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#73: Penguins @ Flyers - Thursday, Mar. 24, 2011 - 7:00 PM (ET)

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03-25-2011, 01:25 PM
  #476
FlyersMania2
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Originally Posted by Doyle View Post
"Embarrassing." "Perplexing." Definitely not the kinds of words you want associated with your team's play, especially heading down the stretch. But unfortunately for the Flyers, these were the descriptive terms they used to define their own play Thursday night. Call it a healthy dose of self-awareness.

http://nhlhotstove.com/flyers-outwor...tout-decision/
I swear we need to bring back the undisciplined, edgy play that resulted with us in the box all the time. Sounds dumb but it worked for us. It seems like we've censored ourselves so much that we not only no longer play Flyers hockey but now we play over-meditated hockey...I feel like the higher our penalty minutes were in the season, the more alive we looked at games and the more successful we were in at least playing like we cared.

Look at Pittsburgh now...minus the absolute ridiculous d-bag Cooke and their bone headed executives who call for the Isles heads then can't control said player (lol sorry for the rant, I had to )... they are winning games with 10 scratches, because they are playing on the edge...almost as though they are drawing their success from whatever bad/good/gritty passion they have. Ever since we bought into a disciplined style we seem to be able to read each other less, have less success on the PP and lack emotion.

Oh and lazy or not, time to give Zherdev another go. The Nodl experiment needs to officially end. He lacks the actual skill (sure he plays with a heart like Richards) but gets tossed around like a baby doll and just doesn't have the skillset necessary. Zherdev, while lazy, that alone shouldnt be enough to scratch him considering half this team is lazy...not to mention he has a skillset that is more beneficial when he uses it.

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03-25-2011, 01:34 PM
  #477
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Originally Posted by ShotScore View Post
Sure. I won't embarass you if I go back into all the threads you replied to with an ignorant statement you made to someone else will I?
Have at it chief. Though, nothing is going to top: "There is nothing Timonen is capable of doing on the ice that Carle is not."

The resident Carle lover, in this very thread, stated specifically that Timonen is better than Carle. You don't even have a Carle homer on your side with that statement.

You know what Carle isn't better than Timonen at? Protecting the puck.

The source for those statistics: www.nhl.com

Quote:
Originally Posted by The Inebriator View Post
What is so unbelievable about it? You could definitely argue that Desjardins was a better player, but they are highly comparable.

1. Career numbers are similar, considering Timonen still has a few years left.
2. Both 2 way defensemen, both great defensively and good but not amazing offensively
3. Both got by with their hockey sense not neccessarily their physical skills
4. Neither overly physical but great defensively, positionally, and along the boards
5. Both spent most of their careers in the #1 defensemen tier of the NHL
They're essentially the same player, we just got Timonen when he was 32... as opposed to 25 like Rico. You can quibble about different elements of their game, but there is very little that differentiates them. Though, it is worth nothing that Timonen is aging better than Rico did.

Rico 0.5 PPG for his career, Timonen 0.52 PPG.

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03-25-2011, 01:37 PM
  #478
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I still don't know how to mentally process the concept of Carle being better than Timonen.

Kimmo: absolutely reliable

Carle: Carle.

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03-25-2011, 01:50 PM
  #479
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thanks for the lolz, ShotScore. they've made this loss a little less painful.

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03-25-2011, 01:52 PM
  #480
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Originally Posted by ShotScore View Post
At $7 million a year he's SUPPOSED to carry the defense!

He still remains too inconsistent for me to justify his salary.

Meszaros, at $4 million, has been just as good if not better and is a +26.

Is Timonen some sort of sacerd cow that is above criticism?
I didn't know that 6.333 rounded to 7, thanks for the math lesson

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03-25-2011, 01:54 PM
  #481
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Originally Posted by Beef Invictus View Post
I still don't know how to mentally process the concept of Carle being better than Timonen.

Kimmo: absolutely reliable

Carle: Carle.
Who is saying Carle is better? Timonen is a rock for this team and half the team doesnt get enough recognition. The fact that people never notice his play typically means its because he is playing defensively sound hockey...if you notice the D-men its usually when they eff up.

Carle is decent...the same as he has been. Meszaros is a monster- love having him and Coburn seems to have found his competitive edge as of late (finally).

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03-25-2011, 01:59 PM
  #482
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Originally Posted by FlyersMania2 View Post
Who is saying Carle is better? Timonen is a rock for this team and half the team doesnt get enough recognition. The fact that people never notice his play typically means its because he is playing defensively sound hockey...if you notice the D-men its usually when they eff up.

Carle is decent...the same as he has been. Meszaros is a monster- love having him and Coburn seems to have found his competitive edge as of late (finally).
Timonen has been "absolutely atrocious" at times this year, and is a turnover machine at inopportune times. Clearly you didn't get the memo, and/or haven't been paying attention.

In the real world, Timonen has been the best D on this team this year given Pronger's limited number of games (Pronger quietly went back into beast mode once he got up to full speed).

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03-25-2011, 01:59 PM
  #483
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Originally Posted by FlyersMania2 View Post
Who is saying Carle is better? Timonen is a rock for this team and half the team doesnt get enough recognition. The fact that people never notice his play typically means its because he is playing defensively sound hockey...if you notice the D-men its usually when they eff up.

Carle is decent...the same as he has been. Meszaros is a monster- love having him and Coburn seems to have found his competitive edge as of late (finally).
Well, this was said: "False. Explain what Timonen is capable of that Carle, Coburn, and Meszaros are not. I can think of a few things each are capable of that Timonen isn't."

Kimmo is on another level compared to everyone listed there. He can, and has, carried the defense. The others have been workable, but none of them are a #1 dman.

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03-25-2011, 02:07 PM
  #484
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Originally Posted by Jester View Post
Timonen has been "absolutely atrocious" at times this year, and is a turnover machine at inopportune times. Clearly you didn't get the memo, and/or haven't been paying attention.

In the real world, Timonen has been the best D on this team this year given Pronger's limited number of games (Pronger quietly went back into beast mode once he got up to full speed).
Lol...this must be coming from new flyers fans who have a misunderstanding of what good defense is...sometimes people forget that when we got Kimmo, he was thought to be one of the best defenseman out there...he still is but most people keep him in Pronger's shadow.

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03-25-2011, 02:41 PM
  #485
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one of the peculiar discussions I've read lately...Please...

If every other player on this team gave every shift as much as Timonen we did'nt have to worry as much as most of us do lately.

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03-25-2011, 03:10 PM
  #486
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Has anyone seen a worse call than the crucial one on Nodl last night and a worse period than our third?

I wish Bobrovsky played like that every night.

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03-25-2011, 03:12 PM
  #487
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Another shootout loss, shocker!!!

Timonen is the only player I know I don't have to worry about showing up to a game. And I feel safer with him on the ice than any other flyer, that's for sure

Carter's annual springtime injury is here again? ahhhhh

I'm glad they have 2 games this weekend, I wanna see how they respond to this ugly game

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03-25-2011, 03:14 PM
  #488
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Another shootout loss, shocker!!!

Timonen is the only player I know I don't have to worry about showing up to a game. And I feel safer with him on the ice than any other flyer, that's for sure

Carter's annual springtime injury is here again? ahhhhh

I'm glad they have 2 games this weekend, I wanna see how they respond to this ugly game
My prediction: underwhelmingly.

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03-25-2011, 03:28 PM
  #489
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Has anyone seen a worse call than the crucial one on Nodl last night and a worse period than our third?

I wish Bobrovsky played like that every night.
That call is made almost every time... you can't go at the goalie like that, make contact... and not expect to get called.

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03-25-2011, 03:30 PM
  #490
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Originally Posted by Beef Invictus View Post
My prediction: underwhelmingly.
Sadly I have to agree with ya! Blah

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03-25-2011, 03:31 PM
  #491
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Originally Posted by Jester View Post
That call is made almost every time... you can't go at the goalie like that, make contact... and not expect to get called.
The fact it's called all the time doesn't mean it's the correct call.

He made a clear and concerted effort to get out of the way but was met by a Penguins defender who simply didn't give him chance to. He chased in the puck for a scoring chance, do we not want him doing that in case the 'flower' wilts again?

Incidental contact by all means, but a penalty? Incredibly dumb.

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03-25-2011, 03:34 PM
  #492
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Originally Posted by 1865 View Post
The fact it's called all the time doesn't mean it's the correct call.

He made a clear and concerted effort to get out of the way but was met by a Penguins defender who simply didn't give him chance to. He chased in the puck for a scoring chance, do we not want him doing that in case the 'flower' wilts again?

Incidental contact by all means, but a penalty? Incredibly dumb.
i agree. essentially, you're not allowed to go hard to the net anymore. nodl created a beautiful chance by driving hard and getting to the puck. couple that with a little bit of a shove from (i can't remember who, engelland?) and it's a "charging" penalty.

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03-25-2011, 03:37 PM
  #493
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Originally Posted by 1865 View Post
The fact it's called all the time doesn't mean it's the correct call.

He made a clear and concerted effort to get out of the way but was met by a Penguins defender who simply didn't give him chance to. He chased in the puck for a scoring chance, do we not want him doing that in case the 'flower' wilts again?

Incidental contact by all means, but a penalty? Incredibly dumb.
That's like saying, "just because that's the way a word is pronounced, doesn't mean it's correct."

If you want to argue for a new implementation/interpretation of the rule, that's fine... but they make an interference call on the forward 9.9/10 there, players gotta play to how the game is officiated.

God knows I'd want an GI call if a guy went at want of our goalies like that and made contact.

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03-25-2011, 03:38 PM
  #494
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I think it was Lovejoy. Overall, I was actually pretty satisfied with the reffing last night. There's usually a lot of BS in these matchups.

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03-25-2011, 03:41 PM
  #495
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I think it was Lovejoy. Overall, I was actually pretty satisfied with the reffing last night. There's usually a lot of BS in these matchups.
They let the Pens get away with a TON of interference... lots of defenseman interfering with forwards on the forecheck. Now, this is a normal thing in the NHL at this point, but it's one of the reasons scoring is down. Pen were playing passively defensively, and then doing everything in their power to get in front of, and impede forwards as they went in on the chase.

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03-25-2011, 03:43 PM
  #496
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They let the Pens get away with a TON of interference... lots of defenseman interfering with forwards on the forecheck. Now, this is a normal thing in the NHL at this point, but it's one of the reasons scoring is down. Pen were playing passively defensively, and then doing everything in their power to get in front of, and impede forwards as they went in on the chase.
That's a given, but I mean there weren't any horrendously questionable calls against the Flyers, unless they were in the 2nd, which I missed most of.

edit: hell, even their announcers were comparatively bearable.

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03-25-2011, 04:01 PM
  #497
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That's a given, but I mean there weren't any horrendously questionable calls against the Flyers, unless they were in the 2nd, which I missed most of.

edit: hell, even their announcers were comparatively bearable.
Psh, obviously its was because Crosby didnt play. Crosby plays, all game long you hear how great he is.

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03-25-2011, 04:02 PM
  #498
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Psh, obviously its was because Crosby didnt play. Crosby plays, all game long you hear how great he is.
Nothing tops the Jason Smith SLASH OF DOOM!

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03-25-2011, 04:07 PM
  #499
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Nothing tops the Jason Smith SLASH OF DOOM!
It's amazing Crosby and his family survived it.

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03-25-2011, 07:08 PM
  #500
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Have at it chief. Though, nothing is going to top: "There is nothing Timonen is capable of doing on the ice that Carle is not."

The resident Carle lover, in this very thread, stated specifically that Timonen is better than Carle. You don't even have a Carle homer on your side with that statement.

You know what Carle isn't better than Timonen at? Protecting the puck.

The source for those statistics: www.nhl.com

There is nothing Timonen can do Carle can't. That's what I stated. If timonen is capable of protecting the puck a little better than Carle that doesn't mean Carle isn't capable of protecting the puck does it? Apparently, you can't understand the argument.

Also, if we're going by nhl statistics, perhaps you should take a peek and see who they have as the higher rated defenseman. Carle is ahead of Timonen both overall and in real-time stats.




They're essentially the same player, we just got Timonen when he was 32... as opposed to 25 like Rico. You can quibble about different elements of their game, but there is very little that differentiates them. Though, it is worth nothing that Timonen is aging better than Rico did.

Rico 0.5 PPG for his career, Timonen 0.52 PPG.
This is one of the most ignorant statements I've seen here. It shows you have ZERO understanding of the difference between these two players.

Eric Desjardins carried the Flyers defense while being dragged down by having to carry useless Chris Therien for YEARS. In no way was his responsibilities the same as Timonen's. They are not comparable.

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