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Old
04-10-2011, 10:51 AM
  #26
GrizzLeaf
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nick942 View Post
imo i think this team isnt really close to being a cup contender (mabey in a few tears, but not now) so i think the best strategy we could use is just letting the kids play. Next year we have our draft pick, im not saying we tank, but we may finish out of the playoffs by giving guys like colborne, kadri, frattin, (maybe Gardiner) more prominent roles on the team to develop better. And i agree burke is pretty successful when trading so if he could pick up some prospects/ or young players from trades that would be great. I think if this team continues to rebuild the right way instead of trying to cheat and bring in expensive ufa's to cut on time, then in 3-6 years time this team could very well be a stanley cup contender

- also if burke can sign mcarthur for 2.2-2.75 mil then im fine , but anymore and i would let him walk
- if giguere is willing to play backup for around 1.5-2 mil then im also fine with him staying for another year or 2
-i agree that burke should look for some better pk players
- in terms of improving scoring, again i feel guys like kadri could definitely help in that area
So you're comfortable with Giggy becoming the starter if Reimer goes down with an injury? Cause that's what you expect from your backup. It's not just about coming in to play the odd game, and giving the team a chance to win. There will be times when the backup is expected to carry the load.

I would rather see Burke sign a veteran goalie to back up Reimer. Back in Sept I was saying that Giggy's best season's were behind him, and we can clearly see that he's declining even more. His best days are far behind him.

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Old
04-10-2011, 10:55 AM
  #27
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I know it's only one game but which McArthur will we get next season on a comfortable long term deal? The one we saw most of the season or the player I saw going through the motions last night?

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04-10-2011, 10:57 AM
  #28
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MacArthur would be crazy to go back to arbitration, even if he knew he would win.

Does he really want to have to find another team and accept less money again in hopes of getting a similar role? Burke is smart enough to know he has him over a barrel and will try to get him signed for a similar contract to what Kulemin got last year. 2 years around at 2.25-2.5.

The team also has Kadri who could probably step right into that role if needed.

The team holds all the cards in this case and would be prepared if they need to walk away.

If they did decide to trade him, they would get far more than a 4th. Maybe a deal like MacArthur for Liles would work for both teams.

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04-10-2011, 11:01 AM
  #29
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Originally Posted by Hold Steady View Post
MacArthur would be crazy to go back to arbitration, even if he knew he would win.

Does he really want to have to find another team and accept less money again in hopes of getting a similar role? Burke is smart enough to know he has him over a barrel and will try to get him signed for a similar contract to what Kulemin got last year. 2 years around at 2.25-2.5.

The team also has Kadri who could probably step right into that role if needed.

The team holds all the cards in this case and would be prepared if they need to walk away.

If they did decide to trade him, they would get far more than a 4th. Maybe a deal like MacArthur for Liles would work for both teams.
THANK YOU!!! Macarthur has said repeatedly that he was pissed off with how his summer went last year. he's got issues with the arbitration system (fair complaints in my eyes). i'd find it hard to believe that he'd want to go to arbitration again. i strongly doubt he'll make it that far.

he complained about not becoming a free agent until mid august, by which point most teams have sorta settled their rosters, so there wasn't much demand. that why he signed a 1.1m contract, when he easily deserved more.

im quite certain burke will re-sign him at a reasonable rate. burke has all the cards: macarthur likes toronto, has chemistry with linemates, likely doesnt wanna go back to arbitration, and he's an rfa. he can't threaten to leave, and if he won't agree to a reasonable contract, there's the threat of arbitration over him. he'll be back

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04-10-2011, 11:03 AM
  #30
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Originally Posted by Baba Ganoush View Post
totally disagree. even as an unsigned RFA, he holds value imo. it's not like he's a pending UFA and the team he would be going to would have no leverage...

regardless though, the Leafs won't move his rights for a measly pick anyways, coming off of a 60-ish point season worth $1.1mil, and considering he has great chemistry with two guys who will almost 100% be back with the Leafs next season.



not going to take wild guesses at players...but things i think Burke needs to adress are:

- top 4 puck moving dman
- replace Lebda by any means necessary with a #5/6/7 (depth) dman
- top 6 forward for Kessel
- special teams (whether it be bringing in a special teams coach, or new players, or both)
- MAYBE sign a goalie

Lupul - ______ - Kessel
Mac - Grabovski - Kulemin
_____ - ______ - Armstrong
Brown - ______ - Orr
_______ / _______

Aulie - Phaneuf
_______ - Schenn
Gunnarsson - Komisarek
_______

Reimer
Gus / ______



maybe some of those _____ can be filled with players we already have like Kadri, Hanson, Bozak, Zigo, Brent, Boyce, etc...but all i know is, we need better special teams.

i believe signing bozak will have completed the third line
a great line would
armstrong bozak kadri

2 talented young forwards plus a grind out guy and also bozak and army can help kadri on defense

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Old
04-10-2011, 11:04 AM
  #31
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Originally Posted by GrizzLeaf View Post
I'm hoping to see Burke move at least one of Lebda or Komi. Both would be nice, but moving one alone is probably gonna be tough. If Komi goes on waivers, what are you hoping for next? He plays in the A next season? Or try re-entry and hope someone takes a flyer on him at half price?
Either one would be better than him actually playing on our team and giving away the puck

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04-10-2011, 11:07 AM
  #32
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I agree with most, CMac is just reaching his prime, he might be even better next year with grabo and kulie. If burke wanted to get rid of him he would have at the deadline this year when he would have gotten the most for him.. Cmac is worth 2.5-2.75 mil in my opinion. As for #1 centre you guys don't think after a summer of heavy workouts Colborne could be that guy, if burke can't sign Richards I say give Colborne and Kadri a shot next year. Frattin I think should make the team next year also. Just my 2 cents

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Old
04-10-2011, 11:07 AM
  #33
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> Upgrade at center, even if it's a 2nd line center. Need someone to take the offensive burden off of Grabovski. Hopefully Bozak can find his scoring/playmaking touch again.

> Upgrade at goal, I don't see Gustavsson as the mentor type and that's what Reimer may need. A veteran back-up. Gustavsson potentially dealt.

> Upgrade bottom-six. Bring back Boyce/Brent let Crabb/Sjostrom walk. Re-sign Rosehill, but start with the Marlies. Need a 6'1+ defensive forward for the 4th line center spot. Someone who can win some key faceoffs maybe. Someone like Marty Reasoner may fit here as a UFA. Explore options for upgrading 2nd/3rd lines.

> Upgrade the defensive unit by adding two mobile defenders.

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Old
04-10-2011, 11:11 AM
  #34
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Originally Posted by Tiger Blood View Post
Line 4
- It's impossible to pick who might make a 4th line, but we can assume that one of the guys battling for 3rd line C will end up the 4th line C and picture names like Crabb, Frattin, Komarov, Brown, Rosehill, and maybe Orr (if he plays) and Zigomanis.
side the system and he's already publicly stated that he knows he has to address it.
Matt Frattin is not a fourth line player.

Brown and Orr are already clinched for the fourth line if they're health (which they should be). I could see them keeping Crabb up though to swap out for Orr for games where an enforcer is probably not needed.

The only real debate about the fourth line is who gets centre: Boyce or Brent?

I wouldn't be opposed to dealing Gustavsson if the price is right. I'd prefer to see them hang onto him for one more year but wouldn't be terribly upset if he left. I'd think we might be able to manage a second round pick for him.

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Old
04-10-2011, 11:13 AM
  #35
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People what has bb said at every corner in the last 2 months...He wants size and snarl added...Yet may people are suggesting changes of players not fitting that...i think we need to look at what he is saying...

clearly we need a centre, a nasty winger....and perhaps others...

But BB will not bring in another small player no way....were smaller and weak in top 6 outside of Kuli...that will not win in playoffs and we all know that when series get physical and tough we will go nowhere.....

Thats when intensity becomes fierce, and we are soft...

bottom 6 does not win series for you...we are stronger for playoffs in the bottom 6, perhaps a change here for next year..as well but it looks good...

I think we need to trade an asset plus a pick/prospect to fill centre or winger...

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Old
04-10-2011, 11:14 AM
  #36
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MacArthur had a good first half, then sort of disappeared the second half.

He got odd assists here and there, and a couple of fights, but only than the Buffalo game didn't really score any big goals.

I can kind of see why Buffalo and Atlanta were hesitant to sign him.

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04-10-2011, 11:15 AM
  #37
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Originally Posted by Porn* View Post
yes...

secondly, burke's signing have been great, hindsight is always 20/20.

orr
beauch
komi
gustavsson
brown

i'm missing quite a few... were all solid additions at the time.
Brown was a trade, I want to say a 5th rounder

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04-10-2011, 11:20 AM
  #38
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Hawaiinleaf View Post
People what has bb said at every corner in the last 2 months...He wants size and snarl added...Yet may people are suggesting changes of players not fitting that...i think we need to look at what he is saying...

clearly we need a centre, a nasty winger....and perhaps others...

But BB will not bring in another small player no way....were smaller and weak in top 6 outside of Kuli...that will not win in playoffs and we all know that when series get physical and tough we will go nowhere.....

Thats when intensity becomes fierce, and we are soft...

bottom 6 does not win series for you...we are stronger for playoffs in the bottom 6, perhaps a change here for next year..as well but it looks good...

I think we need to trade an asset plus a pick/prospect to fill centre or winger...
You're right about Burke wanting to add size. But you shouldn't say bottom six doesn't win a series for you. It's a full team out there, and all cylinders need to be firing. The bottom six is where you usually put your PK specialist(s), and hopefully where your secondary scoring comes from. The Leafs need to improve in both of those from the bottom six.

I agree that they need to add a big body or two in the top six (hopefully a center). I'm not really seeing any UFA's that fit the bill, so it's looking like trade will be how it's done. That means giving up one of our top six guys to get one.

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Old
04-10-2011, 11:23 AM
  #39
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macarthur will sign for 3 years around 3 mill per

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04-10-2011, 11:24 AM
  #40
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Originally Posted by Baba Ganoush View Post
totally disagree. even as an unsigned RFA, he holds value imo. it's not like he's a pending UFA and the team he would be going to would have no leverage...

regardless though, the Leafs won't move his rights for a measly pick anyways, coming off of a 60-ish point season worth $1.1mil, and considering he has great chemistry with two guys who will almost 100% be back with the Leafs next season.



not going to take wild guesses at players...but things i think Burke needs to adress are:

- top 4 puck moving dman
- replace Lebda by any means necessary with a #5/6/7 (depth) dman
- top 6 forward for Kessel
- special teams (whether it be bringing in a special teams coach, or new players, or both)
- MAYBE sign a goalie

Lupul - Ladd/Laich - Kessel
Mac - Grabovski - Kulemin
Kadri - Bozak - Armstrong/Frattin
Brown - Brent - Orr

Aulie - Phaneuf
J.M. Lilies - Schenn
Gunnarsson - Komisarek
Lebda

Reimer
Gus / Giguere



maybe some of those _____ can be filled with players we already have like Kadri, Hanson, Bozak, Zigo, Brent, Boyce, etc...but all i know is, we need better special teams.
Filled it in for you.

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Old
04-10-2011, 11:27 AM
  #41
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I'm sure MacArthur will be re-signed, just because he hasn't scored in a number of games, is no reason to write him off, scorers often go into scoring slumps but he has solidified that line and works well with Kulemin and Grabovski, even to making it the #1 line, ahead of Lupul, Bozak and Kesssel, in many minds.

This will come down to a money issue but from what I've read and watched in interviews MacArthur wants to be here and Burke wants him here and he will, in all likelihood, be re-signed, for a similar contract to Grabs and Kulemin.

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Old
04-10-2011, 11:29 AM
  #42
Baba Ganoush
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Originally Posted by zapy View Post
Filled it in for you.
i fail to see how the exact same forward group with Laich/Ladd would be any better to be honest.

Laich is NOT first line C material...and Ladd is a winger who is the captain of the Thrashers, and likely not available at all.

plus, Giguere is poop and is a UFA now.

if i had to fill in those forward blanks with players already in our system, i would likely go with:

Lupul - Kadri - Kessel
Mac - Grabovski - Kulemin
Boyce - Bozak - Armstrong
Brown - Zigomanis - Orr
Hanson/Brent


Kadri has great hands and it's time to put him with skilled players at his natural position...not on the wing in a 3rd line role.

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Old
04-10-2011, 11:31 AM
  #43
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He's a RFA. If they traded his rights it would be worth next to nothing.
Of course they are... just look at Kessel....

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04-10-2011, 11:34 AM
  #44
Baba Ganoush
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i don't know where people get the idea that RFA's have no value...

pretty odd.

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04-10-2011, 11:36 AM
  #45
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> Upgrade at center, even if it's a 2nd line center. Need someone to take the offensive burden off of Grabovski. Hopefully Bozak can find his scoring/playmaking touch again.

> Upgrade at goal, I don't see Gustavsson as the mentor type and that's what Reimer may need. A veteran back-up. Gustavsson potentially dealt.

> Upgrade bottom-six. Bring back Boyce/Brent let Crabb/Sjostrom walk. Re-sign Rosehill, but start with the Marlies. Need a 6'1+ defensive forward for the 4th line center spot. Someone who can win some key faceoffs maybe. Someone like Marty Reasoner may fit here as a UFA. Explore options for upgrading 2nd/3rd lines.

> Upgrade the defensive unit by adding two mobile defenders.
This is almost everything I see, in the new look Leafs for next year, I don't think Bozak will stay between Lupul and Kessel he may drop down to center the third line but I agree with everything else.

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Old
04-10-2011, 11:38 AM
  #46
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Originally Posted by Baba Ganoush View Post
i fail to see how the exact same forward group with Laich/Ladd would be any better to be honest.

Laich is NOT first line C material...and Ladd is a winger who is the captain of the Thrashers, and likely not available at all.
Agreed. Seems like a few people want Laich as our #1C and I can't help but laugh. First time I've seen Ladd in our lineup as #1C though

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Old
04-10-2011, 11:40 AM
  #47
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Agreed. I have no idea why people keep posting that.
I don't mind so much that people post things like Ladd in the lineup, but they need to remove someone significant to show what was given for him. It's not like Burke can just call up any old GM and ask for their best and brightest and pay them in shiny rocks.

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Old
04-10-2011, 11:42 AM
  #48
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Matt Frattin is not a fourth line player.

Brown and Orr are already clinched for the fourth line if they're health (which they should be). I could see them keeping Crabb up though to swap out for Orr for games where an enforcer is probably not needed.

The only real debate about the fourth line is who gets centre: Boyce or Brent?
And Kadri isn't a 3rd line player, but that might be where he starts the season. Just because you ultimately see a guy playing a certain role doesn't mean he won't start in a different one. Matt Frattin can play any position in the bottom 6, but there's not much room for him on the 3rd line (unless he dominates camp) so he'll be fighting for a 4th line role.

I think that eventually Frattin's development path could have him take over Armstrong's role, but not yet.

Also, I'm not convinced Orr will be on the team next year, so I'd be weary pencilling him in already.

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04-10-2011, 11:43 AM
  #49
Baba Ganoush
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Originally Posted by John-Eric Iannicello View Post
> Upgrade at goal, I don't see Gustavsson as the mentor type and that's what Reimer may need. A veteran back-up. Gustavsson potentially dealt.
i agree with your post but not this.

it's not that i think Gus should for sure be the backup, cause i don't...but what would be the point in dealing him?

after heart problems and a poor season, what would his value be at the moment? a 7th rd pick?

the potential is still there with Gus, and Burke went way out of his way to sign him. at worst, let him start for the Marlies with Rynnas or Scrivens and see how he does, if he's not used with Reimer.

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04-10-2011, 11:45 AM
  #50
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Originally Posted by Baba Ganoush View Post
i agree with your post but not this.

it's not that i think Gus should for sure be the backup, cause i don't...but what would be the point in dealing him?

after heart problems and a poor season, what would his value be at the moment? a 7th rd pick?

the potential is still there with Gus, and Burke went way out of his way to sign him. at worst, let him start for the Marlies with Rynnas or Scrivens and see how he does, if he's not used with Reimer.
He needs to clear waivers to go to the AHL. Could be lost for nothing. But I would rather take that chance, and see him develop in the Leaf's system than to trade him away. No way do I want to see him with the big club next season. At all.

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