HFBoards

Go Back   HFBoards > NHL Eastern Conference > Metropolitan Division > Washington Capitals
Mobile Hockey's Future Become a Sponsor Site Rules Support Forum vBookie Page 2
Notices

Acquisitions/Cap management/Roster Building Thread XVI

Closed Thread
 
Thread Tools
Old
06-13-2011, 01:07 PM
  #526
Hivemind
We're Touched
 
Hivemind's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2010
Location: Philadelphia
Posts: 16,044
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Marshall View Post
Portzline says he doesn't think Columbus will re-sign Upshall.

I know he's had injury issues in the past, and wasn't much of a factor in his brief time with the Jackets, but there's a guy I'd like to see the Caps have interest in.
Would love to get Upshall. If we add him, resign Laich, and get a top 4 defenseman (with Hannan as a back-up plan) I'd be thrilled with this off-season.

Heck, if we find a way to have MoJo at 3C instead of 2C (Laich? Arnott?), a Chimera-Johansson-Upshall 3rd line would be a nightmare for opponents. Strong defensively, fast enough to be a transition threat and keep their defensemen honest, and willing to take it to you and grind you down. Chimera-Laich-Upshall could work as well.

Quote:
Originally Posted by macavoy View Post
Hey guys,

I skimmed the past 2 pages and didn't see any recent reports but how likely is Laich to be resigned? What do you guys think he's worth given that he'll likely be the most sought after UFA available (Richards will be overpriced to most teams). Almost everyone could use a Laich.
A little better than 50%, I think. His desire to stay in Washington is apparent, but so is the fact that he could likely fetch more on the open market. If he hits July 1st unsigned, I think he's probably gone. But good odds he signs with Washington before then.

Hivemind is offline  
Old
06-13-2011, 01:48 PM
  #527
HSHS
Losing is a disease
 
HSHS's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2005
Location: Redondo Beach, Ca
Country: United States
Posts: 17,641
vCash: 500
Give a comback Frolov a chance!

HSHS is offline  
Old
06-13-2011, 02:00 PM
  #528
Stewie G
Needed more hitting!
 
Join Date: Oct 2009
Posts: 2,514
vCash: 500
I haven't posted for a while but I was just wondering if anyone else agrees with RH's line of thinking that Nick's offense (or any offensive player really) was stifled by having to cover up for the "hard charging Schultz, Alzner, and Erskine". Maybe I was in the bathroom every time it happened, but I can only remember that happening once a game on average, at least when the team wasn't down late in the game. Did I miss something?

Stewie G is offline  
Old
06-13-2011, 02:18 PM
  #529
Millhaus
Registered User
 
Join Date: Dec 2002
Posts: 6,701
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Stewie G View Post
I haven't posted for a while but I was just wondering if anyone else agrees with RH's line of thinking that Nick's offense (or any offensive player really) was stifled by having to cover up for the "hard charging Schultz, Alzner, and Erskine". Maybe I was in the bathroom every time it happened, but I can only remember that happening once a game on average, at least when the team wasn't down late in the game. Did I miss something?
I'm with you. Did it happen now and then? Sure. Was it an issue, much less THE issue, with respect to Backstom's, or any of the other offensive stars', abysmal play all season? Not in the least.

And I would like Boudreau gone also so it isn't like I am looking for reasons to defend the guy.

Millhaus is offline  
Old
06-13-2011, 02:59 PM
  #530
RandyHolt
Keep Truckin
 
Join Date: Nov 2006
Country: Poland
Posts: 26,290
vCash: 2743
It's a theory to try to rationalize why Nick struggled, why we struggle to find a 2C, and why our offense... looks like crap. Its all one man shows, or dirty work in front. What else would one expect with Ovi and Knuble in deep?

On average, how much higher (farther from the net) did Backstrom have to be for defensive zone responsibilities compared to centers in others very offensive systems. I often noted him and other C's shaded "high" and have for years. I think the system is also dependent on the defensemen to NOT pinch when the center is tied up down low, obviously. And we didnt face a plethora of odd mans, our centers were almost always high. Our centers are VERY responsible.

But every time you saw a defensemen pinch this last year, Backstrom (in all likelyhood re: highest TOI of our C's) was the one that had to be back, and was back. I dont watch other teams, but I will go out on a limb and guess that our defensive dmen were the most active in the offensive zone of any team in the league, in tie games, or playing with a lead.

How many times a game did you see a LD pinch in. That is how many times Nick was not just thinking defense, but bringing it. I think its a lot, at least 5 -10 times a game. Maybe 15. thinking about defense? Much more than that.

I want him thinking and bringing offense, and Sarge and Alzner thinking defense. 99% of the time.


Last edited by RandyHolt: 06-13-2011 at 03:05 PM.
RandyHolt is online now  
Old
06-13-2011, 03:15 PM
  #531
CapitalsCupFantasy
HFBoards Sponsor
 
CapitalsCupFantasy's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2002
Country: United States
Posts: 29,037
vCash: 500
Talbot? Dude talks about how much he hates the Caps.....I would be shocked if he came here. He's certainly the type of bottom 6 guy we need to add though....

CapitalsCupFantasy is offline  
Old
06-13-2011, 03:17 PM
  #532
RandyHolt
Keep Truckin
 
Join Date: Nov 2006
Country: Poland
Posts: 26,290
vCash: 2743
Think about it like this. Ovi battling down in the corner. The puck dribbles up the boards and Erskine comes crashing down. Nick slides back to just outside the blue to cover, and was probably there from the start since aggressive dmen play in the OZ is a staple of the Bruce offense. Is it not?

Our defensemen were almost always successful on their pinches. Who is Ovi passing to at that point when he gets the puck, Erskine has turned his back, Nick is just starting to drift back into the play; the RW without even trying has covered two guys.

I am thinking in Bruces system, the center could stand to be shooter. Up high in the dot, looking to shoot or cover.

Something isnt working in the offensive zone. Its ugly! I watch other teams on rare occassion, and its a thing of beauty. Sharp crisp passing, great chemistry with linemates knowing where the other is; what I call quality goals.

Until a better theory comes around, I will pick apart what I see us do and other teams not do.

How many goals did we get from a D Dman deep pinch? 5 all year, if that.

RandyHolt is online now  
Old
06-13-2011, 03:30 PM
  #533
Langway
Death/Taxes/Choking
 
Langway's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2006
Posts: 22,150
vCash: 50
Dmen pinches are more about maintaining possession and/or breaking up transition flow than scoring goals directly, especially on the left side. Their offensive tactics were quite ugly last season but I don't put that on aggressive pinching from the D at the point as lax forechecking by forwards and negligible team play/chemistry. As with past seasons in the playoffs, their execution was way too loose and unstructured. Their mentality was still very much that of a transition team...only without the team speed or precise support through the neutral zone to pull it off. Offensively they just didn't seem all that motivated. The result was a team whose offensive habits were pretty shaky and whose overall approach was playing not to lose all too often. As much as they did miss some of their puck moving guys on the back-end vs. TB, their overall puck movement was pretty bad and reverting to the dump and chase was a simple-minded fix that just made it worse.

You can talk about the system but decision making and execution within that system is paramount and their detail work still isn't where it needs to be.

Langway is offline  
Old
06-13-2011, 03:35 PM
  #534
Millhaus
Registered User
 
Join Date: Dec 2002
Posts: 6,701
vCash: 500
I don't know man. Hockey is a free flowing game. Forwards are always covering for defensemen who pinch down low during the course of the game regardless of team.

Unless I am missing something in the situation you described if Erskine doesn't pinch the other team simply takes it the other way as their guy gets to the puck first instead of Erskine. Sure the Caps are in decent shape as Backstrom was already the high man but how is that a better thing than Erskine keeping the puck in the other team's zone instead?

If the choice is don't pinch and the other team gets the puck and takes it the other way or pinch and keep it in, even if that forces a forward to have to cover for the defenseman, I don't see how pinching is a bad play, regardless of the type of player the pinching defenseman is unless the game situation dictates no pinching regardless.

Millhaus is offline  
Old
06-13-2011, 04:28 PM
  #535
HSHS
Losing is a disease
 
HSHS's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2005
Location: Redondo Beach, Ca
Country: United States
Posts: 17,641
vCash: 500
I have no problem with D pinches. Actually I like that agressive nature. While it does give the center and weakside winger something extra to think about I think its typically way more helpful than hurtful.

It becomes hurtful if you can't maintain possession because of execution/effort/bad decisions and the other team easily takes the puck from down deep and puts you on your heels with a forward playing D and a slow LD trying to chug his way back into the play.

If that pinch and subsequent dump only maintains possession say about 60-70% of the time with your team able to restructure the attack then I think its time to re-evaluate that pressure hockey and consider playing a cerebral/patient game. IMHO the ability to do both served TB very well come playoff time and severely limited our efforts.

HSHS is offline  
Old
06-13-2011, 04:30 PM
  #536
Hivemind
We're Touched
 
Hivemind's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2010
Location: Philadelphia
Posts: 16,044
vCash: 500
Thoughts on retaining Sturm? Especially if Laich isn't in DC next year or Fehr isn't ready to go at the beginning of the season. Offer him a one-year deal to try an re-establish his value around the league.

If he'd accept a deal in the ~$1.2M range, I think I'd be for it. He played well, even if he was terrible at finishing. He's good enough at moving the puck forward and defensive play that he fits into a bottom 6 role (though he'd lack the 'nasty' that is so desired down there).

Hivemind is offline  
Old
06-13-2011, 05:04 PM
  #537
fsnoles98
Registered User
 
fsnoles98's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2009
Posts: 1,059
vCash: 500
Sign Laich and Alzner. Add Upshall, Talbot and a skilled/physical dman. Let Arnott, Sturm and Brads (though I like him) go. Trade Schultz (pylon), Semin (on again/off again) and possibly Varly (not sure about this move, but sooner or later one of the three have to go) for value. King did absolutely nothing for this team, buy out and find a young tough guy in the minors. Make sure Nicky does not skate with ankle weights on this season or SOMEONE GET HIM ON A CONDITIONING PROGRAM and we should be looking good for next season. Trade value players and skilled dman, not included, please add your own. just something to get some discussion, some of you on these boards please do not take it personal. Thank you. LOL

fsnoles98 is offline  
Old
06-13-2011, 06:07 PM
  #538
Robert Theodorson
Registered User
 
Robert Theodorson's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2010
Location: Washington DC
Country: United States
Posts: 7,347
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by fsnoles98 View Post
Sign Laich and Alzner. Add Upshall, Talbot and a skilled/physical dman. Let Arnott, Sturm and Brads (though I like him) go. Trade Schultz (pylon), Semin (on again/off again) and possibly Varly (not sure about this move, but sooner or later one of the three have to go) for value. King did absolutely nothing for this team, buy out and find a young tough guy in the minors. M
Couldn't have said it better myself.

Here's a Scottie Upshall video for those of you (like myself) who never really got to see much of him.



All I would add to your post is to probably find a way to get rid of Fehr if you want to install Upshall as the 1st/2nd line RW

Robert Theodorson is offline  
Old
06-13-2011, 06:15 PM
  #539
bonzaibondra12
Registered User
 
bonzaibondra12's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2010
Location: Rockville, MD
Posts: 1,875
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mystlyfe View Post
Thoughts on retaining Sturm? Especially if Laich isn't in DC next year or Fehr isn't ready to go at the beginning of the season. Offer him a one-year deal to try an re-establish his value around the league.

If he'd accept a deal in the ~$1.2M range, I think I'd be for it. He played well, even if he was terrible at finishing. He's good enough at moving the puck forward and defensive play that he fits into a bottom 6 role (though he'd lack the 'nasty' that is so desired down there).
Your assessment on Sturm sound exactly like what we have too much of.

bonzaibondra12 is offline  
Old
06-13-2011, 06:57 PM
  #540
Atlas
Registered User
 
Atlas's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2004
Country: United States
Posts: 3,417
vCash: 500
I couldn't make heads or tails out of what the plan was this year. The previous two seasons made perfect sense and they looked great. This year was ugly hockey all year long on O, even when they were winning. Everything points to Bruce being Problem #1. I guess the faithful here and in management will need another fail or two to wake up.

Discussing acquisitions and the draft is much ado about nothing if the coach isn't good enough. But to play along:

The power play is the key this year. If they get that up and running the O guys will be confident and play better at regular strength.

Put Ovie anywhere but at the point. I'd try Carlson and Green at the points. Put Ovie on the left down low and Backstrom opposite. But then who can play in the middle? Knuble and Fehr are the best candidates but I don't love those guys there on a regular basis. That's a position to fill this off season. I don't like Laich's game very much. He's solid but gets outmuscled and outskilled in the playoffs. See ya, Brooks.

That puts Semin off PP1, I guess. If he isn't on PP1 he doesn't do you much good. So I'd explore a trade for him.

MaJo and Fehr are both question marks. Good players but I don't know what to expect from them. Can MJ play a solid defensive 3C all year? 40 pts, a plus rating and good on the PK? If so, great. If not, we need someone to do that. Arnott can still add something but he's more spice, less core.

The Caps are weaklings up the middle. It's McPhee's job to correct that.

The D is getting more talented but the mix isn't right yet.

Hannan - Green
Alzner - Carlson
Wideman - XXXX
Erskine #7


I'd trade or bury Schultz and get someone who battles and hurts people.

Varly and Holtby are our two best goalies. I'd trade Neuvy to the highest bidder. Maybe someone will give up a middlin' 1st rounder for him or even a solid 3rd liner to replace Laich.

It's hard to be optimistic...the puzzle pieces don't fit. It's like 3 sets have been mixed together and the cat chewed and peed on some of the pieces.

Atlas is offline  
Old
06-13-2011, 07:12 PM
  #541
Langway
Death/Taxes/Choking
 
Langway's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2006
Posts: 22,150
vCash: 50
Quality, well-rounded centers are like rugs that really tie the room together.

Langway is offline  
Old
06-13-2011, 07:22 PM
  #542
Atlas
Registered User
 
Atlas's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2004
Country: United States
Posts: 3,417
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Langway View Post
Quality, well-rounded centers are like rugs that really tie the room together.

Obviously, you are not a golfer.

Atlas is offline  
Old
06-13-2011, 07:24 PM
  #543
Robert Theodorson
Registered User
 
Robert Theodorson's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2010
Location: Washington DC
Country: United States
Posts: 7,347
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Atlas View Post
\
Put Ovie anywhere but at the point. I'd try Carlson and Green at the points. Put Ovie on the left down low and Backstrom opposite. But then who can play in the middle? Knuble and Fehr are the best candidates but I don't love those guys there on a regular basis. That's a position to fill this off season. I don't like Laich's game very much. He's solid but gets outmuscled and outskilled in the playoffs. See ya, Brooks.


Hannan - Green
Alzner - Carlson
Wideman - XXXX
Erskine #7
Carlson and Wideman can handle the QB position on the powerplay.

1) Alzner-Carlson will be the #1 pairing for awhile to come

2) We don't need Mike Green anymore now that we have Wideman and with the continued development of Carlson we have our offensive defensemen. Imagine the money we spend on Green going towards a true #1-2 shutdown defensemen who plays on the second pairing.

Green is nice to have in the regular season, we all like to clap and cheer when he scores his goals but once the postseason rolls around he goes from being a #1 defensemen to a guy you'd seriously have to consider giving him ice time and making him the 6th D Man. He doesn't lose a gear, he goes from 6th to stalling out and dying. Green takes more hits than he dishes out as he has little to no idea how to defend his own zone, which wouldn't be a big deal except for the fact, of course, that he is in name, a defensemen.

He has shown absolutely no sign of improvement in his years here when it comes to performing in the clutch and his injury history can become a huge problem down the road. Since Green has no situational awareness other players easily paint a bullseye on him and he's one or two bad hits away from losing all his trade value before he hits RFA.

Furthermore the Caps are desperate for leaders and other than OV, Knuble, and Laich (who we will in all likelihood lose to UFA). Green does not even come close to even possessing the simplest leadership skills. He inspires no man, and his teammates' confidence in him in crunch time/the playoffs is probably around zero.

Robert Theodorson is offline  
Old
06-13-2011, 07:58 PM
  #544
RandyHolt
Keep Truckin
 
Join Date: Nov 2006
Country: Poland
Posts: 26,290
vCash: 2743
Quote:
Originally Posted by HSHS View Post
I have no problem with D pinches. Actually I like that agressive nature. While it does give the center and weakside winger something extra to think about I think its typically way more helpful than hurtful.

It becomes hurtful if you can't maintain possession because of execution/effort/bad decisions and the other team easily takes the puck from down deep and puts you on your heels with a forward playing D and a slow LD trying to chug his way back into the play.

If that pinch and subsequent dump only maintains possession say about 60-70% of the time with your team able to restructure the attack then I think its time to re-evaluate that pressure hockey and consider playing a cerebral/patient game. IMHO the ability to do both served TB very well come playoff time and severely limited our efforts.
I used to love our D pinches. And hate teams that dont even try it down a few goals late cough Hanlon. But we do it any time all the time. Versus a teams bigguns.

After seeing how easy pitt was beating it in center ice with a little chip play in the playoffs, and realizing we never really hit anyone doing it, making them give up the puck or have doubts next time around, I started wondering. Offensive zone center ice, it can help keep the attack up, but our sustained attack doesnt lead to wins. Ovi and our skill players win games for us. Thats how we roll.

I see our pinches even at best in goals created and goals allowed, over the past 3 years. Dmen are going to make bad reads and they do. Erskine had a few that lead to goals this spring. Hannan in deep all those times this year, led to one goal.

We need to copy what other teams do. At least try. Its dumb to do the exact same approach next year. When we dont have superman leading the charge, or the PP clicking, our offense is consistently ugly. We are a good skilled team, we dont need Sarge and Alzner and Hannan to go in deep to score goals. We need three forwards WORKING AS ONE, focusing on offense until they can score consistently; quality goals.

Then start making forwards and defensemen interchangeable. But we are far away from pulling that off, and trying, its ugly. Is anyone here happy with our offense at ES or PP?

We were a well polished machine after the Clark trade, for a month or two. We cant even come close to that anymore. That is when we peaked under Bruce.

RandyHolt is online now  
Old
06-13-2011, 08:34 PM
  #545
txpd
Registered User
 
txpd's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2003
Posts: 43,818
vCash: 500
the more team's pack their 5 players down low, the more critical even defensive defensemen are going to be in the offense. otherwise its 3 against 5 anymore.

txpd is offline  
Old
06-13-2011, 08:35 PM
  #546
EroCaps
Registered User
 
EroCaps's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2003
Location: Virginia
Country: United States
Posts: 15,474
vCash: 500
Step 1:

Sign Laich/Alzner. Trade Semin, Schultz and Varlamov for value. Dump Poti. Do everything you can to sign Richards and Kuznetsov. Have several back-up plans for the that cash.

Step 2:

Hope the team flames out before the playoffs this time so they have time to bring in a quality coach.

Step 3:

Success.

EroCaps is offline  
Old
06-13-2011, 09:23 PM
  #547
habsrule22
Registered User
 
habsrule22's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2010
Location: Powassan, Ontario
Country: Canada
Posts: 1,686
vCash: 500
Any word on Brooks Laich, is he gonna sign with washington or become a UFA? What would his salary demand be?

habsrule22 is offline  
Old
06-13-2011, 09:55 PM
  #548
Hivemind
We're Touched
 
Hivemind's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2010
Location: Philadelphia
Posts: 16,044
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by EroCaps View Post
Step 1:

Sign Laich/Alzner. Trade Semin, Schultz and Varlamov for value. Dump Poti. Do everything you can to sign Richards and Kuznetsov. Have several back-up plans for the that cash.

Step 2:

Hope the team flames out before the playoffs this time so they have time to bring in a quality coach.

Step 3:

Success.
Kuznetsov just signed a new contract with Traktor for next season (despite the fact his old one covered next season anyway). Traktor is giving him more money than his previous deal. 0% chance that Kuznetsov plays in NA next year, he's not even coming over for development camp at this point. The deal he signed is only 1 year though, so he could jump over in 2012-2013.

Hivemind is offline  
Old
06-13-2011, 10:02 PM
  #549
Dirtbag59
Registered User
 
Dirtbag59's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2011
Posts: 1,867
vCash: 500
The real question is how much Carlson and Alzner improve next year. It's like would their progress be the equivalent of signing one or two relatively big names.

Dirtbag59 is offline  
Old
06-13-2011, 10:32 PM
  #550
Atlas
Registered User
 
Atlas's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2004
Country: United States
Posts: 3,417
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by EroCaps View Post
Step 1:

Sign Laich/Alzner. Trade Semin, Schultz and Varlamov for value. Dump Poti. Do everything you can to sign Richards and Kuznetsov. Have several back-up plans for the that cash.

Step 2:

Hope the team flames out before the playoffs this time so they have time to bring in a quality coach.

Step 3:

Success.


Yeah. It just seems like the team has been mishandled. There are all these nice assets and a few clunky ones but it doesn't fit together right. My only hope is step 2 there...and they bring in a guy that has an actual coaching strategy. I suppose that works sometimes as a shot in the arm. That'd be more interesting than this year's product.

I'm not sold on trading Green or Semin. I expect Green to thrive under a better coach either in D.C. or for his next team (remember Larry Murphy?). Semin--god who knows about that guy. He doesn't fit but the team is so screwy it's hard to tell.

If they trade Varly I'm really gonna hoot. That kid is a winner. You'll see.

Atlas is offline  
Closed Thread

Forum Jump


Bookmarks

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off



All times are GMT -5. The time now is 06:27 AM.

monitoring_string = "e4251c93e2ba248d29da988d93bf5144"
Contact Us - HFBoards - Archive - Privacy Statement - Terms of Use - Advertise - Top - AdChoices

vBulletin Copyright ©2000 - 2015, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
HFBoards.com is a property of CraveOnline Media, LLC, an Evolve Media, LLC company. 2015 All Rights Reserved.