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Rangers will buy out Drury (Brooks: Drury gone, Avery safe; Wolski maybe?)

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Old
06-10-2011, 07:14 PM
  #476
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Originally Posted by Levitate View Post
No, no he wouldn't be. He really would not be.

Dubinsky and Callahan also do a lot for their team (more than Weiss IMO) and at this point are putting up comparable pionts.
When have they ever put up 60 points on a bottom feeding team?

You can use projections, but then the other side of the argument has to be valid as well, and that's Weiss has never had the chance to play on a good team.

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06-10-2011, 07:17 PM
  #477
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Originally Posted by kaneone View Post
But putting up points is what's most important.
Then why has Zherdev struggled to stay in the NHL?

He put up points.

No it's not the most important thing.

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06-10-2011, 07:18 PM
  #478
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Originally Posted by nyr2k2 View Post
Really? I never knew that.



Seriously though, I acknowledged as much in my first response when I said, "even with everything Weiss does better than Gaborik." Again though, I don't think those things outweigh the difference in offensive production. I still think Gaborik is a better player. I think the majority of people would agree.
Well no matter who is better.

Weiss is still a very good player and being undervalued here.

He isn't an elite player, however. And Richards should absolutely still be the target.

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06-10-2011, 07:21 PM
  #479
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Originally Posted by SupersonicMonkey View Post
Then why has Zherdev struggled to stay in the NHL?

He put up points.

No it's not the most important thing.
Because he does literally nothing else when he's not scoring points. And he definitely goes through prolonged stretches of not scoring. You could make the same point about Gaborik, but then Gaborik has always been a productive offensive player. And he doesn't have the attitude concerns that accompany Zherdev.

You've already mentioned Toews, and now Zherdev. Neither have anything to do with a discussion about Gaborik/Dubinsky/Callahan/Weiss. They're all different players with additional variables to consider.

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06-10-2011, 07:28 PM
  #480
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Originally Posted by nyr2k2 View Post
Because he does literally nothing else when he's not scoring points. And he definitely goes through prolonged stretches of not scoring. You could make the same point about Gaborik, but then Gaborik has always been a productive offensive player. And he doesn't have the attitude concerns that accompany Zherdev.

You've already mentioned Toews, and now Zherdev. Neither have anything to do with a discussion about Gaborik/Dubinsky/Callahan/Weiss. They're all different players with additional variables to consider.
Just making a point that good players are not specialists.

Meaning, not just scorers, not just fighters, so on.

Good players do lots of things on the ice.

I used Toews as an example. Because while his stats may not look elite in comparison to some others. He is an elite player.

But you are right... this is a pretty dumb argument. We need Richards. Not Weiss.

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06-11-2011, 01:51 AM
  #481
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still remembered day they signed dru and gomer, how they had a puck flip for the #23, how sather managed to make the gomez contract disappear. the buyout makes sense, but i think im still waiting for slats to do something, dont even know why.
i'd keep wolski at least til 2nd buyout period in august, see if richards comes in.
would've been nice if pronger was on the market now with the stable of d prospects we have but hey....
I wish dru well, slats signed him, that was fine... 35 mil contract...eh not so fine.
The trade with columbus, it would be nice if we could.

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06-11-2011, 02:17 AM
  #482
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Zherdev: 261 pts in 421 games. (0.62 PPG)
Weiss: 333 pts in 557 games. (0.60 PPG)
Gaborik: 571 pts in 640 games. (0.89 PPG)

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06-11-2011, 02:45 AM
  #483
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Originally Posted by RangerBoy View Post
I wonder if the Rangers want to buy him out but can't because of his injury. They probably don't want the guy to sit on LTIR all season and waste a year...

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06-11-2011, 03:07 AM
  #484
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I very highly doubt Drury is injured. Also, like the article said, I don't think Drury will file a grievance claim if the Rangers do try buying out his contract, but it's possible he does.

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06-11-2011, 05:08 AM
  #485
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I'm rarely right about a lot of things, but I called Drury's demise as far back as the fall of 2008.

Really sad, to be honest. This guy went from being one of the game's great leaders and clutch performers to a broken down and lackluster role player.

I'm not going to miss him, his cap hit or his vanishing acts.

Moving forward, I hope the Drury and Redden situations make prospective UFA's ponder the possibility that the millions they receive in salary from the Rangers will not protect them from a degrading and shameful close to a career if they underperform.

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06-11-2011, 08:58 AM
  #486
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Underperforming implies a lack of effort.

You can never accuse Drury of that. He didn't willingly give any less than he always did before he signed.

Age and injury did him in. Factors he had no control over.

In Redden's case, it may have been a combination of age-eroded skills and a lack of effort.

Look at the Mets for a second (I know it's painful). Watch the sheer agony on Jason Bay's face. It's not a lack of effort, desire, conditioning, etc. Who knows what it is but again its perhaps age and injury.

An athlete owes a team his all, You can't give more than that. Drury gave the Rangers that. You can't tell a player that somehow he must overcome the effects of aging (isn't that partly what led to the steroid problem in baseball?). Conditioning and hard workout regimens will only take you so far.

Teams understand this when they give out big contracts to players over 30. As I said in another post regarding Richards: high risk, high reward. If you don't want to gamble on the high reward, than don't take the risk. Don't sign any free agents over 30 to long term deals. Hey, don't sign any free agents at all.

To even hint that Drury underperformed on purpose is a slight against a consummate professional.

Age comes for all athletes. Drury can no longer perform at the NHL level. I hope the Rangers do buy him out. I hope we do sign BR and that he gives us many high quality and injury-free ages of max effort. Chances are he will give us a few before we see diminishing returns. But eventually, these boards will be full of posters bemoaning the cap burden of his contract relative to his performance. Will that be underperforming and the implication of a lack of effort and desire? Don't think so.

As a Mets fan, I can't understand Yankee fans giving Jeter any grief at all. They should just be celebrating the twilight of a great career and appreciated the fact that he is on the field at all. Is he underpeforming and beating himself up for the fact that he may not be "earning" his contract. Don't think so. Let's use underpeforming a bit more carefully and use it for players who "earn" the term. Not with Drury.

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06-11-2011, 09:14 AM
  #487
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Originally Posted by nyr2k2 View Post
Because he does literally nothing else when he's not scoring points. And he definitely goes through prolonged stretches of not scoring. You could make the same point about Gaborik, but then Gaborik has always been a productive offensive player. And he doesn't have the attitude concerns that accompany Zherdev.
You've already mentioned Toews, and now Zherdev. Neither have anything to do with a discussion about Gaborik/Dubinsky/Callahan/Weiss. They're all different players with additional variables to consider.
I lol'd. Why'd you actually answer that he was asking rhetorically because he already knew the answer.

I don't know how valid the gabs comparison is. Gabs is on another two tiers play wise and has a better all around game than Zherdev which I mean Zherdev has no two way game but still I think Gabs when he's tuned in actually plays good D which leads to great offensive chances...when he's not robbing our own damn goalie.

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06-11-2011, 09:28 AM
  #488
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Originally Posted by alkurtz View Post
Underperforming implies a lack of effort.

Teams understand this when they give out big contracts to players over 30. As I said in another post regarding Richards: high risk, high reward. If you don't want to gamble on the high reward, than don't take the risk. Don't sign any free agents over 30 to long term deals. Hey, don't sign any free agents at all.

To even hint that Drury underperformed on purpose is a slight against a consummate professional.

Age comes for all athletes. Drury can no longer perform at the NHL level. I hope the Rangers do buy him out. I hope we do sign BR and that he gives us many high quality and injury-free ages of max effort. Chances are he will give us a few before we see diminishing returns. But eventually, these boards will be full of posters bemoaning the cap burden of his contract relative to his performance. Will that be underperforming and the implication of a lack of effort and desire? Don't think so.

As a Mets fan, I can't understand Yankee fans giving Jeter any grief at all. They should just be celebrating the twilight of a great career and appreciated the fact that he is on the field at all. Is he underpeforming and beating himself up for the fact that he may not be "earning" his contract. Don't think so. Let's use underpeforming a bit more carefully and use it for players who "earn" the term. Not with Drury.
Underperform to me implies performing less than what would be expected of you. He was expected to play at LEAST at the level we signed him for 4 years. he didn't make it a single one except arguably his first year here. he was on an upward trajectory when we signed him, arguably in his absolute prime yet his numbers from 06 decreased his first year here and just went down and down and down to the point he couldn't even play. His motivation or work ethic, age, injury, etc are unimportant when it comes to labeling Drury as underperforming.

Richards is just as much of a risk as Drury. Offensively he's a much better bet but as an all around he's not as good defensively and he's an injury risk now too. He's got a history already. Last year I felt if he could go this year, no injury, hit another 80-90 pts than hell yea move heaven and earth to get him. instead he was concussed and missed essentially two months. I have to now say i don't want Richards for 5 years 7 per. I don't think he's worth it and I certainly didn't think Drury was worth it though i expected much better from him hence the term underperforming because he did not match expectations for performance. If BR can go 2 or 3 years of 80 pts then it was worth it. Even if his last two years he's nearly unplayable. Will we get it from him? I'm scared no we won't.

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06-11-2011, 10:03 AM
  #489
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Jimmy I'd argue the fault lies in the expectations, not in Drury's performance.

Having said that, Richards is a risk, definitely...as yo said, we'd need some big seasons from him for at least 3 years, and if we dont get that we'll have another Drury on our hands. Thing is, I dont see another way of getting a 90 pt player other than waiting on Stephan to become one over the next 3, 4, 5 years, and honestly, I don want to wait that long. At the very least, if Richards starts declining 3 years from now, Stepan will be on the way up along with Anisimov. That should balance it out, at least as far as performance.

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06-11-2011, 10:46 AM
  #490
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if u're waiting for stepan to become a 90 point scorer, unfortunately, i think we'll be waiting a lot more than 3, 4, or even 5 years. i love stepan, but i highly doubt that he'll be a 90 point scorer. he'll double his point total from this year? that means he'd be sandwiched in terms of points between these guys above him: Stamkos-91 points, Sedin-94 points, and these guys below him: Iginla-86 points and Ovechkin-85 points. Even though Ovechkin had a terrible year statistically, the guys below that were Selanne and Zetterberg at 80 points. Right below that was Richards at 77 points, who missed a whole bunch of games.

If u wanna say that Stepan will be a very good center, i can get on board with that. But to say that he'll be a top point scorer and be pushing 90 points, i have serious doubts about that. I hope Stepan ends up being as good as guys like E. Staal or Ribiero, but to expect him to be on the level of Sedin or Stamkos, i just don't see it. I think he needs to put on a little bit of muscle and hope the extra weight doesn't slow him down.

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06-11-2011, 01:28 PM
  #491
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Injuries is not an acceptable excuse for Drury. He had one solid wire-to-wire season as a Ranger, and even that season was a bit of an underachievement when you consider his previous two seasons. Drury's last two seasons as a ranger were disasters. His 2nd season started out as a disaster and he feasted on lesser teams to make his stats look respectable (17 of his 56 points -- 30 pct) came against the Isles, TB and Atlanta)

I didnt want Drury to be a superstar. I wanted him to score big goals, win clutch faceoffs, be a strong leader and make the Rangers a better team than they were before he got there.

None of the above happened with frequency. Therefore, his tenure as a Ranger was a disappointment.

If the report is true, I'm happy he's gone. He serves no purpose on this team.

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06-11-2011, 02:43 PM
  #492
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Of course his time here was a disappointment...even a disaster.

Of course, his time here is over and we are better off without him.

But none of this was his fault. You can't play with a broken finger. You can't play with a torn up knee.

There is only so much you can do to counterbalance the effects of aging.

I could understand the anti-Drury venom if he just "mailed it in," "laughed all the way to the bank," etc. That is not the case here.

These are not just actors in a movie or characters in a video or fantasy game. These are real life human beings. Imagine what it must be like to be a professional athlete (all of whom are genetic freaks of sorts), with physical skills way beyond what most of us are capable of, who have dedicated the lives to their sport and career, who take great pride in what their bodies can do. Imagine coming to the realization that you can't do what you once can, no matter how hard you try or care. It must be incredibly hard to deal with, especially if you are an athlete who always gave his all.

Underachiever? No way. Zherdev was an underachiever. Wolski is an underachiever. Players who waste the skills most of us would die for. An underachiever is someone who doesn't reach his potential.

What was the potential or an older, oft-injured player, with quickly eroding skills? Not very high. Sather paid him based on what he had done in the past. Did he overpay? Of course, big time.

Unless we understand the human side of sports, we miss grasping the human drama inherent in it. All athletes age. All aging athletes are prone to injuries. Again I say that if you don't want to deal with the human aspects of the game, don't sign players after 30. When you do, you are always going to have to deal with aging bodies and deteriorating skills.

Sather paid Drury for a certain skill set and intangibles. It didn't work out. Was it Drury's fault? Did he ever give less than his all? You can't perform when you are hurt. You can't perform the same way you did when you were younger when you body has aged and you are not as quick as you once were.

I'm certainly glad to see him gone. But it's sad. He couldn't do what he was brought here to do. But I certainly value the ethic he brought to the team and the impact he had on our younger players and the example he set.

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06-11-2011, 02:54 PM
  #493
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Thats fine, if Drury tries to play that card then the Rangers should immediately try to throw him on the Long Term Injury reserve list and keep him there for the season, if he is denied then he is not, "injured" enough and they should buy him out imminently.

He will never win a grievance.

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06-11-2011, 04:05 PM
  #494
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Even in 2008-09 when he scored 20 some goals and 50 some points he was going through prolonged scoring droughts--like 15 games without a goal. As much as the age and injuries I think he hit a crossroads where speedwise he just couldn't keep up. I've said this a lot of times and I don't know whether it was the Rangers coaches or Drury's reluctance or a combination of both but apart from faceoffs he wasn't a good fit at center these last few years. I think he would have been better off on the wing--preferrably left wing. He just doesn't distribute the puck or create plays well and speed covering a wide area is important for a center. That's one reason why he had such a hard time creating chemistry with any of his teammates. We never found linemates to play with him consistently for any length of time--and at this point in time the game is up for him here.

IMO he has the right to keep on playing if that's what he wants. I don't wish anything bad for him but I have doubts he is going to be more than a bit player for anyone at this juncture in time. IMO--it would be better if he retired not only for the Rangers but for himself as well.

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06-11-2011, 06:37 PM
  #495
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Really sad, to be honest. This guy went from being one of the game's great leaders and clutch performers to a broken down and lackluster role player.
In ten years we will likely be saying the same thing about Callahan. Those who were fortunate enough to watch Drury's entire career can sit back, and appreciate how good a player he was before the age-factor kicked in. He had a great career. I'd be thrilled to see him stay in our organization, somehow. (off the ice, obviously )

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06-11-2011, 07:11 PM
  #496
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Originally Posted by Boom Boom Geoffrion View Post
In ten years we will likely be saying the same thing about Callahan. Those who were fortunate enough to watch Drury's entire career can sit back, and appreciate how good a player he was before the age-factor kicked in. He had a great career. I'd be thrilled to see him stay in our organization, somehow. (off the ice, obviously )
Unfortunately, I agree with you. Callahan's playing style will get him injured annually and he'll decline similar to Drury.

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06-11-2011, 07:17 PM
  #497
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Originally Posted by kaneone View Post
Zherdev: 261 pts in 421 games. (0.62 PPG)
Weiss: 333 pts in 557 games. (0.60 PPG)
Gaborik: 571 pts in 640 games. (0.89 PPG)
Again. Points are not everything.

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06-11-2011, 08:18 PM
  #498
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Again. Points are not everything.
Agreed. I haven't read the thread but basically the numbers should indicate that zherdev is even better than Weiss and I'm assuming thats what the other guy was saying. What you have to consider is the other facets of the game like puck possession and what those players do away from the puck. Zherdev disappears ALL the time for long stretches of time. And its almost the same case for gaborik except I still think he is a threat when hes not scoring because hes quick and his shot is lethal. I think Weiss is a solid player.

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06-12-2011, 04:59 AM
  #499
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Larry Brooks

Quote:
The Blueshirts, by the way, are all but certain to file for salary arbitration against one of their eligible impending Group II free agents as a mechanism to trigger a second buyout period in August.
Read more: http://www.nypost.com/p/sports/more_...#ixzz1P3NXQW9Z

But one arbitration case doesn't trigger the window for the 2nd buyout period. A player elected and a club elected arbitration case opens up the 2nd window

Quote:
11.18 Ordinary Course Buy-Outs Outside the Regular Period. Clubs shall have the
right to exercise Ordinary Course Buy-Outs outside the regular period for Ordinary
Course Buy-Outs in accordance with Paragraph 13(c)(ii) of the SPC. Each Club shall be
limited to no more than three (3) such buyouts over the term of this Agreement pursuant
to Paragraph 13(c)(ii) of the SPC. However, in the event that a Club has only one salary
arbitration hearing pursuant to Section 12.3(a) in a given League Year, such Club shall
not be entitled to exercise such a buyout outside the regular period for Ordinary Course
Buy-Outs. No Club shall exercise an Ordinary Course Buy-out outside the regular period
for any Player earning less than $1 million.
Paragraph 13(c)(ii)

Quote:
(ii) For Clubs who have Club or Player elected Salary Arbitration filings
pursuant to Article 12, within the forty-eight (48) hour period beginning on the third day
following the later of: (i) the Club's receipt of its last salary arbitration award; or (ii) settlement
of its last case (provided such award was received or such settlement occurred after 7:00 p.m.
New York time; awards or settlements that occurred or were received after 7:00 p.m. New York
time will be deemed to have occurred or received the following business day for purposes of this
provision).
Complete paragraph 13

Quote:
(c) The notice of termination shall be effective if given in the form attached as
Exhibit 20, with a copy faxed to the NHLPA and Central Registry as follows:

(i) beginning the later of June 15 or forty-eight (48) hours after the
conclusion of the Stanley Cup Finals and ending at 5:00 p.m. New York time on June 30; and

(ii) For Clubs who have Club or Player elected Salary Arbitration filings
pursuant to Article 12, within the forty-eight (48) hour period beginning on the third day
following the later of: (i) the Club's receipt of its last salary arbitration award; or (ii) settlement
of its last case (provided such award was received or such settlement occurred after 7:00 p.m.
New York time; awards or settlements that occurred or were received after 7:00 p.m. New York
time will be deemed to have occurred or received the following business day for purposes of this
provision).
Its not really August. 48 hours after the club's last arbitration case is settled. A Ranger player files and the Rangers file. The last case could be settled before the hearings even begin in late July. They begin July 20-21.

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06-12-2011, 06:06 AM
  #500
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A possible game 7 on Wednesday will force the buyout period to begin on Friday

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Later of June 15
or 48 hours after conclusion of
Stanley Cup Finals
Moratorium on New SPCs Begins
First Buy-Out Period Begins
Deadline for First Club-Elected Salary Arbitration
Notification (5:00 p.m. New York time)
Draft in 12 days

QO's due two weeks from tomorrow

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