HFBoards

Go Back   HFBoards > NHL Western Conference > Pacific Division > Anaheim Ducks
Mobile Hockey's Future Become a Sponsor Site Rules Support Forum vBookie Page 2
Notices

UFAs / Roster Changes / Trades / Qualifying Offers (#864) 2011? Part 2

Closed Thread
 
Thread Tools
Old
05-05-2011, 04:31 PM
  #101
Giguere27
Registered User
 
Join Date: Feb 2006
Location: Bavaria
Country: Germany
Posts: 1,013
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by DuckshaveaRPG View Post
OK he my very long list sorry about that of guys who think we could realistically go after and get without giving away too much and still improve are team
Tomas Kopecky
Tomas Fleischmann
Scottie Upshall
Andrew Brunette
Marcel Goc
Jeff Tambellini
Tim Connolly
Jussi Jokinen
Joni Pitkanen
Zenon Konopk
Cal Clutterbuck
Gagne
Booth
Weiss
TJ Oshie
Mark Letestu
Matt Stajan
J.P. Dumont
Daniel Carcillo
Matt Carle
Braydon Coburn
Scott Hartnell
Ville Leino
Mark Letestu
Troy Brouwer
what you guys think any guys there you like or is this just absolute rubbish
I think Fleischmann would be a nice option for more scoring on this team,but I think he will get a good contract from another team.
Goc would be the perfect 3rd line center,but I doubt that Nashville won' resign him until July 1st.
In my opinion,the perfect addition to this team would be Upshall.He is the perfect 3rd line player,who plays hard but will also add some scoring.
A 3rd line of Upshall-Goc-McMillan would be great and would improve this team heavily.

Giguere27 is offline  
Old
05-05-2011, 05:46 PM
  #102
jepjepjoo
Registered User
 
jepjepjoo's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2002
Posts: 3,112
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ducks DVM View Post
You ran the numbers to check p values did you?
If you're going to insist on that game then you have to admit that there is also no statistical evidence that the line WOULD produce with McMillan, so all YOU are doing is putting out your own opinion with absolutely no statistical proof while insisting everyone else is wrong because.....they have no statistical proof. Stop it or produce the statistics that the 2nd line produced better with Blake off it - you are the one insisting it does, proving Blake underperforms far from proves your position.
So when did I say that the 2nd line produces better without Blake? It would produce better without Blake if the Ducks had some kind of capable replacement for him. It would produce better if it had Ryan in place of Blake.

I'm saying that Blake has no business being on a playoff team's 2nd line.


"You ran the numbers to check p values did you? " <--- What does that mean?

Quote:
Originally Posted by jepjepjoo View Post
I find it funny that people saying things like "Blake makes the 2nd line work" etc. while he clearly is the weakest link on the line.

jepjepjoo is offline  
Old
05-05-2011, 07:10 PM
  #103
Ducks DVM
Moderator
There is no grunion
 
Ducks DVM's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2010
Location: Long Beach, CA
Country: United States
Posts: 21,282
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by jepjepjoo View Post
I find it funny that people saying things like "Blake makes the 2nd line work" etc. while he clearly is the weakest link on the line.
Quote:
Originally Posted by jepjepjoo View Post
So when did I say that the 2nd line produces better without Blake? It would produce better without Blake if the Ducks had some kind of capable replacement for him. It would produce better if it had Ryan in place of Blake.

I'm saying that Blake has no business being on a playoff team's 2nd line.


"You ran the numbers to check p values did you? " <--- What does that mean?

A "p value" is how you determine if the numbers are statistically significant or not. It's a numerical value derived by specific formulas - you can't just decide on your own whether statistics are meaningful or not. You really shouldn't be throwing around statistics as proof of anything if you don't understand some of the things you learn in the first 2 weeks of a statistics course.

There is ALWAYS a weakest link on a line. It is also true that quite frequently there is a player on a line that performs actions allowing line success that are not reflected on a score sheet. Koivu also has no business being on a playoff team's second line based on his production this year. Why do you keep glossing over that? Selanne in 2009-10 had 21 ES points in 54 games - borderline 2nd line production again (and no, you can't pro-rate points, a whole lot of players would be monsters if you did that), the fact that he plays like he discovered HGH this year notwithstanding. You say it's funny people say Blake makes the second line work when he's the weakest on the line but pretend he doesn't have the best giveaway:takeaway ratio by saying giveaways are a cooked stat due to dump-ins? When have you EVER seen Selanne dump the puck in? You've refused to engage in discussion about why Blake spent as much time on the second line as he did, and who else actually ever looked good there instead. Again - why did Carlyle play him on the second line? He's a better player than anyone the Ducks used on the third line the entire year and would have improved it immediately, anyone who says otherwise is looking at his salary not his abilities. If RC felt McMillan was better on the second line he would have stuck there and he didn't.

Ducks DVM is offline  
Old
05-05-2011, 08:22 PM
  #104
caliamad
Registered User
 
caliamad's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2003
Posts: 3,214
vCash: 500
I agree, the BKS 2nd line is decent, but not dominant and the lack of a scoring line puts way too much pressure on RPG... getting older too.

If we don't improve the 2nd line, some better additions are needed on the 3rd line...which I why I advocate for upgrade at 3rd line center and sandwhiching MacMillian and Ryan around him...

Beleksy/chester Getzlaf Perry
BKS
Mac 3rd line Center Ryan
Beleksy/chester Konopka/Bonino Parros

At end of game, Carlyle will change lines and go with 2.5 lines anyways, but at least Perry/Getlzaf won't play 28 minutes per game..

3rd line center has to be able to jive with Ryan and Macmillian and be a better faceoff option.

caliamad is offline  
Old
05-06-2011, 12:40 AM
  #105
2faded
Registered User
 
2faded's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2009
Location: Torrance, Ca
Country: United States
Posts: 3,040
vCash: 500
One of my pet peeves is people moving Ryan to a different line and calling it the 3rd line while having the Selanne line as the 2nd line. Any line Ryan moves to, to create scoring, automatically becomes the 2nd line.

Not only that, but wouldnt it be ideal to actually play the Ryan line more min than the BKS line because...oh, you know...they're old and Selanne is most effective on the PP anyways. Sheesh people.

2faded is offline  
Old
05-06-2011, 01:14 AM
  #106
Paul4587
Registered User
 
Paul4587's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2006
Posts: 16,347
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by 2faded View Post
One of my pet peeves is people moving Ryan to a different line and calling it the 3rd line while having the Selanne line as the 2nd line. Any line Ryan moves to, to create scoring, automatically becomes the 2nd line.

Not only that, but wouldnt it be ideal to actually play the Ryan line more min than the BKS line because...oh, you know...they're old and Selanne is most effective on the PP anyways. Sheesh people.
It's more of a case of 2A, 2B. Kind of how like one of Giroux/Richards/Carter/Briere is on the "third" Philadelphia line. It doesn't make them a third liner, they're just spreading the offense over three lines.

Anaheim does not have the depth to come close to doing this yet so I doubt Ryan is moved down to the third line to spread the scoring.

Paul4587 is offline  
Old
05-06-2011, 01:19 AM
  #107
jepjepjoo
Registered User
 
jepjepjoo's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2002
Posts: 3,112
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ducks DVM View Post
When have you EVER seen Selanne dump the puck in? Again - why did Carlyle play him on the second line? He's a better player than anyone the Ducks used on the third line the entire year and would have improved it immediately, anyone who says otherwise is looking at his salary not his abilities. If RC felt McMillan was better on the second line he would have stuck there and he didn't.
Multiple times for a line change... Have you really watched the games?

Quote:
You've refused to engage in discussion about why Blake spent as much time on the second line as he did, and who else actually ever looked good there instead.
Because he is the best option besides Ryan the Ducks had?

Quote:
You say it's funny people say Blake makes the second line work when he's the weakest on the line but pretend he doesn't have the best giveaway:takeaway ratio by saying giveaways are a cooked stat due to dump-ins?
Even if giveaways was a good stat Blake would be -2, Koivu -3, Selanne -8

Quote:
Koivu also has no business being on a playoff team's second line based on his production this year.
Blake is a bigger problem.


Last edited by jepjepjoo: 05-06-2011 at 01:32 AM.
jepjepjoo is offline  
Old
05-06-2011, 04:21 AM
  #108
Seanconn*
mission accomplished
 
Join Date: Mar 2010
Location: Manhattan
Country: United States
Posts: 4,267
vCash: 500
wow we need to get this budget crap outa here. seriously 55 million? We need to secure the team for when our entire second line dissapears 2 seasons from now!!!

we have no chance at anything spending that money... if we win the cup next year, say good bye to Koivu, Selanne, Blake, Beauch.

and if we don't win the cup, say goodbye to Koivu and Selanne and Blake. So where's the real harm in spending towards the cap. our owner can't spare another 4-5 million dollars?

it will bug me to no extreme if we end up bargain shopping again this postseason, and until the deadline. what a freaking way to entice Teemu to come back... especially if they want any sort of freaking discount!!!

If they don't fix the D, and at least sign 1 or 2 solid additions to the fowards, i don't see Teemu singing for a dollar under 4.5 million, what's the point?

Seanconn* is offline  
Old
05-06-2011, 04:28 AM
  #109
Seanconn*
mission accomplished
 
Join Date: Mar 2010
Location: Manhattan
Country: United States
Posts: 4,267
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ducks DVM View Post
A "p value" is how you determine if the numbers are statistically significant or not. It's a numerical value derived by specific formulas - you can't just decide on your own whether statistics are meaningful or not. You really shouldn't be throwing around statistics as proof of anything if you don't understand some of the things you learn in the first 2 weeks of a statistics course.

There is ALWAYS a weakest link on a line. It is also true that quite frequently there is a player on a line that performs actions allowing line success that are not reflected on a score sheet. Koivu also has no business being on a playoff team's second line based on his production this year. Why do you keep glossing over that? Selanne in 2009-10 had 21 ES points in 54 games - borderline 2nd line production again (and no, you can't pro-rate points, a whole lot of players would be monsters if you did that), the fact that he plays like he discovered HGH this year notwithstanding. You say it's funny people say Blake makes the second line work when he's the weakest on the line but pretend he doesn't have the best giveaway:takeaway ratio by saying giveaways are a cooked stat due to dump-ins? When have you EVER seen Selanne dump the puck in? You've refused to engage in discussion about why Blake spent as much time on the second line as he did, and who else actually ever looked good there instead. Again - why did Carlyle play him on the second line? He's a better player than anyone the Ducks used on the third line the entire year and would have improved it immediately, anyone who says otherwise is looking at his salary not his abilities. If RC felt McMillan was better on the second line he would have stuck there and he didn't.
you realize Koivu had 7 points in the playoffs this year, and scored many clutch goals at the start of the season.

.................... and is turning 37

Seanconn* is offline  
Old
05-06-2011, 09:08 AM
  #110
KelVarnsen
Line combos anyone?
 
KelVarnsen's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2010
Location: Mission Viejo
Country: United States
Posts: 4,127
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Seanconn View Post
wow we need to get this budget crap outa here. seriously 55 million? We need to secure the team for when our entire second line dissapears 2 seasons from now!!!

we have no chance at anything spending that money... if we win the cup next year, say good bye to Koivu, Selanne, Blake, Beauch.

and if we don't win the cup, say goodbye to Koivu and Selanne and Blake. So where's the real harm in spending towards the cap. our owner can't spare another 4-5 million dollars?

it will bug me to no extreme if we end up bargain shopping again this postseason, and until the deadline. what a freaking way to entice Teemu to come back... especially if they want any sort of freaking discount!!!

If they don't fix the D, and at least sign 1 or 2 solid additions to the fowards, i don't see Teemu singing for a dollar under 4.5 million, what's the point?
You know what else will bug me? On FA day, a lot of FA's will start to sign as they ALWAYS do and Murray will miss out and then say something stupid like "I didn't think players would sign so quickly." He does it every year.

I also see your point. The value of the Ducks is way higher than what the owner bought it for so why not spend an extra few mil to ice a more complete team seeing that you are already ahead of the game because the value of the franchise is higher.

KelVarnsen is online now  
Old
05-06-2011, 09:18 AM
  #111
Takao
kesbae
 
Takao's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2010
Location: Southern California
Country: United States
Posts: 10,425
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Seanconn View Post
If they don't fix the D, and at least sign 1 or 2 solid additions to the fowards, i don't see Teemu singing for a dollar under 4.5 million, what's the point?
I'm not sure what you are expecting with the defense.

Lydman, Lubo, Sbisa, Fowler, and Beauch are not going anywhere. That leaves trading Sutton and signing one reliable defender.

Takao is offline  
Old
05-06-2011, 09:36 AM
  #112
albertabound
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Posts: 450
vCash: 500
Has Chipchura been let go for sure? When do we know if they are re- signing him or letting him go.

albertabound is offline  
Old
05-06-2011, 10:23 AM
  #113
Selanne138
Registered User
 
Selanne138's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2009
Posts: 3,479
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Seanconn View Post
you realize Koivu had 7 points in the playoffs this year, and scored many clutch goals at the start of the season.

.................... and is turning 37
Theres no question Saku steps his game up come playoff time, especially now, but we still have to get to the playoffs, and we could use a better number two center option. Koivu is a fantastic 3rd line guy, and a good second line guy WITH Teemu, but if we have no Teemu we need someone else that can put up points.

Barring the Cardiac Kids phase this team doesnt make the playoffs, IMO we could use a better top 6 guy.

Selanne138 is offline  
Old
05-06-2011, 11:06 AM
  #114
rocsfeather
jump
 
rocsfeather's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2010
Location: Arrowhead Pond
Posts: 1,946
vCash: 500
I really hope we stop the bargain phase and can maybe package Sutton and a high pick to get a reliable shutdown defender from a rebuilding team.

rocsfeather is offline  
Old
05-06-2011, 12:18 PM
  #115
wesott11
Registered User
 
wesott11's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2009
Location: huntington beach,CA
Country: United States
Posts: 1,580
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by albertabound View Post
Has Chipchura been let go for sure? When do we know if they are re- signing him or letting him go.
I'm assuming on July 1st. He's an RFA right? If he isn't qualified a contract offer then we lose his rights.

wesott11 is offline  
Old
05-06-2011, 04:07 PM
  #116
Ducks DVM
Moderator
There is no grunion
 
Ducks DVM's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2010
Location: Long Beach, CA
Country: United States
Posts: 21,282
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Seanconn View Post
you realize Koivu had 7 points in the playoffs this year, and scored many clutch goals at the start of the season.

.................... and is turning 37
I totally agree and love Koivu, don't get me wrong. But by total points production he was the #42 center in the league with the #4 right wing and #55 left wing. ES he was #48C with the #11RW and #56 LW. You have a 1st line RW carrying a bottom tier LW/middle tier C 2nd liners, not good enough for a playoff team unless there's a 3rd line that can score.

Ducks DVM is offline  
Old
05-06-2011, 04:11 PM
  #117
Ducks DVM
Moderator
There is no grunion
 
Ducks DVM's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2010
Location: Long Beach, CA
Country: United States
Posts: 21,282
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by davidy2d View Post
I really hope we stop the bargain phase and can maybe package Sutton and a high pick to get a reliable shutdown defender from a rebuilding team.
I'd much rather get a reliable 3rd liner with that trade. No need to trade a high pick for cap dump and a #6 defender (you're replacing Brookbank, and may as well use the cap relief on the forwards)

Ducks DVM is offline  
Old
05-06-2011, 04:29 PM
  #118
Ducks DVM
Moderator
There is no grunion
 
Ducks DVM's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2010
Location: Long Beach, CA
Country: United States
Posts: 21,282
vCash: 500
Here's a hypothetical - IF Drury is bought out by the Rangers (hehehe Eklund) what do you think about seeing if he'll take a reasonable contract for the 3rd line?

Ducks DVM is offline  
Old
05-06-2011, 04:32 PM
  #119
Takao
kesbae
 
Takao's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2010
Location: Southern California
Country: United States
Posts: 10,425
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ducks DVM View Post
Here's a hypothetical - IF Drury is bought out by the Rangers (hehehe Eklund) what do you think about seeing if he'll take a reasonable contract for the 3rd line?
I would be fine with that but whenever I watched any Ranger games it seemed like he got barely any ice time, wonder what was up with that.

Takao is offline  
Old
05-06-2011, 04:53 PM
  #120
Duck Off
HF needs an App
 
Duck Off's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2002
Location: Oklahoma
Country: United States
Posts: 12,119
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ducks DVM View Post
Here's a hypothetical - IF Drury is bought out by the Rangers (hehehe Eklund) what do you think about seeing if he'll take a reasonable contract for the 3rd line?
I don't like the idea personally. In the games I saw him play, he looks... Well... Old I guess. Slow and his hands aren't there anymore. Maybe he's better then what he was showing but he looked bad when I saw him.

Duck Off is online now  
Old
05-06-2011, 05:00 PM
  #121
Duck Off
HF needs an App
 
Duck Off's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2002
Location: Oklahoma
Country: United States
Posts: 12,119
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ducks DVM View Post
I totally agree and love Koivu, don't get me wrong. But by total points production he was the #42 center in the league with the #4 right wing and #55 left wing. ES he was #48C with the #11RW and #56 LW. You have a 1st line RW carrying a bottom tier LW/middle tier C 2nd liners, not good enough for a playoff team unless there's a 3rd line that can score.
Our 2nd like is decent at best in general IMO. It's definitely a 3rd line on a contending team. People keep saying they want us to add a good 3rd line center, but I still think that doesn't improve us much. The only thing it would help IMO is that RPG wouldn't have to play 28 mins a game. However, BKS would be a year older and we'd still have almost no depth. If you're going to be a 2 line scoring team, BOTH lines have to be consistently dangerous and IMO BKS just doesn't get it done.

However, despite my desire to see us add another 2nd line center, it's probably not going to happen due to lack of options.

I just don't want to see BM stick to his old habits this offseason. Please... No more past their prime players or crappy former first round picks.

I also think it's essential for ownership to increase the payroll. Carlyle did a damn good job with what he was given last season and if the cap goes up, our budget should be at least 57 million IMO.

Duck Off is online now  
Old
05-06-2011, 05:02 PM
  #122
Gibson Les Palms
pas assez bon
 
Gibson Les Palms's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2010
Location: Calgary
Country: Canada
Posts: 11,292
vCash: 50
I wonder how highly the Preds think of Colin Wilson. Just yesterday, he finally got into a game. I've heard from the Preds fans that he isn't committed to playing "Preds" hockey. He'd be worth a lot, but if he's available, I would like Murray to be in on that. Not sure if the Ducks have the assets, though.

Still think it's unlikely they would trade him...yet.

Gibson Les Palms is offline  
Old
05-07-2011, 12:54 AM
  #123
Takao
kesbae
 
Takao's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2010
Location: Southern California
Country: United States
Posts: 10,425
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hazy View Post
I wonder how highly the Preds think of Colin Wilson. Just yesterday, he finally got into a game. I've heard from the Preds fans that he isn't committed to playing "Preds" hockey. He'd be worth a lot, but if he's available, I would like Murray to be in on that. Not sure if the Ducks have the assets, though.

Still think it's unlikely they would trade him...yet.
I'd like to take more of a look at someone more proven who can hold the third line pretty well ala Goc.

Takao is offline  
Old
05-07-2011, 02:31 AM
  #124
Static
Registered User
 
Static's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2006
Location: SoCal
Country: United States
Posts: 19,524
vCash: 500
Send a message via AIM to Static
Drury would be a nice 3rd center option at a discounted price, but he's pretty injury prone and another old guy. I'd rather the team got younger and hungrier.

Again, Brooks Laich would be a perfect addition, but he's going to cost too much for penny counting Sameuli.

Static is online now  
Old
05-07-2011, 05:57 AM
  #125
Giguere27
Registered User
 
Join Date: Feb 2006
Location: Bavaria
Country: Germany
Posts: 1,013
vCash: 500
I have looked trough the UFA-list and found some players,who could be a realistic option,if the will be on the market.

2nd-line Defender

Joni Pitkanen (caphit: 4 000 000) -> good skater,able for 30+ points and can play PP and PK,would enlarge our finnish community
Kevin Bieksa (caphit: 3 750 000) -> Bieksa was an option this season and could be the better partner for Fowler then Pitkanen
Ian White (caphit: 2 999 995) -> cheaper option with solid offensive and defensive skills
Anton Babchuk (caphit: 1 400 000) -> cheapest player,who has a great shot and would be a nice addition for our PP

2nd line LW or 3rd line LW on a line with B. Ryan

Tomas Fleischmann (caphit: 2 600 000) -> good skater who can put up 50+ points,because of his injury,perhaps he could be had for a reasonable price
Jussi Jokinen (caphit: 1 700 000) -> had some good seasons in Carolina and as a Finn,he would fit in Anaheim

3rd-line winger

Scottie Upshall (caphit: 2 250 000) -> perfect addition to our team as he plays hard and puts up some points,has also improved his points totals in the last 4 years
Joel Ward (caphit: 1 500 000) -> has shown his skills in the series against the Ducks,comperable player to Upshall
Curtis Glencross (caphit: 1 200 000) -> I still don't understand why he was traded,same player like Upshall and Ward,but his 24-goal-season could make him to expensive

3rd-line center

Marcel Goc (caphit: 775 000) -> solid offensive and defensive,good on the bully and with 27 years in the perfect age,his injury could make him available and it would be great to have a German player on the Ducks
Eric Belanger (caphit: 750 000) -> comperable to Goc,but probably little bit better offensive abilities

So what do you guys think?

Giguere27 is offline  
Closed Thread

Forum Jump


Bookmarks

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off



All times are GMT -5. The time now is 02:02 PM.

monitoring_string = "e4251c93e2ba248d29da988d93bf5144"
Contact Us - HFBoards - Archive - Privacy Statement - Terms of Use - Advertise - Top - AdChoices

vBulletin Copyright ©2000 - 2015, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
HFBoards.com is a property of CraveOnline Media, LLC, an Evolve Media, LLC company. 2015 All Rights Reserved.