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Holik and Jagr not happy...

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07-06-2004, 10:12 PM
  #1
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Holik and Jagr not happy...

It seems like Holik and Jagr are pretty pissed with the situation they are in right now. The only thing that satisfied both players, was the coaching of Tom Renney last year, and the hiring of him this year...

Also seems like the Rangers may have tried to move both players, but no team was biting due to their contract. Too bad...

Looks like star power is gonna rule once again in the Garden, here comes a top line of Holik, Jagr and some other random Czech

http://www.leaderboard.com/rodent.htm2
Thanks Rodent.

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07-06-2004, 11:24 PM
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Damn, my heart really goes out to these two guys.

If they really don't like it here why don't they renegotiate and take less money so they can be traded somewhere they'll be content.

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07-06-2004, 11:29 PM
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Holik's attitude sucks, he has offered no leadership to this team at all and all he does is complain.
Jager gets paid enough to keep his mouth shut for half a season, beceause he wont be here much longer than that anyway

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07-06-2004, 11:42 PM
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no

Holik says what us fans cant say because we dont have access to the media or to sather or anyone - he says how crappy the team is - ofcourse he can keep quiet and try to lead the team but that is impossible because most of them especially messier has no clue how to play on the ice. They have the worst coaches and the worst captains/leaders - I wouldnt be mad if Holik demanded a trade - I mean he came here because he thought the Rangers had something going - he never expected to be on a team rebuilding. And with the whole free agency thing - We had guys who were underachieving stars and we traded them for draft picks and prospects which really made ranger fans happy - now what is the big deal with signing superstars in free agency? Either you make ranger fans happy by signing a star who plays like a star or you make ranger fans happy by trading the underachiever for draft picks and prospects.

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07-07-2004, 12:07 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RangerBlues
Holik's attitude sucks, he has offered no leadership to this team at all and all he does is complain.
Jager gets paid enough to keep his mouth shut for half a season, beceause he wont be here much longer than that anyway
Finally, someone speaking the truth about Holik...And people a few days ago were ready to slap the 'C' on his chest this season. I just don't see it.

I wish we could get rid of this guys, but no one wants them, and i dont blame them. Who is gonna take on 9 million dollars for some 3rd line checking center.

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07-07-2004, 12:28 AM
  #6
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Holik can't get the 'C' because he's a former Devil. It had BETTER be an unwritten rule that former Philly, Devils and Fishticks cannot wear the C (I'm a little looser on the A, but would prefer never to see a Devil or Fishie to get that either).

Then again (a la ARod), can a hockey player accept less pay after a contract was negotiated? It would have to be a buyout and new contract for Holik to leave, seemingly.

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07-07-2004, 12:30 AM
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i have to disagree. when holik said that we were the worst team in the league fundamentally after the albatross in ottawa last season, he was saying what we ALL were thinking. the fact that he was willing to put pressure on sather to make changes for the betterment of the team is something that should be applauded by all of us.

holik's attitude hasn't always sucked. he came here looking for a refreshing change from a robotic scenery in new jersey. he was welcomed by the rangers with open arms. and yet while his performance on the ice has been exactly what we all expected (which is mostly good), the team has reached the low point of its playoff drought. which was totally impossible to imagine as far as i'm concerned when sather was hired. it's not like holik is a coach-killer or anything like that. he's a very honest person and what he said needed to be said. i only hope renney can utilize him correctly and start this team in the upward direction it needs to go.

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07-07-2004, 12:42 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Yizee
...especially messier has no clue how to play on the ice.
Yeah. Ok.

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07-07-2004, 12:48 AM
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Holik needs to shut his piehole and actually walk the walk a little bit. I would have more respect for him and what he said if he didn't turn around and commit the same errors he complains about. And I don't ever want to hear him say something like "I didn't sign up for this" with regard to an injection of youth into the Ranger ranks.

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07-07-2004, 01:03 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Chief
Holik needs to shut his piehole and actually walk the walk a little bit. I would have more respect for him and what he said if he didn't turn around and commit the same errors he complains about. And I don't ever want to hear him say something like "I didn't sign up for this" with regard to an injection of youth into the Ranger ranks.
thank you...very good post. I am not a fan of the guy going to the media every second to complain about the team...Keep it in the locker room please, if you wanna be a real leader, you should know that. And if you dont wanna be a part of this youth movement, feel free to redo your contract and take you Czech ass somewhere else.

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07-07-2004, 01:18 AM
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well, it SEEMS like he's willing to accept this new "challenge" as he put it when he talked to the ny times:

http://www.nytimes.com/2004/07/07/sp...07rangers.html

It is unclear how the Rangers' few remaining veterans will respond to the organizational changes. Bobby Holik, who previously said he had not signed on for this type of change, said yesterday that he had changed his mind.

"I love challenges," Holik said by phone from his off-season residence in Jackson Hole, Wyo. "Maybe at the time I didn't feel challenged. We really didn't have a clue where we were going. But I've had time to think about it. It could be fun."

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07-07-2004, 01:53 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MyCaptain11
well, it SEEMS like he's willing to accept this new "challenge" as he put it when he talked to the ny times:

http://www.nytimes.com/2004/07/07/sp...07rangers.html

It is unclear how the Rangers' few remaining veterans will respond to the organizational changes. Bobby Holik, who previously said he had not signed on for this type of change, said yesterday that he had changed his mind.

"I love challenges," Holik said by phone from his off-season residence in Jackson Hole, Wyo. "Maybe at the time I didn't feel challenged. We really didn't have a clue where we were going. But I've had time to think about it. It could be fun."
lol, he changed his mind...Well, if he's gonna go in with this kind of positive attitude, thats great. I hope he does...if not, he should feel free to leave.

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07-07-2004, 09:13 AM
  #13
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You guys seem pretty rough on ol' Bobby.........

NY RANGER TEAM LEADERS

Points -- B. Holik 56
Goals -- B. Holik 25
Assists -- B. Holik 31
Plus/Minus -- M. Barnaby 15
Penalty Minutes -- C. Simon 225
Time On Ice B. -- Leetch 26:14
Shots on Goal -- B. Holik 225
PP goals -- B. Holik 8
Wins M. Dunham -- 16
GAA J. Markkanen -- 2.56
Save Pct S. Valiquette -- .915


What more do you want him to do? Play Goal maybe?

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07-07-2004, 09:25 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JimEIV
What more do you want him to do?
Shut his mouth and lead.

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07-07-2004, 10:01 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JimEIV
What more do you want him to do?
I agree. I think some of his opponents need to clarify what they mean by "lead". And personally, I could care less about his lack of media savvy. Every time I hear a hockey player step up to the mic and start gushing cliche's and sound bytes, I want to vomit. I don't need to have my intelligence insulted as a fan by a player, coach or broadcaster who thinks they need to sugar coat a situation just so they don't rock the boat. Tell me what would have been different the last 2 years if Sather had been able to gag Holik.

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07-07-2004, 10:04 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Melrose_Jr.
I agree. I think some of his opponents need to clarify what they mean by "lead". And personally, I could care less about his lack of media savvy. Every time I hear a hockey player step up to the mic and start gushing cliche's and sound bytes, I want to vomit. I don't need to have my intelligence insulted as a fan by a player, coach or broadcaster who thinks they need to sugar coat a situation just so they don't rock the boat. Tell me what would have been different the last 2 years if Sather had been able to gag Holik.
Yep. There is no telling what might have happened if Mark Messier was not around to balance out Mike Keenan. I see this in the same scenario.

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07-07-2004, 10:25 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MyCaptain11
i have to disagree. when holik said that we were the worst team in the league fundamentally after the albatross in ottawa last season, he was saying what we ALL were thinking. the fact that he was willing to put pressure on sather to make changes for the betterment of the team is something that should be applauded by all of us.

holik's attitude hasn't always sucked. he came here looking for a refreshing change from a robotic scenery in new jersey. he was welcomed by the rangers with open arms. and yet while his performance on the ice has been exactly what we all expected (which is mostly good), the team has reached the low point of its playoff drought. which was totally impossible to imagine as far as i'm concerned when sather was hired. it's not like holik is a coach-killer or anything like that. he's a very honest person and what he said needed to be said. i only hope renney can utilize him correctly and start this team in the upward direction it needs to go.
I agree. He showed his frustration. We knew what we were getting. Remember when he questioned Gomez's penalties in between periods when he was a Devil playing against the Rangers. He speaks his mind and I like people like that. He was DEAD ON when he said we were fundamentlly the worst team in Hockey. Holik is a competitior and will call out players/management if he thinks they are lacking.

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07-07-2004, 11:06 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JimEIV

What more do you want him to do?
Shut his mouth and play the game. He is not being paid large sums of money to critique his team through the media. He certainly takes his share of dumb penalities and makes his share of mistakes. If he wants to be a color commentator or reporter , he should wait until his career is over.

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07-07-2004, 11:10 AM
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Great to hear Holik's happy.

Now all they gotta do is put a slot machine in the locker room and Jagr'll be happy, too.

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07-07-2004, 11:18 AM
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I find Holik hilarious... what has he done wrong? He tells the truth and he often does it in a very amusing way... remember all the scrutiny he was brought under for saying something to the effect of "NY is the worst team in the NHL when it comes to fundamentals." Is that not true?

There's no Joe McCarthy for NYR...

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07-07-2004, 11:25 AM
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The problem with Holik is not the accuracy of his statements, but their audience..

It might be refreshing to hear someone speak candidly, but as a team leader, he needs to keep it in the lockeroom.

It wasn't as much of a big deal the last couple of years, becuase the theam reached the point where they DID need to be called out in private, in public all over the place, BUT now with a group of kids looking to him for leadership, he better be critiquing in the lockeroom and supporting publicly.

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07-07-2004, 11:50 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Slewfoot
Shut his mouth and play the game.
As far as I am concerned, anything that caused Sather more embarassment is a good thing. Like MJ, I do not need to hear cookie-cutter cliches. The Rangers were SO bad, that Holik brought to attention the fact that no one is trying becuase no one is held accountable. What, would it be better if he said that the Rangers play their hearts out every night? What is worse, calling your team out or ingnoring what is reality?

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07-07-2004, 12:35 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Davisian
The problem with Holik is not the accuracy of his statements, but their audience..

It might be refreshing to hear someone speak candidly, but as a team leader, he needs to keep it in the lockeroom.

It wasn't as much of a big deal the last couple of years, becuase the theam reached the point where they DID need to be called out in private, in public all over the place, BUT now with a group of kids looking to him for leadership, he better be critiquing in the lockeroom and supporting publicly.
That's absolutely right. I think you'll find, if you look back, that Holik's criticism was always about people whom he expected more out of. He never said anything bad about youngsters or those who were working hard. He was pissed off at management and the big stars who weren't pulling their weight. Remember how he enjoyed playing with Lundmark?

He included himself in that group often -- the difference was, Holik would work back from bad patches while other players would just slip into a funk. Personally, I think he was one of the best players on this team over the last two years.

Even if Holik isn't interested in being a part of this rebuilding long-term, he's smart enough to know that it's in his best interest to have a good season and be a good team contributor. Then he'd be valuable to a contender around playoff-time, and he might get his chance at another cup. The same goes for Jagr, but I don't know that he's calculating enough...

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07-07-2004, 12:40 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by True Blue
As far as I am concerned, anything that caused Sather more embarassment is a good thing. Like MJ, I do not need to hear cookie-cutter cliches. The Rangers were SO bad, that Holik brought to attention the fact that no one is trying becuase no one is held accountable. What, would it be better if he said that the Rangers play their hearts out every night? What is worse, calling your team out or ingnoring what is reality?
Holik should call his team out in the lockerroom not in the press. It seems to me holik tried to make himself above all his teammates when he has been part of the problem the past two seasons. This is a guy that admited to showing up to his first training camp out of shape. Has everything Holik said been accurate? 9 times out of 10 yes it has but he needs to keep it in the lockerroom.

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07-07-2004, 12:46 PM
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Originally Posted by Son of Steinbrenner
Holik should call his team out in the lockerroom not in the press. It seems to me holik tried to make himself above all his teammates when he has been part of the problem the past two seasons. This is a guy that admited to showing up to his first training camp out of shape. Has everything Holik said been accurate? 9 times out of 10 yes it has but he needs to keep it in the lockerroom.
1. Apparently calling teamates out in the lockerroom has not worked for 7 years.
2. Holik included himself in the problems, not excluded himself. Not once did he say anything that would leave me to believe that he is trying to absolve himself.
3. He never admitted to showing up to camp out of shape. The only one that has said that has been Sather.

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