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Russia at the 2011 World Championship

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Old
04-30-2011, 09:35 AM
  #26
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NYR didn't let him

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05-01-2011, 05:47 AM
  #27
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NYR didn't let him
That is a disgrace. How is it they allowed Stepan and McDonaugh to play then ?

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05-01-2011, 08:34 AM
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Originally Posted by takharov View Post
That is a disgrace. How is it they allowed Stepan and McDonaugh to play then ?
dunno

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05-01-2011, 01:44 PM
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I really hope Barulin starts from now on. I'm saddened to say this, but Nabby is finished.

Man, I really hope they use this mediocre result as motivation to start playing the way they should.

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05-05-2011, 04:37 AM
  #30
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I really hope Barulin starts from now on. I'm saddened to say this, but Nabby is finished.

Man, I really hope they use this mediocre result as motivation to start playing the way they should.
Hey, will this meen that Ovi, Varlamov, and Semin free up ?
Without a chance I think mad Ovies coming if he isint hurt with his knee..

Would Bykov bench Nabakov and go with the Tandem of Varla-Barulin?

whatbout Bobrovsky??

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05-08-2011, 02:20 PM
  #31
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I really hope Barulin starts from now on. I'm saddened to say this, but Nabby is finished.

Man, I really hope they use this mediocre result as motivation to start playing the way they should.
Mediocre is the word. At this rate the quarter final is the end of the road.

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05-09-2011, 12:05 PM
  #32
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Originally Posted by SgStorm View Post
Hey, will this meen that Ovi, Varlamov, and Semin free up ?
Without a chance I think mad Ovies coming if he isint hurt with his knee..

Would Bykov bench Nabakov and go with the Tandem of Varla-Barulin?

whatbout Bobrovsky??
Like many other posters, I was critical of Bykov for playing Nabokov in goal instead of Barulin. Should I apologize to Bykov now? After the second period of today's loss, I was wishing that Nabokov could somehow come back. Barulin was terrible, and the main reason, in my opinion, for the back-to-back losses to the Czechs and Finland. If Nabokov would have been there today, there would have been a chance to stay alive in the shootout.

In my opinion, it is time for Russia to create a real national team, as in past eras. It would have to come exclusively from the KHL, because breaks in the season would permit the national team to train. The guys from the NHL (Kovalchuk, Ovechkin, Kulikov, etc.) are generously contributing their time when they could be on a beach somewhere, but the fact is that they don't contribute enough on the ice to make it worthwhile to rely on them. How many goals did Kovalchuk score? Ovechkin? Kulemin scored just one goal. They are giving maximum effort, but they don't fit into any scheme, and frankly, this was a Russian team that generated very little offense. Let's get young guys from the KHL and train them intensively to become a cohesive team.

And let's hope we never see any of the following again: Zinoviev, Gorovikov, Kaigorodov, Atyushov, and Belov. These are players who are not of international class or quality, and are a liability when they are on the ice.

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05-09-2011, 04:22 PM
  #33
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Yakushev72 View Post
Like many other posters, I was critical of Bykov for playing Nabokov in goal instead of Barulin. Should I apologize to Bykov now? After the second period of today's loss, I was wishing that Nabokov could somehow come back. Barulin was terrible, and the main reason, in my opinion, for the back-to-back losses to the Czechs and Finland. If Nabokov would have been there today, there would have been a chance to stay alive in the shootout.

In my opinion, it is time for Russia to create a real national team, as in past eras. It would have to come exclusively from the KHL, because breaks in the season would permit the national team to train. The guys from the NHL (Kovalchuk, Ovechkin, Kulikov, etc.) are generously contributing their time when they could be on a beach somewhere, but the fact is that they don't contribute enough on the ice to make it worthwhile to rely on them. How many goals did Kovalchuk score? Ovechkin? Kulemin scored just one goal. They are giving maximum effort, but they don't fit into any scheme, and frankly, this was a Russian team that generated very little offense. Let's get young guys from the KHL and train them intensively to become a cohesive team.

And let's hope we never see any of the following again: Zinoviev, Gorovikov, Kaigorodov, Atyushov, and Belov. These are players who are not of international class or quality, and are a liability when they are on the ice.
If you had the chance to assemble the roster, who would be on it?

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05-09-2011, 08:00 PM
  #34
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If you had the chance to assemble the roster, who would be on it?
If I had to assemble the roster, it would be younger, and play with more of an attitude, like R2. I loved the way R2 played, with passion and emotion, dealing out clean, heavy hits (yes, they were clean!) to establish a physical presence. I am a long-time Russian fan, and I can easily tell when Russian teams will succeed. The teams that play as if they are hungry with a fire inside them - for example, the 1979 Challenge Cup team and the 2008 WC team - are almost impossible to stop! They combine great skill and talent with an inexorable desire to win.

Contrast those teams with this year's edition. You can see that this group clearly lacks the intensity and will to accept the pain that goes with carving out their own territory in front of the opposing net. Instead, they are content to play with the puck on the side boards and at the blue line, firing low percentage shots on net and hoping they get a lucky bounce! Unfortunately, they have been mostly unlucky, which is why they are scoring no more than two goals agains the good teams.

Zinoviev is talented, but in the last four WC's, he has produced no results. If Gorovikov and Kaigorodov are among the cream of the crop in the KHL, things are worse than I thought. Unfortunately, it is a Russian tradition to have second-rate defensemen. Even in Soviet times, there were only a handful of decent defensemen. To return to a dominant position, it is going to take a long-term building process, and the KHL is the league that must lead the way. The sad truth is that some of the best young talents from Russia (Grachev, Voinov, Kitsyn, Kabanov) are in the CHL and AHL, both of which offer one-way tickets to oblivion for Russian players. If I were to pick a roster, players like Tarasenko and Kuznetsov would get their feet wet early.

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05-10-2011, 04:28 AM
  #35
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Yakushev72, great posts, as usual. I only don't agree on Zinoviev. He's a very talented player (as you said admitted) and he's an integral part of the ZZM line, the best by far of our team.

But I agree on your thoughts about our NT, which saddenly it's just the shadow of its former self. I also think that NHL players shouldn't be considered as key players, it's great to have all these enthusiastic players saying Yes whenever they are called, but still, we should focus on being a team, like we always have been. And we do need more youth, I frankly wouldn't have call Ovechkin and kept Tarasenko in. We also need to re-install some limitation to foreign goaltending in the KHL. I loved the first year's rule about 65% of time, there was a period in which we started producing good goalies (Barulin, Kasutin, Koshechkin, ...), now without limitations foreigners play most of the games and we don't produce good keepers. And Barulin lacks experience on the international stage. However, I liked the "second national team" project, hopefully it will go on next year.

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05-10-2011, 11:01 AM
  #36
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Other countries seem to be able to integrate their NHL players into their sides with sucess.

Surely it is more to do with coaching and picking the right blend of players ?

Some of those picked from the KHL haven't exactly shone.

It's all has to be hammered into the youth. There needs to be specialist netminding schools and practice practice and practice for them.

Practice does make perfect. Sure talent helps but without practice it's useless and will not acheive perfection as with all the gymnasts, ice skaters , pianists etc etc that were produced en masse.

The Red Machine sure it thrived on playing together as a 'club' based side but the amount of practice and innovative coaching is another factor.

It's no coincidence that a lot of the sucess of the USA in junior hockey aside from a bigger physical stature at that age is down to borrowing from Russian coaching manuals.

The same way gymnasts and skaters over there have unfortunately benefitted from Russian coaches who instil the old Soviet ethics and techniques.

It is sad albeit it is a WC to see the team perform so poorly. This had better not happen in the Olympics or perhaps heads and about time too will roll.

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05-10-2011, 11:29 AM
  #37
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Originally Posted by Alessandro Seren Rosso View Post
Yakushev72, great posts, as usual. I only don't agree on Zinoviev. He's a very talented player (as you said admitted) and he's an integral part of the ZZM line, the best by far of our team.

But I agree on your thoughts about our NT, which saddenly it's just the shadow of its former self. I also think that NHL players shouldn't be considered as key players, it's great to have all these enthusiastic players saying Yes whenever they are called, but still, we should focus on being a team, like we always have been. And we do need more youth, I frankly wouldn't have call Ovechkin and kept Tarasenko in. We also need to re-install some limitation to foreign goaltending in the KHL. I loved the first year's rule about 65% of time, there was a period in which we started producing good goalies (Barulin, Kasutin, Koshechkin, ...), now without limitations foreigners play most of the games and we don't produce good keepers. And Barulin lacks experience on the international stage. However, I liked the "second national team" project, hopefully it will go on next year.
Thank you for the kind words, Alessandro. And when you put it in terms of the ZZM line, you are right about the importance of Zinoviev. He is a great skater and a really talented puckhandler, but I wish his style was more like that of his linemates, particularly Zaripov. I really like the way Zaripov plays. He is such a great skater and puckhandler, and he uses his balance and instant acceleration to drive hard to the net before the defense can get set. I think this team is being too easily confined to the perimeter, away from the net, and if they are to survive on Thursday, they will need to venture into the slot area to put pressure on the Canadian goal.

I absolutely agree that too many foreign players, especially goaltenders, will retard the development of the KHL, and more importantly, Russian hockey. Part of the purpose for the KHL has to be to improve the quality of Russian national teams. This is true in football (soccer), and I know Russian fans are intensely interesed in the success of Russian national teams in international hockey matches. They want the Russian flag hoisted, and the national anthem played, at the end of world matches. If Czech, Swedish, Canadian players, etc., improve the caliber of play and make the league more intense and competitive, that will help the KHL develop and benefit the development of Russian players in the short term, but the goal should be to arrive at the point where foreign players are no longer necessary to elevate the quality of play, and only the best players (e.g., Crosby, Henrik Sedin) are sought after to join the league. That may be a long way off, but I believe that should be the goal.

I also strongly believe that the KHL should be the primary source of talent for senior and U20 national teams, for the following reasons: (1) the number of Russians playing in the NHL continues to dwindle year after year, with only 28 Russians playing this past season, in comparison to 79 in the 2000-2001 season, and (2) players who choose to play in North America at the CHL and AHL levels are not developing adequately, and often drop out of hockey altogether after years in those leagues. In my opinion, the distinctive Russian style of hockey is much more dissimilar to the North American hitting and grinding, small rink style of hockey than the style that other Europeans play. Very talented Russian players are relegated to minor leagues because they dont hit, fight and play a tough-guy style of hockey. They are either a great talent, like Ovechkin and Malkin, or they are labeled as finesse players who can't check or play defense. In other words, they are destined for oblivion.

The KHL offers two things: (1) the opportunity to play Russian-style hockey on a big rink, and (2) to gather players together during breaks in the season to practice as a national team. Obviously, North America is too far away to permit the Ovechkins and Datsyuks to train with a national team to the degree necessary to become part of a cohesive team. That is what they will need on Thursday against Canada. Sorry for the long-winded post!

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05-10-2011, 11:55 AM
  #38
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Kovalchuk, Radulov and Morozov has to step up next game against Canada. They hasn't impress at all. And Zinoviev has in my mind been the best russian center this WC

I think it sad that Bykov don't play Tarasenko and Burmistrov more in this tournament, look at sweden, finland and canada they all has young player who contribute to their team.

And i think this team need some line changes. Kovalchuk and Radulov can't play in same line, they has no chemistry at all. Put Ovechkin with Radulov and Terechenko and Kovalchuk with Gorovikov and Afinogenov (afino and Kovy played great together in Atlanta) ZZM and last line is good imo...

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05-10-2011, 12:35 PM
  #39
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Originally Posted by takharov View Post
Other countries seem to be able to integrate their NHL players into their sides with sucess.

Surely it is more to do with coaching and picking the right blend of players ?

Some of those picked from the KHL haven't exactly shone.

It's all has to be hammered into the youth. There needs to be specialist netminding schools and practice practice and practice for them.

Practice does make perfect. Sure talent helps but without practice it's useless and will not acheive perfection as with all the gymnasts, ice skaters , pianists etc etc that were produced en masse.

The Red Machine sure it thrived on playing together as a 'club' based side but the amount of practice and innovative coaching is another factor.

It's no coincidence that a lot of the sucess of the USA in junior hockey aside from a bigger physical stature at that age is down to borrowing from Russian coaching manuals.

The same way gymnasts and skaters over there have unfortunately benefitted from Russian coaches who instil the old Soviet ethics and techniques.

It is sad albeit it is a WC to see the team perform so poorly. This had better not happen in the Olympics or perhaps heads and about time too will roll.
I agree with you that practice and training is everything. The best Soviet teams obviously benefitted from the fact that all players played in the same country, where they could be accessible for practice and training without disrupting league schedules. In fact, most national team players migrated to Moscow, which made it completely easy.

Obviously, players who prefer to go the NHL should be completely free to do so, with no penalty in terms of being boycotted from the national teams. At the same time, it would be much better if the KHL could develop enough high quality players so that it wouldn't be necessary to pray on your knees that the Capitals or Red Wings get eliminated from the playoffs early, so that they could be available for the national team. For Canadians and Americans, the NHL is everything, and the WC's are unimportant.

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05-10-2011, 12:41 PM
  #40
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C'mon, the roster is fine, it's ridiculously talented. The problem is BZ have not found the right combinations and lost the confidence of the team.
When there's little passion or direction from the top, no wonder players look like they're not giving it 100%.

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05-10-2011, 01:07 PM
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And let's not think the sky is falling. It's hasn't even been 2 years since a 27 game winning streak at WC.....you don't do that without all the right pieces in place (NHL + KHL).

Good coaches have the ability to evolve and change. BZ became arrogant and complacent and it was evident during the olympics. Remember the olympic summer camp? While Canada was having an intense and serious camp, BZ held a light scrimmage for the entertainment of fans with Zakharkin saying "We're fine, we know how Canadians play" . It's no wonder the team was steamrolled. Ovechkin even said they receive more preparation for regular season NHL games.

It's not the players. BZ have become stale and need to go.

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05-10-2011, 02:11 PM
  #42
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Kovalchuk, Radulov and Morozov has to step up next game against Canada. They hasn't impress at all. And Zinoviev has in my mind been the best russian center this WC

I think it sad that Bykov don't play Tarasenko and Burmistrov more in this tournament, look at sweden, finland and canada they all has young player who contribute to their team.

And i think this team need some line changes. Kovalchuk and Radulov can't play in same line, they has no chemistry at all. Put Ovechkin with Radulov and Terechenko and Kovalchuk with Gorovikov and Afinogenov (afino and Kovy played great together in Atlanta) ZZM and last line is good imo...
I really like your ideas. Since the line combinations that Bykov has put together so far have not produced scoring, why not shake the line combinations up (with the exception of the ZZM line, which has played together for a long time) to see if other combinations produce chemistry. In fact, now that you mention it, it probably should have been done two or three games ago. Also, I would have loved to have seen more of Tarasenko and other promising young players. They couldn't have done much worse than what we have seen so far.

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05-10-2011, 02:19 PM
  #43
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And let's not think the sky is falling. It's hasn't even been 2 years since a 27 game winning streak at WC.....you don't do that without all the right pieces in place (NHL + KHL).

Good coaches have the ability to evolve and change. BZ became arrogant and complacent and it was evident during the olympics. Remember the olympic summer camp? While Canada was having an intense and serious camp, BZ held a light scrimmage for the entertainment of fans with Zakharkin saying "We're fine, we know how Canadians play" . It's no wonder the team was steamrolled. Ovechkin even said they receive more preparation for regular season NHL games.

It's not the players. BZ have become stale and need to go.
I agree with most of what you say, although I'm not sure that all but a few players are "ridiculously talented." After bringing the program back to prominence, starting in 2007, Bykov and Zakharkin have lost their ability to motivate players and outline winning schemes. It seems to have started with the steamrolling at the Olympics, which sucked the confidence right out of the team. I believe that the psychological fallout from that 7-3 loss at least partially explains why Ovy and Kovy had mediocre years in the NHL this year, and why a star-studded lineup failed to win gold at the WC's last year. I loved Bykov as a player, so I hate to badmouth him now, but I agree that he seems to have lost whatever he had as a coach.

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05-10-2011, 05:32 PM
  #44
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I agree with Zine, BZ have not put forth enough effort into the NT - too busy earning big bucks @ Ufa and unfathomed overconfidence. I have no expectations from this year's team, but on paper they are certainly good enough to win the whole thing. When Detroit won Game 5, should have invited Semin and benched Arti.

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05-11-2011, 12:56 PM
  #45
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I agree with Zine, BZ have not put forth enough effort into the NT - too busy earning big bucks @ Ufa and unfathomed overconfidence. I have no expectations from this year's team, but on paper they are certainly good enough to win the whole thing. When Detroit won Game 5, should have invited Semin and benched Arti.
I agree with you about BZ. Have no idea why they would be overconfident, but its unlikely that they will stay overconfident after this year's performance. Still, I also agree that in a one game situation, they have the talent to beat Canada if they play their best. Canada is not a great team. They've won all their games, but almost all by a one-goal margin. I think they can be had - the question is will our guys have the will and the way to do it.

I also agree that they should have picked up Semin. They need goal scoring, and that is his best attribute. I disagree that he should have replaced Artyukhin. To me, Arti was one of the few players who showed passion and intensity every time he was on the ice. He is not a great hockey player, for sure, but he forces people to pay attention to him. I think he will be an asset in keeping Phaneuf distracted. If they could beat Canada, then they would likely get a rematch with Finland. I think they would beat Finland in a second matchup, which would take them the to the Gold Medal Game. Just dreaming out loud.

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05-12-2011, 12:23 PM
  #46
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Originally Posted by Yakushev72 View Post
I agree with you about BZ. Have no idea why they would be overconfident, but its unlikely that they will stay overconfident after this year's performance. Still, I also agree that in a one game situation, they have the talent to beat Canada if they play their best. Canada is not a great team. They've won all their games, but almost all by a one-goal margin. I think they can be had - the question is will our guys have the will and the way to do it.

I also agree that they should have picked up Semin. They need goal scoring, and that is his best attribute. I disagree that he should have replaced Artyukhin. To me, Arti was one of the few players who showed passion and intensity every time he was on the ice. He is not a great hockey player, for sure, but he forces people to pay attention to him. I think he will be an asset in keeping Phaneuf distracted. If they could beat Canada, then they would likely get a rematch with Finland. I think they would beat Finland in a second matchup, which would take them the to the Gold Medal Game. Just dreaming out loud.
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05-12-2011, 03:31 PM
  #47
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Good win. Finally a good effort by the defense and goaltending.

I hope they carry this momentum into the semis.

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05-12-2011, 04:40 PM
  #48
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Good win. Finally a good effort by the defense and goaltending.

I hope they carry this momentum into the semis.
Great win! Barulin played great after giving up the breakaway goal to Spezza, but the play of the game, imo, was Kaigorodov's spectacular effort in the third period to tie the game when the team was shorthanded. His play is one of the greatest I've ever seen in hockey. It was a huge spark, and you had the sense that the second goal would soon follow. Radulov and Kovy had nearly connected several times during the game, but his late goal sparked the whole team. I really believe they will beat Finland in the rematch. I can't wait!

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05-12-2011, 05:41 PM
  #49
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I hope so.

Time for Ovy to start taking over.

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05-13-2011, 11:42 AM
  #50
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I hope so.

Time for Ovy to start taking over.
He has to do it today! He was close yesterday, so maybe today he'll break through.

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