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2011 NHL Entry Draft/Other Prospects (All NON-RANGERS Prospect Discussion - Part 2)

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Old
04-23-2011, 12:11 PM
  #476
ECL
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I don't think Burmistrov will ever be anything more than a good 2nd line center. He has such little offensive awareness. I really think it's going to hamper him when all is said and done.

Tarasenko and Kuznetsov have proven nothing as of right now and neither has anyone else you listed. That's the point. It's been almost a decade since we've seen a new Russian emerge. It's scary.

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04-23-2011, 12:39 PM
  #477
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yakupov may go 1 and galchenyuk top 5 next year. both are considered to have nhl impact foward talent. i would say that both have a real chance to end whatever 1st round drought there has been.

burmy may not have 1st line talent but hes got the high end skills to be an impact player.

and 3 years from now tarasenko will be one of the best young players in the entire league.

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04-23-2011, 12:49 PM
  #478
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They are all potential until they show it. That's my whole point. The Russians as of late have left everyone wondering WTF is happening over there. Filatov was supposed to set the league on fire. Zherdev was one of the most skilled young ones in years. Etc., etc.

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04-23-2011, 01:07 PM
  #479
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Originally Posted by Jonathan. View Post
They are all potential until they show it. That's my whole point. The Russians as of late have left everyone wondering WTF is happening over there. Filatov was supposed to set the league on fire. Zherdev was one of the most skilled young ones in years. Etc., etc.
How is that any different from North American skaters? They are no different from Russians since they all potential until they show it too. Especially the Russians who play in the CHL like Khokhlachev, Namestnikov, Yakupov and Galchenyuk... how are they any different? They show the same potential.

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04-23-2011, 03:09 PM
  #480
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Tarasenko and Kuznetsov have proven nothing as of right now and neither has anyone else you listed. That's the point. It's been almost a decade since we've seen a new Russian emerge. It's scary.
I have not followed this whole thread so this may have been mentioned... What about Ovechkin?

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04-23-2011, 03:16 PM
  #481
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DatsyukSOGoal View Post
How is that any different from North American skaters? They are no different from Russians since they all potential until they show it too. Especially the Russians who play in the CHL like Khokhlachev, Namestnikov, Yakupov and Galchenyuk... how are they any different? They show the same potential.
It's very different. I don't even know how you can argue it. With the amount of players Russia produces, you very rarely see a 2nd or 3rd line talent come up. You see guys like Kulemin and Anisimov once in a while, but every other country is producing a number of players like them every draft.

Russia has been an anomaly for years now. It's why scouts are hesitant to take their players. Not just because of the fleeing North America potential. But because of the lack of results in the top end from them.

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04-23-2011, 03:17 PM
  #482
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Quote:
Originally Posted by msv957 View Post
I have not followed this whole thread so this may have been mentioned... What about Ovechkin?
I specifically mentioned players besides him and Malkin. The dearth of gamebreaking Russians has been reduced drastically over the last 20 years, I would say.

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04-23-2011, 03:19 PM
  #483
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For the record, I am mostly Russian so it isn't any bias against Russians. Just astounded at how bad my countrymen have been developing prospects as of late.

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04-23-2011, 03:21 PM
  #484
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Originally Posted by DatsyukSOGoal View Post
How is that any different from North American skaters? They are no different from Russians since they all potential until they show it too. Especially the Russians who play in the CHL like Khokhlachev, Namestnikov, Yakupov and Galchenyuk... how are they any different? They show the same potential.
I don't think anyone can accuse me of being a xenophobe or anything. I study Russian, speak Russian, and am currently writing a thesis on Russian literature.

That being said, Jonathon's point is a good one. Since the lockout, the only Russian to be drafted and make an impact is Nikolai Kumelin, who is a good player but certainly not a dynamo or anything. So in the '06, '07, '08, '09, and '10 drafts, only one Russian has as of yet become a noteworthy NHL player. Being wary of taking Russians may have been silly in the past, but it's gotten to a point where taking a Russian seems to be riskier than taking a North American.

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04-23-2011, 04:54 PM
  #485
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I don't think anyone can accuse me of being a xenophobe or anything. I study Russian, speak Russian, and am currently writing a thesis on Russian literature.

That being said, Jonathon's point is a good one. Since the lockout, the only Russian to be drafted and make an impact is Nikolai Kumelin, who is a good player but certainly not a dynamo or anything. So in the '06, '07, '08, '09, and '10 drafts, only one Russian has as of yet become a noteworthy NHL player. Being wary of taking Russians may have been silly in the past, but it's gotten to a point where taking a Russian seems to be riskier than taking a North American.
Ever hear of Artem Anisimov?

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04-23-2011, 04:55 PM
  #486
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so we locked ourselves into 15. hopefully we find a gem.

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04-23-2011, 05:08 PM
  #487
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so we locked ourselves into 15. hopefully we find a gem.
I'm definitely looking at Armia and Rask at 15.

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04-23-2011, 05:12 PM
  #488
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I'm definitely looking at Armia and Rask at 15.
At this point, we could probably target Rask with the #45 pick.

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04-23-2011, 05:21 PM
  #489
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Well, this is now officially top of mind.

Realistic list as of 4/23:
1A. Zibanejad
1B. Armia
1C. Scheifele
4. McNeill
5. Puempel
6. Biggs

HM - Grimaldi, JT Miller (dominating U-18), Brodin
Do not want - Saad, Rattie, Rask
Undecided (aka will trust Gordie) - Khokhlachev, Bartschi, Jensen

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04-23-2011, 05:24 PM
  #490
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Give McNeil or Scheifele.

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04-23-2011, 05:33 PM
  #491
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Zibanejad would be great, but I think he won't be available at #15. Maybe we can trade up a few spots with our extra 2nd.

Somehow I don't have good feeling with Bartschi, I'd rather hope for Armia instead

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04-23-2011, 05:35 PM
  #492
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I don't see any reason to compare the Russians that are coming out of the Canadian junior system with Russians like Zherdev and Filatov who were primed back home.

Zherdev and Filatov will not have any effect on my desire for the Rangers to draft Khokhlachev, in particular, and they CERTAINLY wouldn't scare me away from drafting Yakupov or Galchenyuk if the opportunity presented itself.

That said, I'm also not going to get down on Tarasenko because of Zherdev and Filatov, either.

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04-23-2011, 07:19 PM
  #493
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I don't see any reason to compare the Russians that are coming out of the Canadian junior system with Russians like Zherdev and Filatov who were primed back home.

Zherdev and Filatov will not have any effect on my desire for the Rangers to draft Khokhlachev, in particular, and they CERTAINLY wouldn't scare me away from drafting Yakupov or Galchenyuk if the opportunity presented itself.

That said, I'm also not going to get down on Tarasenko because of Zherdev and Filatov, either.
Would you say Khokhlachev is likely to be the BPA when we pick? Would you take him over Armia?

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04-23-2011, 07:36 PM
  #494
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Rangers picking 15th.

Don't see the following still around at 15.

1. Larsson
2. Nugent Hopkins
3. Landeskog
4. Couturier
5. Huberdeau
6. Strome
7. Hamilton
8. Murphy
9. Siemens
10. Armia
11. Zibinejad

That leaves possibilities such as:

Forwards--Biggs, Schiefele, Bartschi, McNeill, Puempel, Khokhlachev, Saad, Jensen, Jenner, Rattie, Miller

Defensemen--Brodin, Beaulieu, Oleksiak and Musil.

Kind of thinking Biggs is going to be going somewhere 12-14. Wondering about how good Oleksiak is?--I know most people are thinking offense but not sure that any of the remaining forward figures to be a 1st line NHL'er. Oleksiak has great size and was one of the final cuts for the USA WJC team. Also thinking a bit more about McNeill, Schiefele and Puempel but interested in knowing what people think about Brodin and Beaulieu as well.

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04-23-2011, 07:55 PM
  #495
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Originally Posted by Zil View Post
Would you say Khokhlachev is likely to be the BPA when we pick? Would you take him over Armia?
I don't know if there is going to be a clear cut BPA when it's our turn, and perhaps more than ever, I think it's going to be really tough to predict who is picked when in this year's first round, after the top 10 or so. I think 10-30 is a real crapshoot.

I do like him more than Armia, but more importantly, although he may not be a clear cut BPA, of the guys who stand to still be on the board at #15, I think it's pretty likely that he has the highest level of offensive skill.

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04-23-2011, 09:15 PM
  #496
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Worried we're going to get Johansen'd with Scheifele. Kid keeps going up, and up, and up...

Quote:
Rising

•Mark Scheifele (Barrie): His play at the World U-18 Championships is a classic example of a player who elevates his game when he gets to play with skilled players. Was in tough this season on a poor team in Barrie where he had no one to help him.
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Red Line has just returned from the all-important World Under-18 Championships, where players can make or break their draft status, and from a draft perspective the big winner — hands down — was Barrie's Mark Scheifele. The big center was rather hamstrung without quality players to work alongside in Barrie all year, but was a beast pivoting Team Canada's top line at the tournament in Germany. His great hands and skills were on display as he racked up six goals and created dangerous chances nearly every shift.

As a first-year major junior player on a poor club, Scheifele had some growing pains and a lot of learning to do this season. He's also nowhere near fully developed physically at 6-2 and just 175 pounds, but he has a great frame to fill out and should be a real load to handle once he adds about 20-25 pounds of upper body strength. In fact, we think so highly of his upside that we've moved him from just outside the first round on our rankings to a point where he's knocking on the door of the top 10 overall. At Red Line, we look for prospects whose development curve is headed straight upward – and Scheifele is one such player in this year's field.
http://www.usatoday.com/sports/hocke...ne-draft_N.htm

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04-23-2011, 09:21 PM
  #497
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Worried we're going to get Johansen'd with Scheifele. Kid keeps going up, and up, and up...
No way does he rise that much. I can see 8th-10th, and I'm sure if the Rangers really wanted him by then, they would trade up.

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04-23-2011, 11:34 PM
  #498
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All I know is that I will throw something through my TV if we pick another defenseman.

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04-24-2011, 12:07 AM
  #499
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I would love to trade up to take Ryan Murphy. What would it take to move up to say the No 8 spot?

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04-24-2011, 12:18 AM
  #500
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All I know is that I will throw something through my TV if we pick another defenseman.
True story. I want elite scoring talent and I want it now!

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