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ATD 2011 Draft Thread VIII

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Old
03-16-2011, 12:58 PM
  #351
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Originally Posted by BraveCanadian View Post
Why is that?

To me they are roughly the same size/grit/offense level and from the outside looking in, around the same leadership type of guy too.

Just wondering your thoughts behind it
Even if they are they same player, Doan just did it for longer. I also think Doan is quite a bit faster. Being able to play both sides is a small but nice bonus.

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03-16-2011, 01:02 PM
  #352
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Originally Posted by seventieslord View Post
Glass is an excellent pick. I had him tabbed as "one of those awesome MLD roleplayers I can steal later" - but I had totally forgotten his profile had already risen last draft (selected around 500)



That would be an interesting debate - Smyth vs. Doan vs. Morrow - who's better, and why? I don't even know where to start.
Smyth isn't the dame type of player IMO. Much better in front of the net, not nearly as good defensively or in corners.

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03-16-2011, 01:06 PM
  #353
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Just realized Sturm stole my pick in Paiement...

Few things to be considered, pick coming shortly!

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03-16-2011, 01:14 PM
  #354
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Smyth isn't the dame type of player IMO. Much better in front of the net, not nearly as good defensively or in corners.
I agree with this.. Smyth is hard nosed going to the net at all costs but I think Morrow and Doan are better on the boards.

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03-16-2011, 01:26 PM
  #355
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Can someone take my list for today/tonight?

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03-16-2011, 01:26 PM
  #356
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Smyth isn't the dame type of player IMO. Much better in front of the net, not nearly as good defensively or in corners.
Defensively, no.

In the corners, he's excellent! Pretty sure he and Iginla won a players' poll about 5 years ago for best along the boards and/or in the corners, conducted by THN.

I realize that all three aren't identical players, and there are little things to choose from between them, but they are all similar in princple - gritty, scoring canadian wingers who played in best-on-best tournaments because of intangibles and passable offense.

At first glance, I guess I have to say Doan and Smyth have a major offensive edge based on more established Resumes. Both have scored 49+ points ten times. Morrow's only done that 3 times. but two of those times he had 65+ points, and Smyth's only done that 3 times, and Doan 4. So he's peaked fairly close to where they did.

He also has a lot more time to improve on that, but that's irrelevant to this discussion.

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03-16-2011, 01:31 PM
  #357
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I find it hard to believe Morrow has never participated in an All-Star game.

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03-16-2011, 01:34 PM
  #358
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Originally Posted by markrander87 View Post
I find it hard to believe Morrow has never participated in an All-Star game.
Very hard to believe, he's not among the elite scoring class in the NHL, but he can overcome many intangibles. He makes Ribeiro look better most nights.

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03-16-2011, 01:38 PM
  #359
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Very hard to believe, he's not among the elite scoring class in the NHL, but he can overcome many intangibles. He makes Ribeiro look better most nights.
Well lets be honest.. how hard can it be to make that rat-boy diver look better?


(don't hate me mods, its true!)







Yeah, I don't like him.. I admit it.

I assume he won't be drafted but feel free to delete this post if someone is going to get their pants in a knot.


Last edited by BraveCanadian: 03-16-2011 at 01:46 PM.
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03-16-2011, 01:38 PM
  #360
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Can someone take my list for today/tonight?
I can.

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Old
03-16-2011, 01:58 PM
  #361
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This one was tough, because I couldn't find anybody to satisfy the need on the 3rd line yet.

We'll begin our fourth line with one of the earliest dominant Swedish hockey players.

Hakan Loob, RW



Puts some firepower on the fourth line, and a better power play choice than Neely.

Next manager notified.

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03-16-2011, 01:59 PM
  #362
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Doan broke 50 points 10 times, including this season. 60 points 5 times. Morrow just has the two seasons over 60, no other over 50. And Doan has had very little offensive help for a number of years. Morrow had aging modano and now ratboy is actually and excellent playmaker.

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03-16-2011, 02:01 PM
  #363
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How is loob better on the pp than Neely?

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03-16-2011, 02:03 PM
  #364
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How is loob better on the pp than Neely?
Actually to be honest, I don't know that

Just wanted a little comfort in selecting an explosive scoring winger.

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03-16-2011, 02:04 PM
  #365
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Originally Posted by TheDevilMadeMe View Post
Doan broke 50 points 10 times, including this season. 60 points 5 times. Morrow just has the two seasons over 60, no other over 50. And Doan has had very little offensive help for a number of years. Morrow had aging modano and now ratboy is actually and excellent playmaker.
This is true.. I do think that Doan is probably better and especially over time but does anyone know how much he plays right compared to how much he plays left?

One thing that pushed Morrow up on my list when I was thinking of taking him was that it is much harder to find comparable LW to RW.

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Old
03-16-2011, 02:11 PM
  #366
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Originally Posted by BraveCanadian View Post
This is true.. I do think that Doan is probably better and especially over time but does anyone know how much he plays right compared to how much he plays left?

One thing that pushed Morrow up on my list when I was thinking of taking him was that it is much harder to find comparable LW to RW.
Left wingers were starting to become very hard to come by around 500, Dennis Hull (who I know you wanted as well judging by your reaction to matsblue selecting him ) was very close to being taking by me, I stuck to what I know, as I see Morrow 5-6 times a year, and I love his style.

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03-16-2011, 02:17 PM
  #367
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Originally Posted by TheDevilMadeMe View Post
Doan broke 50 points 10 times, including this season. 60 points 5 times. Morrow just has the two seasons over 60, no other over 50. And Doan has had very little offensive help for a number of years. Morrow had aging modano and now ratboy is actually and excellent playmaker.
Sorry, hadn't even thought about this season, and obviously I should. Even though it's not over, if I'm talking benchmarks and he's already met it...

What this has all taught me is that with all considered, Morrow is a ton behind Smyth and Doan offensively at this point. He does bring intangibles, but so do they, and I don't see how it can be enough to overtake them.

So I'm sure Morrow is 3rd of the three. But what of Smyth and Doan?

Quote:
Originally Posted by BraveCanadian View Post
One thing that pushed Morrow up on my list when I was thinking of taking him was that it is much harder to find comparable LW to RW.
Totally.

Right now, I see the best offensive wingers available are all on the right, the best "energy" guys available are all on the right, defense is about a wash, and the left side has a "tough/two-way guy" edge at the moment.

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Old
03-16-2011, 02:17 PM
  #368
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BraveCanadian View Post
Why is that?

To me they are roughly the same size/grit/offense level and from the outside looking in, around the same leadership type of guy too.

Just wondering your thoughts behind it
Quote:
Originally Posted by MadArcand View Post
For me, Smyth > Doan > Morrow, without a shred of doubt.
Quote:
Originally Posted by TheDevilMadeMe View Post
P

Doan is who I thought you meant too. Glad to get him. The fact that he can play both wings like Phillips and mayorov gives me a lot of options come playoffs.
Interesting I've gotten a lot of responses from this. The reason I say that Doan is better fit for a third line role is that he's better defensively in my opinion than both of the other two. He's been effective playing a defensive role for team Canada in the World Championships before.
Prior to the last 2 (3 counting this season) seasons, he's been a major PK guy for Phoenix (I believe he's in the top 4 for them among forwards in PK mins 03-08, finishing in the top 2 among forwards twice if I remember correctly from my research). Even in the years before that where he wasn't he was still averaging between 1:30 and 2 mins on the PK per game on a very penalized team).

He does this, along with being their leading scorer in every season since 03 (excluding this year with Yandle becoming a beast on the backend). Had he ever had a decent center like MOrrow did, we really may have been talking about a guy who could have been around 40 goals a couple of times. Outisde of a 20 game or so stretch with ****, his best center may have been ***** (if anyone is upset with my mentioning of those names, please delete them seventies).

Now when it comes to Smyth, Smyth is certainly more dangerous on the offensive end. But personally for my team I'd rather have DOan because Smyth isn't a top 6 option in this. His defensive game is below average in this context. He's not enough of a scorer. He's a 4th liner in my view, plain and simple. You can play Doan on the third and 4th lines and be totally fine in this context. Plus Doan has the positional versatility. And let's not forget, Doan has been a captain now for about 8 years (since 03), and has been named a captain of Team Canada in the past, so I think he has leadeership on Morrow at least. I would even argue his leadership in comparison to Smyth, whose leadership I believe has been a result of media overhype. Grit, he is probably just a shade below the other two. Offensively, I think he's better than MOrrow and certianly worse than Smyth. But defensively, he's defintiely better than the other two. In a historical context, Smyth>Doan>Morrow, but in this context, Doan>Smyth>Morrow in my opinion.


Last edited by seventieslord: 03-16-2011 at 02:23 PM. Reason: yep, best to leave them out if they were AAA picks :)
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Old
03-16-2011, 02:27 PM
  #369
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Interesting I've gotten a lot of responses from this. The reason I say that Doan is better fit for a third line role is that he's better defensively in my opinion than both of the other two. He's been effective playing a defensive role for team Canada in the World Championships before.
Prior to the last 2 (3 counting this season) seasons, he's been a major PK guy for Phoenix (I believe he's in the top 4 for them among forwards in PK mins 03-08, finishing in the top 2 among forwards twice if I remember correctly from my research). Even in the years before that where he wasn't he was still averaging between 1:30 and 2 mins on the PK per game on a very penalized team).

He does this, along with being their leading scorer in every season since 03 (excluding this year with Yandle becoming a beast on the backend). Had he ever had a decent center like MOrrow did, we really may have been talking about a guy who could have been around 40 goals a couple of times. Outisde of a 20 game or so stretch with ****, his best center may have been ***** (if anyone is upset with my mentioning of those names, please delete them seventies).

Now when it comes to Smyth, Smyth is certainly more dangerous on the offensive end. But personally for my team I'd rather have DOan because Smyth isn't a top 6 option in this. His defensive game is below average in this context. He's not enough of a scorer. He's a 4th liner in my view, plain and simple. You can play Doan on the third and 4th lines and be totally fine in this context. Plus Doan has the positional versatility. And let's not forget, Doan has been a captain now for about 8 years (since 03), and has been named a captain of Team Canada in the past, so I think he has leadeership on Morrow at least. I would even argue his leadership in comparison to Smyth, whose leadership I believe has been a result of media overhype. Grit, he is probably just a shade below the other two. Offensively, I think he's better than MOrrow and certianly worse than Smyth. But defensively, he's defintiely better than the other two. In a historical context, Smyth>Doan>Morrow, but in this context, Doan>Smyth>Morrow in my opinion.
you're underrating Smyth's offense here. He is a passable 2nd line finisher and glue guy with 40 teams. He's been top-15 and top-20 in goals as often as Rick Tocchet, for example. Certainly wouldn't be my first choice though.

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03-16-2011, 05:13 PM
  #370
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Originally Posted by Velociraptor View Post
This one was tough, because I couldn't find anybody to satisfy the need on the 3rd line yet.

We'll begin our fourth line with one of the earliest dominant Swedish hockey players.

Hakan Loob, RW



Puts some firepower on the fourth line, and a better power play choice than Neely.

Next manager notified.
Loob is a more of a even strength scorer.

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Old
03-16-2011, 05:24 PM
  #371
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This is true.. I do think that Doan is probably better and especially over time but does anyone know how much he plays right compared to how much he plays left?

One thing that pushed Morrow up on my list when I was thinking of taking him was that it is much harder to find comparable LW to RW.
Check out the profile I just posted. One of the HNC analysts (and some blogger I never heard of) said that Doan can play both wings equally well when choosing their 2010 Olympic teams. That's kind of what I remember of Doan - he generally plays RW in the NHL but usually plays LW in the International game.

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Old
03-16-2011, 05:52 PM
  #372
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Loob is a more of a even strength scorer.
Thanks jkrx, yeah I just kinda added he was a PP scorer for pick inflation

Quote:
Originally Posted by TheDevilMadeMe
Check out the profile I just posted. One of the HNC analysts (and some blogger I never heard of) said that Doan can play both wings equally well when choosing their 2010 Olympic teams. That's kind of what I remember of Doan - he generally plays RW in the NHL but usually plays LW in the International game.
http://www.cbc.ca/sports/hockey/stor...#ixzz1Gnrwx1cR

^ Pretty interesting stuff, nobody named Smyth to their team, only one analyst named him as a tough omission, Morrow was named to two of the teams, so it wasn't like his selection was too farfetched.

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Old
03-16-2011, 06:02 PM
  #373
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^ Pretty interesting stuff, nobody named Smyth to their team, only one analyst named him as a tough omission, Morrow was named to two of the teams, so it wasn't like his selection was too farfetched.
This is the 2010 team they're talking about... Smyth was long done being "eligible" for a best-on-best roster by this time.

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03-16-2011, 06:03 PM
  #374
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you're underrating Smyth's offense here. He is a passable 2nd line finisher and glue guy with 40 teams. He's been top-15 and top-20 in goals as often as Rick Tocchet, for example. Certainly wouldn't be my first choice though.
I'm certainly more likely to take Morrow over Smyth. I wouldn't be happy with Smyth on a second line, and he has no place in the bottom 6 unless you want a 4th line pp guy.

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03-16-2011, 06:10 PM
  #375
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Originally Posted by TheDevilMadeMe View Post
Check out the profile I just posted. One of the HNC analysts (and some blogger I never heard of) said that Doan can play both wings equally well when choosing their 2010 Olympic teams. That's kind of what I remember of Doan - he generally plays RW in the NHL but usually plays LW in the International game.
who have you not heard of out of those analysts?

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Originally Posted by Nalyd Psycho View Post
I'm certainly more likely to take Morrow over Smyth. I wouldn't be happy with Smyth on a second line, and he has no place in the bottom 6 unless you want a 4th line pp guy.
can't he still be a mucker who can cycle and hope to pin the opposition in their zone, so that the scorers get an offensive zone faceoff?

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