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Habs should sign Wisniewski over Markov

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Old
04-17-2011, 05:47 PM
  #226
lou4gehrig
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Originally Posted by intylerwetrust View Post
Gomez + Camm + Gionta = $18 mil cap hit... Its probably the worst cap hit to points ratio in the NHL. IMagine what they could have for $18 mil with smart spending?
That's not how the NHL works. There are not enough decent players to go around, so you have to overpay for the ones available. It's either have nothing or overpay.

You make it sound like we're the only team with overpaid players. At least ours play and produce somewhat. Plenty of teams get less for their money (Rangers with Gaborik, Drury, Frolov, Redden is $23M, Toronto with Phaneuf, Lupul, Komisarek, Finger is over $18M).

Obviously Gomez is overpaid. It's the most discussed point on this board. So? Either we buy him out or stash him in the minors a la Redden. Gionta and Camm are fine and produced well enough this season. We're a defense first team.

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Old
04-17-2011, 05:56 PM
  #227
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The best case scenario is that we sign both.

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Old
04-17-2011, 05:57 PM
  #228
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Originally Posted by marvelousmotion View Post
He probably exaggerated a bit saying that it is worse, but Wiesniewski also had to overcome knee injury problems in 07 and 08.

Wiesniewski
  • 2007/04/09 Missed the last 15 games of the regular season (right knee injury).
  • 2007/12/30 Sprained right knee, sidelined indefinitely.
  • 2008/09/01 Right knee surgery, sidelined indefinitely.
  • 2008/12/14 Missed 28 games (right knee surgery).

vs.

Markov
  • 2009/04/06 Left knee injury, late April.
  • 2010/05/24 Missed 11 playoff games (right knee injury).
  • 2010/09/17 Right knee surgery, injured reserve.
And the surgery to repair Markov's lacerated tendon from the 1st game of 2009-2010.

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Old
04-17-2011, 06:41 PM
  #229
Watsatheo
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Originally Posted by JimmyDarmody View Post
And the surgery to repair Markov's lacerated tendon from the 1st game of 2009-2010.
Wiz's is worse because it was his same right knee for 2 straight years + 3 surgeries on it.



Starting at 18:45

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Old
04-17-2011, 07:17 PM
  #230
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I think we could keep both. We could keep Gill for maybe a bit less than he's making now, Wiz won't take more than what Hamrlik is making.

Markov-Gorges
Gill-Subban
Spacek-Wiz
Weber/Mara/Sopel/Emelin?

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Old
04-17-2011, 07:26 PM
  #231
JHabs61
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Originally Posted by Watsatheo View Post
Wiz's is worse because it was his same right knee for 2 straight years + 3 surgeries on it.



Starting at 18:45
I watched the whole thing
& Can't we just sign them both?

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Old
04-17-2011, 07:39 PM
  #232
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I hope we can re-sign that guy!

He's talented and he plays with an edge! Yesterday, he made Hnidy look like a punching bag!

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Old
04-17-2011, 08:10 PM
  #233
Kriss E
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Originally Posted by Price2Pleks View Post
I watched the whole thing
& Can't we just sign them both?
We could, but that likely means byebye to Gill and Hammer, because Gorges and Weber also need to be re-signed. It also depends on the salaries.

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Old
04-17-2011, 08:58 PM
  #234
Subban76
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Habs should sign Wisniewski AND Markov.

Add Subban, Gorges, Gill and Hammer (get rid of Spacek and Weber is 7th) and kaboum!

Markov-Wisniewski
Gill-Subban
Hammer-Gorges
Weber

Amazing D with an amazing goalie.

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Old
04-17-2011, 09:24 PM
  #235
Stan
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Markov
Subban
Gorges
Wisnewski
Spacek
Weber

If you can move Spacek, then bring Gill back. Hamrlik is likely gone.

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Old
04-17-2011, 09:36 PM
  #236
Miller Time
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Originally Posted by E = CH² View Post
One thing to keep in mind about the Wiz is that he's only 27 years old. And dman tend to improve a lot defensively around that age. It takes a while to acquire the experience and defensive instincts. We all know Wiz is worth 5M offensively, but we don't think he is defensively. With the habs, he was a plus player however, and I've seen him improve defensively and not be a liability in his short time here.

Anyway, I guess what I'm trying to say is that what we see of Wiz right now might not necessarily be the best he'll ever be. Dmen can still improve at that age on the defensive side of things. For me 5M would be my limit when it comes to Wiz.
that is a good point about the age/development.

if the habs are going to give him a big pay day in the ball park of what he'd likely get as a UFA (4.5-5.5M), I would hope that they've done extensive research into his progression defensively, especially in the past 2-3 seasons, and come away quite confident that he'll continue to progress defensively at a solid pace. Not too mention have a glowing recommendation from the current coaching staff about his attitude/effort in practice.

While most dmen do get better with age/experience, it does vary from individual to individual. Before investing in him long-term on a big deal, I'd want to feel pretty confident that he's the type of athlete committed and able to improve year by year (focus and attitude).

imo, the pts don't mean as much, M.A Bergeron more than illustrated that, and while Wiz obviously brings far more to the table, his impressive production this year was buoyed by a massive career best in PP production...
29pts this year compared to 11 as a previous career best.

at 25-30pts/season, with his defensive play, there'd be no discussion around paying him in the 5M$ range, so the team had better be very confident he'll improve in other areas before making him one of our highest paid players

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Old
04-17-2011, 09:55 PM
  #237
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Originally Posted by intylerwetrust View Post
7G 23A 30PTS in 42 GP with the Habs, a pace of almost 60 PTS!

Not to mention 105 hits and 115 blocked shots (80 with Habs alone) to top it off. In his prime at 27 years old too.

Markov is obviously the more skilled Dman, but given the injury worries and not knowing if Markov will indeed be the same player he was, wouldnt it make more sense to throw a $3-4 mil per to Wiz over Markov at this point? To me its a pretty easy choice.
The main quality of this thread is to do as many of the media do - create a conflict so as to polarize people.

With as many pages as have been taken up on this topic, it looks like it worked.

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Old
04-17-2011, 10:20 PM
  #238
Guy Caballero
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Sign them both. Beautiful thing is the Wiz makes a great poor man's Markov when the real deal is on the shelf... And let's be honest. That's a lot now.

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Old
04-17-2011, 10:37 PM
  #239
habtastic
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no brainer. sign both. confident it will be done, they will find a way considering both Marky and Wiz want to stay here (too tired to back up reasons why I think that's true). Sadly Hammer is probably leaving, I really love the guy and his commitment. Gorges will be signed as well and as far-fetched as it sounds, I think Gill too. As a result, prolly not Sopel.

Markov Subban Wiz Gorges Spacek Gill. This is a good D-corps IMO. (Spacho is still under contract right?)

We'll see how the playoffs unravel, but I don't think we really need to go for that top 6 bomb. I think we do have good depth and the younger guys are only getting better. A big question is how much we sign AK for since the argument for him being a 30 goal scorer with PP is a valid one and he's worth a lot more skill-wise. I will be very upset if we try to trade him now that he's had a pretty consistent season (if not scoring, doing other things).


incidentally I don't think Markov and Wiz play the same game. A lot in common and Wiz is good at creating plays, but Markov's hockey mind, like Pleky and Gio's is incredible. Also, Wiz is daaaaym physical. If anything he's like the Komisarek we wanted. Probably more cuz of his offense.

Just watched the Nos Canadiens thing with him. That's incredible!!!! He was literally parachuted into Montreal! cool


Last edited by habtastic: 04-17-2011 at 10:42 PM.
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Old
04-17-2011, 10:50 PM
  #240
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Man.. I like the WIZ! But if I had to choose, I'd stick with Markov.. Though personally I think the Habs should keep both.

And why do most people want Gill out of town? I've learned to love the guy after last year's playoffs and I actually feel confident when he's out there against the other team's top lines, especially come playoff time.

But anyway here's what I want our defense to look like next year.

Markov Wiz
Gill Subban
Gorges Sopel
Mara as 7th (just for his kicka55 beard)
Or Spacek (for his awkward funny interviews lol)

This gives us 3 offensive d and 3 defensive (SHOT BLOCKING BEASTS) d! Also this way we can roll 3 pairings, no more 27-30min/game for someone.

then maybe we could trade weber this summer. I like the guy too but there's just no room for him. It's either he wants to get traded or spend some ahl time again.

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Old
04-18-2011, 10:15 AM
  #241
No Team Needed
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Markov - Wiz
Gill - Subban
Spacek - Gorges

What's wrong with this?

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Old
04-18-2011, 10:33 AM
  #242
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I wouldn't want to work out in the summer with my best buddy Plekanec if I was Kaberle and we got swept

Heck even if they lose in 7, it's going to be tough for Kabs to train with his buddy Plek after that

Maybe Plek can convince Kab to sign a 1 year 1mil deal with us to go on a cup run

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Old
04-18-2011, 11:17 AM
  #243
BigNumber1Centre
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CammerScores View Post
This. In fact, I think Markov and Wiz would make a good defense pairing.

Markov would settle Wiz down defensively. Wiz would bring some hits to that pairing and help to protect Markov, and Markov could set him up with perfect passes for his one timers.

XXX --- Subban
Markov --- Wiz
Spacek --- Gorges


Keep Mara as a 7th defensemen. That leaves room for one free agent defenseman.
Does XXX=Gill? Just out of curiosity is the general consensus on the habs board that Gill wont or shouldn't be re-signed?

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Old
04-18-2011, 11:25 AM
  #244
Roulin
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Originally Posted by Triple Low Five View Post
Does XXX=Gill? Just out of curiosity is the general consensus on the habs board that Gill wont or shouldn't be re-signed?
Between Gill and Hamrlik, I think the Hab fan consensus is to keep whoever played better in the last game! Right now that's Gill, but I think being paired with Subban for the last little while has something to do with that.

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Old
04-18-2011, 11:28 AM
  #245
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Originally Posted by Triple Low Five View Post
Does XXX=Gill? Just out of curiosity is the general consensus on the habs board that Gill wont or shouldn't be re-signed?
I would say there there is no general consensus on what to do. There are alot of options, but the only thing that remains constant is that our D-core probably isn't going to be that much different next year. Sure Markov and Gorges should be back, but the overall group of players will be similar.

I imagine 3 of Wiz/Markov/Gill/Hammer/Spacek will be retained. They have to make a decision on whether they can afford to sign both Markov and Wiz, and then figure out who to keep between Gill/Hammer/Spacek (which has be debated in other threads). Spacek seems like the most realistic of the 2nd group just because hes already under a contract which could be tricky to trade.

But in the end I don't think the people on this board have a consensus one way or another.


Last edited by bjac: 04-18-2011 at 12:32 PM.
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Old
04-18-2011, 12:27 PM
  #246
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Triple Low Five View Post
Does XXX=Gill? Just out of curiosity is the general consensus on the habs board that Gill wont or shouldn't be re-signed?
I like Gill however our line up is full unless we can move Spacek and even than I would like to retain Sopel, who has been a fantastic pick up as a 6th defenseman. I would not be averse to dropping Weber to the minors though.

As for the topic. You are damn well mad if you sign Wiz over Markov.

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Old
04-18-2011, 12:36 PM
  #247
holyhabs87
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Quote:
Originally Posted by No Team Needed View Post
Markov - Wiz
Gill - Subban
Spacek - Gorges

What's wrong with this?
Nothing...it's what I am hoping for.

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Old
04-18-2011, 01:35 PM
  #248
Kriss E
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Originally Posted by neofury View Post
I wouldn't want to work out in the summer with my best buddy Plekanec if I was Kaberle and we got swept

Heck even if they lose in 7, it's going to be tough for Kabs to train with his buddy Plek after that

Maybe Plek can convince Kab to sign a 1 year 1mil deal with us to go on a cup run
I'm not too sure Kaberle will sign in Boston. It doesn't seem like it's quite the fit for him.
I actually thought a guy like Kaberle would look perfect in Mtl. It just seems like the perfect match. The type of Dman Habs love.
He seems lost and confused in Boston.
According to some Boston journalist, he's not even sure Boston would want to even re-sign him if the Bruins don't step up their play in the POs. He does say Kaberle was god awful in the first two games, which I strongly disagree with, but wtv.

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Old
04-18-2011, 01:39 PM
  #249
DekeLikeYouMeanIt
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Quote:
Originally Posted by neofury View Post
I wouldn't want to work out in the summer with my best buddy Plekanec if I was Kaberle and we got swept

Heck even if they lose in 7, it's going to be tough for Kabs to train with his buddy Plek after that

Maybe Plek can convince Kab to sign a 1 year 1mil deal with us to go on a cup run
They play table tennis together too, I think
"Ooh that rebound just killed you.. again" - Pleky

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Old
04-18-2011, 03:21 PM
  #250
Maxpac
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Quote:
Originally Posted by No Team Needed View Post
Markov - Wiz
Gill - Subban
Spacek - Gorges

What's wrong with this?
Just 1 thing, Spacek has really not played well as the pp shooter since he signed in Montreal. Really wish we could trade him and sign one of Ernhoff/ Jovanovski at a good price instead.

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