HFBoards

Go Back   HFBoards > NHL Western Conference > Pacific Division > Edmonton Oilers
Mobile Hockey's Future Become a Sponsor Site Rules Support Forum vBookie Page 2
Notices

Tambellini (Edmonton) vs. Burke (Toronto) Development

Reply
 
Thread Tools
Old
02-20-2011, 02:12 PM
  #1
Coach Parker
Stanley Cup Champion
 
Coach Parker's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2008
Location: Vancouver, B.C.
Country: Canada
Posts: 12,640
vCash: 500
Tambellini (Edmonton) vs. Burke (Toronto) Development

Hey guys,

I posted this on the Leafs board in response to their comparison of the Leafs and the Lightning. I didn't think it was a fair comparison because of the assets Tampa Bay had at the time, and after doing some research I posted this on their thread. I thought some of you may find this comparison interesting.

If you really want to do a comparison between two teams then the best answer would be to compare Toronto to Edmonton. Think about it.

Both are Canadian teams who have stable ownership and management with the same level of fan support.

On July 31st 2008 Tambelinni took over as GM in Edmonton.
On November 28th 2008 Burke took over as GM in Toronto.

In 2008-2009 Edmonton finished with 85 points. (21st)
In 2008-2009 Toronto finished with 81 points. (24th)

Toronto drafted Nazem Kadri. (7th)
Edmonton drafted Magnus Pjaarvi. (10th)

Both narrowly missed the playoffs in their respective divisions.

Hemsky was Edmonton's top scorer with 66 points.
Jason Blake was Toronto's top scorer with 63 points.

Souray was Edmonton's top scoring defenceman with 53 points.
Kubina was Toronto's top scoring defenceman with 40 points.

Edmonton had two rookies play more than 10 games:

Reddox had 12 points.
Peckham had 0 points.

Toronto had eight rookies play more than 10 games:

Grabovski had 48 points.
Kulemin had 31 points.
Mitchell had 29 points.
Schenn had 14 points.
Williams had 7 points.
Oreskovic had 2 points.
Sifers had 2 points.
Deveaux had 1 point.


It is at this point that Toronto decided to re-tool while Edmonton decided to rebuild. The most notable move was Burke's addition to the team and the famous Kessel trade.

In 2009-2010 Edmonton finished with 62 points. (30th)
In 2009-2010 Toronto finished with 74 points. (29th)

Both finished in the bottom two spots in the NHL.

Penner was Edmonton's top scorer with 63 points.
Kessel was Toronto's top scorer with 55 points.

Visnovsky was Edmonton's top scoring defenceman with 32 points.
Kaberle was Toronto's top scoring defenceman with 49 points.

Edmonton had three rookies play more than 10 games:

Stone had 6 points.
Chorney had 3 points.
Peckham had 1 point.

Toronto had six rookies play more than 10 games:

Bozak had 27 points.
Gunnarsson had 15 points.
Stalberg had 14 points.
Hanson had 7 points.
Caputi had 6 points.
Rosehill had 2 points.

Both teams had the same assets available at the start of the tenure but it is clear that Edmonton chose to do the 'Oil Change' and supported a full rebuild complete with tanking for consecutive years. On the other hand Toronto has chosen to re-tool and build by acquiring young prospects in hopes of accelerating their chances for the playoff berth.

In 2010-2011 the Edmonton Oilers have 46 points.
In 2010-2011 the Toronto Maple Leafs have 57 points.

Hemsky is Edmonton's top scorer with 40 points.
MacArthur is Toronto's top scorer with 45 points.

Phaneuf is Toronto's top scoring defenceman with 15 points.
Whitney is Edmonton's top scoring defenceman with 27 points.

In 2010-2011 Edmonton has five rookies who have played more than 10 games:

Hall has 38 points.
Eberle has 31 points.
Paajarvi has 23 points.
Omark has 15 points.
Petry has 3 points.

In 2010-2011 Toronto has three players who have played more than 10 games:

Kadri has 6 points.
Rosehill has 3 points.
Aulie has 0 points.

If a comparison between two teams is being done, Tampa is a poor choice as they had many more assets than Toronto and it isn't fair to compare the two. By looking at the status of the two teams listed above, it is clear that Edmonton and Toronto were at the same juncture in 2008-2009 when they both decided to do their respective 'rebuilds' and 're-tools'.

During this process Toronto will have had 17 rookies play 10 or more games in a season while Edmonton will have iced 9 rookies.

Next year both teams will have had three years to produce their products and I believe that is when you will see the true results of each teams processes.

These two teams will be the best example of two similar teams in the same situation at one period of their franchises (2008-2009) taking two different directions with their development and we can more fairly compare the two GM's directions. So many people debate the re-build through the draft vs. the re-tool approach and these two Canadian teams are providing us with the best example possible to look at the two methods.

Cheers

Coach Parker is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
02-20-2011, 02:16 PM
  #2
Paralyzer
The Oilers Awaken
 
Paralyzer's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2006
Location: Edmonton
Country: Canada
Posts: 5,849
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Coach Parker View Post
Hey guys,

I posted this on the Leafs board in response to their comparison of the Leafs and the Lightning. I didn't think it was a fair comparison because of the assets Tampa Bay had at the time, and after doing some research I posted this on their thread. I thought some of you may find this comparison interesting.

If you really want to do a comparison between two teams then the best answer would be to compare Toronto to Edmonton. Think about it.

Both are Canadian teams who have stable ownership and management with the same level of fan support.

On July 31st 2008 Tambelinni took over as GM in Edmonton.
On November 28th 2008 Burke took over as GM in Toronto.

In 2008-2009 Edmonton finished with 85 points. (21st)
In 2008-2009 Toronto finished with 81 points. (24th)

Toronto drafted Nazem Kadri. (7th)
Edmonton drafted Magnus Pjaarvi. (10th)

Both narrowly missed the playoffs in their respective divisions.

Hemsky was Edmonton's top scorer with 66 points.
Jason Blake was Toronto's top scorer with 63 points.

Souray was Edmonton's top scoring defenceman with 53 points.
Kubina was Toronto's top scoring defenceman with 40 points.

Edmonton had two rookies play more than 10 games:

Reddox had 12 points.
Peckham had 0 points.

Toronto had eight rookies play more than 10 games:

Grabovski had 48 points.
Kulemin had 31 points.
Mitchell had 29 points.
Schenn had 14 points.
Williams had 7 points.
Oreskovic had 2 points.
Sifers had 2 points.
Deveaux had 1 point.


It is at this point that Toronto decided to re-tool while Edmonton decided to rebuild. The most notable move was Burke's addition to the team and the famous Kessel trade.

In 2009-2010 Edmonton finished with 62 points. (30th)
In 2009-2010 Toronto finished with 74 points. (29th)

Both finished in the bottom two spots in the NHL.

Penner was Edmonton's top scorer with 63 points.
Kessel was Toronto's top scorer with 55 points.

Visnovsky was Edmonton's top scoring defenceman with 32 points.
Kaberle was Toronto's top scoring defenceman with 49 points.

Edmonton had three rookies play more than 10 games:

Stone had 6 points.
Chorney had 3 points.
Peckham had 1 point.

Toronto had six rookies play more than 10 games:

Bozak had 27 points.
Gunnarsson had 15 points.
Stalberg had 14 points.
Hanson had 7 points.
Caputi had 6 points.
Rosehill had 2 points.

Both teams had the same assets available at the start of the tenure but it is clear that Edmonton chose to do the 'Oil Change' and supported a full rebuild complete with tanking for consecutive years. On the other hand Toronto has chosen to re-tool and build by acquiring young prospects in hopes of accelerating their chances for the playoff berth.

In 2010-2011 the Edmonton Oilers have 46 points.
In 2010-2011 the Toronto Maple Leafs have 57 points.

Hemsky is Edmonton's top scorer with 40 points.
MacArthur is Toronto's top scorer with 45 points.

Phaneuf is Toronto's top scoring defenceman with 15 points.
Whitney is Edmonton's top scoring defenceman with 27 points.

In 2010-2011 Edmonton has five rookies who have played more than 10 games:

Hall has 38 points.
Eberle has 31 points.
Paajarvi has 23 points.
Omark has 15 points.
Petry has 3 points.

In 2010-2011 Toronto has three players who have played more than 10 games:

Kadri has 6 points.
Rosehill has 3 points.
Aulie has 0 points.

If a comparison between two teams is being done, Tampa is a poor choice as they had many more assets than Toronto and it isn't fair to compare the two. By looking at the status of the two teams listed above, it is clear that Edmonton and Toronto were at the same juncture in 2008-2009 when they both decided to do their respective 'rebuilds' and 're-tools'.

During this process Toronto will have had 17 rookies play 10 or more games in a season while Edmonton will have iced 9 rookies.

Next year both teams will have had three years to produce their products and I believe that is when you will see the true results of each teams processes.

These two teams will be the best example of two similar teams in the same situation at one period of their franchises (2008-2009) taking two different directions with their development and we can more fairly compare the two GM's directions. So many people debate the re-build through the draft vs. the re-tool approach and these two Canadian teams are providing us with the best example possible to look at the two methods.

Cheers
Pretty much tells me to stay away from Toronto's way of 're-tooling'.

Paralyzer is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
02-20-2011, 02:19 PM
  #3
Lion
Gretzky to McDavid
 
Lion's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2009
Location: Edmonton
Country: Canada
Posts: 3,540
vCash: 500
We have suffer more but in the end it is worth it. I'd take our devlopment process over theirs because we have more top end talent and potenial.

Lion is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
02-20-2011, 02:23 PM
  #4
NGARV
Registered User
 
NGARV's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2010
Location: Edmonton
Country: Canada
Posts: 372
vCash: 500
The other thing you could add in, is that we have 18 mil in cap space. WE could have been using that to sign FA's on short term deals.

NGARV is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
02-20-2011, 02:24 PM
  #5
Coach Parker
Stanley Cup Champion
 
Coach Parker's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2008
Location: Vancouver, B.C.
Country: Canada
Posts: 12,640
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Evil Oilers View Post
Pretty much tells me to stay away from Toronto's way of 're-tooling'.
I am a person who thinks that three years is enough of an example, but the way that these two developed and made changes at the same time when they were both just outside of the playoff picture gives us years of comparison to work with.

Toronto could have a better team than Edmonton next year of some of the rookies with some experience start filling in the 2nd-4th lines.

Coach Parker is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
02-20-2011, 02:25 PM
  #6
Coach Parker
Stanley Cup Champion
 
Coach Parker's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2008
Location: Vancouver, B.C.
Country: Canada
Posts: 12,640
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by NGARV View Post
The other thing you could add in, is that we have 18 mil in cap space. WE could have been using that to sign FA's on short term deals.
I didn't want to add the cap space to the argument because it would go against the method that Tambellini is taking by playing the top drafted rookies this year and continuing to 'tank' while Toronto is adding pieces and prospects that will hopefully make an impact next season.

Coach Parker is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
02-20-2011, 02:34 PM
  #7
CanadianCommie
Cold North Comrade
 
CanadianCommie's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2006
Location: Sherwood Park, AB
Country: Canada
Posts: 10,568
vCash: 500
Interesting comparison, I would just say that the oilers' rebuild is probably only at the midway point, and that tambellini has pretty much rebuilt the entire organization's structure. We have a new farm team in a new city, almost 100% new support and coaching staff which has resulted in what I would categorize as a multi-level rebuild.

I think Toronto felt they could afford the re-tooling over a full blown rebuild simply because the whole system was innot nearly as bad a shape as edmonton's. Tambellini's approach was the right one for the situation, and burke's approach may have been the correct one, I just think it's too early to tell.

CanadianCommie is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
02-20-2011, 02:36 PM
  #8
oil slick
Registered User
 
Join Date: Feb 2004
Posts: 7,423
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Coach Parker View Post
I am a person who thinks that three years is enough of an example, but the way that these two developed and made changes at the same time when they were both just outside of the playoff picture gives us years of comparison to work with.

Toronto could have a better team than Edmonton next year of some of the rookies with some experience start filling in the 2nd-4th lines.
Next year is not nearly enough time. I would say the cornerstones of each franchise are:

Hall - 19
Paajarvi - 19
Eberle - 20
Gagner - 21

Kessel - 23
Grabovski - 27
Kadri - 19
Phaneuf - 25

the Leafs might be better next year, but of course the Oilers players have far more room to grow. Added to that, the Oilers will have a top 5 pick, who won't make an impact for a few years (as opposed to two late round firsts - not nearly the same value).

Wait another 2-3 years and you'll have an idea.

oil slick is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
02-20-2011, 02:43 PM
  #9
Coach Parker
Stanley Cup Champion
 
Coach Parker's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2008
Location: Vancouver, B.C.
Country: Canada
Posts: 12,640
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by oil slick View Post
Next year is not nearly enough time. I would say the cornerstones of each franchise are:

Hall - 19
Paajarvi - 19
Eberle - 20
Gagner - 21

Kessel - 23
Grabovski - 27
Kadri - 19
Phaneuf - 25

the Leafs might be better next year, but of course the Oilers players have far more room to grow. Added to that, the Oilers will have a top 5 pick, who won't make an impact for a few years (as opposed to two late round firsts - not nearly the same value).

Wait another 2-3 years and you'll have an idea.
Interesting point. I will enjoy watching the two develop and continue to see what approach produces the best results over the short and long-term.

Both have the young players in place and are just waiting for their prospects to develop at this point.

Coach Parker is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
02-20-2011, 03:00 PM
  #10
Eytinge
Registered User
 
Eytinge's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2009
Posts: 10,791
vCash: 500
Grabovski is 27? I always thought he was younger.

Eytinge is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
02-20-2011, 03:01 PM
  #11
Hugo Stiglitz
5-14-6-1
 
Hugo Stiglitz's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2010
Country: Canada
Posts: 1,213
vCash: 113
Edge to Tambo on this one.

Hugo Stiglitz is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
02-20-2011, 03:02 PM
  #12
oil slick
Registered User
 
Join Date: Feb 2004
Posts: 7,423
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Coach Parker View Post
Both have the young players in place and are just waiting for their prospects to develop at this point.
That's the point, the situations aren't the same at all because the young players are not at the same stage of development.

The Leafs young players have for the most part been around for a while. This is Phaneuf's 8th year in the NHL, and Kessel's 5th, and the Grabovski's 4th in the league. They might round out their games a little, but these guys are in their prime.

The point of going purely through the draft is not so that Hall, Eberle, Paajarvi, and *undrafted top 4 pick* can be better players in year 1 and 2, it's that they'll be better players in year 4.

oil slick is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
02-20-2011, 03:38 PM
  #13
Sloth Slothersons*
They cut my beard
 
Join Date: Mar 2010
Location: Planet Earth
Country: Canada
Posts: 5,329
vCash: 500
Wow, Whitney is still leading our defencemen in points? And also Hemsky which isn't quite as surprising.

Sloth Slothersons* is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
02-20-2011, 04:04 PM
  #14
jumptheshark
McDavid Headquarters
 
jumptheshark's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2003
Location: EVIL EMPIRE
Country: United Nations
Posts: 58,891
vCash: 0
On a few board this debate is going back and forth and a few people give the edge to the leafs

I look at players under 25, prospects and picks in the first 100 position in the draft. Leafs and oilers are head to head over the past 4 years in top 100 picks(something like 15 to 12 for the oilers) but the oilers have more picks in the top 50 then the leafs.

Leaf and burke supporters are over the moon at the two first rounders--but they will be in the bottom of the first round and I would not be shocked if they get packaged to get moved into the a 12 to 18 spot draft pick

__________________
"If the Detroit Red Wings are defying gravity" by consistently contending without the benefit of high draft picks, "the Edmonton Oilers are defying lift.

Welcome to Edmonton Connor McDavid--the rest of you HA HA HA HA HA HA
jumptheshark is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
02-20-2011, 04:06 PM
  #15
jumptheshark
McDavid Headquarters
 
jumptheshark's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2003
Location: EVIL EMPIRE
Country: United Nations
Posts: 58,891
vCash: 0
oilers got the depth

jumptheshark is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
02-20-2011, 04:17 PM
  #16
Pourinthecoal
Registered User
 
Pourinthecoal's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2009
Posts: 194
vCash: 500
Nice write-up. Didn't know the stats listed, and how similar our paths are. The comparison between Tambo and Burke is night and day, and the teams they are developing are also quite different. Burke likes attention, interviews, and lots of trades whether they are good for the team or not. He keeps the fans in it at least, and I'm sure Toronto fans love him as much as the rest of the hockey workd despises him. Tambo doesnt say anything, keeps everything under wraps with the Oilers, censor the media reseased, and will not trade unless its a necesity. Next year should be interesting with Burke trading for his picks back and seeing how this all ends up.

Pourinthecoal is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
02-20-2011, 04:33 PM
  #17
Meanashell11
Registered User
 
Meanashell11's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2003
Location: Greenwich CT
Country: United States
Posts: 2,100
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by oil slick View Post
Next year is not nearly enough time. I would say the cornerstones of each franchise are:

Hall - 19
Paajarvi - 19
Eberle - 20
Gagner - 21

Kessel - 23
Grabovski - 27
Kadri - 19
Phaneuf - 25

the Leafs might be better next year, but of course the Oilers players have far more room to grow. Added to that, the Oilers will have a top 5 pick, who won't make an impact for a few years (as opposed to two late round firsts - not nearly the same value).

Wait another 2-3 years and you'll have an idea.
Hemmer is 27 and Penner 28. Still part of the core if we want.

Meanashell11 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
02-20-2011, 04:37 PM
  #18
DousedInOil
Registered User
 
DousedInOil's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2007
Location: Katy <3
Country: Canada
Posts: 8,122
vCash: 500
Edmonton is miles ahead of Toronto and I'm not just being a homer either.

Hall >>>> Kessel
Eberle >>> Schenn
Paajarvi >>> Kadri
Hemsky >>>>> Grabovski
Larsson* >>>> Phaneuf
Penner >>>> McArthur
Gagner >> Kulemin

Average age of 21.7 vs an average age of 23.5. Toronto's 7 has also produced 203 points while Edmonton has also produced 203 points WITHOUT adding Larsson's point totals. Yes, I compared 5 forwards and 2 dmen to 6 forwards and 1 dman but considering how much younger they are (and that 4 of them are rookies or not even in the NHL) it bodes well for Edmonton.

Taylor Hall (19): 0.65 points/game
Jordan Eberle (20): 0.67 points/game
Magnus Paajarvi (19): 0.40 points/game
Combined average age of 19.3 with an average of 0.57 points per game.

Clarke MacArthur (25): 0.76 points/game
Mikhail Grabovski (27): 0.76 points/game
Nikolai Kulemin (24): 0.70 points/game
Combined average age of 25.3 with an average of 0.74 points per game.

That essentially means that our rookies have 6 years to try and produce a difference of .17 points per game. That means that they only have to increase their point totals by 14 points each in 6 years. So if they can each produce 2.3 extra points each year for the next 6 years we should be set.

DousedInOil is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
02-20-2011, 04:51 PM
  #19
Robbler
Registered User
 
Robbler's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2010
Location: London, ON
Country: Canada
Posts: 2,034
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by DousedInOil View Post
Edmonton is miles ahead of Toronto and I'm not just being a homer either.

Hall >>>> Kessel
Eberle >>> Schenn
Paajarvi >>> Kadri
Hemsky >>>>> Grabovski
Larsson* >>>> Phaneuf
Penner >>>> McArthur
Gagner >> Kulemin

Average age of 21.7 vs an average age of 23.5. Toronto's 7 has also produced 203 points while Edmonton has also produced 203 points WITHOUT adding Larsson's point totals. Yes, I compared 5 forwards and 2 dmen to 6 forwards and 1 dman but considering how much younger they are (and that 4 of them are rookies or not even in the NHL) it bodes well for Edmonton.

Taylor Hall (19): 0.65 points/game
Jordan Eberle (20): 0.67 points/game
Magnus Paajarvi (19): 0.40 points/game
Combined average age of 19.3 with an average of 0.57 points per game.

Clarke MacArthur (25): 0.76 points/game
Mikhail Grabovski (27): 0.76 points/game
Nikolai Kulemin (24): 0.70 points/game
Combined average age of 25.3 with an average of 0.74 points per game.

That essentially means that our rookies have 6 years to try and produce a difference of .17 points per game. That means that they only have to increase their point totals by 14 points each in 6 years. So if they can each produce 2.3 extra points each year for the next 6 years we should be set.

Robbler is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
02-20-2011, 04:57 PM
  #20
Coach Parker
Stanley Cup Champion
 
Coach Parker's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2008
Location: Vancouver, B.C.
Country: Canada
Posts: 12,640
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Pourinthecoal View Post
Nice write-up. Didn't know the stats listed, and how similar our paths are. The comparison between Tambo and Burke is night and day, and the teams they are developing are also quite different. Burke likes attention, interviews, and lots of trades whether they are good for the team or not. He keeps the fans in it at least, and I'm sure Toronto fans love him as much as the rest of the hockey workd despises him. Tambo doesnt say anything, keeps everything under wraps with the Oilers, censor the media reseased, and will not trade unless its a necesity. Next year should be interesting with Burke trading for his picks back and seeing how this all ends up.

Thanks!

At that point in 2008 both teams hired new GM's and went in entirely different directions. Whether Tambellini intended to rebuild through the draft or not that is what has occurred and whether or not Burke has had to rebuild through trades rather than the draft it is exactly what has happened.

The personalities also contrast but now we are seeing both teams enter their third season this fall with some tangible results and prospects to compare.

Coach Parker is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
02-20-2011, 04:59 PM
  #21
Coach Parker
Stanley Cup Champion
 
Coach Parker's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2008
Location: Vancouver, B.C.
Country: Canada
Posts: 12,640
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by DousedInOil View Post
Edmonton is miles ahead of Toronto and I'm not just being a homer either.

Hall >>>> Kessel
Eberle >>> Schenn
Paajarvi >>> Kadri
Hemsky >>>>> Grabovski
Larsson* >>>> Phaneuf
Penner >>>> McArthur
Gagner >> Kulemin

Average age of 21.7 vs an average age of 23.5. Toronto's 7 has also produced 203 points while Edmonton has also produced 203 points WITHOUT adding Larsson's point totals. Yes, I compared 5 forwards and 2 dmen to 6 forwards and 1 dman but considering how much younger they are (and that 4 of them are rookies or not even in the NHL) it bodes well for Edmonton.

Taylor Hall (19): 0.65 points/game
Jordan Eberle (20): 0.67 points/game
Magnus Paajarvi (19): 0.40 points/game
Combined average age of 19.3 with an average of 0.57 points per game.

Clarke MacArthur (25): 0.76 points/game
Mikhail Grabovski (27): 0.76 points/game
Nikolai Kulemin (24): 0.70 points/game
Combined average age of 25.3 with an average of 0.74 points per game.

That essentially means that our rookies have 6 years to try and produce a difference of .17 points per game. That means that they only have to increase their point totals by 14 points each in 6 years. So if they can each produce 2.3 extra points each year for the next 6 years we should be set.
Great stats to add to the continuing comparison but Aces pointed out one serious flaw in your comparison; Kulemin is a much better player right now that Gagner.

You have to remove your '>>>>>' in the discussion because they are entirely your opinion and have already discredited your post. By simply posting the stats you can let the facts speak for themselves over the next two seasons rather than relying on your opinion.

Coach Parker is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
02-20-2011, 06:10 PM
  #22
Joseppi
Registered User
 
Joseppi's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2008
Location: Kepler-22b
Country: Canada
Posts: 5,104
vCash: 131
Quote:
Originally Posted by Aces High View Post
Gagner is further ahead in his development than Kulemin at the same age. Keep in mind Kulemin is 3+ years older than Gagner, and you can see where the preference would be going forward.

Joseppi is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
02-20-2011, 06:20 PM
  #23
Eytinge
Registered User
 
Eytinge's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2009
Posts: 10,791
vCash: 500
Biggest difference? We have Taylor Hall as our franchise forward, you guys have Phil Kessel.

Eytinge is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
02-20-2011, 07:40 PM
  #24
sid49
#FreeGaza
 
sid49's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2009
Country: Canada
Posts: 1,926
vCash: 50
As a player Kessel is nothing to sneeze at. 36 goals as a 21 year old is pretty remarkable. Its his attitude that worries me, seems like an arrogant selfish person. Im rooting for Toronto to take the right path and begin rebuilding.

sid49 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
02-20-2011, 07:58 PM
  #25
Grod
The New Era Lives On
 
Grod's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2010
Location: Edmonton
Country: Canada
Posts: 7,440
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by TheStig View Post
On a few board this debate is going back and forth and a few people give the edge to the leafs

I look at players under 25, prospects and picks in the first 100 position in the draft. Leafs and oilers are head to head over the past 4 years in top 100 picks(something like 15 to 12 for the oilers) but the oilers have more picks in the top 50 then the leafs.

Leaf and burke supporters are over the moon at the two first rounders--but they will be in the bottom of the first round and I would not be shocked if they get packaged to get moved into the a 12 to 18 spot draft pick
He has already stated publicly that these are his intentions. He will be yapping through the media and creating a frenzy on the draft floor come June.

Grod is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Forum Jump


Bookmarks

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off



All times are GMT -5. The time now is 03:07 PM.

monitoring_string = "e4251c93e2ba248d29da988d93bf5144"
Contact Us - HFBoards - Archive - Privacy Statement - Terms of Use - Advertise - Top - AdChoices

vBulletin Copyright ©2000 - 2015, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
HFBoards.com is a property of CraveOnline Media, LLC, an Evolve Media, LLC company. 2015 All Rights Reserved.