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Old
10-31-2012, 02:43 PM
  #651
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Originally Posted by phillipsj89 View Post
Get off your high horse, a forum is for discussion, that is what im doing. And you surely can't be talking about Columbus' prospects. How did Brule turn out...oh ya, pls don't do the same with Murray, he is a great talent just like Brule was.
Brule was kind of awhile ago. It's about time we put that one to bed I think when worrying over how prospects are handled. There's an entirely new organization here, more or less, than there was in those days. Time to get over it. (Brule sucked for many more teams than the CBJ and believe it or not, he's not the first kid to look great in junior only to be average or worse in the pro leagues).

I don't know why they sent Madaisky to the ECHL instead of Kamloops. Perhaps there's a good reason, maybe not. Either way, none of us outside of that decision will ever know. Maybe being on a struggling team in the ECHL will build more character than being on a team that has things relatively easy in juniors.

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10-31-2012, 03:42 PM
  #652
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Originally Posted by SuperGenius View Post
Brule was kind of awhile ago. It's about time we put that one to bed I think when worrying over how prospects are handled. There's an entirely new organization here, more or less, than there was in those days. Time to get over it. (Brule sucked for many more teams than the CBJ and believe it or not, he's not the first kid to look great in junior only to be average or worse in the pro leagues).

I don't know why they sent Madaisky to the ECHL instead of Kamloops. Perhaps there's a good reason, maybe not. Either way, none of us outside of that decision will ever know. Maybe being on a struggling team in the ECHL will build more character than being on a team that has things relatively easy in juniors.
It's not easy by any means. Kamloops beat everette last night in a shoot-out, in fact many of Kamloops' wins have been in overtime or shoot-out. During their current streak of 14 wins, 5 of them have been in overtime. Oh and if you think Junior is so easy. You should check out Ryan Murray's plus-minus. I know he was never touted as a defensive defenseman, but if he can't stop junior teams from scoring on him, I doubt he could at the NHL level.

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10-31-2012, 04:41 PM
  #653
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Originally Posted by phillipsj89 View Post
It's not easy by any means. Kamloops beat everette last night in a shoot-out, in fact many of Kamloops' wins have been in overtime or shoot-out. During their current streak of 14 wins, 5 of them have been in overtime. Oh and if you think Junior is so easy. You should check out Ryan Murray's plus-minus. I know he was never touted as a defensive defenseman, but if he can't stop junior teams from scoring on him, I doubt he could at the NHL level.
This is substantially more entertaining than anything else I've seen this week.

Not just here, but anywhere.

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10-31-2012, 04:48 PM
  #654
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Originally Posted by phillipsj89 View Post
It's not easy by any means. Kamloops beat everette last night in a shoot-out, in fact many of Kamloops' wins have been in overtime or shoot-out. During their current streak of 14 wins, 5 of them have been in overtime. Oh and if you think Junior is so easy. You should check out Ryan Murray's plus-minus. I know he was never touted as a defensive defenseman, but if he can't stop junior teams from scoring on him, I doubt he could at the NHL level.
Hockey is a team sport, you cant judge strictly off +/-.
Although its a good stat to look at you have to look at the team as a whole. Im sure if he was on kamploops his +/- would be unreal. .

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10-31-2012, 05:19 PM
  #655
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Originally Posted by phillipsj89 View Post
It's not easy by any means. Kamloops beat everette last night in a shoot-out, in fact many of Kamloops' wins have been in overtime or shoot-out. During their current streak of 14 wins, 5 of them have been in overtime. Oh and if you think Junior is so easy. You should check out Ryan Murray's plus-minus. I know he was never touted as a defensive defenseman, but if he can't stop junior teams from scoring on him, I doubt he could at the NHL level.
Madaisky doesn't 'need' the Blazers, I am pretty sure he would rather tend to the wishes of his NHL team about where he plays his hockey. No, I don't like that he plays there, but to suggest Madaisky needs the Blazers because the ECHL sucks (Which is an entirely different argument.) and the Blazers are a powerhouse this year, is preposterous. If the Blazers don't need Madaisky, then why are you here clambering for him to go back? You seem fine without him, as you indicated.

And about Ryan Murray, I never thought we should have drafted him (well documented on here with me.) but we did so I deal with it. To suggest he's a 'great talent' and not to ruin him like Brule because of the great talent, only to blast him by using his +/- numbers (which is a terrible statline to use.) and won't last in the NHL if he can't stop junior players, is condescending to your previous remarks.. Do you think he's talented or not?

You can disagree with us here, but most of us are on your side thinking he should go back to Junior. You don't need to blast our organization or our other prospects to get your point across.

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Old
10-31-2012, 05:26 PM
  #656
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Originally Posted by phillipsj89 View Post
It's not easy by any means. Kamloops beat everette last night in a shoot-out, in fact many of Kamloops' wins have been in overtime or shoot-out. During their current streak of 14 wins, 5 of them have been in overtime. Oh and if you think Junior is so easy. You should check out Ryan Murray's plus-minus. I know he was never touted as a defensive defenseman, but if he can't stop junior teams from scoring on him, I doubt he could at the NHL level.
So earlier you were asking us (the fans?) To prevent Murrays talent be wasted, but now you expect him to be bad? Make up your mind.

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Old
10-31-2012, 05:31 PM
  #657
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So earlier you were asking us (the fans?) To prevent Murrays talent be wasted, but now you expect him to be bad? Make up your mind.
I was simply exemplifying why Junior isn't the cakewalk some think it is. Even for the Blazers who are (16-0-0-1) have had tough time, just as a great player like Ryan Murray has as well.

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10-31-2012, 05:39 PM
  #658
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I was simply exemplifying why Junior isn't the cakewalk some think it is. Even for the Blazers who are (16-0-0-1) have had tough time, just as a great player like Ryan Murray has as well.
Nobody has said that junior hockey is a cakewalk, or implied it, or inferred it.

Players improve by playing against a better level of competition. And, simply put, a CHL team would have a hell of a tough time playing against even a mid-level professional team. Look at the overagers who go from top-line minutes in the CHL to the third and fourth lines in the ECHL, and only emerge toward the top of a lineup two, three, or four years later.

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10-31-2012, 06:10 PM
  #659
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Originally Posted by Mayor Bee View Post
Nobody has said that junior hockey is a cakewalk, or implied it, or inferred it.

Players improve by playing against a better level of competition. And, simply put, a CHL team would have a hell of a tough time playing against even a mid-level professional team. Look at the overagers who go from top-line minutes in the CHL to the third and fourth lines in the ECHL, and only emerge toward the top of a lineup two, three, or four years later.
That's all completely correct. In terms of skill level and strength, a player out of junior will very rarely be able to compete with grown men. What most people here seem to be discounting is the fact that players in the ECHL just don't care! That rubs off on players, there is a reason that a very low percentage of players ever make it to the NHL from the ECHL and it's not only because they are not good enough.

Simply put, I see this as a wrong move by Columbus. I leave in peace

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10-31-2012, 06:53 PM
  #660
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Originally Posted by phillipsj89 View Post
That's all completely correct. In terms of skill level and strength, a player out of junior will very rarely be able to compete with grown men. What most people here seem to be discounting is the fact that players in the ECHL just don't care! That rubs off on players, there is a reason that a very low percentage of players ever make it to the NHL from the ECHL and it's not only because they are not good enough.

Simply put, I see this as a wrong move by Columbus. I leave in peace
I have no idea where you'd get this idea from at all. Guys who play in the ECHL get $400/week to take long bus rides to minor-league towns and eat at McDonald's. I seriously doubt that a player just two levels removed from six- or seven-figure salaries, luxury travel and luxury accommodations, and a chance to play for a Stanley Cup is just going to mail it in and float.

Also, many of us remember the old Columbus Chill of the ECHL. Considering some of the guys who came through here (Phil Crowe, Barry Dreger, Sasha Lakovic, Justin McPolin, to name just a few), the idea of ECHL players lacking "desire" and "heart" is crazy talk.

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Old
10-31-2012, 06:54 PM
  #661
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They're not the angelic Icemen. They're the E'Ville Icemen!

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10-31-2012, 06:56 PM
  #662
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Originally Posted by Mayor Bee View Post
I have no idea where you'd get this idea from at all. Guys who play in the ECHL get $400/week to take long bus rides to minor-league towns and eat at McDonald's. I seriously doubt that a player just two levels removed from six- or seven-figure salaries, luxury travel and luxury accommodations, and a chance to play for a Stanley Cup is just going to mail it in and float.

Also, many of us remember the old Columbus Chill of the ECHL. Considering some of the guys who came through here (Phil Crowe, Barry Dreger, Sasha Lakovic, Justin McPolin, to name just a few), the idea of ECHL players lacking "desire" and "heart" is crazy talk.
Agreed. While not the most talented, those guys that played for the Chill were warriors. They'd play the game that way for free if they didn't have bills to pay. And there was this guy I saw from Johnstown. What was his name? Oh I remember now... JODY SHELLEY.

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10-31-2012, 07:03 PM
  #663
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They're not the angelic Icemen. They're the E'Ville Icemen!
And they'll be in Toledo Saturday. Can't wait to see some hockey!

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10-31-2012, 07:09 PM
  #664
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Agreed. While not the most talented, those guys that played for the Chill were warriors. They'd play the game that way for free if they didn't have bills to pay. And there was this guy I saw from Johnstown. What was his name? Oh I remember now... JODY SHELLEY.
According to the back of his jersey, he was SHELLY.

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10-31-2012, 07:14 PM
  #665
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Originally Posted by phillipsj89 View Post
It's not easy by any means. Kamloops beat everette last night in a shoot-out, in fact many of Kamloops' wins have been in overtime or shoot-out. During their current streak of 14 wins, 5 of them have been in overtime. Oh and if you think Junior is so easy. You should check out Ryan Murray's plus-minus. I know he was never touted as a defensive defenseman, but if he can't stop junior teams from scoring on him, I doubt he could at the NHL level.
I think you need to pay closer attention to the posts you're responding to.

"junior" is not easy, nor did I imply it.

Being on a winning team, one that's successful enough to be 16-0 or whatever would logically seem to be easier to cope with than being on a collection of players on a team in their inaugural year in the ECHL struggling to win their first game. In my experience, you learn more about yourself when times are bad than when things are rolling. The fact that the wins are hard fought or difficult doesn't really have anything to do with it.

This was just one theory, of course, and could be far from the truth. I don't think it's really all that useful for you to try to shoot everything down that doesn't fit your thoughts on the matter.

I don't understand the point of the Murray comments. 1) we're not talking about Murray 2) we're not talking about any particular junior's potential immediate success at the NHL level 3)If we were talking about Murray, +/- is probably the most useless of any available information that we could use to form an opinion.

I understand you're passionate in your opinion that Madaisky should be sent back to Kamloops, but it didn't happen, none of us know why, and none of us can really be sure it's a bad move yet. For all any of us know, it could be a great move for all involved.

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10-31-2012, 07:22 PM
  #666
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According to the back of his jersey, he was SHELLY.
Everybody's a typing critic!
Yes, of course it's SHELLY.

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10-31-2012, 11:50 PM
  #667
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Originally Posted by phillipsj89 View Post
ECHL is far from Pro Hockey, even if it's is considered some sort of pro. Honestly, The Blazers don't need Madaisky, Madaisky needs the Blazers, or rather, the experience he will gain from playing (most likely) deep into the playoffs and quite possibly into the memorial cup against the best junior teams in Canada
It's clear that you're trying to stir up the pot here, but I'll try to be nice.

The ECHL is a competitive league with some very good talent in it, particularly during the lockout. To say what you just said about it is insulting - not to the league, but to yourself as a hockey fan. You're proving homerism at it's finest, and that's all you're achieving in this discussion. While I don't agree with some of the responses you've gotten, I think you need to be more realistic with your posts. And to say that we ruined Gilbert Brule is a farce, and you being in a BC Division locale should know that as well as I do living in the US Division. Brule was on a high horse even in junior, and it's clear to see that his failures had little to do with how he was developed, and more to do with his maturity and playstyle. 5'11" power forwards rarely succeed at the NHL level, and Brule was too cocky to adapt.

I get what you're saying about Madaisky, but you have to take a step back and look at the whole picture. Legitimate NHL players are playing in the ECHL right now, and Madaisky's game will only develop further by playing against them. If the lockout is settled, he will absolutely be moved up to the AHL ... will that make you happy?

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11-01-2012, 02:10 PM
  #668
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11-01-2012, 09:43 PM
  #669
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Paul Dainton is injured and out day to day. Mike Clemente has been re-called from the Missouri Mavericks.

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11-01-2012, 10:34 PM
  #670
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Originally Posted by leesmith View Post
Everybody's a typing critic!
Yes, of course it's SHELLY.
Your typing was accurate, but there's a Johnstown Chiefs game jersey out there that has his last name misspelled. I don't know who owns it right now.

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11-02-2012, 12:12 PM
  #671
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What's the latest on Allen York's injury?

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11-02-2012, 12:30 PM
  #672
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What's the latest on Allen York's injury?
Supposedly several weeks from returning

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11-02-2012, 01:12 PM
  #673
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Your typing was accurate, but there's a Johnstown Chiefs game jersey out there that has his last name misspelled. I don't know who owns it right now.
I swear I've seen that somewhere!

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11-02-2012, 02:13 PM
  #674
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Supposedly several weeks from returning
I hope he doesn't end up being a sort of forgotten player, with Dansk and Korpisalo in the system now.

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11-02-2012, 04:44 PM
  #675
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Guys, how will any links, throw please. While I do not see any ...

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