HFBoards

Go Back   HFBoards > NHL Eastern Conference > Atlantic Division > Montreal Canadiens
Mobile Hockey's Future Become a Sponsor Site Rules Support Forum vBookie Page 2
Notices

Benoit Pouliot: not tendered qualifying offer (June 27)

Closed Thread
 
Thread Tools
Old
05-08-2011, 02:00 PM
  #26
Team_Spirit
Gangsta Pleks
 
Team_Spirit's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2002
Posts: 21,543
vCash: 50
It's 100% mental games for him.

When he's on he looks strong and everything goes in.

When he's not he flops around like a US player drafted out of high school attending his 1st pro camp.

Team_Spirit is offline  
Old
05-08-2011, 02:02 PM
  #27
Bob Cole
Registered User
 
Bob Cole's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2009
Country: Canada
Posts: 6,831
vCash: 500
I hope we sign him and give him one last chance to prove himself.

If he can get his skating straighten out and stop taking dumb penalties, he can easily be a solid 3rd line winger for us. Hes got a rocket shot.

Bob Cole is online now  
Old
05-08-2011, 02:02 PM
  #28
Quarantesix
#Galchenyuk
 
Quarantesix's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: Montréal
Posts: 4,502
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by ScottyG 91 View Post
Very good read.

I can't see the organization give up on Pouliot just yet. They gave AK quite a few chances and I can see the same for Pouliot. He has all the tools to succeed.
even if both are inconsistent AK is a better player and he's more proven. He have three 20 goals season.

but I can see both come back next season or just AK or just Pouliot or neither of them. It's hard to see what are Gauthier plan right npw but if I had to bet I will say both will be back next year. The only reason why Pouliot didn't play in the playoff it's because he was horrible at the end of the season. Next year will be a new year and he will have a chance to prove himself once again. He don't hurt the team on the bottom six and he will not cost much money and he don't worth much on the trading block.

so keep him and AK and bring another scoring winger for more scoring depth

Quarantesix is offline  
Old
05-08-2011, 02:02 PM
  #29
HotPie
Registered User
 
HotPie's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2007
Country: Canada
Posts: 3,587
vCash: 500
Flop.

HotPie is offline  
Old
05-08-2011, 02:08 PM
  #30
Blind Gardien
Global Moderator
nexus of the crisis
 
Blind Gardien's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2004
Location: Four Winds Bar
Country: France
Posts: 19,867
vCash: 500
I don't feel like he helps us in a bottom-6 role as much as maybe a different player would, given the way Martin runs the team. But who knows. I usually just kind of assume he's going the way of the other Martin discards, O'Byrne, Chipchura, Latendresse, SK, etc. But maybe not yet, I'm not sure. I don't think he has earned a salary any higher than his QO. So he has a little bit of power to manage his own situation, if he opts not to sign it and push for more. Then I can't see the Habs keeping him. Which is probably good for him.

Anyway, I basically see exactly the same Pouliot at 24 that I saw at 18, and didn't want. My optimism is not high that he'll ever be more than what you see right now. At the same time, what we see right now isn't awful, he has a place in the league, scoring 10-20 goals, depending on his utilization, capable of filling in some tertiary offense at times.

Blind Gardien is offline  
Old
05-08-2011, 02:19 PM
  #31
vokiel
I hate blind passes
 
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: Montréal
Country: Martinique
Posts: 7,235
vCash: 500
He's just not being used at his best, that is all. Having confidence in his skills is a serious motivation on the ice, but if the team doesn't actually give him the opportunity to use them as he thinks best, it's just not going to work. Habs are always the team asking some of their recruits to re-learn hockey completely. (not a great strategy)

Pouliot should just ask for a trade imho, see if he can fit somewhere else better.

vokiel is offline  
Old
05-08-2011, 02:33 PM
  #32
JohnLennon
Registered User
 
JohnLennon's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2011
Posts: 3,197
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by coolasprICE View Post
the risk of giving up on him now exceeds the reward of replacing his ~1m cap hit

He's got good hands, skating, shooting and reach... plus decent vision

He has horrible balance, confidence is fragile, needs to improve his play, focus and discipline in tight / defensive playoff type games.

At the very worst, he's a 15-20 goal scorer who you sit out come PO time.

At 1 million cap hit, I don't see much harm in that.

I would take 7 Pouliot's over 1 Gomez
Did you not see how badly he fits into this team in the playoffs? He stuck out like a sore thumb because he didn't buy into our system, and ended up being benched for the rest of the series because it was obvious he wasn't getting it. I don't care what his cap hit is, he is skilled and all but he does not belong on this team.

And as much as people don't like to hear it, Gomez is part of the core of this team and he played well in the playoffs, as usual. I would take Gomez over Pouliot, he is way more important to our team than Pouliot. It's sad that I actually have to say that nowadays.

JohnLennon is offline  
Old
05-08-2011, 02:47 PM
  #33
Kriss E
HFB Partner
 
Join Date: May 2007
Posts: 25,054
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Zeroknowledge View Post
FLOP

I don't care if he goes on and scores 40 in 2 years, I just don't want him here next year.
You're gonna have to explain to me why you wouldn't take a 40G scorer on your team.


As for the subject on hand, flop considering he was selected 4th. But I don't see a reason to really move him right away, especially considering we have 4 centers that can all use their share of offensive wingers. Plek-Gomez are our one-two punch, but with Eller-DD for possibly our 3rd-4th liners, giving them offensive forwards wouldn't be a bad thing.

Pouliot had a great start to the season, for a good part, he was actually our best scorer at ES, even ahead of Plekanec. Consistent is the issue, just like many other players in the NHL. At 1M, there's no need to get rid of him really. He's cheap, you can scratch him if needed, and if he's on he can be great. This was just his first full NHL season, so I would expect management to give him another year.

Kriss E is offline  
Old
05-08-2011, 03:09 PM
  #34
Le Tricolore
Boo! Booooo!
 
Le Tricolore's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2005
Location: Montreal
Posts: 28,352
vCash: 500
He's young and frustrating to watch. I wouldn't want to trade him now unless we're getting fair value, which I know we wouldn't.

also, he's scored like this a few times, which is just awesome:


Le Tricolore is offline  
Old
05-08-2011, 03:15 PM
  #35
LyricalLyricist
Registered User
 
Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: Montreal
Country: Canada
Posts: 21,804
vCash: 500
Thanks for the read Habsterix.

I like Pouliot. Thing is, he seems very shy and differs from the personality of say, a PK Subban. Pouliot seems like an introvert and by such, I'd imagine his confidence and quesitoning of his own ability fluctuate pretty often. This guy has tremendous skill and a willingness to get better, but at same time, I think he's not going in the right direction. 3rd line duties are fine, but give the guy a little PP time. Really, the level of PP time this guy gets is insanely low:

He's 16th on the team in PP TOI/G



He's 23rd in TOI/G

1:37 total TOI SH. Good for 26th on the team, an TOI SH/G of 0:01.

Really, he's not been given confidence to play much EV, much SH or much PP.


If we do a chart based on EV PTS/ EV TOI:



Yeah, I'm bored so I took the time to do it. BP is one of the best EV performers on the team, I did everybody on the team so you have reference. BTW, I rounded minutes down because I wasn't in the mood to calculate what every second converted to fraction was. If there's a mistake, let me know.

Edit: I missed Dawes, but basically 0 EV PTS so irrelevant.


Last edited by LyricalLyricist: 05-08-2011 at 04:00 PM.
LyricalLyricist is offline  
Old
05-08-2011, 03:40 PM
  #36
CuteHockeyBunny
Registered User
 
Join Date: May 2009
Location: Montreal
Country: Yugoslavia
Posts: 1,113
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Emanresu Wen View Post
He can be even more frustrating that Andrei at times


It's like if he always wants to rush everything, never slows down to take a better decision

And he falls at least 3 times every game

That being said, I wouldn't let im go, I'd rater see Moen walk

A line of Pouliot-Desharnais-Eller would be amazing
Andrei was nothing but solid this season. Give him the benefit of the doubt from now on, on matters of consistency. If you want the frustrating players of 2010-2011, you're looking at Spacek and Gomez.

CuteHockeyBunny is offline  
Old
05-08-2011, 03:43 PM
  #37
le_sean
Registered User
 
le_sean's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2006
Location: Ottawa
Country: Vatican City State
Posts: 15,168
vCash: 500
The more the Habs need him the less visible he becomes. Not really a player I want for the long-term. It's pretty bad when the team is starving for goals and an offensive player is benched in the playoffs. Goes to show you his lack of impact.

le_sean is offline  
Old
05-08-2011, 03:58 PM
  #38
PunkinDrublic*
 
Join Date: Aug 2009
Location: Sutton,Qc-Sudbury,On
Posts: 8,283
vCash: 500
Miss-used. Non- flop.

PunkinDrublic* is offline  
Old
05-08-2011, 04:09 PM
  #39
ChoseLa
Registered User
 
ChoseLa's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2010
Country: Martinique
Posts: 4,472
vCash: 500
I'm puting my money on him being a late bloomer. Next season he could surprise us all.

ChoseLa is offline  
Old
05-08-2011, 04:28 PM
  #40
Myron Gaines*
Trop Giou
 
Myron Gaines*'s Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2005
Location: Montreal
Country: Canada
Posts: 14,391
vCash: 500
Pools is just weak mentally, the minute something goes wrong, he plays like a pee wee chasing a puck. But when he's on...good lord, he is something to watch.

Myron Gaines* is offline  
Old
05-08-2011, 04:57 PM
  #41
JAVO16
Registered User
 
JAVO16's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2008
Location: Montréal
Country: Canada
Posts: 3,823
vCash: 500
Misunderstood lol

JAVO16 is offline  
Old
05-08-2011, 05:28 PM
  #42
Markowicz
Simple Jacques
 
Markowicz's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2009
Posts: 3,061
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Blind Gardien View Post
I don't feel like he helps us in a bottom-6 role as much as maybe a different player would, given the way Martin runs the team. But who knows. I usually just kind of assume he's going the way of the other Martin discards, O'Byrne, Chipchura, Latendresse, SK, etc. But maybe not yet, I'm not sure. I don't think he has earned a salary any higher than his QO. So he has a little bit of power to manage his own situation, if he opts not to sign it and push for more. Then I can't see the Habs keeping him. Which is probably good for him.

Anyway, I basically see exactly the same Pouliot at 24 that I saw at 18, and didn't want. My optimism is not high that he'll ever be more than what you see right now. At the same time, what we see right now isn't awful, he has a place in the league, scoring 10-20 goals, depending on his utilization, capable of filling in some tertiary offense at times.
I agree with most of this. I think his non use in the playoffs painted the picture pretty well. Pouliot has never really shown me that he can play a playoff brand of hockey. And i'm not even talking about an extra gear; playoff hockey is more about intelligence, awareness, and ability to raise your level of work ethic. Look at a guy like Backstrom on Washington. All the talent in the world couldn't hide the fact that this guy just doesn't get playoff hockey. The same can be said about Pouliot and a bunch of other guys. I'd argue that Andrei Kostitsyn does get it, he just happened to have a really bad last game, and unfortunately for him, that's what everyone seems to remember. For those who have complained night and day about giving up on Sergei Kostitsyn, dry your weeping eyes. The guy is the very epitome of a no-show in the playoffs. Pouliot is in the same boat as S. Kostitsyn, and may very well go on to have a similar year next year with another team. People need to look past the stats sometimes, and instead concentrate on the player's performance in important games. You want to retain the players that perform well in the tough games, and try to obtain player like them. Personally I'd trade Pouliot and try to get a player like Joel Ward. A player that's reliable, buys into the system, and understands the importance of big games. There's a reason why went out and got guys like Gomez, Gionta, Moen, and Gill. Playoffs performance means way more than regular season performance.

Markowicz is offline  
Old
05-08-2011, 05:30 PM
  #43
Kriss E
HFB Partner
 
Join Date: May 2007
Posts: 25,054
vCash: 500
I think Pouliot really just needs to do a new thing...


Kriss E is offline  
Old
05-08-2011, 05:35 PM
  #44
JHabs
HFB Partner
 
JHabs's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: Montreal
Country: Canada
Posts: 5,358
vCash: 500
Send a message via MSN to JHabs
We should show him this http://gobarbra.com/hit/new-f92bd3c8...6060ad6e0e18ba That should perk him up!

(Totally just threw his name into the song )

JHabs is offline  
Old
05-08-2011, 05:56 PM
  #45
Hank Scorpio
Registered User
 
Hank Scorpio's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2010
Posts: 475
vCash: 500
Play him in an offensive system or simplified offensive role and watch him flourish. This is a player who has had to work against his natural talents since he came into the league with varying levels of success and no real progression. In order to gain confidence, he needs to produce. In order to produce, he needs to go back to his basics, what got him into this league in the first place.

This would be difficult to do in Montreal because of how we match up lines. We match talent with talent and base our game around solid two-way play, something Pouliot has yet to master to the point where he can take on a top NHL line. If we were to roll three offensive lines and bring in another top six forward, he may have an opportunity here but, based on the players we have available to us now. Another option is putting Desharnais up with Eller and Pouliot but there's a lot of uncertainty there.

Another option could be to package him with our first round draft pick to a rebuilding team for a younger player who who suits our needs and can play in the top six. As an example, let's say to Ottawa for Nick Foligno and their second round draft pick. Ottawa gives up a promising, young forward who doesn't mind playing in the corners or in front of the net which suits Montreal's needs and in return upgrade their 36th overall pick to the 17th and get an enigmatic player with a ton of skill and a lot of potential. Benoit Pouliot gets a fresh start in an environment where he has room to make mistakes as Ottawa (/Florida/Edmonton/the Islanders) is not expected to be competitive this season and likely gets time to play his game with established players between Michalek, Spezza, and Alfredsson (or players like them).

That's my 2 cents on Pouliot. Productive thoughts are always welcome, particularly as I'm not really sure of values of players/picks.

Hank Scorpio is offline  
Old
05-08-2011, 06:22 PM
  #46
jlgib21*
 
Join Date: Mar 2011
Posts: 620
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by le_sean View Post
The more the Habs need him the less visible he becomes. Not really a player I want for the long-term. It's pretty bad when the team is starving for goals and an offensive player is benched in the playoffs. Goes to show you his lack of impact.
His first 15-20 games with us last year he was our best player imo. From last playoffs on he's been a total bust. Another trade i wish we could undo.

jlgib21* is offline  
Old
05-08-2011, 06:23 PM
  #47
durojean
Registered User
 
Join Date: May 2007
Posts: 951
vCash: 500
Benoit Pouliot is an asset right now. He is a young player with potential that has absolutely no value. I don't want to squeeze a trade with another team just to have a lesser player than him.

If we trade him it s for something good or I don't want him traded. Even if we have to let him go only when he is a UFA.

durojean is offline  
Old
05-08-2011, 06:28 PM
  #48
JHabs
HFB Partner
 
JHabs's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: Montreal
Country: Canada
Posts: 5,358
vCash: 500
Send a message via MSN to JHabs
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hank Scorpio View Post
Play him in an offensive system or simplified offensive role and watch him flourish. This is a player who has had to work against his natural talents since he came into the league with varying levels of success and no real progression. In order to gain confidence, he needs to produce. In order to produce, he needs to go back to his basics, what got him into this league in the first place.

This would be difficult to do in Montreal because of how we match up lines. We match talent with talent and base our game around solid two-way play, something Pouliot has yet to master to the point where he can take on a top NHL line. If we were to roll three offensive lines and bring in another top six forward, he may have an opportunity here but, based on the players we have available to us now. Another option is putting Desharnais up with Eller and Pouliot but there's a lot of uncertainty there.

Another option could be to package him with our first round draft pick to a rebuilding team for a younger player who who suits our needs and can play in the top six. As an example, let's say to Ottawa for Nick Foligno and their second round draft pick. Ottawa gives up a promising, young forward who doesn't mind playing in the corners or in front of the net which suits Montreal's needs and in return upgrade their 36th overall pick to the 17th and get an enigmatic player with a ton of skill and a lot of potential. Benoit Pouliot gets a fresh start in an environment where he has room to make mistakes as Ottawa (/Florida/Edmonton/the Islanders) is not expected to be competitive this season and likely gets time to play his game with established players between Michalek, Spezza, and Alfredsson (or players like them).

That's my 2 cents on Pouliot. Productive thoughts are always welcome, particularly as I'm not really sure of values of players/picks.
So your saying Our 1st, Pouliot for Foligno and their 2nd? I can appreciate the value here, but If we can land that deal I'd do a dance. Foligno is better than most ppl think and his value is abit higher than a slumping developing Pouliot.

We would have to add but I like the concept.

JHabs is offline  
Old
05-08-2011, 06:53 PM
  #49
OneSharpMarble
Registered User
 
OneSharpMarble's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2007
Location: Calgary
Country: Canada
Posts: 9,436
vCash: 500
Misunderstood, he gets zero time and usually with centres that are below his skill level. If we had a respectable #2 centre and Pouliot got 15+ minutes a night he would be much further ahead and playing like a real top 6 winger.

I have seen him control the flow of the game single handedly only to have the play ruined by a plug dumping the puck into the corner or losing it outright.

I think he will get better, giving up now would be stupid. He is one of the few on the team with a backbone and the ability to fight...and win. If that imbecile JM keeps giving him 7 or 8 minutes a night then no he will never have confidence and never develop and you might aswell ship him off.

OneSharpMarble is offline  
Old
05-08-2011, 07:14 PM
  #50
Habs Fan In Ottawa*
 
Join Date: Mar 2011
Location: Ottawa
Country: Canada
Posts: 783
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by LyricalLyricist View Post
Thanks for the read Habsterix.

I like Pouliot. Thing is, he seems very shy and differs from the personality of say, a PK Subban. Pouliot seems like an introvert and by such, I'd imagine his confidence and quesitoning of his own ability fluctuate pretty often. This guy has tremendous skill and a willingness to get better, but at same time, I think he's not going in the right direction. 3rd line duties are fine, but give the guy a little PP time. Really, the level of PP time this guy gets is insanely low:

He's 16th on the team in PP TOI/G

You need to keep in mind there are 3 better left-wingers than him that would be placed on the PP before him.

Habs Fan In Ottawa* is offline  
Closed Thread

Forum Jump


Bookmarks

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off



All times are GMT -5. The time now is 06:23 PM.

monitoring_string = "e4251c93e2ba248d29da988d93bf5144"
Contact Us - HFBoards - Archive - Privacy Statement - Terms of Use - Advertise - Top - AdChoices

vBulletin Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
HFBoards.com is a property of CraveOnline Media, LLC, an Evolve Media, LLC company. ©2014 All Rights Reserved.