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06-07-2011, 09:41 AM
  #76
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Originally Posted by txpd View Post
the alternative there was not to take him in the draft and not issue him a roster spot and a budget line.

so, what now? you want to trade him? that has to be what you want, because if he has a 20-25 goal season and he takes his defensive work to another level yet, he's going to earn a nice contract extension during his 3rd season. a contract you obviously would not be in favor of committing to.
You're such a drama queen. Clearly I'm advocating trading him

The alternative is simply to bring in another center.

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06-07-2011, 09:48 AM
  #77
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Madden would be a solid 4C option, particularly in terms of leadership and championship experience. Not quite a 3C but a really strong 4C still.

I would hope that they do more than re-sign BGordon, keep Beagle around as depth and let Eakin, Perreault & Sjogren battle it out for 3C.

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06-07-2011, 10:59 AM
  #78
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Wait a sec. We are talking about a 20 year-old kid, right?

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06-07-2011, 01:32 PM
  #79
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BrooklynCapsFan View Post
You're such a drama queen. Clearly I'm advocating trading him

The alternative is simply to bring in another center.
Admit it though, you'd deal him if the right offer for "another" center came along, right?

(Don't worry about the drama queens and prospect lovers. Just say it. You'll feel a whole lot better, lighter, even cleansed. )


MoJo is a beauty to watch. His skating his sublime and he scores timely goals. But you said it yourself...
Quote:
Originally Posted by BrooklynCapsFan View Post
Ideally you want a great second line center who can put up close to a point per game plus offer intangibles.

MoJo doesn't offer the necessary intangibles that only a select few here seem to understand (despite years of playoff disappointment). He's not a change of pace center in relation to Backstrom.

-VAN has Henrik Sedin, but they wouldn't be where they are without the change of pace #2C, Ryan Kesler.
-CHI has Toews but they also have Bolland (whose return was pivotal for CHI in their series against VAN this playoffs).
-PIT has of course Crosby/Malkin/Staal (unbelievable)
-TBL has Stamkos (and had Richards), but they also have 6'4" Lecavalier
-BOS has Krejci but also Bergeron
-SJ has Pavelski/Couture and also have 6'4" Thornton (they'll be in the finals next season)
-COL had amazing Sakic and true viking Forsberg
-EDM had Gretzky, but they also needed Messier
-and on and on...


MoJo is not a change of pace or a point-producer-with-intangibles 2C IMO. However, MoJo is one of GMGM's most marketable commodities, perhaps enticing enough (with his convenient ELC) as part of package to dislodge a 6'2" Bergeron , killer Backes, pesky Bolland, etc from their respective teams.

GMGM understands the benefits of the "intangibles". He acquired Arnott (fading intangibles notwithstanding) for this reason.

Perhaps he'll be able to get it done in earnest this off-season. A true playoff team hangs in the balance.

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06-07-2011, 02:10 PM
  #80
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If only Vancouver and Chicago had taken this advice and dealt away 20 year old unfinished articles Kesler and Bolland when they had the chance...

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06-07-2011, 02:16 PM
  #81
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BrooklynCapsFan View Post
You're such a drama queen. Clearly I'm advocating trading him

The alternative is simply to bring in another center.
slurs are not necessary. cut it out.

the alternative is not simple. bring what kind of center? if you dont trust johansson as the 2c because of his head, then you must want a 2c. then johansso is playing out of position because you dont trust him with the place on the roster he has earned.

when he is due a contract extension at a 2c salary, i would have to guess that you would not approve of that either as his injury history doesnt wash away after a couple of healthy seasons.

where am i wrong?

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06-07-2011, 02:18 PM
  #82
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Drama queen is a slur?

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06-07-2011, 02:19 PM
  #83
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Drama queen is a slur?
I thought it was a term of endearment.

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06-07-2011, 02:23 PM
  #84
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Originally Posted by Langway View Post
Madden would be a solid 4C option, particularly in terms of leadership and championship experience. Not quite a 3C but a really strong 4C still.

I would hope that they do more than re-sign BGordon, keep Beagle around as depth and let Eakin, Perreault & Sjogren battle it out for 3C.
the idea of backstrom, johansson, perreault-sjogren-eakin, and gordon/beagle doesnt bring a lot of confidence.

i'd really like to see a 30+ year old playoff warhorse for the 3c spot. i am not sure marty reasoner is the guy. he hasnt been in the playoffs in ten years and has only been as far as the 2nd round once. if he was the option, i'd rather keep arnott and baby him thru the season.

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06-07-2011, 02:42 PM
  #85
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Quote:
Originally Posted by txpd View Post
slurs are not necessary. cut it out.

the alternative is not simple. bring what kind of center? if you dont trust johansson as the 2c because of his head, then you must want a 2c. then johansso is playing out of position because you dont trust him with the place on the roster he has earned.

when he is due a contract extension at a 2c salary, i would have to guess that you would not approve of that either as his injury history doesnt wash away after a couple of healthy seasons.

where am i wrong?
You're wrong in that you haven't read anything I've written in here.

1. I don't think Johansson has 2c upside.
2. He has done nothing to "earn" the 2c spot.
3. Because of 1 and 2 I'm not worried about him making $5 million on his next contract.

I'm guessing that at his peak, Mjo is a defensively excellent 25-25 center. A Legwand clone. I think we need a 2nd line center. Even if Mjo exceeds my projections down the line, do you really expect him to be a competent 2c on a contending team as soon as next year?

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06-07-2011, 02:50 PM
  #86
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Originally Posted by BrooklynCapsFan View Post
You're wrong in that you haven't read anything I've written in here.

1. I don't think Johansson has 2c upside because IMO 2c's should really be 1c's and for that matter 3c's should really be 2c's, and 4c's really 3c's.
Fixed that for you...

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06-07-2011, 02:51 PM
  #87
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BrooklynCapsFan View Post
You're wrong in that you haven't read anything I've written in here.

1. I don't think Johansson has 2c upside.
2. He has done nothing to "earn" the 2c spot.
3. Because of 1 and 2 I'm not worried about him making $5 million on his next contract.

I'm guessing that at his peak, Mjo is a defensively excellent 25-25 center. A Legwand clone. I think we need a 2nd line center. Even if Mjo exceeds my projections down the line, do you really expect him to be a competent 2c on a contending team as soon as next year?
A defensively excellent 25-25 center is most certainly a 2C. That would have been good for 34th (tie) in points amongst centers and 13th (tie) in goals.

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06-07-2011, 02:56 PM
  #88
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Fixed that for you...
I guess it all depends on whether you want to compete with Pittsburgh or Long Island.

Or if you want to try once more to charge into the postseason with stacked wingers as opposed to centers, defensemen or goalies.

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06-07-2011, 02:59 PM
  #89
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I think BCF is just wanting his team to be strong down the C and if MoJo is 3C for the next few years then this team is really doing well.

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06-07-2011, 02:59 PM
  #90
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Or if you want to try once more to charge into the postseason with stacked wingers as opposed to centers, defensemen or goalies.
Yes because the reason the Caps have failed in the post season the last couple of seasons is because of the positions their best players play. If Ovechkin or Semin were natural centerman we'd all be admiring their rings...

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06-07-2011, 03:04 PM
  #91
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Originally Posted by NobodyBeatsTheWiz View Post
A defensively excellent 25-25 center is most certainly a 2C. That would have been good for 34th (tie) in points amongst centers and 13th (tie) in goals.
Do you expect that from him as soon as next year?

Further, Vancouver, Philadelphia, Tampa, Boston, and Dallas have 2 men in the top 30. San Jose and Carolina have 3. Being a top 60 player doesn't make you an ideal 2nd liner.

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06-07-2011, 03:07 PM
  #92
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BrooklynCapsFan View Post
Do you expect that from him as soon as next year?

Further, Vancouver, Philadelphia, Tampa, Boston, and Dallas have 2 men in the top 30. San Jose and Carolina have 3. Being a top 60 player doesn't make you an ideal 2nd liner.
If you're top 60 in points and excellent defensively, you're a 2nd line center.

No, I don't expect him to be that player next year. But I don't see what other options are out there, whereas there are plenty of options for the 3C.

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06-07-2011, 03:07 PM
  #93
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On man I remember one poster trying to convince us that Semin could be our #2C like 2 seasons ago. The thought is just funny.

On topic: I don't know where I fall on this issue. Its hard to image any 2C upgrade with Semin on the roster. You have to roll with youth somewhere in a cap world with a 9.5M player and MoJo is a capable player.

I'd rather stock the defense. Solid Def Dman, ala Hannan, who communicates, teaches, takes good penalties, plays hard/honest, and is versatile enough to play RD is a huge bonus on a team with Green, Wides, and JC. Words can't explain how important that guy was IMHO.

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06-07-2011, 03:09 PM
  #94
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I am pretty sure that person that wanted Semin to play center was George McPhee. He, or Bruce, or both of them. Semin refuses; all IIRC.

Dont laugh too hard, the day of the big burly center is slowly fading into the sunset of what was once a much more physical NHL.

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06-07-2011, 03:10 PM
  #95
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I think Mojo has the skill, but not the strength and grit he'll need as a 2c. The one thing I noticed in the playoffs was contact averse he was...and how much stronger he seemingly needs to get.

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06-07-2011, 03:14 PM
  #96
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Originally Posted by BrooklynCapsFan View Post
Do you expect that from him as soon as next year?

Further, Vancouver, Philadelphia, Tampa, Boston, and Dallas have 2 men in the top 30. San Jose and Carolina have 3. Being a top 60 player doesn't make you an ideal 2nd liner.
And being strong down the middle doesn't make you necessarily even a playoff team. So where do we go from here...?

If Backstrom gets back to close to his best and Johansson can be a 50 point guy they are fine down the middle IMO. The bigger if in that hypothetical is Backstrom IMO...

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06-07-2011, 03:20 PM
  #97
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And being strong down the middle doesn't make you necessarily even a playoff team. So where do we go from here...?

If Backstrom gets back to close to his best and Johansson can be a 50 point guy they are fine down the middle IMO. The bigger if in that hypothetical is Backstrom IMO...
Alternatively, you could take away that the 4 conference finalists all had multiple centers finish top 30 in points.

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06-07-2011, 03:23 PM
  #98
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Originally Posted by BrooklynCapsFan View Post
Alternatively, you could take away that the 4 conference finalists all had multiple centers finish top 30 in points.
So if Johansson can step it up and get in the top 30 we are good then...

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06-07-2011, 03:27 PM
  #99
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So if Johansson can step it up and get in the top 30 we are good then...
Most definitely. If he hits 54 points next year we should be a very good team.

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06-07-2011, 03:45 PM
  #100
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Originally Posted by BrooklynCapsFan View Post
Most definitely. If he hits 54 points next year we should be a very good team.
And I think that is a reasonable expectation for him if all the young guns don't have poor years again next year. He did have 20 points in his last 40 regular season games and 6 points in 9 playoffs games as a 20 year old rookie in his first season of North American hockey with the 4 big offensive stars of the team not playing anywhere close to expectations for the most part.

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