HFBoards

Go Back   HFBoards > NHL Western Conference > Pacific Division > San Jose Sharks
Mobile Hockey's Future Become a Sponsor Site Rules Support Forum vBookie Page 2
Notices

June 1 signing deadline for....

Closed Thread
 
Thread Tools
Old
05-20-2011, 02:28 AM
  #1
LadyStanley
Elasmobranchology-go
 
LadyStanley's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2004
Location: North of the Tank
Country: United States
Posts: 57,929
vCash: 500
June 1 signing deadline for....

Just wondering if the Sharks will sign one or more of the kids they have to sign before June 1 (or they go back into the draft and/or become free agents).

These are:
D William Wrenn, C Philip Varone, D Dominik Bielke.


Also, there are two 2010 draftees that can be signed (in the exclusive window that closes 6/1): C Freddy Hamilton, D Konrad Abeltshauser


There's also the August 15 deadline to signPatrick White (or the Sharks will get a 2012 compensatory 2nd round pick).

LadyStanley is offline  
Old
05-20-2011, 02:30 AM
  #2
The Nemesis
Global Moderator
Semper Tyrannus
 
The Nemesis's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2005
Location: Langley, BC
Country: Canada
Posts: 49,405
vCash: 500
Both Wrenn and Varone seemed to have solid seasons overall and have some interesting potential. I see both of them probably getting contracts. Bielke I admittedly don't know much about.

As for Patrick White:

__________________

"Do you know what "nemesis" means? A righteous infliction of retribution manifested by an appropriate agent."
'14-15 Sharks CI Tracker: 57 GP, 18-28-11 (home-away-Nat'l/In-Region)
Sorry, I am not taking signature requests at this time.
The Nemesis is offline  
Old
05-20-2011, 02:50 AM
  #3
Hertl Power
Registered User
 
Hertl Power's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2010
Location: Bay Area, California
Country: United States
Posts: 1,383
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by The Nemesis View Post
Both Wrenn and Varone seemed to have solid seasons overall and have some interesting potential. I see both of them probably getting contracts. Bielke I admittedly don't know much about.

As for Patrick White:
It could be DW's stupid moment of the summer.

Hertl Power is offline  
Old
05-20-2011, 03:17 AM
  #4
wtfisthis
Registered User
 
wtfisthis's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2007
Country: United States
Posts: 2,831
vCash: 500
I would not be surprised at all if DW actually signs Patrick White.

wtfisthis is offline  
Old
05-20-2011, 03:25 AM
  #5
gonegonegone*
 
Join Date: Feb 2008
Location: San Diego
Country: United States
Posts: 3,338
vCash: 500
ooh this is the season where trading errhoff to our biggest rivals to the canucks pays off! hello 2nd/3rd riound pick!!

gonegonegone* is offline  
Old
05-20-2011, 03:33 AM
  #6
CrazedZooChimp
Not enough guts
 
CrazedZooChimp's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2005
Location: Bay Area, CA
Country: United States
Posts: 6,024
vCash: 500
Send a message via AIM to CrazedZooChimp
Quote:
Originally Posted by wtfisthis View Post
I would not be surprised at all if DW actually signs Patrick White.
Before or after he re-signs Wallin...?

CrazedZooChimp is offline  
Old
05-20-2011, 06:44 AM
  #7
210
Registered User
 
210's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2003
Location: Worcester, MA
Country: United States
Posts: 10,054
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by wtfisthis View Post
I would not be surprised at all if DW actually signs Patrick White.
I don't think he signs him only because San Jose will be very close to the NHL contract limit without his contract...that 2nd rounder is much better in the long run.

210 is offline  
Old
05-20-2011, 11:14 AM
  #8
stalockrox
Registered User
 
stalockrox's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2007
Posts: 5,171
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by 210 View Post
I don't think he signs him only because San Jose will be very close to the NHL contract limit without his contract...that 2nd rounder is much better in the long run.
Seriously, aside from what 210 mentions above, I'm pretty sure Wilson knew what he was getting here when he made the trade...a 2nd round pick.

I'd be pretty surprised if he doesn't sign Varone and only a little surprised if he doesn't wign Wrenn but Bielke is a toss up. There's a decent chance he may not want to come to NA to play.

stalockrox is offline  
Old
05-20-2011, 01:48 PM
  #9
The Nemesis
Global Moderator
Semper Tyrannus
 
The Nemesis's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2005
Location: Langley, BC
Country: Canada
Posts: 49,405
vCash: 500
I've been thinking since last night that a negative for Bielke is that he's bounced between the DEL and German 2nd league. I would think by now if he had reasonable upside he would at least be able to stick with Berlin.

The Nemesis is offline  
Old
05-20-2011, 01:54 PM
  #10
magic school bus
***********
 
magic school bus's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2010
Location: San Jose, CA
Country: United States
Posts: 16,347
vCash: 141
idk if we can count that against him. what if there was some german fan on HF that said Griess doesnt have much potential because he couldnt stick with the Sharks big club?*


*i know thats an unlikely scenario.

magic school bus is online now  
Old
05-20-2011, 05:35 PM
  #11
Janney
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jul 2004
Posts: 3,126
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by The Nemesis View Post
I've been thinking since last night that a negative for Bielke is that he's bounced between the DEL and German 2nd league. I would think by now if he had reasonable upside he would at least be able to stick with Berlin.
Yup, and it's been going on for two seasons. He pretty much spent half the season this year in their 2nd league.



Philip Varone should definitely be signed, he put up good numbers as soon as he got traded to Erie. Even if he turns out to be our Simon Gamache, he deserves a chance, at the very least he could become an effective force in Worcester.

With William Wrenn I'd be a bit hesitant. He's known as a rugged tough defensive defenseman, but can his stature be good enough for the big leagues? Its easier to dominate guys physically in college or the juniors but I'm not sure how effective he can be for the NHL. Still even if he becomes a fixture in the AHL, I say why not.

Janney is offline  
Old
05-20-2011, 05:44 PM
  #12
Vaasa
Registered User
 
Vaasa's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2006
Location: Sacramento, CA
Country: United States
Posts: 8,346
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by The Nemesis View Post
I've been thinking since last night that a negative for Bielke is that he's bounced between the DEL and German 2nd league. I would think by now if he had reasonable upside he would at least be able to stick with Berlin.
On the other hand, Bielke looked extremely good at the prospects camp this last year (IMO). He was pretty mobile, carried the puck very well, played moderately physical, and didn't look that bad defensively.

It may be purely an issue of the organization he belongs to in the DEL having so much depth for his position that he hasn't the chance. He's still the 3rd youngest guy on the team (and only a month away from being the 2nd youngest) and he's 5-years younger than the next-youngest d-man.

EDIT: I forgot to also remind folks that the German Jr. leagues are not just kids. He's still the 6th-youngest player on his Jr. team, and that team includes 3 31-year olds. So he's playing against full grown men in either league.

Vaasa is offline  
Old
05-20-2011, 10:04 PM
  #13
Admiral Al
Registered User
 
Admiral Al's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2005
Posts: 152
vCash: 500
The sharks dont have to offer Wrenn a contract by June 1st.

Admiral Al is offline  
Old
05-31-2011, 08:57 PM
  #14
KeziaTML
Registered User
 
Join Date: Apr 2010
Location: Calgary, AB
Posts: 1,379
vCash: 500
William Wrenn

Needs to be signed before the deadline.. Will he be or will he re-enter the draft?

KeziaTML is online now  
Old
05-31-2011, 09:12 PM
  #15
stalockrox
Registered User
 
stalockrox's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2007
Posts: 5,171
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by KeziaTML View Post
Needs to be signed before the deadline.. Will he be or will he re-enter the draft?
The Sharks org. is very, very quiet about signings until they are signed, sealed, delivered and accepted - meaning, no one knows.

Threre's two other players, Phil Varone and Dominic Bielke who both need to be signed as well.

I emailed the Sharks beat writers to see if they had heard anything but neither of them had a clue.

stalockrox is offline  
Old
06-01-2011, 12:17 PM
  #16
magic school bus
***********
 
magic school bus's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2010
Location: San Jose, CA
Country: United States
Posts: 16,347
vCash: 141
don't we have to offer Pat White a contract to get the 2nd rd comp? what if he takes it??

magic school bus is online now  
Old
06-01-2011, 12:41 PM
  #17
fr4ed2384
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jul 2005
Posts: 1,390
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by magic school bus View Post
don't we have to offer Pat White a contract to get the 2nd rd comp? what if he takes it??
in a word .. NO /Yes
CBA does require an "bonofide offer " but does not specify kind of offer

example .. NY Rangers 2007 -17th ...Alexei Cherepanov , and on his death .... given a 2nd rd in 2009 47th

MON ... Dave Fischer 2006-20th ,.. not signed by Mon ..given a 2nd rd in 2011 -50th


Last edited by fr4ed2384: 06-01-2011 at 01:07 PM.
fr4ed2384 is offline  
Old
06-01-2011, 01:07 PM
  #18
LadyStanley
Elasmobranchology-go
 
LadyStanley's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2004
Location: North of the Tank
Country: United States
Posts: 57,929
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by magic school bus View Post
don't we have to offer Pat White a contract to get the 2nd rd comp? what if he takes it??
Nope.

Sharks should only make offer if they feel him playing is a better deal than a 2nd round pick in the bank.

LadyStanley is offline  
Old
06-01-2011, 01:31 PM
  #19
fr4ed2384
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jul 2005
Posts: 1,390
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by LadyStanley View Post
Nope.

Sharks should only make offer if they feel him playing is a better deal than a 2nd round pick in the bank.
Sorry for this LS, but a drafted 1st rd player even if in college has to be made a "Bona Fide" offer

the catch is the offer can be made anytime after he has been drafted ..

As for David Fischer, The Canadiens will receive a compensatory draft pick in 2011 since he was unsigned by Montreal by August 15, 2010. The offer required to (bona fide offer) was presented within one year from the moment he was drafted, which Fischer declined....

Montreal did not extend a second offer to Fischer by August 15 , 2010

WE DON'T KNOW IF AN " BONO FIDE" OFFER was ever made to White either by Canucks or Sharks

The exact CBA section is pg 17 , 8.3 (b)

In the event a Club loses its draft rights to an Unsigned Draft Choice
drafted in the first round of the Entry Draft (except as a result of failing to tender a
required Bona Fide Offer (as defined below)), who is again eligible for the Entry Draft or becomes an Unrestricted Free Agent, a Compensatory Draft Selection shall automatically be granted to that Club, which Compensatory Draft Selection shall be the same numerical choice in the second round in the Entry Draft immediately following the date the Club loses such rights.
By way of example, if a Club cannot sign the third pick in the first
round, it will receive the third pick in the second round as compensation.

fr4ed2384 is offline  
Old
06-01-2011, 01:44 PM
  #20
WedgeAntilles*
 
Join Date: Apr 2011
Location: Philly Burbs
Country: United States
Posts: 663
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by endy View Post
ooh this is the season where trading errhoff to our biggest rivals to the canucks pays off! hello 2nd/3rd riound pick!!
Laugh if you want, but Ray Whitney was a 2nd rd pick, Sandis Ozolinsh was as well. Cheechoo, Carle, Vlasic, McGinn, all 2nd rounders.

In fact, the Sharks hit % in the 2nd rd is by far their best of any rd...

WedgeAntilles* is offline  
Old
06-01-2011, 01:47 PM
  #21
stalockrox
Registered User
 
stalockrox's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2007
Posts: 5,171
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by fr4ed2384 View Post
Sorry for this LS, but a drafted 1st rd player even if in college has to be made a "Bona Fide" offer

the catch is the offer can be made anytime after he has been drafted ..

As for David Fischer, The Canadiens will receive a compensatory draft pick in 2011 since he was unsigned by Montreal by August 15, 2010. The offer required to (bona fide offer) was presented within one year from the moment he was drafted, which Fischer declined....

Montreal did not extend a second offer to Fischer by August 15 , 2010

WE DON'T KNOW IF AN " BONO FIDE" OFFER was ever made to White either by Canucks or Sharks

The exact CBA section is pg 17 , 8.3 (b)

In the event a Club loses its draft rights to an Unsigned Draft Choice
drafted in the first round of the Entry Draft (except as a result of failing to tender a
required Bona Fide Offer (as defined below)), who is again eligible for the Entry Draft or becomes an Unrestricted Free Agent, a Compensatory Draft Selection shall automatically be granted to that Club, which Compensatory Draft Selection shall be the same numerical choice in the second round in the Entry Draft immediately following the date the Club loses such rights.
By way of example, if a Club cannot sign the third pick in the first
round, it will receive the third pick in the second round as compensation.
College players need not be tendered an offer (bona fide or otherwise) and if they are not signed then the team gets the compensatory pick.

As mentioned before, when DW made this trade it was not for Patrick White (unless he had some major turn around in his development/attitude) it was for the 2nd round pick the Sharks would get when White isn't signed.

stalockrox is offline  
Old
06-01-2011, 02:28 PM
  #22
fr4ed2384
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jul 2005
Posts: 1,390
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by stalockrox View Post
College players need not be tendered an offer (bona fide or otherwise) and if they are not signed then the team gets the compensatory pick.

As mentioned before, when DW made this trade it was not for Patrick White (unless he had some major turn around in his development/attitude) it was for the 2nd round pick the Sharks would get when White isn't signed.
Wrong , on both counts

see the CBA ... http://www.nhl.com/cba/2005-CBA.pdf

Pgs 17 -8.3 Compensation Draft selections (b)
and, Pg 19 - 8.6 Exclusive rights (c) College Players ..

You want to have an example go to Habs site which explains how Habs got the compensation for Fischer

http://www.habseyesontheprize.com/20...-the-status-of

8.6(c) states a team keeps the exclusive rights until it expires without having to make a "BONO FIDE" offer

8.3 (b) states to receive compensation a team must make a "BONO FIDE' offer

secondly, DW made a trade for the "rights" to Patrick White which would include the compensation if the Sharks did not sign after making an offer ( or Canucks previously). You cannot trade what you don't have (which was Canucks did not have 2nd rd pick only the rights to White) and trades are not made on a condition of development /attitude

fr4ed2384 is offline  
Old
06-01-2011, 02:34 PM
  #23
WineShark
HFBoards Sponsor
 
WineShark's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2006
Location: Napa Valley, CA
Country: United States
Posts: 7,033
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by stalockrox View Post
Seriously, aside from what 210 mentions above, I'm pretty sure Wilson knew what he was getting here when he made the trade...a 2nd round pick.

I'd be pretty surprised if he doesn't sign Varone and only a little surprised if he doesn't wign Wrenn but Bielke is a toss up. There's a decent chance he may not want to come to NA to play.
The sad part is we gave away Erhoff for a pick. The Nucks beat us adding Ehrhoff, making the pick the 29th or 30th of the second round .... not even a mid rounder.

__________________
The Best Sports Team in the Bay Area for 20 Years
WineShark is offline  
Old
06-01-2011, 02:38 PM
  #24
stalockrox
Registered User
 
stalockrox's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2007
Posts: 5,171
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by fr4ed2384 View Post
Wrong , on both counts

see the CBA ... http://www.nhl.com/cba/2005-CBA.pdf

Pgs 17 -8.3 Compensation Draft selections (b)
and, Pg 19 - 8.6 Exclusive rights (c) College Players ..

8.6(c) states a team keeps the exclusive rights until it expires without having to make a "BONO FIDE" offer

8.3 (b) states to receive compensation a team must make a "BONO FIDE' offer

secondly, DW made a trade for the "rights" to Patrick White which would include the compensation if the Sharks did not sign after making an offer ( or Canucks previously). You cannot trade what you don't have (which was Canucks did not have 2nd rd pick only the rights to White) and trades are not made on a condition of development /attitude
This was posted when the trade took place:

Originally Posted by CBA Article 8.3(b)
(b) In the event a Club loses its draft rights to an Unsigned Draft Choice
drafted in the first round of the Entry Draft (except as a result of failing to tender a
required Bona Fide Offer (as defined below)), who is again eligible for the Entry Draft or
becomes an Unrestricted Free Agent, a Compensatory Draft Selection shall automatically
be granted to that Club, which Compensatory Draft Selection shall be the same numerical
choice in the second round in the Entry Draft immediately following the date the Club
loses such rights. By way of example, if a Club cannot sign the third pick in the first
round, it will receive the third pick in the second round as compensation

But Article 8.6(c) for College players explicitly states that Bona Fide Offers are NOT required for players who are or become bona fide college students within a year of being drafted.


Quote:
Originally Posted by CBA Article 8.6(c)(i)
(i) If a Player drafted at age 18 or 19 is a bona fide college student at
the time of his selection in the Entry Draft, or becomes a bona fide
college student prior to the first June 1 following his selection in
the Entry Draft, and remains a bona fide college student through
the graduation of his college class, his drafting Club shall retain the
exclusive right of negotiation for his services through and
including the August 15 following the graduation of his college
class. The Club need not make a Bona Fide Offer to such Player to
retain such rights.

And don't take what I said about the "trade" so literally - of course he traded for the rights to Patrick White, my opinion is that it was with the intention that the Sharks would not sign him and get the compensatory pick. My comment about a change in White's development/attitude was if, by chance he became the player he was projected to be the Sharks could hang on to him. He was pretty much already a bust when the trade was made.


Last edited by stalockrox: 06-01-2011 at 02:45 PM.
stalockrox is offline  
Old
06-01-2011, 02:43 PM
  #25
X-SHARKIE
Registered User
 
X-SHARKIE's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2003
Location: Janesville Wisconsin
Posts: 9,362
vCash: 500
Send a message via AIM to X-SHARKIE
Quote:
Originally Posted by stalockrox View Post
Seriously, aside from what 210 mentions above, I'm pretty sure Wilson knew what he was getting here when he made the trade...a 2nd round pick.

I'd be pretty surprised if he doesn't sign Varone and only a little surprised if he doesn't wign Wrenn but Bielke is a toss up. There's a decent chance he may not want to come to NA to play.
Bingo. White will not be signed and I don't think they ever even intended to.

X-SHARKIE is offline  
Closed Thread

Forum Jump


Bookmarks

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off



All times are GMT -5. The time now is 11:26 PM.

monitoring_string = "e4251c93e2ba248d29da988d93bf5144"
Contact Us - HFBoards - Archive - Privacy Statement - Terms of Use - Advertise - Top - AdChoices

vBulletin Copyright ©2000 - 2015, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
HFBoards.com is a property of CraveOnline Media, LLC, an Evolve Media, LLC company. 2015 All Rights Reserved.