Burke doesn't want a truculant team, he has states that numerous times. He's said you need 3 scoring lines who are fast in todays game.
Brian Burke:
"We require, as a team, proper levels of pugnacity, testosterone, truculence and belligerence. That's how our teams play."
"I make no apologies for that. Our teams play a North American game. We're throwbacks. It's black-and-blue hockey. It's going to be more physical hockey here than people are used to.
Quote:
Originally Posted by mapes
Burke was asked to retool, not rebuild so he did as he was asked.
Are you calling Burke a liar?
"I'm not interested . . . in a five-year rebuild like some of these teams have done. Maybe because of my age, maybe just because I know it doesn't have to be five years because it wasn't in Anaheim.
Brian Burke:
"We require, as a team, proper levels of pugnacity, testosterone, truculence and belligerence. That's how our teams play."
"I make no apologies for that. Our teams play a North American game. We're throwbacks. It's black-and-blue hockey. It's going to be more physical hockey here than people are used to.
Are you calling Burke a liar?
"I'm not interested . . . in a five-year rebuild like some of these teams have done. Maybe because of my age, maybe just because I know it doesn't have to be five years because it wasn't in Anaheim.
He's fooling himself if he thinks that he can duplicate what he did in Anaheim! A lot of things came together for him there, it's not that easy or it'd be done more often. His arrogance is going to be his downfall! Sure he's good at trading, sometimes. He's also terrible at signing UFA's.
The Leafs are only in a slightly better position than when he took over because they have some youth now, unproven youth but at least they have young players in the system now.
He's fooling himself if he thinks that he can duplicate what he did in Anaheim! A lot of things came together for him there, it's not that easy or it'd be done more often. His arrogance is going to be his downfall! Sure he's good at trading, sometimes. He's also terrible at signing UFA's.
The Leafs are only in a slightly better position than when he took over because they have some youth now, unproven youth but at least they have young players in the system now.
But any GM in the league can bring in some young players and prospects if you give him 4 years. Maybe it has more to do with the people above Burke giving him more control than a guy like JFJ who has openly stated that he wanted to rebuild and get young but was not allowed.
Although Burke is very good at moving assets around by trades. He's as good at trading as he is bad at signing free agents.
But any GM in the league can bring in some young players and prospects if you give him 4 years. Maybe it has more to do with the people above Burke giving him more control than a guy like JFJ who has openly stated that he wanted to rebuild and get young but was not allowed.
Although Burke is very good at moving assets around by trades. He's as good at trading as he is bad at signing free agents.
Toronto will most likely finish in the bottom eight this year (hopefully ) Burke has pretty much fallen flat on his face with his not wanting a five year rebuild comment
Brian Burke:
"We require, as a team, proper levels of pugnacity, testosterone, truculence and belligerence. That's how our teams play."
"I make no apologies for that. Our teams play a North American game. We're throwbacks. It's black-and-blue hockey. It's going to be more physical hockey here than people are used to.
Are you calling Burke a liar?
"I'm not interested . . . in a five-year rebuild like some of these teams have done. Maybe because of my age, maybe just because I know it doesn't have to be five years because it wasn't in Anaheim.
How old are those quotes? The conference about Orr he said you need 3 fast scoring lines, not this top 6, bottom 6 stuff you used to.
"We're not interested in a 5 year rebuild, that's not what I'm being asked to do"
Typically it is ownership who asks for a rebuild or a retool. Since it effects greatly on sales. JFJ has stated he wanted to rebuild but was told not to. Why would it be any different?
Brian Burke:
"We require, as a team, proper levels of pugnacity, testosterone, truculence and belligerence. That's how our teams play."
"I make no apologies for that. Our teams play a North American game. We're throwbacks. It's black-and-blue hockey. It's going to be more physical hockey here than people are used to.
I agree about the whole "truculence" thing, that's one of the things Burke hasn't delivered on.
Regarding the 3 scoring lines, Burke said he's changed his blueprint from his previous "top-6, bottom-6" model.
Burke is called an arrogant blowhard that's too stubborn to admit his mistakes, but when he does change his stance he is called a liar.
Quote:
Are you calling Burke a liar?
"I'm not interested . . . in a five-year rebuild like some of these teams have done. Maybe because of my age, maybe just because I know it doesn't have to be five years because it wasn't in Anaheim.
What else is he going to say though? I can't see him saying "My bosses don't want a rebuild." People say that Burke should have rebuilt just like JFJ should have rebuilt. Maybe it's ownership that doesn't want to rebuild. I can't see see them going through all this trouble and spending all this money to hire Burke only to have him do the supposed tried-and-true-tanking method. If that was the case, they could have just hired somebody like Tambellini to stockpile 1st overall picks.
The people that bring up the "5-year rebuild" argument saying that it's going to end up being 5 years anyways, it's revisionist history. It's like if a team is fighting for a playoff spot all season and then miss by a few points, saying that since they missed the playoffs anyways it would have been better to tank and draft a star. It's easy to say after the fact when your team just played intense games with playoff implications instead of the games being meaningless for most of the season except for draft position.
This is what I got from Burke's comment about 5 year rebuild; that he didn't want to completely gut the team and sit back and draft top-5 for a number of years. Now I know people will say that's what ended up happening anyways, and I agree. The 09-10 season was a horrible season to go through, especially when the Leafs didn't receive the biggest benefit of going through such a dreadful season. The 10-11 season though, the Leafs were fighting for a playoff spot up until the last week or so in the season, and this season was looking pretty good until they hit this recent skid.
I agree about the whole "truculence" thing, that's one of the things Burke hasn't delivered on.
Regarding the 3 scoring lines, Burke said he's changed his blueprint from his previous "top-6, bottom-6" model.
Burke is called an arrogant blowhard that's too stubborn to admit his mistakes, but when he does change his stance he is called a liar.
What else is he going to say though? I can't see him saying "My bosses don't want a rebuild." People say that Burke should have rebuilt just like JFJ should have rebuilt. Maybe it's ownership that doesn't want to rebuild. I can't see see them going through all this trouble and spending all this money to hire Burke only to have him do the supposed tried-and-true-tanking method. If that was the case, they could have just hired somebody like Tambellini to stockpile 1st overall picks.
The people that bring up the "5-year rebuild" argument saying that it's going to end up being 5 years anyways, it's revisionist history. It's like if a team is fighting for a playoff spot all season and then miss by a few points, saying that since they missed the playoffs anyways it would have been better to tank and draft a star. It's easy to say after the fact when your team just played intense games with playoff implications instead of the games being meaningless for most of the season except for draft position.
This is what I got from Burke's comment about 5 year rebuild; that he didn't want to completely gut the team and sit back and draft top-5 for a number of years. Now I know people will say that's what ended up happening anyways, and I agree. The 09-10 season was a horrible season to go through, especially when the Leafs didn't receive the biggest benefit of going through such a dreadful season. The 10-11 season though, the Leafs were fighting for a playoff spot up until the last week or so in the season, and this season was looking pretty good until they hit this recent skid.
I hate to sound like a Leaf hater because I honestly don't have anything vested in them now that the Bruins don't have any picks on the line, but these last two seasons are fool's gold. The Leafs finished last season 6-3-1, and still wound up 8 points outside the playoffs. The NHL has intentionally designed the points system so that all but a handful team's fanbases feel like they have a shot at a playoffs far longer than it's actually a reality. The last two seasons might have "felt" like the Leafs were contenders for a playoff spot, but the numbers say otherwise. It's fools gold in today's NHL.
In a related note, I was listening to XM Home Ice yesterday in the car, and Boomer Gordon (I think it was him) was talking about the Leafs cap space for next season. I had no idea that they already had roughly $58million locked up in contracts without Kulemin or Gustavsson signed. Ouch.
I hate to sound like a Leaf hater because I honestly don't have anything vested in them now that the Bruins don't have any picks on the line, but these last two seasons are fool's gold. The Leafs finished last season 6-3-1, and still wound up 8 points outside the playoffs. The NHL has intentionally designed the points system so that all but a handful team's fanbases feel like they have a shot at a playoffs far longer than it's actually a reality. The last two seasons might have "felt" like the Leafs were contenders for a playoff spot, but the numbers say otherwise. It's fools gold in today's NHL.
In a related note, I was listening to XM Home Ice yesterday in the car, and Boomer Gordon (I think it was him) was talking about the Leafs cap space for next season. I had no idea that they already had roughly $58million locked up in contracts without Kulemin or Gustavsson signed. Ouch.
Yikes. Are you saying that any part of the 2009/2010 season can be considered fool's gold?
I think you're completely wrong. The rest of your post is fine but you're incorrect to say that a 2nd-last place team was ever "fool's gold." They were never close to a playoff spot so that doesn't mesh with the main point of your post.
Brian Burke:
"We require, as a team, proper levels of pugnacity, testosterone, truculence and belligerence. That's how our teams play."
"I make no apologies for that. Our teams play a North American game. We're throwbacks. It's black-and-blue hockey. It's going to be more physical hockey here than people are used to.
Are you calling Burke a liar?
"I'm not interested . . . in a five-year rebuild like some of these teams have done. Maybe because of my age, maybe just because I know it doesn't have to be five years because it wasn't in Anaheim.
His arrogant, smug attitude will be his undoing...he should build his teams quietly like the rest of the GM's...
I agree about the whole "truculence" thing, that's one of the things Burke hasn't delivered on.
Regarding the 3 scoring lines, Burke said he's changed his blueprint from his previous "top-6, bottom-6" model.
Burke is called an arrogant blowhard that's too stubborn to admit his mistakes, but when he does change his stance he is called a liar.
What else is he going to say though? I can't see him saying "My bosses don't want a rebuild." People say that Burke should have rebuilt just like JFJ should have rebuilt. Maybe it's ownership that doesn't want to rebuild. I can't see see them going through all this trouble and spending all this money to hire Burke only to have him do the supposed tried-and-true-tanking method. If that was the case, they could have just hired somebody like Tambellini to stockpile 1st overall picks.
The people that bring up the "5-year rebuild" argument saying that it's going to end up being 5 years anyways, it's revisionist history. It's like if a team is fighting for a playoff spot all season and then miss by a few points, saying that since they missed the playoffs anyways it would have been better to tank and draft a star. It's easy to say after the fact when your team just played intense games with playoff implications instead of the games being meaningless for most of the season except for draft position.
This is what I got from Burke's comment about 5 year rebuild; that he didn't want to completely gut the team and sit back and draft top-5 for a number of years. Now I know people will say that's what ended up happening anyways, and I agree. The 09-10 season was a horrible season to go through, especially when the Leafs didn't receive the biggest benefit of going through such a dreadful season. The 10-11 season though, the Leafs were fighting for a playoff spot up until the last week or so in the season, and this season was looking pretty good until they hit this recent skid.
It's really not. A lot of people questioned the unconventionality of what Burke was trying to do and realized it probably wouldn't work.
Yikes. Are you saying that any part of the 2009/2010 season can be considered fool's gold?
I think you're completely wrong. The rest of your post is fine but you're incorrect to say that a 2nd-last place team was ever "fool's gold." They were never close to a playoff spot so that doesn't mesh with the main point of your post.
Not even a little bit. The two years I'm referring to are this year and last year. Sorry for the confusion.
I still hear chatter here that this year was going great until a "recent skid" knocked them out of the playoff race. It's almost as comical as hearing Wild fans (where I live) tell me that they were the best team in the NHL until the injuries hit. Um, nope. Your requisite winning streak happened to occur at the beginning of the season. In today's NHL, good teams can withstand small skids and still make the playoffs. The bottom ten teams, by and large, are what they are...especially when you've almost completely avoided injuries to your core players this year like the Leafs have.
He's fooling himself if he thinks that he can duplicate what he did in Anaheim! A lot of things came together for him there, it's not that easy or it'd be done more often. His arrogance is going to be his downfall! Sure he's good at trading, sometimes. He's also terrible at signing UFA's.
The Leafs are only in a slightly better position than when he took over because they have some youth now, unproven youth but at least they have young players in the system now.
He came into Toronto thinking he could replicate the ducks quick 2 year road to becoming a cup contender. And is now realizing that the rebuild will be more like the 7 year walk through the Wilderness that he led the canucks through.
Also the current dislike for Burke, is coming from in part holding onto Wilson too long. There was built up frustration with Wilson as the leaf coach and the lack of holding him to account for the teams performance. By the time he was fired it was too little too late. And leaf fans are still frustrated with the leafs currently so the next person to direct their anger towards is Burke.
In short, if Burke was more proactive in his handling of the coaching situation he wouldn't be getting such a rough time now from loyal leaf fans now.
How old are those quotes? The conference about Orr he said you need 3 fast scoring lines, not this top 6, bottom 6 stuff you used to.
First, you're creating a false dilemma. A player can be truculent and score goals (See: Lucic).
Second, the Orr press-conference was like three months ago. Was the team particularly truculent for three years? No
Quote:
Originally Posted by mapes
Typically it is ownership who asks for a rebuild or a retool. Since it effects greatly on sales. JFJ has stated he wanted to rebuild but was told not to. Why would it be any different?
IF he told them a retool wasn't enough, they would most likely listen. Afterall, MLSE went after Burke hard and he had a ton of clout.
And, again, he himself stated he wasn't interested in a 5-year rebuild, citing his time with the Ducks.
No one realistic could have expected a quick retool to work.
) Burke has pretty much fallen flat on his face with his not wanting a five year rebuild comment 
