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Phoenix Part XXXII: Bridge over Troubled Goldwater

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Old
04-06-2011, 09:05 AM
  #76
Buck Aki Berg
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Originally Posted by JAX View Post
I've been following the story on and off for the year or so, but can someone answer my question. why is Bettman so obsessive with keeping this team in Phoenix givin the massive loses they have year after year?
It isn't Gary's money. Nor is it Gary's responsibility to babysit owners (not to mention the municipalities that the NHL plays in) and make sure they spend their money wisely.

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04-06-2011, 09:06 AM
  #77
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Originally Posted by mikelvl View Post
1. Growing market (5th largest metro area in America) - but not all of them hockey fans
2. Bettman's beloved sunbelt
3. Bettman's beloved sunbelt
4. Stubbornness
5. Bettman unwilling to admit the sunbelt experiment failed in some cities

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04-06-2011, 09:12 AM
  #78
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Originally Posted by Fidel Astro View Post
4. Stubbornness
5. Bettman unwilling to admit the sunbelt experiment failed in some cities
That almost seems like it, it's not Buffalo or Ottawa where there was temperary trouble, this team will lose millions more this season and the season after and it will never end. You would think he would want to move this money losing team, it's embarrasing to watch how obsessive he has become with this.

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04-06-2011, 09:15 AM
  #79
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Originally Posted by goyotes View Post
Just a thought. IF (and it is a big if) the NHL is so intent on keeping the Coyotes in Arizona. And the NHL cannot lower the price of a franchise without upsetting all the other owners and costing them money as well. But MH isn't going to up his ante to make up the difference because he believes the franchise is already being over-valued.

Would a compromise be to sell the team at the current estimated price of around $200M, but have the NHL purchase the remaining $50M in bonds at a reasonable interest rate of say 6%. The worst case, according to the GWI, is if the deal goes through and the GWI wins in court, the bonds lose their tax-exempt status but the CoG taxpayers still are on the hook for the bonds. So, the NHL doesn't lose its investment and I don't think the deal gets undone so the NHL's big risk is about a 2% interest rate margin on tax-emempt versus taxable investments.

For this, the NHL gets the owners' money back up front on the sale of the team, keeps franchise values high, and maintains control of where it sends its teams.

Putting aside any outrage that the NHL might do this for Phoenix and did much less for Winnipeg and other relocated markets, what is the "objective" opinion on whether this sort of compromise might just fly?
Anything is possible. I think everyone just wants an answer.

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04-06-2011, 09:22 AM
  #80
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It isn't Gary's money. Nor is it Gary's responsibility to babysit owners (not to mention the municipalities that the NHL plays in) and make sure they spend their money wisely.
It's not his business to babysit owners but yet he still is looking for an owner to buy the team and keep them in this money pit. He expects other people to dump all their money in this francise and lose it. To me it's almost criminal what he is trying to do, not to mention what the city of Glendale is doing with the "bond sales" etc. Good thing goldwater is watching out for this farce.

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04-06-2011, 09:29 AM
  #81
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Originally Posted by xtra View Post
What are the rumors regarding the bank of Canada and the NHL. I must have missed it in the last thread
Bettman is trying to influence the BOC to crash the value of the CAD.

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04-06-2011, 09:44 AM
  #82
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Originally Posted by JAX View Post
It's not his business to babysit owners but yet he still is looking for an owner to buy the team and keep them in this money pit. He expects other people to dump all their money in this francise and lose it. To me it's almost criminal what he is trying to do, not to mention what the city of Glendale is doing with the "bond sales" etc. Good thing goldwater is watching out for this farce.
Yet now that the league owns the team, they are refusing to lose a dime over it. They want the purchaser to pay full price (well above what the franchise is worth) so they can recoup their losses. They should lose money on this team like everyone else has. Personally, that's what I don't like about the whole thing.

It'll be interesting to see how all this plays out.

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04-06-2011, 09:50 AM
  #83
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Originally Posted by OthmarAmmann View Post
Bettman is trying to influence the BOC to crash the value of the CAD.
Yeah because the Bank of Canada is so willing to bend to the will of Gary Bettman, lol. That is the dumbest rumor i have heard yet, lol.

Good luck with that, CDN$ is gaining daily.

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04-06-2011, 09:55 AM
  #84
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JAX View Post
It's not his business to babysit owners but yet he still is looking for an owner to buy the team and keep them in this money pit. He expects other people to dump all their money in this francise and lose it. To me it's almost criminal what he is trying to do, not to mention what the city of Glendale is doing with the "bond sales" etc. Good thing goldwater is watching out for this farce.
This must be some new meaning of the word "criminal" that I wasn't previously aware of. Nobody is getting a gun put to their head and being screamed at to buy the team. If WE know how much the team has lost, you can bet your powdered bottom that any prospective buyer knows it as well, and knows that trend will continue.

If they want to sink their money into the team, it's entirely their choice. The league owns the team, and can choose to sell it on their terms, just like you could choose to sell your house with the provision that the new owner must paint a "Dogs Playing Poker" mural on the wall of the guest bedroom and neer paint over it. If the new owner signs off, that's all that matters. Just because you would walk away from a deal doesn't make it "criminal".

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04-06-2011, 09:58 AM
  #85
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Originally Posted by MHX View Post
Yet now that the league owns the team, they are refusing to lose a dime over it. They want the purchaser to pay full price (well above what the franchise is worth) so they can recoup their losses. They should lose money on this team like everyone else has. Personally, that's what I don't like about the whole thing.

It'll be interesting to see how all this plays out.
For sure, there has to be some shady dealings going on if he thinks someone would put millions of their own dollars in a sinking ship and want them to keep the team in phoenix. He has a better chance selling snow to an eskimo.

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04-06-2011, 10:02 AM
  #86
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Yeah because the Bank of Canada is so willing to bend to the will of Gary Bettman, lol. That is the dumbest rumor i have heard yet, lol.

Good luck with that, CDN$ is gaining daily.
You honestly couldn't tell that wasn't serious???? My lord.

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04-06-2011, 10:02 AM
  #87
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Yeah because the Bank of Canada is so willing to bend to the will of Gary Bettman, lol. That is the dumbest rumor i have heard yet, lol.

Good luck with that, CDN$ is gaining daily.
Umm he was making a joke.

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04-06-2011, 10:04 AM
  #88
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Originally Posted by Haymaker View Post
This must be some new meaning of the word "criminal" that I wasn't previously aware of. Nobody is getting a gun put to their head and being screamed at to buy the team. If WE know how much the team has lost, you can bet your powdered bottom that any prospective buyer knows it as well, and knows that trend will continue.

If they want to sink their money into the team, it's entirely their choice. The league owns the team, and can choose to sell it on their terms, just like you could choose to sell your house with the provision that the new owner must paint a "Dogs Playing Poker" mural on the wall of the guest bedroom and neer paint over it. If the new owner signs off, that's all that matters. Just because you would walk away from a deal doesn't make it "criminal".
Well yes i realize this, I said "almost criminal" just because this whole fiascal has become a joke.

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04-06-2011, 10:19 AM
  #89
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Originally Posted by OthmarAmmann View Post
Bettman is trying to influence the BOC to crash the value of the CAD.
OA for the record I had a hearty cackle at this remark this morning as my boss walked by my desk wondering what was so funny.

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04-06-2011, 10:21 AM
  #90
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On a more serious note, I'd be interested to see how strong the CAD stays if the NDP can exert significant influence in a coalition government.

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04-06-2011, 10:28 AM
  #91
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Originally Posted by OthmarAmmann View Post
On a more serious note, I'd be interested to see how strong the CAD stays if the NDP can exert significant influence in a coalition government.
Oil and natural resources, and red-hot growth in India and China are driving the Canadian dollar, more than domestic political machinations.

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04-06-2011, 10:37 AM
  #92
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Originally Posted by Haymaker View Post
This must be some new meaning of the word "criminal" that I wasn't previously aware of. Nobody is getting a gun put to their head and being screamed at to buy the team. If WE know how much the team has lost, you can bet your powdered bottom that any prospective buyer knows it as well, and knows that trend will continue.

If they want to sink their money into the team, it's entirely their choice. The league owns the team, and can choose to sell it on their terms, just like you could choose to sell your house with the provision that the new owner must paint a "Dogs Playing Poker" mural on the wall of the guest bedroom and neer paint over it. If the new owner signs off, that's all that matters. Just because you would walk away from a deal doesn't make it "criminal".
Quote:
Originally Posted by JAX View Post
Well yes i realize this, I said "almost criminal" just because this whole fiascal has become a joke.
Swindling is still a crime!!

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04-06-2011, 10:40 AM
  #93
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Originally Posted by OthmarAmmann View Post
Bettman is trying to influence the BOC to crash the value of the CAD.
Now there is a conspiracy theory I can get behind...

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04-06-2011, 11:13 AM
  #94
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Part of me thinks that Bettman will convince the league to continue to own the Coyotes both to keep them in Glendale and away from Canada. They will lose more money and perhaps call on COG to once again cough up some more money. This is not smart but who knows.

In saying that, Bettman knows that Arizona is a big potential market and it's that fact that's keeping him there. There is a reccession going on that Arizona is the hardest hit. He feels that it will turn around and perhaps when the state is in better shape, people will want to watch hockey.

The other part of me thinks that the league doesn't want to lose more money on this and if a deal to sell the team to MH fails for whatever reason, it's time to move and keep Glendale on the back burner until an owner shows up because I think the NHL would gladly return.

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04-06-2011, 11:29 AM
  #95
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Courts are...a little...more sophisticated than that.
You'd think huh?., Yet how to explain that seemingly court approved clause in the NHL- APA?.

Quote:
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With the way things seem to be working in Arizona I'm not so sure.
Thats a strange one alright. I was almost certain that had a sale not been consummated locally & the team sold for relocation, any Relocation Fee charged by the league wouldve' been apportioned to Moyes's BK'd Estate, the funds used to off-set creditor losses', most notably the COG's claims. Odd.

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04-06-2011, 11:31 AM
  #96
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Good luck with that, CDN$ is gaining daily.
CNN speculates the U S government may just shutdown in the coming weeks, because they have no money. Yet there apparently still are communities in the U S willing to give away 100 million dollars. Unbelievable! No wonder the U S buck is tanking. I almost expect Bettman to say that's 170 million Canadian dollars the team is selling for.

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04-06-2011, 11:35 AM
  #97
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There are many problems with that, but there is one I've mentioned before although it hardly ever gets considered. Let's suppose that Calgary, Edmonton and Ottawa are removed. All 3 markets are capable of hosting pro hockey at the highest level.

Now this is all hypothetical and a more thought exercise in response to your post than reality. However, if you remove those 3 Canadian markets from the NHL, you also present and create the opportunity for a rival league. Add Winnipeg (TNSE), Quebec City (Quebecor), Hamilton (Balsillie), perhaps a team in Toronto at some point and a few select USA cities, and you have the basis for a rival WHA-type league.

Make no mistake. The NHL needs the Canadian markets not only for the TV dollars and merchandise sales, etc., but as a means of maintaining their defacto monopoly on pro hockey at the highest level.



IGHOST

Unless you start signing guys away from the NHL, I don't think you have the horses to start another NHL-WHA type war....

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04-06-2011, 11:38 AM
  #98
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Originally Posted by JAX View Post
I've been following the story on and off for the year or so, but can someone answer my question. why is Bettman so obsessive with keeping this team in Phoenix givin the massive loses they have year after year?

To me it almost seems like madness what he is doing.
If you substitute "Board of Governors" for "Bettman", I think you might capture the situation more accurately....

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04-06-2011, 11:41 AM
  #99
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Unless you start signing guys away from the NHL, I don't think you have the horses to start another NHL-WHA type war....
Well there would be 3 shunned Billionaires...... Just start signing the top homegrown prospects, unsigned Europeans and NHL FA's as they become available.

Add Canadian tv revenue that would be split 7 or 8 ways rather than 30. Forget the 200 million franchise fee, build your own arena instead. I'd say they would have a great shot at success.

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04-06-2011, 11:47 AM
  #100
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Originally Posted by OthmarAmmann View Post
Bettman is trying to influence the BOC to crash the value of the CAD.
Fear not fellow Canucks', Maple Leaf, Superhero,Stands on Guardian for Thee!.
According to the NHL web-bio, "A fierce immovable object that can grow exponentially larger at will". So.....

Why worry?.

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