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Is Datsyuk the most exciting player you have ever watched play?

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Old
03-01-2011, 09:32 PM
  #51
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Fugu View Post
But he was. Wasn't he the Wings leading scorer for most of that time, or right up there with Stevie and Shanny later. (Too tired to look up the rankings from those days.)

Are you trying to make a case for Zetterberg being in Fedorov's class of player? I personally don't think so because of how Feds got things done--- seemingly without trying at times and still being better than just about everyone on the ice. Z has to work harder and just doesn't have the skating + speed, and certainly not the puck control, or the slap shot.
No. But from Around '96 on Fedorov only averaged around 70pts per season and right around 28-30 goals (just quick glance). I guess my point is, that saying a player is only elite if they're top 5 in scoring every year or whatever the credentials people make up don't measure to past elites.

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03-01-2011, 10:22 PM
  #52
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Originally Posted by Fugu View Post
You guys seriously need to dig up some Feds highlight YT's. He was incredibly exciting to watch. Dats does have him beat on the work ethic side, except in the playoffs. Feds was a monster in the Cup runs.
I think there is a heavier lean toward Datsyuk in this thread than there otherwise would be, due to the fact that we are watching Datsyuk right now, while Fedorov is slowly fading from memory. That, and maybe some posters here were too young to fully appreciate Fedorov in his prime.

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03-01-2011, 10:25 PM
  #53
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I wish it was 5 cups lol
uhhh.
Woops.
But three cups in 5 years.

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03-01-2011, 10:31 PM
  #54
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Zetterberg's regular season's post lockout are superior to Fedorov's from 96-97 to 02-03. Sergei was in the mid to late 20's in pts per game during that time frame among his peers and Zetterberg is tied for 7th. Their +- was pretty similar though Z still holds a definite edge in that department, but I don't see how Z's regular seasons compare to Feds and the overall comparison itself doesn't make sense. Z's numbers in the playoffs are right in line with what he does in the regular season.


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03-01-2011, 10:42 PM
  #55
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Originally Posted by Fugu View Post
Come on, Huddy. Scotty Bowman played Feds on defense! Only guy I can think of that was a forward whom you could flip over to D and not worry. He won a couple of Selkes, while winning leading the team, iirc, offensively. I can see the preference for a style between these two, but no way is Datsyuk a better or more complete player.
I think it's hard to say definitively, one way or the other.

Lately, Heaton's been on a kick about Zetterberg being underrated around here. But quite honestly, I still don't think Datsyuk has ever gotten the respect he deserves.
Here's a guy who has led the team in scoring for six straight seasons. How many Wings have ever done that?
Here's a guy who has won three straight Selke trophies. How many Red Wings have done that?
He should also finish at least sixth on the Wings all-time scoring list. The one guy who he may or may not catch, oddly, is Fedorov.



Quote:
What I liked about Feds was the smoothness. Everything looked smooth--skating, turning, accelerating, scoring with a wrister, slapshot, from a afar or close, he was simply dangerous no matter where he was on the ice.

It was absurd how talented he was. And I LOVE Datsyuk, so don't even think it's just me being a Feds slappy too.

You guys seriously need to dig up some Feds highlight YT's. He was incredibly exciting to watch. Dats does have him beat on the work ethic side, except in the playoffs. Feds was a monster in the Cup runs.
Both are among my all-time favorite.
I have no patience for Fedorov bashers. But I just think Datsyuk has been too good, for too long to avoid the comparison.

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03-01-2011, 11:35 PM
  #56
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Huddy View Post
Its also crazy to note DRAPER & Dan Bylsma were drafted before Fedorov and Bure that draft
you can't say that in a vacuum. No one knew if Fedorov or Bure were coming over to the US, that's why they weren't drafted high.

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03-02-2011, 12:10 AM
  #57
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Originally Posted by Jussha View Post
Z's coasting in the regular season to me seems much different than Fedorovs, where Z seems to be conserving energy to make sure he is not banged up for the playoffs ideally, whereas Feds seemed to know that even if he coasted he was better than most players anyways so it didn't matter until the playoffs came
He was remarkably durable too, given that he often received top IT and always craved more.

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Originally Posted by Scottwood View Post
Zetterberg's regular season's post lockout are superior to Fedorov's from 96-97 to 02-03. Sergei was in the mid to late 20's in pts per game during that time frame among his peers and Zetterberg is tied for 7th. Their +- was pretty similar though Z still holds a definite edge in that department, but I don't see how Z's regular seasons compare to Feds and the overall comparison itself doesn't make sense. Z's numbers in the playoffs are right in line with what he does in the regular season.
Is there anything to be said for the era in which each guy was at his peak? Just like we can't compare the scoring of the 80's to the Dead Puck Era or today, what about the latter two?

And I agree with whoever it was that reminded us that Scotty's centers had to play two-way hockey and sacrifice their personal stats.


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Originally Posted by Captain Bob View Post
I think it's hard to say definitively, one way or the other.

Lately, Heaton's been on a kick about Zetterberg being underrated around here. But quite honestly, I still don't think Datsyuk has ever gotten the respect he deserves.
Here's a guy who has led the team in scoring for six straight seasons. How many Wings have ever done that?
Here's a guy who has won three straight Selke trophies. How many Red Wings have done that?
He should also finish at least sixth on the Wings all-time scoring list. The one guy who he may or may not catch, oddly, is Fedorov.

Both are among my all-time favorite.
I have no patience for Fedorov bashers. But I just think Datsyuk has been too good, for too long to avoid the comparison.

Yeah, me too. I think the only time we really could consider the comparison is after Datsyuk consistently played to a certain level. You can't take 2-3 yrs of one guy's career and compare it to Fedorov's prime and his tenure in Detroit of ~12 yrs?? As each year passes, you realize he's the real thing too, but remarkable in his own unique way. (He's a better pickpocket too btw.)

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03-02-2011, 01:33 AM
  #58
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Fugu View Post



Is there anything to be said for the era in which each guy was at his peak? Just like we can't compare the scoring of the 80's to the Dead Puck Era or today, what about the latter two?

And I agree with whoever it was that reminded us that Scotty's centers had to play two-way hockey and sacrifice their personal stats.
No, b/c I compared Fedorov to his peers. From 96-97 to 02-03 (or the years I guess some might have thought that he was taking games off in the regular season) he was 27th among qualified players in pts per game, right behind Shanny. Since the lockout, against his own peers, Z is tied for 7th among active players in pts per game and Pavel is 5th. They are also 1st and 3rd in +- among forwards and this all comes while having some of the toughest defensive assignments in the NHL.

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03-02-2011, 01:47 AM
  #59
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Originally Posted by Scottwood View Post
No, b/c I compared Fedorov to his peers. From 96-97 to 02-03 (or the years I guess some might have thought that he was taking games off in the regular season) he was 27th among qualified players in pts per game, right behind Shanny. Since the lockout, against his own peers, Z is tied for 7th among active players in pts per game and Pavel is 5th. They are also 1st and 3rd in +- among forwards and this all comes while having some of the toughest defensive assignments in the NHL.
To go from Yzerman and Fedorov to Datsyuk and Zetterberg... It leaves me speechless. 'How fortunate we are' is all that i can say.


And for the original question proposed in the thread: I think i might have to say yes. He's right up there with Fedorov and Forsberg for me. Fedorov in his prime was perfection on the ice. To have that much raw talent is just mindblowing. Watching Fedorov carry the puck through the neutral zone always had me on edge, because you just knew that with his skating he wasn't going to be impeded. Forsberg's ability to make it look like he had a special button that controlled the pace of the game always amazed me. I always got the sense that i was watching the game in slow-motion when Forsberg had the puck, even when he was flying. It was special. And in regards to Datsyuk, i mean, what can you say? His skill level is just stupid. It's not normal. His ability to regularly pull off maneuvers that i've honestly never seen before is [Once again i'm left speechless. I don't have a word that justifies my thoughts to finish that sentence.]

When Hasek wasn't on Detroit i was always fascinated by him. "What is he doing?" was a common thought that crossed my mind watching him play. It was exciting to watch him play with Detroit as well, but it's also a lot more nerve-racking which dampered the excitement for me.

Then you have your typical names like Lemieux, Jagr, Bure, Savard, Coffey, etc... Orr was way before my time, so i can't comment on that.


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03-02-2011, 05:15 AM
  #60
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Originally Posted by arwawr View Post
This would be Scott, right? I think the term beast is overused, but Scott Stevens was one. I have a massive amount of man-love for that guy.
Yeah, of course it was Scott. I also think Lindros was a beast. Bertuzzi as well.
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Originally Posted by Trevor Gillies View Post
Nah, but he's pretty exciting. Jagr, Fedorov and Lemieux are more exciting to watch.

edit: Hasek also. Wasn't around for Bobby Orr, but from videos I've seen, he looks very exciting to watch too. I'd pay $100 for an upper bowl seat just to have been able to watch him play once.
Another Hasek fan. I believe there are more Hasek fans here.

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Originally Posted by Dogkota View Post
I've been watching NHL hockey for about 22 years and the only other players who I can equate to Datsyuk in terms of excitement are Bure and Ovechkin. Datsyuk is the only player in the NHL at the moment who puts me on the edge of my seat every time he has the puck. He creates a chance almost every time he touches the puck and, more often than not, does something spectacular with it. Pavel Bure was the same way. Whenever he picked up the puck you could sense the anticipation and electricity in the crowd. It was the same way with Ovechkin the year he scored 65.

I sometimes find myself wondering what it would be like be a fan of another team when Datsyuk has the puck coming against you. There must be some impending sense of doom whenever he carries the puck across the blueline.
It would be good to hear what they say.
But I remember the games vs the Avs and I was very nervous when Forsberg was on the ice. You knew something dangerous would come up.

I also think Konstatinov and Kronwall should be mentioned. Those 2 with thier hits most certainly were exciting to watch.

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03-02-2011, 11:54 AM
  #61
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Not really a Wings fan here, but definitely a Datsyuk fan. I check the highlights of just about every single Wings game just to see if he's gotten up to anything new. I don't do that for any other player.

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03-02-2011, 05:48 PM
  #62
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I would say so. Everytime he touches the puck i expect one of those "whoosh" type crossovers and he usually delivers. Fedorov was extremely smooth but wasn't as creative with the puck IMO.


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03-02-2011, 05:52 PM
  #63
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Fugu View Post
He was remarkably durable too, given that he often received top IT and always craved more.



Is there anything to be said for the era in which each guy was at his peak? Just like we can't compare the scoring of the 80's to the Dead Puck Era or today, what about the latter two?

And I agree with whoever it was that reminded us that Scotty's centers had to play two-way hockey and sacrifice their personal stats.





Yeah, me too. I think the only time we really could consider the comparison is after Datsyuk consistently played to a certain level. You can't take 2-3 yrs of one guy's career and compare it to Fedorov's prime and his tenure in Detroit of ~12 yrs?? As each year passes, you realize he's the real thing too, but remarkable in his own unique way. (He's a better pickpocket too btw.)
Any player would score more if they only concentrated on offense, I'm sure Z and Datsyuk have sacrificed a lot of points with their commitment to defense. In Yzerman's case it was different because Fedorov, Z and Datsyuk have always been about defensive commitment, that wasn't the same for Stevie.

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03-02-2011, 06:03 PM
  #64
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Forsberg for me, he killed the Red Wings but on the other hand he gave me a lot of joy playing on Team Sweden. The combination of strength and skill speaks to me.

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03-02-2011, 07:22 PM
  #65
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Captain Bob View Post
I think it's hard to say definitively, one way or the other.

Lately, Heaton's been on a kick about Zetterberg being underrated around here. But quite honestly, I still don't think Datsyuk has ever gotten the respect he deserves.
Here's a guy who has led the team in scoring for six straight seasons. How many Wings have ever done that?
Here's a guy who has won three straight Selke trophies. How many Red Wings have done that?
He should also finish at least sixth on the Wings all-time scoring list. The one guy who he may or may not catch, oddly, is Fedorov.
only players who led DRW in scoring more than 3 times are howe (17), yzerman (11) and datsyuk (6).

howe: '51-'54, '56-'64, '66, '68-'70
yzerman: '84, '87-'93, '98-'00


3 times:
marty barry, syd howe, ted lindsay, marcel dionne, dale mccourt, john ogrodnick, sergei fyodorov, brendan shanahan.

twice:
carson cooper, herbie lewis, larry aurie, ebbie goodfellow, norm ullman, (probably zetterberg this season).

notably absent are sid abel (once tied with lindsay in '49) and alex delvecchio (never). abel's prime overlapped with lindsay's and syd howe's, and he missed 3 seasons b/c of WW2. delvecchio's prime overlapped with howe's and ullman's.

only cooper, aurie, ogrodnick and mccourt are not in HHOF.


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03-02-2011, 08:33 PM
  #66
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Originally Posted by jaster View Post
I think there is a heavier lean toward Datsyuk in this thread than there otherwise would be, due to the fact that we are watching Datsyuk right now, while Fedorov is slowly fading from memory. That, and maybe some posters here were too young to fully appreciate Fedorov in his prime.
Well it's Wings fans here and thus some serious Datsyuk fans. If this thread was the measuring stick you'd expect 150 points from the guy and a Selke as well. But really, he is a great all-round talent and a top 5 player in the league.

Whether it's enough for the Hall of Fame, who knows, he may have to keep it up for another 4-5 years.

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03-02-2011, 09:20 PM
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I tend to agree with the fact that Datsyuk doesn't always get the respect he deserves from Wings fans. I believe it's for two main reasons: his early playoff failures and his agent playing hardball with Holland after the lockout.


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03-02-2011, 10:01 PM
  #68
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Also, he's Russian. Also, he speaks very bad English and is rarely in the media.

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03-02-2011, 10:16 PM
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You guys hang around too many people who don't know hockey (or put too much stock in forum posters). I don't know anyone who doesn't give Datsyuk the respect he deserves. Early playoff performances, contract negotiations, speaking Russian, time in the media.... no Wings fans I know give a crap about that stuff.

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03-02-2011, 10:32 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jaster View Post
You guys hang around too many people who don't know hockey (or put too much stock in forum posters). I don't know anyone who doesn't give Datsyuk the respect he deserves. Early playoff performances, contract negotiations, speaking Russian, time in the media.... no Wings fans I know give a crap about that stuff.
Yeah but you've gotta wonder why it's always Zetterberg's name that pops up for the Hart and not Datsyuk's.

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03-02-2011, 10:50 PM
  #71
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Originally Posted by jaster View Post
You guys hang around too many people who don't know hockey (or put too much stock in forum posters). I don't know anyone who doesn't give Datsyuk the respect he deserves. Early playoff performances, contract negotiations, speaking Russian, time in the media.... no Wings fans I know give a crap about that stuff.
Dude,I'm not talking about forum poster. I'm talking about people in the Detroit area.

Datsyuk/zetterberg are nowhere near as well-known or as loved in metro Detroit as Yzerman, Fedorov and Shanahan were 10 years ago, or even as much as Darren McCarty was 10 years ago.

But speaking of forum posters, there are Wings fans who don't think have much respect for what he's already accomplished in his career. He's already an all-time great in Detroit hockey history, yet people don't view him as a guy who should have his jersey retired. "Maybe if he does it for another four years"

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03-02-2011, 11:01 PM
  #72
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Datsyuk/zetterberg are nowhere near as well-known or as loved in metro Detroit as Yzerman, Fedorov and Shanahan were 10 years ago, or even as much as Darren McCarty was 10 years ago.
I think that's because the Yzerman-era Wings won the team's first Cup in 42 years. By the time the team belonged to Datsyuk and Zetterberg, it had only been 6 years since the last Cup. The Yzerman-era guys gave people a reason to love the Wings again, Hank and Pavel have just maintained it.

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03-02-2011, 11:14 PM
  #73
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Yeah but you've gotta wonder why it's always Zetterberg's name that pops up for the Hart and not Datsyuk's.
Who puts Hank's name in Hart discussions? I've honestly never seen that.

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03-02-2011, 11:52 PM
  #74
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He's the prettiest.

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03-03-2011, 12:21 AM
  #75
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Who puts Hank's name in Hart discussions? I've honestly never seen that.
There was a lot of talking during the '06-07 and '07-08 seasons.

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