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What will it take for the Habs to be a contender

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Old
02-20-2011, 10:02 PM
  #26
Scotianhab
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Old
02-20-2011, 10:04 PM
  #27
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Originally Posted by InglewoodJack View Post
Dude, Gionta sucks this year
he can't be worst than Gomez and kostitsyn reunite together

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Old
02-20-2011, 10:08 PM
  #28
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Gionta is on pace for 28 goals this year and that, after a very rough start to the season. This would equal his second best total career-wise. Really, what are people expecting?

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Old
02-20-2011, 10:13 PM
  #29
Melvin Udall
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Originally Posted by WeThreeKings View Post
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Good post.............couldn't agree with you more!


Show me a team that consistantly finishes anywhere from the middle to the boottom of the league - and I will show you a team that consistantly drafts players who will keep them there!



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Old
02-20-2011, 10:16 PM
  #30
Bobby12345
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Asterix View Post
Gionta is on pace for 28 goals this year and that, after a very rough start to the season. This would equal his second best total career-wise. Really, what are people expecting?
28 goals is fine but at 5M$, I'd say he should provide more than 13 assists to go with that.
At this pace, he'll finish with 41 points... Not that uch cheaper per point than Gomez who people keep hammering.

Montreal isn't getting it's money's worth out of its top players being paid 5M$+

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Old
02-20-2011, 10:19 PM
  #31
HabbyGilmore
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How about an active GM.. good answer I think. Im getting bored waiting for the Habs to make a move.. I know theres still a week but c'mon.. if we need more then one or two moves then get to it already.. help now not later.

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02-20-2011, 10:20 PM
  #32
KILLger
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Now being serious for two seconds:

Pacioretty (great rookie season)-Plekanec (21st in scoring for C and great defensively)-Gionta (headed for +/-30)
Cammalleri (a great goal scorer)-Desharnais (possibly good playmaker)-Kostitsyn (highly skilled though inconsistent/take him away from Gomez)
Pouliot (produces when hot, hopefuly plays well again with Gomez)-Gomez (not going anywhere, sadly)-White (try and give energy to Gomez's play)
Moen (one more year.. meh)-Eller (should become good)-Darche (does all well, nothing excellent)

Markov (pray to god) - Subban
Spacek - Weber
Gorges - Carle
Picard

Price
Ramo

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Old
02-20-2011, 10:22 PM
  #33
Kirk Muller
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Coldplay View Post
Blasphemy.
I like Gionta and I feel Akosts and Gomez need to go way before him but when a team struggles this much offensively, there isn't really anyone safe. You can only have so many guys like Cammalleri, Plekanec, and Gionta in your top six. Its easy to fall in love with these types of players but the overall results just aren't their with this mix of forwards.

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Old
02-20-2011, 10:25 PM
  #34
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Quote:
Originally Posted by KILLger View Post
Now being serious for two seconds:

Pacioretty (great rookie season)-Plekanec (21st in scoring for C and great defensively)-Gionta (headed for +/-30)
Cammalleri (a great goal scorer)-Desharnais (possibly good playmaker)-Kostitsyn (highly skilled though inconsistent/take him away from Gomez)
Pouliot (produces when hot, hopefuly plays well again with Gomez)-Gomez (not going anywhere, sadly)-White (try and give energy to Gomez's play)
Moen (one more year.. meh)-Eller (should become good)-Darche (does all well, nothing excellent)

Markov (pray to god) - Subban
Spacek - Weber
Gorges - Carle
Picard

Price
Ramo
Bury Gomez - Sign Richards.

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Old
02-20-2011, 10:25 PM
  #35
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kirk Muller View Post
I like Gionta and I feel Akosts and Gomez need to go way before him but when a team struggles this much offensively, there isn't really anyone safe. You can only have so many guys like Cammalleri, Plekanec, and Gionta in your top six. Its easy to fall in love with these types of players but the overall results just aren't their with this mix of forwards.
Not having Markov in the lineup isn't the problem... it's the small guys... I hear ya. Yet they are still in the mix and highly probably are going to make it to the series in spite of Markov's huge loss and, last year - with the same core - they made much noise in the playoffs...

It's a rough patch but injuries stroke badly.

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Old
02-20-2011, 10:26 PM
  #36
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Originally Posted by flapshots View Post
28 goals is fine but at 5M$, I'd say he should provide more than 13 assists to go with that.
At this pace, he'll finish with 41 points... Not that uch cheaper per point than Gomez who people keep hammering.

Montreal isn't getting it's money's worth out of its top players being paid 5M$+
I'll never blame a shooter/goals scorer for not having enough assists, as they are often not known for being passers. Gionta is not a play maker.

Do yourself a favour and have a look at the guys who have more goals than Gionta. Then, look at how much they're making. Then come back with the recap. I promise you that you'll be surprised by the results.

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Old
02-20-2011, 10:26 PM
  #37
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nittany View Post
Bury Gomez - Sign Richards.
Ideally, yeah.

Not sure it's going to happen with all the "class" this organization has.

Richard can move up to 1st or 2nd liner and DD to 3rd. Then I think we got a great offense.

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02-20-2011, 10:29 PM
  #38
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Asterix View Post
I'll never blame a shooter/goals scorer for not having enough assists, as they are often not known for being passers. Gionta is not a play maker.

Do yourself a favour and have a look at the guys who have more goals than Gionta. Then, look at how much they're making. Then come back with the recap. I promise you that you'll be surprised by the results.
That or the guys looking for an improvement over Plek...

I'll help both. Plek naysayers: http://www.nhl.com/ice/playerstats.h...ewName=summary (21st in points for centers)

Gionta bashers: http://www.nhl.com/ice/playerstats.h...ewName=summary (11th among RW)

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Old
02-20-2011, 10:34 PM
  #39
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Quote:
Originally Posted by King Kool Aid View Post
CLEAN HOUSE at the senior Management Level.

Commit to a rebuild with youth...similar to the Oilers!

Habs have been trying to do a "Patch Job" for most of the last 20-30 years...it hasn't worked!

Sure....they won 2 Cups in the past 30+ years - largely on Roy's shoulders, but Roy is no longer playing and this team needs a new direction in order to become a true contender!




But Price will be better then Roy

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Old
02-20-2011, 10:34 PM
  #40
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Emelin is of course a what if but we could really use another very good well rounded defensive d-man to round out the top 4.

Of the three old defenders (I know Spacek is still under contract), it's though between Gill and Hammer but I think Hamrlik offers the most if he can be limited to 6th defender minutes and would be willing to get paid as such.

We really need a big, tough 1st line C more than anything else. Plekanec is our best overall forward but he's at his best when he can play his intelligent 2-way game and isn't forced to overcompensate on one end. Gionta works on the 2nd line but I feel that's way too undersized.

I feel like one of Desharnais and Eller has a future here. I really like both of them but while Desharnais is a great playmaker, I think Eller has a much higher ceiling. Hopefully we don't have to worry about that choice for a while...but that means somehow getting rid of Gomez..

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Old
02-20-2011, 10:37 PM
  #41
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Get bigger up front, or to quote Led Zepplin "The song remains the same." You need size and skill to do damage in the NHL.

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Old
02-20-2011, 10:44 PM
  #42
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Quote:
Originally Posted by KILLger View Post
Not having Markov in the lineup isn't the problem... it's the small guys... I hear ya. Yet they are still in the mix and highly probably are going to make it to the series in spite of Markov's huge loss and, last year - with the same core - they made much noise in the playoffs...

It's a rough patch but injuries stroke badly.
I didn't say small guys are the problem but the mix.

Montreal making the playoffs says more about the Eastern Conference and their division more than it does them.

They struggled making the playoffs last year when injuries weren't as much an issue and were also amongst the worst offensive teams in the league.

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Old
02-20-2011, 10:49 PM
  #43
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For those of you putting Markov in the lineup could you make it "A Healthy Markov" because the other version hasn't been working for some time now.

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Old
02-20-2011, 10:55 PM
  #44
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In a ideal World, Plekanec should be the perfect second line center. As was Koivu. The same could be said with Gionta who's a second line guy. Cammy I don't know yet but he looked like a super sniper last year so that depends with who he plays with. In short we may be looking at our big three forwards as second line guys, that means to be a contender we would need an entire first line.

That being said, without living in a dream World, having another strong body with skills on the first two lines(like say a Umberger) with a quality third defenseman to go along Markov and Subban(I've been talking about Erik Johnson for ages) and adding more grit on defense and on our third and fourth lines would make us a whole lot better in my opinion. Maybe near the Bruins.

Building and fixing a team must be a case of looking at the few things we need to compete and getting the players that would get us there. It's really not that complicated. If it's not Umberger, it can be Wheeler. If it's not Wheeler then find someone that fits the criteria of someone with cheap value with a strong body and skills. Andrei K and Eller can't fill that need.

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Old
02-20-2011, 10:59 PM
  #45
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A healthy Markov and Gorges would've have had a huge impact, not having them for so long hurts, but another top 6 player that is consistent (PLZ NOT PENNER) would totally help, ideally a big winger that can put in 60+ points, a tough player that can actually play and is willing to fight and a healthy def corpse can make us a competitive team.

now if I was Guathier here's what I'd do this off season assuming no trades happen from now until then.

Resign Markov 2 years 10 mil
Resign Wiz, but if he needs to be overpaid I'd let him go
let Hamrlik go
I'd trade Eller for Brouwer, something along those lines maybe add a pick or a prospect from our pov.
Acquire Chris Neil and for a late round picks
buy off Gomez and sign Richards if you dont get Richards try to go for Tim Connoly
sign Kenopka
trade AK and Moen for picks and such.

Price
Auld

Markov - Weber/Spacek
Gill - Subban
Gorges- Wiz

Pacioretty-Plekanec-Gionta
Cammalleri-Richards-Brouwer
Pouliot-Desharnais-Glencross
White-Kenopka-Neil

Getting Richards would be the hardest thing but with Gomez, Hamrlik and Akost contract we'd have lots of cap space and lots of room to up the ante.

I like this line up, lots of toughness, size and skill.

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Old
02-20-2011, 11:02 PM
  #46
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A complete overhaul.
From management to philosophy to players.

Keep:

Price
Subban
Patches

Every other player can be had for the right price.

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Old
02-20-2011, 11:03 PM
  #47
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More shooting luck. Another top-6 forward. And a healthy defense.

But mostly, more shooting luck. Their underlying numbers are excellent because they tend to carry the play at even-strength (something they haven't done in 15 years). But they haven't been able to buy a goal all year, even though their offense is leaps and bounds better than last year's.

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Old
02-20-2011, 11:24 PM
  #48
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We've had a bad stretch, and we're not contenders. But how can you say that? We went to the conference finals last year with the same GM and coach...
So tired of hearing the "But they went to the conf. finals" argument. All it proved was that Halak was incredibly hot.

99 times out of 100 the habs lose the 6th game against Washington playing the way they did. And 75 times out of 100 they lose the 7th too.

People are blinded by what was essentially a hot goalie performance and an ultimate defensive team effort against two teams with giant holes in their defense+goaltending.

As soon as Halak stopped playing like a mad men the habs folded like a cheap tent, they were barely even capable of scoring a goal against the flyers.

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Old
02-20-2011, 11:26 PM
  #49
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MathMan View Post
More shooting luck. Another top-6 forward. And a healthy defense.

But mostly, more shooting luck. Their underlying numbers are excellent because they tend to carry the play at even-strength (something they haven't done in 15 years). But they haven't been able to buy a goal all year, even though their offense is leaps and bounds better than last year's.
So, 1 top 6 forward and a healthier Markov, and you consider this team a contender?

Two Questions:

1) Define Contender
2) What kind of top 6 forward are we missing?

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Old
02-20-2011, 11:28 PM
  #50
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Originally Posted by E = CH² View Post
So tired of hearing the "But they went to the conf. finals" argument. All it proved was that Halak was incredibly hot.

99 times out of 100 the habs lose the 6th game against Washington playing the way they did. And 75 times out of 100 they lose the 7th too.

People are blinded by what was essentially a hot goalie performance and an ultimate defensive team effort against two teams with giant holes in their defense+goaltending.

As soon as Halak stopped playing like a mad men the habs folded like a cheap tent, they were barely even capable of scoring a goal against the flyers.
Yup. Habs are a middle of the pack team...nothing more, nothing less.

"Contenders" should never be mentioned in the same sentence as this team. And that's with a healthy Markov and Gorges.

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