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Old
05-12-2011, 01:59 PM
  #301
dpj0122
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Originally Posted by NobodyBeatsTheWiz View Post
So they thought he could win the Cup in one year?
You hire a coach because you think he can win for you. Simple. You're theory disputing that is moronic. As moronic as arguing that Yzerman was overrated.

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05-12-2011, 03:44 PM
  #302
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Originally Posted by dpj0122 View Post
You hire a coach because you think he can win for you. Simple. You're theory disputing that is moronic. As moronic as arguing that Yzerman was overrated.
Pat Quinn was hired for one year. Simple. You're theory that he was hired to win the Cup that year is moronic.

And Yzerman is overrated. Tampa's gotten to where they are on the backs of Stamkos, Lecavalier and St. Louis, which he had nothing to do with. But that's a discussion for another thread.

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05-12-2011, 04:50 PM
  #303
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Originally Posted by NobodyBeatsTheWiz View Post
And Yzerman is overrated. Tampa's gotten to where they are on the backs of Stamkos, Lecavalier and St. Louis...
Boucher's 1-3-1 and Roloson are equally important.

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05-12-2011, 05:48 PM
  #304
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tampas success has a lot to do with our own ineptitude

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05-12-2011, 06:01 PM
  #305
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Yzerman hired Boucher. That looks like a fine first move as GM. I dont think anyone would think Bruce outcoached Boucher. I think he got Rolo to get past us. Coupled with Yzerman's fine career, and almost singlehandedly beating us in 4 straight in our sole cup appearance, I think he should be respected until we have something to laugh at.

It may be some time before a cap fan will laugh at anything Stevie Y has done.

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05-12-2011, 06:08 PM
  #306
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tampas success has a lot to do with our own ineptitude
I was going to say that also. They got a Pens team without either of their big offensive stars and a mentally fragile Caps team that didn't make a single adjustment all series.

Kramer's karate class anyone...?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7t8xwpW8gJQ

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05-12-2011, 07:39 PM
  #307
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Kramer may have been mentally fragile, but he was rested!

One of these days, I think a grading of players playoff performances is in order. I would give Ovi an A-. He scored and hit, and thats all I expect from him. He gets a minus as I didnt really see him being a captain.

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05-13-2011, 09:55 AM
  #308
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Quote:
Originally Posted by NobodyBeatsTheWiz View Post
Pat Quinn was hired for one year. Simple. You're theory that he was hired to win the Cup that year is moronic.

And Yzerman is overrated. Tampa's gotten to where they are on the backs of Stamkos, Lecavalier and St. Louis, which he had nothing to do with. But that's a discussion for another thread.
My theory is that coaches are hired by GMs because the GM thinks the coach can turn the team into a Cup winner. Your disputing that is pretty ridiculous and is your lame attempt to defend your boy McPhee. But this is professional hockey we're talking about. Winning the Cup is what matters.

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05-13-2011, 10:24 AM
  #309
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Originally Posted by dpj0122 View Post
My theory is that coaches are hired by GMs because the GM thinks the coach can turn the team into a Cup winner. Your disputing that is pretty ridiculous and is your lame attempt to defend your boy McPhee. But this is professional hockey we're talking about. Winning the Cup is what matters.
That is absurd. Some coaches are definitely hired with the idea that they are going to take a team to the cup. Others are hired to turn awful teams to respectable. Is it out of the realm of possibility that said coach is going to take an awful team all the way through the stages of a team's development to a cup? No but a guy isn't hired to coach an awful team with that goal in mind.

I understand that the ultimate goal of every team is the cup but teams that are nowhere close to a cup are not putting that cart in front of the horse when pursuing and selecting coaches.

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05-13-2011, 10:36 PM
  #310
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Are the Caps trying to win the Stanley Cup?

I don't see that as their goal. They talked a good game until the playoff loss to the Pens in 2009. Ever since, it's been pitiful excuses from Ted and McPhee. There is exactly ZERO urgency by these mediocrities to win the championship. Ted and George put on their "business as usual" masks and pretend that this debacle isn't happening. They are ostriches sticking their heads in the sand.

But sure, we are the crazy ones; we who want to see Ovie, Varly, Backstrom and Co. win the Stanley Cup before they are too old and before we die.


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05-13-2011, 11:08 PM
  #311
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But I do sense that the incompetence of the Washington Caps organization is slowly being discovered league-wide and locally. At most, there'll be one more year of this particular nonsense and then Ted will be pressured to do *something.*

He won't know what to do, which is why he isn't firing people today but it'll at least be interesting. The organization is boring as can be right now. It's obvious that they'll 1) make the playoffs and 2) lose early and 3) make excuses. Like watching the paint dry on the wall. Boring.

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05-14-2011, 12:26 AM
  #312
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GMGM is flat out incompetent if he thinks the Caps simplistic style of play is anywhere close to championship caliber.

Watching the teams in the West play amazing coherent hockey leads me to believe that we are far away from a title.

Kuznetsov better be world class if he even comes over next year and somebody please please fix the awful PP.

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05-14-2011, 02:41 AM
  #313
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I'm a little surprised the venom hasn't died down by now. I'm resigned to the idea that this is the team managment we're going with next season. There's something to be said for the record of Arbor and Bowman before they won it all. Even the greats took time to learn. Who knows....maybe this all clicks next year, or 2 years from now and they win 1, maybe multiple Cups. Wouldn't we all feel like idiots for even briefly suggesting they fired BB or GMGM?

All of this talk about Ovy's prime years being wasted is....I honestly don't think we've seen the best player that Ovy can be. Maybe we've seen his best goal scoring years....tough to say, but I think he can be a more dominant player overall. He's still maturing himself and by my estimation, still has some growing up to do before he can reach his true potential. He can no longer dominate on his raw talent. The league has adjusted to him pretty well. He now needs to work as a pro. I want more creativity and less predictability from Ovy.

There's no reason why the Caps can't hire a PP specialist, tweak the roster, making some tough Free Agent decisions, and be right back in the top 3 seeds in the East next year and beyond.


And I absolutely think that Bruce needs to tighten the reigns on the team. Less optional practices....show up for work like a pro.

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George McPhee....The Teflon GM. 15 years of failure and counting....

6 - Number of playoff series the Capitals have won since George McPhee took over as General Manager in 1997 (which makes him the third-longest-tenured GM in the League), three of which came in McPhee's first season on the job.
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Old
05-14-2011, 06:55 AM
  #314
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Originally Posted by CapitalsCup2012 View Post
I'm a little surprised the venom hasn't died down by now. I'm resigned to the idea that this is the team managment we're going with next season. There's something to be said for the record of Arbor and Bowman before they won it all. Even the greats took time to learn. Who knows....maybe this all clicks next year, or 2 years from now and they win 1, maybe multiple Cups. Wouldn't we all feel like idiots for even briefly suggesting they fired BB or GMGM?

All of this talk about Ovy's prime years being wasted is....I honestly don't think we've seen the best player that Ovy can be. Maybe we've seen his best goal scoring years....tough to say, but I think he can be a more dominant player overall. He's still maturing himself and by my estimation, still has some growing up to do before he can reach his true potential. He can no longer dominate on his raw talent. The league has adjusted to him pretty well. He now needs to work as a pro. I want more creativity and less predictability from Ovy.

There's no reason why the Caps can't hire a PP specialist, tweak the roster, making some tough Free Agent decisions, and be right back in the top 3 seeds in the East next year and beyond.


And I absolutely think that Bruce needs to tighten the reigns on the team. Less optional practices....show up for work like a pro.

I do agree to some extent, but do you have a crystal ball to predict Ovy's longevity in the NHL? His style of play has and will take a toll on his body. He is in his prime due to his style of play. It seems some think Ovy has another 10 yrs left in this league. I beg to differ. When your star leads your team in hits in the playoffs, your star will not have a long, prosperous career. I say Ovy has a good 6 years left in his tank with his style.

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05-14-2011, 06:57 AM
  #315
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Originally Posted by CapitalsCup2012 View Post
I'm a little surprised the venom hasn't died down by now..
really? viscious criticism is part of the internet culture no matter what the subject. its a major factor in why the most brutal comments about any caps player, coach, management/ownership comes from people that only post after a loss and only post negative.

its how they are entertained. they will be here to rip who they enjoy ripping until which time that those players or coaches or management are moved on and they can dance on their grave for a period of time.

after the caps win games and playoff series, it gets pretty quiet. since this season ended ugly, we are going to see this for 12 months minimum.

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05-14-2011, 12:09 PM
  #316
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really? viscious criticism is part of the internet culture no matter what the subject. its a major factor in why the most brutal comments about any caps player, coach, management/ownership comes from people that only post after a loss and only post negative.

its how they are entertained. they will be here to rip who they enjoy ripping until which time that those players or coaches or management are moved on and they can dance on their grave for a period of time.

after the caps win games and playoff series, it gets pretty quiet. since this season ended ugly, we are going to see this for 12 months minimum.
You do realize that we are fans of the single most underachieving team in the entire league. Don't you?

And it's not even close.

Talk about a team and organization that deserve a healthy portion of "vicious criticism" and "brutal comments"....... I mean let's be reality.

The Caps are a joke in the eyes of those league insiders "who know anything about hockey" while also knowing how NOT to lose during the preliminary stages of the playoffs over and over and over.


Last edited by Icetime: 05-14-2011 at 12:19 PM.
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05-14-2011, 01:12 PM
  #317
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I do agree to some extent, but do you have a crystal ball to predict Ovy's longevity in the NHL? His style of play has and will take a toll on his body. He is in his prime due to his style of play. It seems some think Ovy has another 10 yrs left in this league. I beg to differ. When your star leads your team in hits in the playoffs, your star will not have a long, prosperous career. I say Ovy has a good 6 years left in his tank with his style.

Even though Ovi does play a very physical style, I think he'll make it past 31-32... Additionally, even if he tweaks his style that doesn't mean he'll stop being a dominant player. If he isn't running around like a cannonball hitting everything that move, he can still use his size and speed to make plays, commit more to defense, have a ridiculous scoring touch, and lay the big hit when he gets a good opportunity. I think his best years are ahead of him. Of course, this is contingent upon the organization addressing the lack of physicality (outside of a few players) on the team.

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05-14-2011, 01:31 PM
  #318
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yep. they're a joke. have been for a long time. they are chokingest team in the history of best of seven game series professional sports.

that has nothing to do with a group of posters that arrive soley to rip the franchise from owner to water boy when they lose. fans, as a general rule, cheer the good things and dread the bad things. with many of you, we never hear a peep unless its.....



then its all hands on deck.

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05-14-2011, 02:00 PM
  #319
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GMGM is flat out incompetent if he thinks the Caps simplistic style of play is anywhere close to championship caliber.

Watching the teams in the West play amazing coherent hockey leads me to believe that we are far away from a title.

Kuznetsov better be world class if he even comes over next year and somebody please please fix the awful PP.
Not sure if you follow basketball, but did you get to watch the Chicago Bulls this season? Talk about what a coach can do for a team in one season. It is now a team that is greater than the sum of its parts. Sharp passing, constant movement on offense, and defense that is a thing of beauty. Not just because of effort (although that is certainly part of it), but every defensive rotation is choreographed to the inch. Every guy knows exactly where he should be and where his teammate should be. One guy rotates to help, another guy rotates to his spot. Their guys have been there and done that so much in practice that they could do it with their eyes closed.

I think that Boucher is a somewhat similar example with Tampa Bay. You can see that same cohesion, as you called it, in the Western conference games. It's not always read and react but you can see the choreography. Passes to a spot, expecting a teammate to be there. Not as much panic, because they are not figuring everything out under pressure.

Boudreau's teams, well, I don't know that there is a better way to describe it than loosey goosey. They kind of remind me of when the US NBA all-stars would get together on a moment's notice to play against these European teams that have played together for a long time. It wasn't until this past summer when they really planned far in advance, got tons of practice time together, and became a team that they won something.

I think Bruce is all about talking, I really do. He seems to think that an idea in his head should manifest as performance on the ice. I don't think he is willing or able to spend time on the ice teaching and drilling these guys. I have watched a few of his practices, and to be honest I have not seen opponents' practices for comparison. But he did not strike me as a particularly hands on or dynamic guy.

One final point. Some will turn to the "changes" he made this season as an argument in his favor. To me that is very misleading. Essentially he had forwards backcheck and stay back more, while depending on individual talent to net a couple goals a game. Defensemen were better clearing the crease as well. What I did not see, though, was any consistent improvement in puck movement behind the blueline and getting the puck out of the zone. You expect a harder forecheck come playoff time, which made me pretty nervous watching them despite their regular season "success". Combine that with the difficulty of scoring "individual brilliance" goals in the playoffs, and voila. So Bruce's system change was fool's goal.

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05-14-2011, 06:41 PM
  #320
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One final point. Some will turn to the "changes" he made this season as an argument in his favor. To me that is very misleading. Essentially he had forwards backcheck and stay back more, while depending on individual talent to net a couple goals a game. Defensemen were better clearing the crease as well. What I did not see, though, was any consistent improvement in puck movement behind the blueline and getting the puck out of the zone. You expect a harder forecheck come playoff time, which made me pretty nervous watching them despite their regular season "success". Combine that with the difficulty of scoring "individual brilliance" goals in the playoffs, and voila. So Bruce's system change was fool's goal.
Couldn't agree more.

BB is a fraud.

He switched to a style of play he knows nothing about for one reason. To save his job.

The Power Play failures are hard to fathom seeing as how BB is supposed to be an offensive mind. That is the most powerful indictment against his coaching ability. With this type of talent it's pathetic. There is NO excuse for it.

The man is a Simpleton. Incapable of any adjustment. I can't believe we have to deal with this garbage coach next year, but it is what it is.

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05-14-2011, 07:24 PM
  #321
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I'm a little surprised the venom hasn't died down by now. I'm resigned to the idea that this is the team managment we're going with next season. There's something to be said for the record of Arbor and Bowman before they won it all. Even the greats took time to learn. Who knows....maybe this all clicks next year, or 2 years from now and they win 1, maybe multiple Cups. Wouldn't we all feel like idiots for even briefly suggesting they fired BB or GMGM?

All of this talk about Ovy's prime years being wasted is....I honestly don't think we've seen the best player that Ovy can be. Maybe we've seen his best goal scoring years....tough to say, but I think he can be a more dominant player overall. He's still maturing himself and by my estimation, still has some growing up to do before he can reach his true potential. He can no longer dominate on his raw talent. The league has adjusted to him pretty well. He now needs to work as a pro. I want more creativity and less predictability from Ovy.

There's no reason why the Caps can't hire a PP specialist, tweak the roster, making some tough Free Agent decisions, and be right back in the top 3 seeds in the East next year and beyond.


And I absolutely think that Bruce needs to tighten the reigns on the team. Less optional practices....show up for work like a pro.
Bruce needs to go. Hire a PP specialist? If Evason/Woods re-work the D and Bruce can't manage to get even decent performances out of his elite talent what's he ****ing around for anyways? To keep shuffling the lines? (Which players have said they don't like and doesn't help them). His amazing motivational skills?

The fact he's still around is absurd and my hopes for them are dead until something is done about the management/culture of this team.

My interest in the draft and FA are void for the first time since I can remember.

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05-14-2011, 08:02 PM
  #322
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Caps fans hoping vancover choke would ease their pain.... Nope
Caps fans hope Detroit sweep would ease their pain.... Nope
Caps fans hope SJ choke would ease their pain.... Nope

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05-14-2011, 08:13 PM
  #323
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Caps fans hoping vancover choke would ease their pain.... Nope
Caps fans hope Detroit sweep would ease their pain.... Nope
Caps fans hope SJ choke would ease their pain.... Nope
Actually I was rooting for Detroit as most of the encouragement I saw towards Cap fans after the Tampa series came from Detroit fans and I always respected their style of play as they are a go to answer for bursting the bubble on ridiculous hockey myths. "Oh if the Caps fought more they would win." "Take the C off Ovechkin that will help." "Get rid of Euro's they're soft." Red Wings simply focus on playing hockey and have a great history to show for their efforts.

San Jose and Vancouver, well it's nice to know that maybe we don't have to choke forever. Still just can't believe that they're bringing the coach back after 4 years of horrific under achievement. We didn't just loose to a rebuilding team early in the playoffs, we got SWEPT by a team we had bullied over the course of those last 4 years.

And the coach couldn't even make a freaking goalie switch. HELLO you're loosing despite scoring 3 goals that should be a hint to at least give them a different look in net.

I'll never question GMGM from a scouting and drafting perspective but from the perspective of being the guy who hires the coach he's a complete failure.

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05-14-2011, 10:18 PM
  #324
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I do agree to some extent, but do you have a crystal ball to predict Ovy's longevity in the NHL? His style of play has and will take a toll on his body. He is in his prime due to his style of play. It seems some think Ovy has another 10 yrs left in this league. I beg to differ. When your star leads your team in hits in the playoffs, your star will not have a long, prosperous career. I say Ovy has a good 6 years left in his tank with his style.
I don't think it's realistic to try and manage the comptetive timeline of a franchise based upon a projection of your star player's career path.

Look at Yzerman.....dude was a superstar for a long time before he won a Cup.

No chance I see Ovy being done in the NHL in 6 years. A career threatening knee injury is the only thing I see as a possibility....but I'm not concerned about him checking himself out of a long HOF career.

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05-14-2011, 10:20 PM
  #325
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Bruce needs to go. Hire a PP specialist? If Evason/Woods re-work the D and Bruce can't manage to get even decent performances out of his elite talent what's he ****ing around for anyways? To keep shuffling the lines? (Which players have said they don't like and doesn't help them). His amazing motivational skills?

The fact he's still around is absurd and my hopes for them are dead until something is done about the management/culture of this team.

My interest in the draft and FA are void for the first time since I can remember.
Maybe it is absurd, but he's clearly a coach that can coach a team to wins. That cannot be denied.....like I said....look at Arbor and Bowman. I'm sure there were people just as critical of those two before their teams won.

If we expect players to mature and grow as professionals, why not a coach?

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