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Jackets shopping the 8th Overall. PHI, EDM interested?

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Old
06-09-2011, 04:42 PM
  #151
knucklepuck28
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CAPGEEK.COM CAP CALCULATOR

FORWARDS
Kristian Huselius ($4.750m) / Jeff Carter ($5.272m) / Rick Nash ($7.800m)
Jussi Jokinen ($4.000m) / Derick Brassard ($3.200m) / R.J. Umberger ($3.750m)
Antoine Vermette ($3.750m) / Ryan Johansen ($1.945m) / Matt Calvert ($0.891m)
Derek MacKenzie ($0.600m) / Samuel Pahlsson ($2.650m) / Derek Dorsett ($0.562m)
/ / Jared Boll ($0.725m)

DEFENSEMEN
Christian Ehrhoff ($5.000m) / Marc Methot ($1.700m)
Anton Babchuk ($2.400m) / Grant Clitsome ($1.000m)
Fedor Tyutin ($2.843m) / Kris Russell ($1.300m)
David Savard ($0.916m)

GOALTENDERS
Steve Mason ($2.900m) / Mathieu Garon ($1.200m)

BUYOUTS: Duvie Westcott ($0.616m)

CAPGEEK.COM TOTALS (follow @capgeek on Twitter)
(these totals are compiled without the bonus cushion)
SALARY CAP: $62,000,000; CAP PAYROLL: $59,774,143; BONUSES: $1,397,500
CAP SPACE (22-man roster): $2,225,857

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Old
06-09-2011, 06:33 PM
  #152
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All this theoretical talk about center depth and lineups have really set me up for a severe depression when Carter is traded to another team and Howson admits he was 'never really in it.'

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06-09-2011, 06:45 PM
  #153
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Hahaha - we're stilllll paying Duvie.

By the way....welcome Knucklepuck!

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Old
06-09-2011, 07:28 PM
  #154
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Originally Posted by Goaliemon89 View Post
Hahaha - we're stilllll paying Duvie.
Something for you to look forward to when we buy Commie out.

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06-09-2011, 08:37 PM
  #155
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Originally Posted by Samkow View Post
Agree with your dream, having an AHL level defense is surprisingly underrated.
totally what i thought... lol

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06-09-2011, 09:47 PM
  #156
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Quote:
Originally Posted by hip check View Post
All this theoretical talk about center depth and lineups have really set me up for a severe depression when Carter is traded to another team and Howson admits he was 'never really in it.'
Arguably, we already have center depth.

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06-09-2011, 09:58 PM
  #157
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Viqsi View Post
Arguably, we already have center depth.
We have just enough of some of the wrong things.... If that's depth, we have it..... However, since we have RJ we kind of have depth. Just not good depth.

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06-09-2011, 11:55 PM
  #158
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knucklepuck28-

replace garon with theodore at 1.5m...and I'm totally on board with that lineup...

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06-10-2011, 12:01 AM
  #159
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Fro View Post
knucklepuck28-

replace garon with theodore at 1.5m...and I'm totally on board with that lineup...
You could even dump Pahlsson to make up for Commodore's buy out hit, move MacKenzie to 4th line center and I'm good with it.

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06-10-2011, 12:07 AM
  #160
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Random thoughts.

- A deal with Philly won't be done before the draft unless it's very heavily tilted toward Columbus. Philly has a guy that they're undoubtedly targeting, and Columbus does as well (not the same guy, obviously, and I have a pretty good idea of who each is). If the CBJ target is off the board, the deal gets done if Philly's guy is still there (which he should be). If Philly's target is off the board, there's probably a backup deal being put together. If both Philly's and the CBJ's target is off the board, the pick may well be moved elsewhere for something that no one's expecting. Where it would get very interesting is if both targets are still on the board.

- Mason is still slated to be the starter going into next season. The team didn't "resign" one goalie coach and then hire a new one in order to have him start on someone entirely new. I'd also expect him to spend a decent amount of time on Allen York in Springfield, who's come a long way in a short period of time.

- This draft has serious "interesting" or "weird" potential for Columbus. Notice that there's been almost nothing circulating about picking up a defenseman via trade, even though Scott Howson himself has basically said that upgrading there is a an absolute priority.

- I stand by what I've said previously. Of Clitsome, Russell, and Stralman, I'd be very surprised if more than one of those three is back next year. They're all basically the same guy: a third-pairing defenseman who generates some offense.

- Antoine Vermette cannot play the wing. He's one of those guys who has to be in rhythm and timing to be effective, and creates his own up the middle. On the wing, he has the rhythm and timing of a Gore/Lieberman high-five.

- Barring an absolutely monstrous camp, don't expect there to be more than one truly young defenseman on the opening day roster. That would be Holden, Moore, and Savard.


Last edited by Palinka: 06-10-2011 at 12:19 AM.
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Old
06-10-2011, 12:09 AM
  #161
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If the Carter deal goes through, I'd like to be the first to point out that Jeff Carter would be the SECOND best Carter the Jackets have ever had.

He's good, but he's no Anson Carter.

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06-10-2011, 12:37 AM
  #162
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Nanabijou View Post
Maybe it's just me and that I'm really cheap, but buying out a player just bugs me. Paying someone like Commodore millions of dollars for him not to play for us over the next 4 years drives me nuts.

Anybody got any proposals that would conceivably involve Commie? Well it likely means taking on a bad contract, maybe we can get someone who can contribute something, even if they are overpaid.
Besides loaning him somewhere rather than buying him out?

I'm also of the opinion that buyouts are not optimal. There's always a chance that he's given another year under this contract (thus burning an additional buyout year), with the chance that 2012 CBA alterations adjust the buyout clauses. Of course, that would be a gamble.

If he were bought out this year, the payouts would look like this:
2011-12 - $1.141 million actual salary, $1.391 million cap hit
2012-13 - $1.141 million actual salary, $1.541 million cap hit
2013-14 - $1.141 million actual salary, $1.141 million cap hit
2014-15 - $1.141 million actual salary, $1.141 million cap hit
Total - $4.566 million actual salary, four years on the cap

If it were done next year...
2011-12 - $3.750 million actual salary, ????? cap hit
2012-13 - $1.117 million actual salary, $1.516 million cap hit
2013-14 - $1.117 million actual salary, $1.117 million cap hit
Total - $5.984 million actual salary, two or maybe three years on the cap. If he's buried in the minors or loaned overseas, the cap hit is negated. There are also circumstances where his contract could be voided, although it would take a lot (especially since a guy in the AHL or on loan on a one-way deal makes more than in the NHL).

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Old
06-10-2011, 12:45 AM
  #163
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Roadman View Post
Voracek and/or 8th and/or some combination for top pairing D.

Burns?? Letang??

Plus UFA(s)

Blueline is priority. The Carter thing is an opportunity.
Exactly we can play good without Carter but not without supporting defense. I prefer the trade Voráček/Russell + 2nd/1st round pick for Burns.

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Old
06-10-2011, 06:22 AM
  #164
Matt Foley
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Palinka View Post
- Antoine Vermette cannot play the wing. He's one of those guys who has to be in rhythm and timing to be effective, and creates his own up the middle. On the wing, he has the rhythm and timing of a Gore/Lieberman high-five.
It's also kind of like saying that Alex Van Halen needs to be the drummer and not a dancer in the music video.


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Old
06-10-2011, 10:04 AM
  #165
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Palinka View Post
- A deal with Philly won't be done before the draft unless it's very heavily tilted toward Columbus. Philly has a guy that they're undoubtedly targeting, and Columbus does as well (not the same guy, obviously, and I have a pretty good idea of who each is). If the CBJ target is off the board, the deal gets done if Philly's guy is still there (which he should be). If Philly's target is off the board, there's probably a backup deal being put together. If both Philly's and the CBJ's target is off the board, the pick may well be moved elsewhere for something that no one's expecting. Where it would get very interesting is if both targets are still on the board.
Assuming we haven't made any other moves and Carter is actually a target (and Philly is willing to drop him), why the hell would we care who is on the board? Since you didn't mention the name, if you actually do have any clue what people are thinking I'm going to assume there other other roster moves in the works or Carter is not a consideration at this point.

Quote:
- This draft has serious "interesting" or "weird" potential for Columbus. Notice that there's been almost nothing circulating about picking up a defenseman via trade, even though Scott Howson himself has basically said that upgrading there is a an absolute priority.
Seeing ghosts in the mirror? We've been linked to one real rumor, why would any of us find it weird we aren't liked to others? Even on the defensive end. The Jackets not being rumored to anything on the trade front isn't unusual, even with his "priorities". Would would have to show me these "absolute priority" comments. He's been too busy blowing smoke up our you know whats the last two years saying he would be fine going into the regular season with what he has.

Quote:
- I stand by what I've said previously. Of Clitsome, Russell, and Stralman, I'd be very surprised if more than one of those three is back next year. They're all basically the same guy: a third-pairing defenseman who generates some offense.
Stralman blows more then he's good. Russ hasn't done crap with his ice time. Assuming, again, you have a clue what's going on it Howson's head, there is really only one choice.

Quote:
- Antoine Vermette cannot play the wing. He's one of those guys who has to be in rhythm and timing to be effective, and creates his own up the middle. On the wing, he has the rhythm and timing of a Gore/Lieberman high-five.
Arguably he wasn't that effective at center last year. Hell a lot of our wings weren't really all that effective. What the hell do I care? You trying to say the bar to reach what Juice did last year would be all that hard? Hell, playing effective in two zones would be an improvement what he did in the offensive zone would just be icing on the cake.

Quote:
- Barring an absolutely monstrous camp, don't expect there to be more than one truly young defenseman on the opening day roster. That would be Holden, Moore, and Savard.
Forgetting injuries?


Last edited by blahblah: 06-10-2011 at 10:46 AM.
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Old
06-10-2011, 10:57 AM
  #166
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Crede777 View Post
If the Carter deal goes through, I'd like to be the first to point out that Jeff Carter would be the SECOND best Carter the Jackets have ever had.

He's good, but he's no Anson Carter.
We'll never know for sure but I bet Anson Carter was the determining factor (of many) when McConnell fired MacLean.

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06-10-2011, 11:33 AM
  #167
hip check
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Viqsi View Post
Arguably, we already have center depth.
You are right. Technically yes we have enough centers to cover an NHL club. Perhaps depth wasn't the right word. I should have said inserting Carter would make center depth a value, not just players playing higher in the lineup then they should be.

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06-10-2011, 12:00 PM
  #168
KallioWeHardlyKnewYe
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So says this Flyers fan:
http://hfboards.com/showthread.php?p...2#post33546382

Quote:
Originally Posted by Bennysflyers16 View Post
Last Saturday I played in a local minor celebrity golf tourney, my celebrity was Curt Keilback, freaking awesome for any old Jets fan. On one of the holes there was a back log and the group waiting to tee off had Mike Keane and Scott Arniel in it. I played with Keane the year before so we had a quick conversation. Before any of these rumours I asked Arniel about Carter/Carle for picks to get space for a goalie.

His quick reply was as far as he knew Carter was 100% not available and when I joked that Carle sucked, his reply was he would take Carle in a second on his team and that he did not suck. He also thought our goalies would be Bryz/Bob. I forgot I asked him what he thought about Ericcson being released, but in my drunken stooper I forgot what he said

I was drunk, so he could of just been playing along, but the impression I got was that he was a big fan of Carle ?

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06-10-2011, 12:10 PM
  #169
Viqsi
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The "Don't Trade Anyone On The Roster" Plan:
* Sign Christian Ehrhoff for something silly. I assumed $26 mil over five years.
* Pick up Jose Theodore to back up Mason ($3m/2yr, as usual)
* Trade picks and prospects for Matt Carle. I like sending 'em Goloubef straight up, myself.
* Assume Mayorov is going to make the team, and be prepared if Johansen does.
* Buy out Commodore.

Lo, the roster transformeth as follows:


CAPGEEK.COM CAP CALCULATOR

FORWARDS
Rick Nash ($7.800m) / Derick Brassard ($3.200m) / Jakub Voracek ($2.500m)
Kristian Huselius ($4.750m) / Ryan Johansen ($1.945m) / R.J. Umberger ($3.750m)
Matt Calvert ($0.891m) / Antoine Vermette ($3.750m) / Maxim Mayorov ($0.862m)
Derek MacKenzie ($0.600m) / Samuel Pahlsson ($2.650m) / Derek Dorsett ($0.562m)
Jared Boll ($0.725m) / Kyle Wilson ($0.700m)

DEFENSEMEN
Fedor Tyutin ($2.843m) / Christian Ehrhoff ($5.200m)
Marc Methot ($1.666m) / Matt Carle ($3.437m)
Grant Clitsome ($0.850m) / Kris Russell ($1.300m)
Sami Lepisto ($0.900m) /
(Commie Buyout) ($1.391m)

GOALTENDERS
Steve Mason ($2.900m) / Jose Theodore ($1.500m)

BUYOUTS: Duvie Westcott ($0.616m)

CAPGEEK.COM TOTALS (follow @capgeek on Twitter)
(these totals are compiled without the bonus cushion)
SALARY CAP: $62,200,000; CAP PAYROLL: $57,292,917; BONUSES: $1,350,000
CAP SPACE (24-man roster): $4,907,083


Would fall apart if Ehrhoff doesn't come here. I don't think I trust any other UFA defenseman to help carry this team's top pairing the way we'd be trusting him in this scenario. So it's kind of fragile, but it's otherwise nice.

Wilson's a placeholder for pretty much any depth forward; I considered suggesting signing Derek Meech (who also can play LW) so that we could move MacKenzie to center and have ourselves a Derek Line (Meech-MacKenzie-Dorsett), but I restrained myself.

Lepisto could also be replaced by any depth defenseman, although I think Sami himself would be a good choice.

I'd love to find a taker for Pahlsson, but don't know what the likely return would be. If Johansen proves himself not NHL-ready, MacKenzie hops up to center the third line and we grab ourselves a depth winger, or consider promoting someone else.

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06-10-2011, 01:00 PM
  #170
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Double-Shift Lassé View Post
Sign a 'tweener type winger (or trade for Tyler Kennedy's rights).
I'll be honest, unless trading Brassard (by himself or in a package) for a good top pairing defenseman can be accomplished, and if you've decided that, upon acquiring Jeff Carter, you need to trade a center, I work long and hard to find a new home for Sammy Pahlsson.

I've beaten the "slowly-with-Johansen" drum repeatedly this offseason, and this won't be the first time I've posted that I like:
Carter
Brassard
Vermette
Johansen/MacKenzie

to start the season anyway.
I am in complete agreement. I don't have high hopes for getting Carter to the CBJ, however, if the situation presents itself I think you have to look to move Pahlsson. That really gives time for Johansen to develop at his own pace rather than our (The fans) pace Mac can play wing too and double in for faceoffs.

Granted we need to find a way to improve the defense but I'm holding out hope that we can have some success with UFA's this year. My biggest concern is that by trading the 8th and Voracek (I'm assuming this to be the case for Carter) we lose two big bargaining chips in one deal (a good one and I do it but it leaves us think with bullets for the d-man/men we need). I'm also willing to bet they shop Juice at the draft which means they better either have very high confidence that Filatov can fit the bill in the top 6 or sign a guy like Fleishmann or Lieno.

Need to shift the focus to defense though. That's a big achiles heal right now!

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06-10-2011, 01:31 PM
  #171
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if the 8th goes to the oilers for one of hemsky or gilbert i am going to be the crankiest camper
You won't be getting Hemsky for the #8, Gilbert maybe. #8 picks are anything but sure things, just saying. Not trying to come in here all high and mighty but the oilers won't be getting rid of Hemsky for anything less than a sure fire prospect. The only guy on your team would be Ryan Johansen but Im assuming he's not on the table, this would be if Hemsky was not a UFA after next season.

I don't think there's a trade between these two teams.

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06-10-2011, 01:39 PM
  #172
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People REALLY dont get what Pahlsson is here for, and what hes all about.

If we make the playoffs with Pahlsson (or if he makes it elsewhere) you will see why hes here. He is a playoff shutdown guy.

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06-10-2011, 01:48 PM
  #173
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Originally Posted by CBJBrassard16 View Post
People REALLY dont get what Pahlsson is here for, and what hes all about.

If we make the playoffs with Pahlsson (or if he makes it elsewhere) you will see why hes here. He is a playoff shutdown guy.
What if we have to trade him to actually get to the playoffs? We all know why he is here, but he isn't helping us get there.

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06-10-2011, 01:51 PM
  #174
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You won't be getting Hemsky for the #8, Gilbert maybe. #8 picks are anything but sure things, just saying. Not trying to come in here all high and mighty but the oilers won't be getting rid of Hemsky for anything less than a sure fire prospect. The only guy on your team would be Ryan Johansen but Im assuming he's not on the table, this would be if Hemsky was not a UFA after next season.

I don't think there's a trade between these two teams.
Please, Hemsky isn't even worth the 8 alone in this draft. Johansen? Yeah, Hemsky couldn't even come close to him in a trade. Dude hasn't even combined for a seasons worth of play since like 09, not to mention his contract doesn't go very much longer and he will be a UFA, get real.

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06-10-2011, 01:51 PM
  #175
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IMO, Sammy has been underwhleming the past 2 seasons in Columbus. Then again, maybe we were just spoiled with Manny.

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