as a feared enforcer, thanks largely to memorable battles with the Leafs' xxx and xxx, Flaman never went looking for a fight, though he found more than a few anyways. He was always the first player to arrive on the scene should one of his teammates find themselves in any sort of peril.

Far more impressive than his fistic ability was his feared status in the bodychecking department.

Flaman developed a reputation as one of the leagues most feared hitters and classic defensive blueliners while in Toronto.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mike Wyman; Golden Years: Fern Flaman
Warren Zevon wrote a hockey song about a big farm boy from Saskatchewan. He called it “Hit Somebody,” a title that pretty much sums up Fern Flaman’s career. A big, strong kid from Saskatchewan’s farm country.

The 5-foot-10, 190-pounder joined a team that featured the kraut Line of Schmidt, xxx and xxx up front and was backstopped by Frank Brimsek in nets. Flaman’s role was a simple one. As a stay-at-home defenceman he was charged with defending his territory against invaders by whatever means necessary.

With both the physique and the attitude needed, he did the job for the next three complete seasons. Flaman flattened forwards coming too close to the Bruins net and laid others out in open ice with body checks that made many opponents reluctant to return to his side of the ice. When it was bare-knuckle time, Flaman administered more than a few thrashings to pugilistic foes, carving out a reputation as one of the NHL’s top brawlers that would follow him for the rest of his career.

Flaman’s robust approach was a major contribution to the Leafs success the next spring as they rolled over his old mates from Boston in five games.

Back in black, Flaman showed that he had a few offensive skills, picking up 18 points in 1954-55, the most he had put on the score sheet as a big leaguer while continuing to be a guy opposing forwards kept an eye out for when they crossed the Boston blue line.

Named captain upon Milt Schmidt’s retirement, Flaman kept the C for the rest of his Boston tenure, a forceful presence who led by example and took his somewhat underpowered team into the playoffs in three of the next six seasons.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Who's Who in Hockey
Before Bobby Orr and the Big Bad Bruins came along in the late 1960's, the Boston hockey club was notorious as a bashing sextet. From 1954 through 1961, it's chief basher was defenseman Ferdinand Charles Flaman, a smooth-skating defenseman who broke into hockey as a teenager during World War II.

Rare was the night when Flaman lost a fight. He decisioned Rangers' badman xxx at Madison Square Garden and once nearly killed Montreal's Henri Richard with a devastating, but legal body check during a game at Boston Garden.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Joseph R. Beare; Boston's Fern Flaman: The consummate Bruin and Husky (1/31/2007)
Flaman, who is famous both for his storied NHL career and his 19-year tenure as a division one NCAA coach, retired from hockey in 1989, but left a mark on Boston sports history that will not soon fade.

Born on January 25, 1927, in Dysart, Saskatchewan, Flaman quickly developed into a hard-nosed and steady stay-at-home defenseman. Flaman was famous for his grit and character.

In the "Original Six" era, teams often played each other in back-to-back games, so resentment from previous nights would invariably spill over to the next contest. Flaman did not take lightly any slights against his club and was notorious for having his gloves off, and his stick cast aside, before the finish of the national anthems.

His willingness to battle for teammates and refusal to shy away from the rough aspects of the game made him a perfect candidate for Bruins captaincy and he served as Boston’s leader from his return in 1955 until his retirement in 1961.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Fred Cusick: voice of the Bruins
From the outset, Fernie was a fan favorite. He was a hard-hitting defenseman who could deliver open ice body checks and keep the front of the net clear.
Quote:
Originally Posted by The Bruins Black and White: 1924-1966
When it came to defending the territory in front of the net, Fernie Flaman gave no quarter. Flaman fought battles with some of the premier hard hitters of the era: Rocket Richard, Ted Lindsay and xxx.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Boston Bruins: Greatest Moment and Players
Fernie achieved permanent status in 1946-47 with the Bruins and became an instant favorite in Beantown, where his lusty bodychecks and potent fists endeared him to the Boston Garden faithful.

Thus, it seemed eminently appropriate that the Bruins reclaimed Flaman in a trade at the start of the 1954-55 season. Having matured while losing none of his mustard, Flaman added spice to the Boston backline that made him one of the most feared player in hockey.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hockey's Glory days: the 1950's and 6s
Fern Flaman was a tough, stay-at-home defenseman known for his powerful bodychecks and his ability to cleat the area in front of his team's goal.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Weekend Magazine (02/09/1959)
Strickly of the hockey hardrock is defenseman veteran Ferdinand Charles Flaman, captain of the Boston Bruins.

While an extensive sin-bin record dosn't carry an automatic stamp of greatness, it must be borne in mind that a bashing defenseman may influence people, but he hardly wins friends among opposition. It was recently figure that Fern has probably had more bouts on ice than Floyd Patterson has had in the ring. nd it must be added that Fern dosn't pick his spots - among those with whom he has slashed have been ''Rocket'' Richard, xxx, Beliveau, xxx, Harvey, xxx, Olmstead and xxx.

He has been a major star ever since. Boston likes his hockey in the bashing tradition of Eddie Shore and Flaman was made for Boston.

Quotes:

- ''When hockey players talk shop, they frequently discuss the matter of who is their toughest opponent. A note of something bordering on awe creeps into the conversation when the name Flaman comes up. It is not a question of fear, for Flaman is not a vicious player, but a question of knowing that Flaman can deal a devastating body check, that he is among the most competent of defencemen in the business, and that, if aroused, he is one of the most capable fisticuffers in the league.'' - Sportswriter Jim Proudfoot

- ''If there were slurs about him, we had guys on our Bruins, guys like Fern Flaman and xxx, that would go right after them.'' - xxx, on Willie O'Ree

- ''Hockey players are rough, but they are clean. One who isn't wouldn't last long against the rough competition in the NHL. From what I have seen and from what I hear other players say, Fern Flaman of the Bruins is the roughest. Some of his own teammates agree with me and they ought to know.'' - Tom Johnson

- ''I think almost every team had a tough fella you had to be careful of. Not necessarily for fighting, but for bodychecking. Pierre Pilote. Fernie Flaman. xxx. xxx. Doug Harvey in Montreal. - Andy Bathgate on the toughest competitor in his time

- ''Fernie was a solid bodychecker and was a his best when things were rough.'' - Milt Schmidt

- ''I was pretty cocky then, so I hit him and he fell down. He was mad after that. That turned out to be one of the biggest mistake I have ever made, because every time we played Boston he used to nail me two or three time during the game. Flaman was the toughest player I ever came up against. He wasn't too dirty against me, but he hit me every chance he got.'' - xxx

- ''I think the roughest player in the league is Fernie Flaman.'' - xxx

- ''That Flaman, he bothers me more than anybody else in our league. I can't think or anyone else who gives me such a bad time. He always got his stick between my legs or hooks my stick or something.'' - Henri Richard

- ''Any other player I do not worry about, but when I go near that fellow, believe me I look over my shoulder.'' - Jean Béliveau

- ''He's the toughest defenseman I ever played against.'' - Gordie Howe


Biography & Personal Life:
*Achnowledgement: part of this biography is taken words for words from the book Boston Bruins: Greatest Moment and Players. I peppered some additional information on top of the original article.

''My first hockey was played on outdoor rinks. I'd spend as much time as possible and listen to any person who could give me advice about the game. There was one fellow in town, who worked for the fire-department and was a hockey bird-dog on the side, who recommended me. I would up on the Bruins chain - they had a farm team in the Eastern League called the Boston Olympics - but they had too many players, so they loaned me to another team in the Eastern League called the Brooklyn Crescents. Next thing I know, I'm playing against the Curtis Bay, Maryland Coast Guard Cutters, a wartime club that had NHL stats such as Frankie Brimsek of the Bruins, xxx of the Blackhawks and Art Coulter of the Rangers. What a thrill that was; the first time I had ever been exposed to NHL players and I'm skating against them. I was in awe.''

When an opening developed on the Boston Olympics, Flaman took the train to Beantown and wore the white jersey with the winged crest and soon became a fixture at Boston Garden: ''They paid me 75$ a week,'' he recalled. ''I played for the Olympics for three years in one heck of a league. We'd go in to Madison Square Garden and play the New York Rovers and there would be crowds as big of those the Rangers got.''

Flaman improved to the point where the Bruins organization moved him to the highest minor league club, the Hershey Bears of the American Hockey League. He realized that it would only be a matter of time before he replaced one of the older Bruins' defenseman. ''There's a real touch of irony here,'' Flaman explained. ''When I was a kid, playing peewee hockey in Saskatchewan, we had numbers on our jerseys and we also had the names of an NHL player we hoped to play like. Well; the name on my jersey was xxx, who had been a terrific defenseman with the Rangers, then the Maple Leafs, and finally, the Bruins. When I was ran in Hershey, Babe was in Boston. The ironic aspect of the story is that when Babe was sent down to Hershey in 1946-47, I was the guy who replaced him. That sure made me feel strange.''

If Fernie wasn't the most popular Bruin, he certainly was always among the top three favorites at Boston Gardens. Considering his youth, Fernie had good reason to expect that he would be wearing the black and gold for several seasons. That's why the trade to Toronto stunned him to the core.

''The trade was the lowest point in my life,'' Flaman said. ''I had felt a part of Boston. I had played three years with the Olympics and nearly three more years with the Bruins. On top of that, it had been in the papers that I would not be traded, that I was an ''untouchables''. Next thing I know, I'm with the Maple Leafs.''

Flaman spent the next four seasons in Toronto. In his first year with the blue-and-white, Flaman played mostly beside rugged defenceman xxx. That season, Flaman won his first and only Stanley Cup in his illustrious career. After the Leafs outscored Flaman's former team 17 to 5 in the semi-final, they then triumphed over the Montreal Canadiens, also in five games. Every match needed a few minutes of extra time to bring things to a conclusion and Toronto won it on xxx’s last goal.

Upon the tragic death of playoffs hero xxx, Flaman was then paired with the equally rough-and-tumble defenceman xxx. During his years in Toronto, Flaman was less boisterous and did not seems the own thesame edge in his game when he was wearing the royal blue and white of the maple leafs. During the summer of 1954, GM Conn Smythe invited him into his office one day for a conference: ''He asked me if I'd like to go back and play for the Bruins. That was awfully nice of him, being that my wife was from Boston and my home was there. Yes, I told him, I would like to be a Bruin again. I respected Smythe for letting me know in advance where things stood. You don't find many people in sports as decent as he was to me.''

Flaman became a Bruin again in time for the 1954-55 season and, for Fernie, it was a golden period: ''The homecoming was great. I was named assistant captain and played under Milt Schmidt, who had been my teammate in the previous run with the Bruins. Working for Milt was good and the fans treated me just great. In 1959, while I still was playing, they tossed me a Fernie Flaman Night and presented me with a car and many other gifts. Getting the respects of the Boston fans and the Night was a highlight of my career.''

Off the ice, Flaman was on the quiet side, humorous and perceivable. In the summer, he worked in sales promotion for a floor-covering firm in Boston's Walpole district.

Like so many other hockey ''cops'', Flaman experienced little pleasure in relating his battles of yesteryear: ''They never were a highlight of my career. Of the guys I played against, Gordie Howe was the toughest. We didn't fight because we had a mutual respect for one another. But we both played it hard and I'm sure I received a few nicks from him, and I gave him a few too.''

Also, although he was known as the toughest defenseman in the league, Flaman did not necessarily want that advertised: ''I've got a wife and daughter to support,'' Flaman told reporter Herb Ralby back in 1948. ''I can't have everybody in the league after me which is what happens to a player with that reputation.''

Although Flaman never played on a Stanley Cup winner after he left Toronto, several of his Boston clubs were extremely competitive and twice reached the Cup Finals, losing to the powerful Montreal Canadiens in 1957 and 1958.

In the late 1950's, alongside Doug Harvey, Ted Lindsay, xxx and xxx, Flaman was one of the founders of the first players' association to be recognized by the NHL, the crude precursor to the union that was formalized in 1967.

Upon the end of the 1960-61 season, his last year in the NHL, Flaman's 1,370 penalty minutes were third in league history at the time of his retirement. Though he had trained himself for a career as electrician following his athletic career, he was not yet ready to give up the game he loved. He took a job as a player/coach with the AHL’s Providence Reds, where he is credited with playing a big role in developing a young xxx, later a Rangers’ net minding legend. Not only was he the team's best defenseman, but as coach he guided the Providence Reds to the league's best record in 1962-63. Most significantly, this experience in the AHL made Flaman discovered a passion for coaching.

After three years in the dual role and a fourth in a coaching capacity, Flaman moved on to become coach and general manager of the Fort Worth Red Wings of the Central Hockey League. Flaman then returned to the Bruins organization as a scout. His chief responsibility was assessing college prospects in the northeastern U.S., something that tided him over until a more permanent proposition came his way.

That proposition came in 1970 and Flaman accepted a position as the head coach at Northeastern University, a post he held for almost two decades. xxx, the famous Boston center of the 1960's, would be his assistant to Fern Flaman for 19 years.

Among his high points as a college coach was the ECAC and NCAA coach of the year award in 1982, one ECAC title and an appearance in the NCAA Final Four. He also won four Beanpot tournaments, symbol of hockey supremacy in the Boston area. Flaman’s influence on Northeastern’s hockey program is unparalleled as nearly every accomplishment in the history of the club was achieved with Ferny at the helm: ''If you look at the peaks of Northeastern hockey, it is all Ferny,'' laughed Jack Grinold, Athletics Director of Communications at Northeastern, who worked in the athletics department throughout Flaman’s entire tenure. ''We have only won four Beanpots; Ferny won ‘em all. He coached here longer than any coach, 19 years, and had more victories than anyone else.'' Indeed, when Flaman announced his retirement from coaching on Valentine’s Day of 1989, he registered an amassing a 255–301–23 record with the club.

But Flaman’s road to success at the collegiate level did not pass without sadness. In 1984, his family was stricken by tragedy when his son, Terry, a former captain of the Harvard hockey squad, was diagnosed with terminal cancer. That year, the Huskies would advance to the Beanpot championship under Flaman’s guidance and, in what is remembered as one of the most poignant moments in Beanpot history, Flaman’s gravely ill son, by then confined to a wheelchair, was brought in to the dressing room before the contest to give his father’s team a pep talk. The Huskies then went out to the ice, dominated play and took home the coveted Beanpot trophy, but not before Ferny’s son was wheeled around the rink, clutching the cup victoriously. Unfortunately, Terry passed away a few months after the events.

Aside from being a legend behind the bench, Ferny also possessed a quick wit and a sharp business mind: ''During the 80s, at one time we wanted to measure the effectiveness of our coaches as business men, how they were handling their budgets,'' said Grinold. ''We had a coach who had a masters in business from an Ivy League college, and here Ferny who was without a high school degree. He was our most efficient manager, and our MBA graduate was our most inefficient manager.''

After his coaching career, Flaman couldn't get himself to take a break, and accepted a position as a scouts for the New Jersey Devils, a hob he would held from 1991 to 1995: ''I love scouting,'' said Flaman, ''I scout high school defensemen mostly. Kids around 17 and 18. But if I see a good forward, I'll put him in my report. It keeps me young.''

Flaman was awarded the highest honour of his career when he was inducted into the Hockey Hall of Fame in Toronto, in 1990. The fathers of two boys and a girl, Flaman will always be best remembered for the multi-faceted career that he led in the city of Boston. He defined leadership and heart throughout a career that spanned five decades, and his long-standing contributions to hockey in New England are immeasurable.


Fun & Interesting Facts:

- Flaman was a good amateur boxer in his teens
- A naturalized United States citizen, Flaman was only the third American player to play for the Maple Leafs. The first two were Doc Romnes and Roger Jenkins
- Gordie Howe recorded his first hat trick on October 11, 1953 in a game against the Toronto Maple Leafs when he fought Maple Leaf’s player Fernie Flaman, got an assist and scored a goal
- According to a poll taken of the six general managers in 1958 to determine the toughest player they had ever seen, Flaman appeared on every list.
- In late-1959, Andy Bathgate wrote a controversial article, mentioning Doug Harvey, Tom Johnson, Fern Flaman, Pierre Pilote, Ted Lindsay and teammate xxx as spearing specialists: ''None of them seems to care that he'll be branded as a hockey killer.'' (Bathgate was fine by the NHL for writing the article)
- For most of his career, either in Toronto or his second stint in Boston, Flaman pairing partner was xxx, who played a similar kind of game. They were one of the most feared duo of defenceman in the league.
- In 1995, Flaman won the Stanley Cup as a scout for the Devils


Miscellaneous:

- Once during a tense, rough and brawling hockey game, courageous xxx, one of the tiniest players in the National Hockey League, lost his temper and tangled with big tough defenseman Fernie Flaman. As they grappled, shoulder to shoulder, pint-sized xxx suddenly shouted a warning at his huge opponent who outweighed him by more than fifty pounds: ''Watch out, Fernie, or I'll bleed all over you!''


Signing, Trades & Injury:
- On November 16, 1950, Flaman was traded to the Toronto Maple Leafs by the Boston Bruins with xxx, xxx and xxx for xxx and xxx
- Flaman missed part of the 1953-54 season do to a groin injury
- On July 20, 1954, he was traded to the Boston Bruins by the Toronto Maple Leafs for xxx
- One night, Doug Harvey was stationed near Flaman and swung hard at the puck. He missed it but his follow-through caught fernie flush on the jaw, shattering it at several places.


Coaching:

SeasonPosition/TeamLeagueGWLTOutcome
1961-62Player/CoachAHL70363223rd East Div. 5th overall
 Providence RedsPlayoffs312 Lost quarter-final vs Hershey Bears.
1962-63Player/CoachAHL72382951st Est Div. 2nd overall
 Providence RedsPlayoffs624 Lost semi-final vs Buffalo Bisons
1963-64Player/CoachAHL72323553rd East Div. 6th overall
 Providence RedsPlayoffs312 Lost quarter-final vs Hershey Bears
1964-65Head CoachAHL72205025th East Div. 9th overall
 Providence RedsPlayoffs    No playoffs
1967-68Head CoachCPHL703425112nd South Div. 3rd overall
 Fort Worth Wings Playoffs1367 Lost final vs Tulsa Oilers
1968-69Head CoachCHL722329205th South Div. 8th overall.
  Fort Worth Wings Playoffs    No playoffs

- From 1970 to 1989, coached the NorthEastern University to a 255 wins, 301 losses and 23 ties records


Abbreviation:
AHL: American Hockey League
CHL: Central Hockey League
CPHL: Central Professional Hockey League
EAHL: Eastern Amateur Hockey League
ECAC: Eastern College Athletic Conference
NCAA: National Collegiate Athletic Association
NHL: National Hockey League
NU: Northeastern University


Videos:
http://www.legendsofhockey.net/Legen...eo&list=#photo

Internet Sites:
http://www.legendsofhockey.net/Legen...=P199002#photo
http://www.sihrhockey.org/member_pla...TOKEN=46058421
http://bruinslegends.blogspot.com/20...rn-flaman.html
http://insidehockey.com/?p=696
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fernie_Flaman
http://bruins.nhl.com/club/news.htm?id=447760
http://www.highbeam.com/doc/1P2-7647462.html
http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/vau...6581/index.htm
http://thebiofile.com/2009/07/biofil...andy-bathgate/
http://www.legendsofhockey.net/Legen...eo&list=#photo



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02-14-2011, 03:24 AM
  #149
monster_bertuzzi
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Funny how 5'10 190 was a big defenceman back then. Adjusted it's probably a 6'1 220 pound bruiser today.

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02-14-2011, 03:35 AM
  #150
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I'm getting the someone-just-drafted-your-favorite-player sinking feeling.

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