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Old
05-11-2011, 11:35 AM
  #751
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Originally Posted by silverfish View Post
How about that play where Kreider was wide open for the tap in and Smith was just like...nah I'm gonna shoot it right into the Czech defender. Amazing how his play tailed off when he was moved off of Stepan's line
Actually that was a very good shift by the Kreider & Smith line. Kreider and Smith worked the puck down low well. If Smith hadn't been so selfish and passed to
Kreider he had a lay up for a goal.

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05-11-2011, 11:41 AM
  #752
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I wish they would show more games, not just U.S. It's not like VS has anything else worth watching during the day.
It may not be worth it for them from a cost perspective.

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05-11-2011, 11:47 AM
  #753
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I hate the cap too since the idea was introduced, but Jarg is not a cap casualty. Sather's inability to operate under cap was the reason. He just screwed up. Then later made it look like Jarg wanted to leave.
Not true. Jagr had a lucrative contract offer on the table from the KHL, drags his feet and doesn't make a serious attempt to hammer out a deal with Sather before July 1st, and it's Sather who forced Jagr out?

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05-11-2011, 11:50 AM
  #754
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Jagr was all about the money, not the hometown or NY discount. Let's be honest here. I can't really blame the guy, but I can't help but wonder if it damages (somewhat) his NHL legacy.

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05-11-2011, 11:53 AM
  #755
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Originally Posted by haohmaru View Post
Jagr was all about the money, not the hometown or NY discount. Let's be honest here. I can't really blame the guy, but I can't help but wonder if it damages (somewhat) his NHL legacy.
Jagr could care less about that. He'll be in the HOF and has a couple of SC rings to wear on his hands.

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05-11-2011, 11:57 AM
  #756
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Originally Posted by wolfgaze View Post
Not true. Jagr had a lucrative contract offer on the table from the KHL, drags his feet and doesn't make a serious attempt to hammer out a deal with Sather before July 1st, and it's Sather who forced Jagr out?
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Originally Posted by haohmaru View Post
Jagr was all about the money, not the hometown or NY discount. Let's be honest here. I can't really blame the guy, but I can't help but wonder if it damages (somewhat) his NHL legacy.
JJ gambled away alot of his career earnings up until that point. He was bound to go to the highest bidder, everyone involved knew this, not a secret at all. LIke 94now said, Sather made it look like it was Jagr who didn't want the Rangers. Sather knew if he'd lowball JJ he would have no shot at getting him signed, but still looked like an effort was made to bring him back.

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05-11-2011, 12:01 PM
  #757
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Originally Posted by Bluenote13 View Post
JJ gambled away alot of his career earnings up until that point. He was bound to go to the highest bidder, everyone involved knew this, not a secret at all. LIke 94now said, Sather made it look like it was Jagr who didn't want the Rangers. Sather knew if he'd lowball JJ he would have no shot at getting him signed, but still looked like an effort was made to bring him back.
You have no basis for speculating how much money Jagr gambled away. Everyone knew he liked to gamble, but we have no basis to say what he won or lost in his gambling in relation to his career earnings, that's unfair to speculate on. Secondly, it was reported (by Brooks I think) that Jagr was wanted a 3 year extension, which was ludicrous given his age and the cap implications. If he was seriously interested in re-signing with the Rangers he would not be asking for a 3 year deal and would have made an honest attempt to negotiate with Sather, but he didn't... So unless Sather was flat out lying about Jagr's camp not calling him in the days leading up to July 1st, and I see no reason why he would make a bold face lie that Jagr would come out and deny (which he didn't), it was Jagr who forced his hand.

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05-11-2011, 12:04 PM
  #758
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Originally Posted by doakacola View Post
Jagr could care less about that. He'll be in the HOF and has a couple of SC rings to wear on his hands.
There's no way you could possibly know whether or not Jagr cares about his NHL legacy. Sorry, dude.

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05-11-2011, 12:04 PM
  #759
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Originally Posted by haohmaru View Post
Jagr was all about the money, not the hometown or NY discount. Let's be honest here. I can't really blame the guy, but I can't help but wonder if it damages (somewhat) his NHL legacy.
Agreed. I think being the backbone of the team, and the increased expectations for not only his own performance, but the team's performance, weighed on him heavily. We saw some comments from him before his season even ended that led us to believe he was seriously considering the KHL. Those reports about him meeting with the KHL president, and some other comments. I think it was easy for Jagr to accept the payday to go play in the KHL and also to accept the reduced expectations of his own performance and the reduced pressure to perform in the KHL as opposed to NYC. NHL was getting younger, Jagr was getting older, and it was becoming harder for him to live up to his legacy as one of the greatest players to play the game. Jagr could have come out and said he preferred to play in the KHL and go that route, but that would make him look bad and bring on unwanted criticism around the league. By dragging his feat with the Rangers, it was pretty obvious the Rangers could not afford to wait around during the free agency period on Jagr's decision, and that they would have to move on without him, thus making it look like it was the Rangers that ended the relationship. I blame Jagr. If he wanted to be a Ranger, they would have had serious negotiations in June, which never happened. Not bitter about it at all though, Jagr was getting older and I can't blame him for wanting to go a different direction. I'm more perturbed at fans thinking our management voluntarily ditched the best player we've had since the lock-out. It takes 2 to tango, and Jagr and his Agent didn't feel like dancing.

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05-11-2011, 12:07 PM
  #760
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Originally Posted by wolfgaze View Post
You have no basis for speculating how much money Jagr gambled away. Everyone knew he liked to gamble, but we have no basis to say what he won or lost in his gambling habits, that's unfair to speculate on. Secondly, it was reported (by Brooks I think) that Jagr was wanted a 3 year extension, which was ludicrous given his age and the cap implications. If he was seriously interested in re-signing with the Rangers he would not be asking for a 3 year deal and would have made an honest attempt to negotiate with Sather, but he didn't... So unless Sather was flat out lying about Jagr's camp not calling him in the days leading up to July 1st, and I see no reason why he would make a bold face lie that Jagr would come out and deny (which he didn't), it was Jagr who forced his hand.
I don't need to speculate about his behavior, I was there, but I'm not going into that with you, the Ranger's leading apologist.

Like I said, everyone and their Mom knew what it would take to keep Jagr here and Sather did not make any concessions. He gave the guy one low offer and waited for HIM to call back. That doesn't sound like someone who REALLY was interested in having him back, the proof is in the pudding

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05-11-2011, 12:12 PM
  #761
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Originally Posted by Bluenote13 View Post
I don't need to speculate about his behavior, I was there, but I'm not going into that with you, the Ranger's leading apologist.

Like I said, everyone and their Mom knew what it would take to keep Jagr here and Sather did not make any concessions. He gave the guy one low offer and waited for HIM to call back. That doesn't sound like someone who REALLY was interested in having him back, the proof is in the pudding
I bet all your 'sources' in the CHL informed you about Jagr's finances, right? Keep making wild speculations and expect people to believe you.

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05-11-2011, 12:34 PM
  #762
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Originally Posted by wolfgaze View Post
I bet all your 'sources' in the CHL informed you about Jagr's finances, right? Keep making wild speculations and expect people to believe you.
I've put in 13 years on this site, If you don't believe what I have to say stop responding to my posts.

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05-11-2011, 12:40 PM
  #763
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Originally Posted by Bluenote13 View Post
I've put in 13 years on this site, If you don't believe what I have to say stop responding to my posts.
13 years!?! What was I thinking questioning your unsubstantiated & boastful speculation!

I think I'll defer to Larry Brooks, thanks.

http://www.nypost.com/p/sports/range...901732C3EFEBE2

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05-11-2011, 12:41 PM
  #764
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You fiendish liar!

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05-11-2011, 12:42 PM
  #765
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I dunno, you really can't fault Sather for not offering a huge 35+ contract to Jagr that he wouldn't have been able to get rid of if they guy couldn't perform in year 1, 2 or 3. The Rangers couldn't afford to be on the hook for, let's say, 8 million for a guy that was going into his 37th/38th/39th year. If he would've fallen off like some do as they enter this age area, the Rangers would've been in even deeper trouble because they wouldn't have been able to shift any salary off the cap.

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05-11-2011, 12:44 PM
  #766
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Originally Posted by Bluenote13 View Post
I don't need to speculate about his behavior, I was there, but I'm not going into that with you, the Ranger's leading apologist.

Like I said, everyone and their Mom knew what it would take to keep Jagr here and Sather did not make any concessions. He gave the guy one low offer and waited for HIM to call back. That doesn't sound like someone who REALLY was interested in having him back, the proof is in the pudding
I agree. Since when is Sather one to wait around for a phone call when it comes to a free agent? He's usually super aggressive and willing to blow the competition out of the water if he wants a certain player. He didn't wait around when it came to signing Redden and re-signing Rozy on July 1.

If Sather wanted Jagr back, there is no doubt in my mind he would have re-signed him. This is a GM who is known for adding years, money, and or an NMC/NTC to get what he wants. But the writing was on the wall for Jagr: Sather did not make Jagr a priority on July 1, and instead of telling him directly he didn't want him back, he ensured that he wouldn't return by blowing cap space instead. Let's not forget those useless 3 years for $3 million that went to both Voros and Rissmiller on July 1 as well. That money right there could have gone towards Jagr for sure.

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05-11-2011, 12:46 PM
  #767
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Jagr was offered 3/$35 million in the KHL (tax free, too, iirc). The Rangers would've had to come close to that to be in the running. No way that's happening on a 35+ contract.

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05-11-2011, 12:47 PM
  #768
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I dunno, you really can't fault Sather for not offering a huge 35+ contract to Jagr that he wouldn't have been able to get rid of if they guy couldn't perform in year 1, 2 or 3. The Rangers couldn't afford to be on the hook for, let's say, 8 million for a guy that was going into his 37th/38th/39th year. If he would've fallen off like some do as they enter this age area, the Rangers would've been in even deeper trouble because they wouldn't have been able to shift any salary off the cap.
Article I posted above says Sather wanted to offer a 1 year deal with bonuses that could be deferred to the following year. If Jags wanted to play in the NHL, that's the only type of deal he was looking at getting. His Agent says right there in that article that Jagr wants to play in the NHL another 2-3 years and feels he can play at a high level, yet the guy opted for the more lucrative contract from the KHL. I don't blame Jagr for taking the payday, but I also don't believe he was hell bent on staying in the NHL, because it's pretty clear teams were not going to gamble on a multi-year contract with him given the 35+ rule as you mentioned, and I don't blame any teams for not wanting to go down that road.

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05-11-2011, 01:00 PM
  #769
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With Nylander gone and Jagr knowing he wouldn't get the money anymore, nor be the man anymore (which I believe was of most importance to him) in favor of *laugh* Gomez and Drury, he said I'm done and left.

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05-11-2011, 01:06 PM
  #770
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You fiendish liar!
Don't you remember when HF just had "comments" under its articles? I bet there are some posters who weren't old enough to read yet in those days...

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05-11-2011, 01:08 PM
  #771
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Don't you remember when HF just had "comments" under its articles? I bet there are some posters who weren't old enough to read yet in those days...
The boards existed long before 2002. It was in 2002 that HFB switched to vBulletin and everyone had to re-register.

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05-11-2011, 01:09 PM
  #772
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Don't you remember when HF just had "comments" under its articles? I bet there are some posters who weren't old enough to read yet in those days...
When was that, back in the late 90s?

The internet has really changed.

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05-11-2011, 01:32 PM
  #773
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When was that, back in the late 90s?

The internet has really changed.
you kids today..i remember back when there WASNT an internet. we had to go outside and play with other kids to keep in touch. /crotchety old man

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05-11-2011, 01:33 PM
  #774
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you kids today..i remember back when there WASNT an internet. we had to go outside and play with other kids to keep in touch. /crotchety old man
What is this "outside" you speak of?

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05-11-2011, 01:34 PM
  #775
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Not true. Jagr had a lucrative contract offer on the table from the KHL, drags his feet and doesn't make a serious attempt to hammer out a deal with Sather before July 1st, and it's Sather who forced Jagr out?
Jagr did play KHL card, no question. I do not think Sather had to match. Sather, however, at the end of the day, rid of everyone who in any form tried the KHL racket against him. Someone may say - solid management. Some would say - a stupidity that resulted in current lack of talent.

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