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News & Notes 2010-2011 III

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Old
07-14-2011, 05:44 PM
  #351
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The young players were not their 4-0 downfall.

The team won in the regular season with those young players... no different than in the past.

We all knew that they could be what could limit them from a SC birth, but not the 4-0 drubbing.

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07-14-2011, 05:46 PM
  #352
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That quote also shows Ted's priorities... protect that asset. Which is a regular season cash cow.

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07-14-2011, 06:07 PM
  #353
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Originally Posted by tmljeh19 View Post
Man you literally find ANYTHING to ***** about!
No, I don't; new guy.

I ***** about Boudreau, Semin and to an extent McPhee and a player here or there.

I find it amazing there are so many positive fans around a team that has been summarily humiliated 3 years in a row and kept their leadership intact.

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07-14-2011, 06:16 PM
  #354
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there are degrees. for me, its entertainment. its fun. if its anger and hate and frustration, it ain't fun. i dont bother with the orioles for the redskins anymore for that specific reason.

if i were as upset as you seem to be, i'd be on to something i'd enjoy more.

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07-14-2011, 06:31 PM
  #355
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Originally Posted by EroCaps View Post
No, I don't; new guy.

I ***** about Boudreau, Semin and to an extent McPhee and a player here or there.

I find it amazing there are so many positive fans around a team that has been summarily humiliated 3 years in a row and kept their leadership intact.
You are *****ing about one of the top 10 goalies in the freaking league being told he is the slated #1G over a 2nd year G. Who at this point is average to above average a few times. Again, *****ing for the sake of being different.

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07-14-2011, 06:39 PM
  #356
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Originally Posted by EroCaps View Post
No, I don't; new guy.

I ***** about Boudreau, Semin and to an extent McPhee and a player here or there.

I find it amazing there are so many positive fans around a team that has been summarily humiliated 3 years in a row and kept their leadership intact.
Would you prefer to be a Phoenix fan? An Atlanta fan?

Not exactly the point as all fans are allowed to complain, but when the front office is obviously making fairly big changes, why not wait to see if said changes work before complaining?

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07-14-2011, 07:23 PM
  #357
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I've had an ongoing debate with a friend about Ovi and his physical conditioning. I've seen a few pictures / videos (mainly interviews) in which Ovi is shirtless. He's a big guy, but he's far from 'cut.'

There was an article that highlighted some of the more 'ripped' athletes in sports .... I recall Chara & Seguin being absolutely cut and it makes me wonder what Ovi's conditioning is truly like. It's hard to argue that he's not in shape given the majority of his on ice performances. I also understand that we all have varying body types and structures but I can't help but ask .... why doesn't Ovi ... or why isn't Ovi like many others in the league.

I imagine this has been discussed before but was curious to hear some opinions on the board. Curious if the majority think it would make a clear difference.
Being cut has absolutely nothing to do with conditioning. Being cut = low BF%, low BF% /= in shape. I would even say that in a sport like hockey, being overly cut is a bad thing.

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07-14-2011, 08:58 PM
  #358
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Originally Posted by Jedgi View Post
Would you prefer to be a Phoenix fan? An Atlanta fan?

Not exactly the point as all fans are allowed to complain, but when the front office is obviously making fairly big changes, why not wait to see if said changes work before complaining?
Point taken...Caps fans have it better than a lot of fans, for sure. I wouldn't call the changes made this offseason "big", though. A coaching change. A GM change. A top 5 player on your team being moved. Those are big changes. McPhee beefed up positions that weren't problem areas. He added leaders, sure; but they need leadership from their Coach and top 4 players to get anywhere.

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07-14-2011, 09:21 PM
  #359
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Originally Posted by backs4mvp View Post
Being cut has absolutely nothing to do with conditioning. Being cut = low BF%, low BF% /= in shape. I would even say that in a sport like hockey, being overly cut is a bad thing.
Rod Brindamor

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07-14-2011, 10:01 PM
  #360
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Originally Posted by backs4mvp View Post
Being cut has absolutely nothing to do with conditioning. Being cut = low BF%, low BF% /= in shape. I would even say that in a sport like hockey, being overly cut is a bad thing.
Absolutely nothing? You do know the activities that get one conditioned tend to make one cut, right? The things that make you fat tend to make you unconditioned also. I think they might be slightly connected. Although there are some instances when guys are not cut but incredibly conditioned. Is Ovi one of those guys by not training for two months?

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07-15-2011, 06:48 AM
  #361
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Originally Posted by EroCaps View Post
Point taken...Caps fans have it better than a lot of fans, for sure. I wouldn't call the changes made this offseason "big", though. A coaching change. A GM change. A top 5 player on your team being moved. Those are big changes. McPhee beefed up positions that weren't problem areas. He added leaders, sure; but they need leadership from their Coach and top 4 players to get anywhere.
If you dont think they needed some grit and a vet goalie then I dont know what you have been watching. Its fair to say some things might not have been the biggest needs, but to suggest they "werent a problem" is way off base

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07-15-2011, 06:53 AM
  #362
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If you dont think they needed some grit and a vet goalie then I dont know what you have been watching. Its fair to say some things might not have been the biggest needs, but to suggest they "werent a problem" is way off base
Agreed. How he can say the bottom 6 last year, especially in the playoffs, "weren't a problem" is asinine.

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07-15-2011, 07:04 AM
  #363
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If you dont think they needed some grit and a vet goalie then I dont know what you have been watching. Its fair to say some things might not have been the biggest needs, but to suggest they "werent a problem" is way off base

But McPhee didn't have any designs on Vokoun. He just fell into our laps for 1 year. Who knows how it'll turn out?

The whole problem is that McPhee has no vision for building this team. His moves seem disconnected from each other. The C and G positions have been weak for many years and McPhee hasn't solved C at all. And the supposed 1 year answer at goalie had to call him and sign for peanuts.

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Originally Posted by tmljeh19 View Post
Agreed. How he can say the bottom 6 last year, especially in the playoffs, "weren't a problem" is asinine.

So were the top 6, the D, the goalie, the coach, the GM, and the owner--all were "asinine."

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07-15-2011, 07:40 AM
  #364
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Yep. Tampa Bay's owner definitely out-played Leonsis during the playoffs this year.

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Old
07-15-2011, 08:36 AM
  #365
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@ATLAS

Good Point, We don't know how it will turn out.

The plan seemed like a long term build from within... but we sure seem to go after quite a few free agents. Its the same argument. Holtby, now relegated to the minors. Is that the plan, to keep top prospects in Hershey as long as possible? Or, until they are ready, or until... no cheap free agent is available to take his spot? We go with kids if no UFA is available. It seems the free agent market determines the plan. Was that the Detroit model?

Doing that in recent years, has not turned out well. Maybe the TVo move will turn out better. I know many will tow the line and state they know Holtby in Hershey for another year is the best move for him and our organization both short term and long term, but I wonder where they get the crystal ball. Ebay? Facing inferior shooters another year on a jack stacked team, will he really be tested? Finishing the year 8-0-1 in his last 9GP, I think he showed he is ready for a bigger challenge. So did George, and so did you probably. Dont deny it, and flip flop and rationalize he could use more cooking. TVo wont be here in 5 years. Holtby probably will be. He could be better than Vokoun. this season.

Yeah I know, please dont remind me. Hershey is good for him. He can learn how to celebrate on a jack stacked team. Rah.

I dont mind the Vokoun pickup. If it wins us a cup. This post is directed at Atlas.


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Old
07-15-2011, 09:01 AM
  #366
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@ATLAS

Good Point, We don't know how it will turn out.

The plan seemed like a long term build from within... but we sure seem to go after quite a few free agents. Its the same argument. Holtby, now relegated to the minors. Is that the plan, to keep top prospects in Hershey as long as possible? Or, until they are ready, or until... no cheap free agent is available to take his spot? We go with kids if no UFA is available. It seems the free agent market determines the plan. Was that the Detroit model?

Doing that in recent years, has not turned out well. Maybe the TVo move will turn out better. I know many will tow the line and state they know Holtby in Hershey for another year is the best move for him and our organization both short term and long term, but I wonder where they get the crystal ball. Ebay? Facing inferior shooters another year on a jack stacked team, will he really be tested? Finishing the year 8-0-1 in his last 9GP, I think he showed he is ready for a bigger challenge. So did George, and so did you probably. Dont deny it, and flip flop and rationalize he could use more cooking. TVo wont be here in 5 years. Holtby probably will be. He could be better than Vokoun. this season.

Yeah I know, please dont remind me. Hershey is good for him. He can learn how to celebrate on a jack stacked team. Rah.

I dont mind the Vokoun pickup. If it wins us a cup. This post is directed at Atlas.
For how good he looked in those 9 games was how bad he was in the playoffs in Hershey. If you say he is ready for NHL play, shouldn't he have dominated in the playoffs for Hershey?

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Old
07-15-2011, 09:11 AM
  #367
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@ATLAS

Good Point, We don't know how it will turn out.

The plan seemed like a long term build from within... but we sure seem to go after quite a few free agents. Its the same argument. Holtby, now relegated to the minors. Is that the plan, to keep top prospects in Hershey as long as possible? Or, until they are ready, or until... no cheap free agent is available to take his spot? We go with kids if no UFA is available. It seems the free agent market determines the plan. Was that the Detroit model?

Doing that in recent years, has not turned out well. Maybe the TVo move will turn out better. I know many will tow the line and state they know Holtby in Hershey for another year is the best move for him and our organization both short term and long term, but I wonder where they get the crystal ball. Ebay? Facing inferior shooters another year on a jack stacked team, will he really be tested? Finishing the year 8-0-1 in his last 9GP, I think he showed he is ready for a bigger challenge. So did George, and so did you probably. Dont deny it, and flip flop and rationalize he could use more cooking. TVo wont be here in 5 years. Holtby probably will be. He could be better than Vokoun. this season.

Yeah I know, please dont remind me. Hershey is good for him. He can learn how to celebrate on a jack stacked team. Rah.

I dont mind the Vokoun pickup. If it wins us a cup. This post is directed at Atlas.

Hey there buddy, good point about Holtby. Where do McPhee's whims leave Holtby?

I would have signed Varly long-term and named him the #1. Holtby would've been the stud back-up.

Then I would've traded Neuvy, who is a good player, for picks or in a package for a legit 2C or another major piece.

Winning GMs make commitments up the middle (G, C and a bruiser D). Backstrom is the only guy McPhee has committed to up the gut. Ovechkin is a Hall of Fame rover. As a whole, the team lacks unity and strategy. It sucks.

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07-15-2011, 09:30 AM
  #368
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But McPhee didn't have any designs on Vokoun. He just fell into our laps for 1 year. Who knows how it'll turn out?
interesting position....lets look at this.

First, how does this apply to a vet goalie being/not being a need? Ive read that mgmt was looking/planning on bringing in a vet goalie, of some level. If for only insurance.

Second, how is it he "falls into our laps"? The Caps, get this...are a good team. TV decided to go to a good team for less than market value. Its not an accident the Caps are good and viewed as a team that can win a Cup. Its not like TV is married to some coed going to Georgetown and decided he wanted to be close...or some other non-hockey related reason. This "falls into laps" notion is flawed.....he wanted to go to a good team

Third, what do you mean "how it will turn out"? If he plays poorly, that sucks. If he plays great, thats fantastic. Let me guess....your position is, he plays great....Caps go deep...then what do they do next season. My position is, thats next year. If he plays great I have no problem extending him, moving one of the two young goalies, and roll with that for a couple/few years.

I cant follow the logic that some people use that its bad for players to play well and produce due to the $$ impact in future seasons.

Quote:
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The whole problem is that McPhee has no vision for building this team. His moves seem disconnected from each other. The C and G positions have been weak for many years and McPhee hasn't solved C at all. And the supposed 1 year answer at goalie had to call him and sign for peanuts.
Well the C position weakness predates GMGM. The fact he drafted the best C in franchise history discounts your notion he hasnt addressed it. I feel the D has been a bigger weakness in recent seasons.....you seem to think that C and G were more a need. If your position is, while upgrading the D over the last few years he has only brought in 1 franchise center and another nice looking young center, and 3 young goalies...then I ask, as you effn serious?

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07-18-2011, 10:57 PM
  #369
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Hey there buddy, good point about Holtby. Where do McPhee's whims leave Holtby?

I would have signed Varly long-term and named him the #1. Holtby would've been the stud back-up.

Then I would've traded Neuvy, who is a good player, for picks or in a package for a legit 2C or another major piece.

Winning GMs make commitments up the middle (G, C and a bruiser D). Backstrom is the only guy McPhee has committed to up the gut. Ovechkin is a Hall of Fame rover. As a whole, the team lacks unity and strategy. It sucks.
I liked Varly and thought he had good potential but I'm not sure how you get past the fact that he had chronic injury problems and thats why he was on the bench come playoffs, which was obviously a step back for him. Vokoun has been one of the best goalies in the league for years now and has a lot of experience even if its not in the playoffs. Its true, we don't know how it'll end up but odds are its an upgrade and in terms of regular season performance it seems clear he's one of the team's most talented players- maybe the second most succesful player after Ovechkin at this point given Backstrom's step backwards last season- though I'm sure he'll rebound eventually. I also don't know how you can critique the Varly trade given the situation and the fantastic return.

The team's 2nd C spot is an obvious weakness though and clearly it would be nice to trade Shultz and pick up a tough, playoff hardened d man. I feel like its hard to even fully evaluate the team under BB at this point though and thats part of what bugs me because if we had a better coach our weaknesses might be more clear. If its individual guys- you figure out where they are in their development and decide whether they're gonna progress or need to go- but an entire team melt down only lets you know its past time to fire the coach.

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07-19-2011, 08:43 AM
  #370
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For how good he looked in those 9 games was how bad he was in the playoffs in Hershey. If you say he is ready for NHL play, shouldn't he have dominated in the playoffs for Hershey?
It's a team game that does weigh heavily on G play. But, did he basically cost Hershey its series? If so, then I will speculate and attempt to answer your question.

He was in the zone feeling great about his game, thinking maybe he will get a sniff at an NHL playoff game with Varly on the shelf. Varly got better. He got demoted and probably lost his focus and confidence. Lost that mental edge. Getting undressed in the shootout in his only loss probably didnt help, especially if that was his last NHL game before being sent down. I am fully convinced if an hockey player is at full health, the game becomes largely mental.

I do see Hershey loading up the guns for a stronger run this year which makes me wonder how strong they were last year. And I did hear George proclaim Holtby was ready for NHL play - now, before TVo fell into his lap and caused a change of plans.

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07-19-2011, 03:17 PM
  #371
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Originally Posted by Atlas View Post
Hey there buddy, good point about Holtby. Where do McPhee's whims leave Holtby?

I would have signed Varly long-term and named him the #1. Holtby would've been the stud back-up.

Then I would've traded Neuvy, who is a good player, for picks or in a package for a legit 2C or another major piece.

Winning GMs make commitments up the middle (G, C and a bruiser D). Backstrom is the only guy McPhee has committed to up the gut. Ovechkin is a Hall of Fame rover. As a whole, the team lacks unity and strategy. It sucks.
And this is where your convoluted logic falls apart....

You criticize GMGM and BB for everything, yet you're ready to trade away the only durable goalie we have (Neuvy) and turn the reigns over to Varly (who 1)can't stay healthy and 2) EXPECTS to be gifted the #1 job) and a rookie backup.

Talk about recipe for disaster. Coaches and GMs also have to work with egos and player relationships. Varly made his demands to be the #1 known or he was walking....you really think the other players buy into that strongarm tactic? It would have reflected MUCH MUCH worse has McPhee and BB caved to those demands. Although THEN you really could argue that they've lost the handle on the team.

McPhee's "whims" leave Holtby right where he should be, in Hershey, learning how to win a championship. His time will come and it will come when it makes sense to the franchise, not by player and some of his antsy fans demands.

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07-19-2011, 03:45 PM
  #372
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I liked Varly and thought he had good potential but I'm not sure how you get past the fact that he had chronic injury problems and thats why he was on the bench come playoffs, which was obviously a step back for him. Vokoun has been one of the best goalies in the league for years now and has a lot of experience even if its not in the playoffs.

Well, I definitely like Vokoun. I'm glad he's on the team. But judging McPhee, he didn't have designs on improving the G posish. If Vokoun actually does improve it then it's 100% luck.

IMO, Varly's injuries were overemphasized by Bruce and Co. I mean, its hush hush all year on Backstrom and Ovie's injuries even after the playoff SWEEP. But Varly, if we believe Bruce, is crawling out of the morgue. But then the Avs GM and scouts trade a #1 and a #2 for the broken down goalie.

I strongly believe Varly will be the best goalie of the bunch (including Neuvy, Vokoun and Holtby) but we'll see. Bruce dislikes Varly. Now Varly gets traded. Bruce dislikes Fehr. Now Fehr is in friggin Manitoba.

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07-19-2011, 05:17 PM
  #373
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IMO, Varly's injuries were overemphasized by Bruce and Co. I mean, its hush hush all year on Backstrom and Ovie's injuries even after the playoff SWEEP. But Varly, if we believe Bruce, is crawling out of the morgue.
So that was 3 seasons in a row of 'overemphasizing' Varlamov's injuries then?

You do realize that his North American regular seasons games played numbers over the last 3 seasons are 33, 29, and 30 right?

Fra-gee-lay. That must be Italian...

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07-19-2011, 05:28 PM
  #374
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So that was 3 seasons in a row of 'overemphasizing' Varlamov's injuries then?

You do realize that his North American regular seasons games played numbers over the last 3 seasons are 33, 29, and 30 right?

Fra-gee-lay. That must be Italian...

Time does fly but I don't think I'm forgetting a year. Wasn't the 33 there his rookie year? He wasn't the starter that year. As I remember, he was the surprise goalie in the playoffs replacing Theo (?) and saving Boudreau and the team's bacon against the Rags.

The next year, I believe, he had a legit groan issue. He probably could have played but they wanted to be sure he was playoff ready. He was, he played well, but got Halak'd.

This year, Bruce gave him no chance at all. Neuvy was Bruce's boy all year. Bruce said the world was about to see how great Neuvy was after the Rags series. Then he showed em' by getting swept. This year in particular, I think Varly and Bruce had a kind of understanding--the injuries were insignificant IMO.

I believe these to be the facts. If you prefer to believe Ted, McPhee and Bruce then...hehe...good luck w/ that.

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07-19-2011, 05:55 PM
  #375
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I believe these to be the facts.
The facts are that he has had injury issues every year he has been in North America. Or do you prefer to think the organization was looking to get Daren Machesney all those games in '08-'09? And even if you feel when healthy Boudreau gave Neuvirth more chances than Varlamov there still were stretches of 13 and 11 games in a row that he missed with injuries, and that doesn't take into account the 4 game stretch at the start of the season. That's 28 games, which leaves 54 he could have played and he got half of them plus 3 more in Hershey.

The guy has not even come remotely close to showing he can carry the load as a number 1 in the NHL. In 3 seasons of North American hockey he has broken down and missed a significant number of games because of groin and knee injuries each and every year.

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