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How good was the A. MacInnis-G. Suter pairing in their prime?

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Old
02-26-2011, 12:03 AM
  #1
Puckgenius*
 
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How good was the A. MacInnis-G. Suter pairing in their prime?

Would you say it was very similar to the current Weber-Suter pairing today?

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02-26-2011, 12:40 AM
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Blades of Glory
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Gary Suter was never as good of a defenseman as either Shea Weber or Ryan Suter is currently. What makes the Suter-Weber pairing so incredible is that they are almost dead-even in terms of performance and ability, and both are probably top-10 defensemen in the league. Gary was never a true #1 defenseman, something you could say that both Ryan and Weber are. But at the same time, neither one of the Nashville duo is likely ever going to become the player that Al MacInnis was. MacInnis was one of the five to ten best defensemen in the NHL for a span of almost 15 years. Between 1987 and 2003, a span of 16 seasons, MacInnis finished in the top-8 in Norris Trophy voting 10 times, including winning it in 1999, and finishing runner-up three times; to Ray Bourque in 1989 and 1990 and Nicklas Lidstrom in 2003. He was one of the greatest all-around defensemen in NHL history, and is often overshadowed by his booming slapshot, which changed the league like few other individual skills have. The most fitting tribute to Big Al is that age 25, he was the runner-up for the Norris; at age 35, he won the Norris; and at age 39, he was again a runner-up for the Norris. He scored 66 points in his first full season and 68 points in his last full season 18 years later. It is longevity at it's finest.

As an overall pairing, I would say that Ryan Suter and Shea Weber were better. Especially at even-strength. MacInnis and Suter were far more lethal on the powerplay, but even then, most of that is due to MacInnis. The difference between the two pairings is, while Al MacInnis was by far the best defenseman out of the four discussed, Weber and Ryan Suter are already better than Gary Suter ever was.

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02-26-2011, 12:47 AM
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blogofmike
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I should say that the only full Preds game I've seen this year was a December-ish poor showing against Ottawa, but even still MacInnis and Uncle Gary were both offensive threats for d-men.

Weber goes two ways and may wind up in the HHOF like both MacInnis and Suter did. He's still several years away from that though.

The younger Suter is solid, but nothing special on offense. Plus he has yet to shove his stick in the back of Crosby, head of Iginla, and face of Alexander Semin. (Equivalents to Gretzky 91, Kariya 98, random Russian guy 87.)

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02-26-2011, 12:51 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by blogofmike View Post
I should say that the only full Preds game I've seen this year was a December-ish poor showing against Ottawa, but even still MacInnis and Uncle Gary were both offensive threats for d-men.

Weber goes two ways and may wind up in the HHOF like both MacInnis and Suter did. He's still several years away from that though.

The younger Suter is solid, but nothing special on offense. Plus he has yet to shove his stick in the back of Crosby, head of Iginla, and face of Alexander Semin. (Equivalents to Gretzky 91, Kariya 98, random Russian guy 87.)
haha, gary suter was a cheap ***** on the ice. i'd have to say there is a comparison to be made between weber-suter and mac-suter but i'd take the later any day of the week.

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02-26-2011, 01:05 AM
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BenchBrawl
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Blades of Glory View Post
Gary Suter was never as good of a defenseman as either Shea Weber or Ryan Suter is currently. What makes the Suter-Weber pairing so incredible is that they are almost dead-even in terms of performance and ability, and both are probably top-10 defensemen in the league. Gary was never a true #1 defenseman, something you could say that both Ryan and Weber are. But at the same time, neither one of the Nashville duo is likely ever going to become the player that Al MacInnis was. MacInnis was one of the five to ten best defensemen in the NHL for a span of almost 15 years. Between 1987 and 2003, a span of 16 seasons, MacInnis finished in the top-8 in Norris Trophy voting 10 times, including winning it in 1999, and finishing runner-up three times; to Ray Bourque in 1989 and 1990 and Nicklas Lidstrom in 2003. He was one of the greatest all-around defensemen in NHL history, and is often overshadowed by his booming slapshot, which changed the league like few other individual skills have. The most fitting tribute to Big Al is that age 25, he was the runner-up for the Norris; at age 35, he won the Norris; and at age 39, he was again a runner-up for the Norris. He scored 66 points in his first full season and 68 points in his last full season 18 years later. It is longevity at it's finest.

As an overall pairing, I would say that Ryan Suter and Shea Weber were better. Especially at even-strength. MacInnis and Suter were far more lethal on the powerplay, but even then, most of that is due to MacInnis. The difference between the two pairings is, while Al MacInnis was by far the best defenseman out of the four discussed, Weber and Ryan Suter are already better than Gary Suter ever was.
Disagree.Clearly overrating Ryan & Weber OR underrating Gary.


Last edited by BenchBrawl: 02-26-2011 at 01:11 AM.
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02-26-2011, 01:18 AM
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vadim sharifijanov
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outside of the powerplay, i don't recall suter and macinnis playing together much, even after mccrimmon, who was suter's regular partner, left. macinnis i remember mostly with macoun.

they were the best powerplay duo i've ever seen though.

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02-26-2011, 10:01 AM
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Calgary's powerplay was scary good with them manning the point.

Probably among the best duos I have seen on the PP if not the best.

Very strong at even strength too when they played together but I remember them mostly for that crazy powerplay Calgary had.

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02-26-2011, 12:13 PM
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If people remember when Suter and Chelios were paired up on the PP it was a lot like that, only better. Suter was younger in Calgary and MacInnis was a better overall threat on the powerplay than Chelios. That shot.........my goodness.

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02-26-2011, 01:00 PM
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vadim sharifijanov
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funny thing is, suter was probably only the third best defenseman macinnis had as a teammate, after scott stevens in kitchener and pronger in st. louis. i don't think he played much with stevens as a pairing either, though.

but man, just thinking about that calgary power play makes me nervous as a canucks fan. macinnis' shot was something else. and suter knew just where mac wanted the puck, in addition to being great at keeping the puck in the zone and getting his own wrister to the net or his uncanny ability to pinch in and never get caught. and once those two got the puck to the net, there was joe nieuwendyk in front, or big joel otto, or later gary roberts. with those big strong guys screening the goalie, macinnis could often beat the goalie clean. or the guy in front had the reach and quick hands to either tip the shot or tap in a loose puck if the goalie made a save.

loob, joey mullen, theo fleury, all 50 goal scorers. brett hull could barely crack that powerplay when he was there. and they always had someone who could win faceoffs and gain possession on the PP, between nieuwendyk, otto, and gilmour. and before that group, they had reinhardt, kenta nilsson, and lanny mcdonald. it wasn't edmonton, but it still wasn't fair.

Quote:
"I've never played for a coach that enjoyed power-play work more than Bob," MacInnis said. "He would set aside a full hour and break up the team into two power-play units and two penalty-killing units. Each unit would play against each other for a minute and then switch. He just loved it. To me, he was ahead of his time in regard to teaching tactical hockey and the power play. He was an advanced student of the game.

"Under Bob, the Flames were always near the top power-play team in the NHL. We had at least one season when we were over 30-percent successful and that's unheard of. Just look at our right wings, Hakan Loob, Joe Mullen and Lanny McDonald. We had Joe Nieuwendyk and Joel Otto at center. Gary Roberts and Theo Fleury on the left side. Gary Suter was my partner on the other point for most of those years. We had so much talent and goal-scoring ability.

"We had great hockey players with great hockey sense. When you have that and a coach like Bob Johnson, it won us a lot of games."
http://flames.nhl.com/club/news.htm?id=453937

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02-26-2011, 01:37 PM
  #10
Rhiessan71
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Originally Posted by ReenMachine View Post
Disagree.Clearly overrating Ryan & Weber OR underrating Gary.
Agreed, Suter is getting shortchanged here big time.

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02-26-2011, 02:11 PM
  #11
TheShoe82
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It was a pretty decent pairing on NHL 95 if you used an all star team.

Honestly, that was the first thing that popped into my head when I saw the title of the thread.

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