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Off Season Thread. Trade Spec/GM Mode - Part III

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Old
06-25-2011, 08:15 AM
  #601
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Originally Posted by Whitesnake View Post
While you can't give them away, I just hope Gauthier thinks of talking to teams in need of attaining the cap floor. Just to see if there is some interest for Gomez and Spacek...
FLA have just acquired Brian Campbell. So yes there is hope.

But for this year only, our dump target is Spacek. Unless we trade or sign another center, Gomez is still the most assured and viable solution.

Now, if Spacek goes and we sign Hammer for less than Spacek's cap hit I will build a statue of PG in my backyard.

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06-25-2011, 08:20 AM
  #602
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FLA have just acquired Brian Campbell. So yes there is hope.

But for this year only, our dump target is Spacek. Unless we trade or sign another center, Gomez is still the most assured and viable solution.

Now, if Spacek goes and we sign Hammer for less than Spacek's cap hit I will build a statue of PG in my backyard.
Spacek we should definitely do it even if we have to add a low end prospect(Carle?).

I think the best move we can make for Gomez is to stand pat for a year.

1-because there are not very many good alternatives
2-because he will be ultra motivated to bounce back(see 2009-2010 Plekanec)
3-next summer he could be worth a decent return to a cap floor team with a 10 mil salary plus a 14.7 mil cap hit.

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06-25-2011, 08:31 AM
  #603
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I was thinking that we should try to sign Wizniesky or trade him at the draft.

If he is signed we could always trade him and have something in return in one year.

anyway... right now the habs look like that :

Cammalleri Plekanec Desharnais
Pacioretty Gomez Gionta
Pouliot Eller Kostitsyn
Moen Darche White, Pyatt

Markov Emelin
Gill Subban
Spacek Gorges

weber, diaz

We are already almost complete... But I don t think we re there yet

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06-25-2011, 08:33 AM
  #604
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Originally Posted by Carey Price View Post
Spacek we should definitely do it even if we have to add a low end prospect(Carle?).

I think the best move we can make for Gomez is to stand pat for a year.

1-because there are not very many good alternatives
2-because he will be ultra motivated to bounce back(see 2009-2010 Plekanec)
3-next summer he could be worth a decent return to a cap floor team with a 10 mil salary plus a 14.7 mil cap hit.
As much as it pains me to admit it. This is true. Unless we have a plan for B. Richards, but even then that's iffy because you can't exactly trade Gomez before you know you can sign him.

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06-25-2011, 09:10 AM
  #605
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You CAN trade Gomez... it s just a big risk because want it or not, the Gomez line is a line that is hard to play against et he is taking te big minutes for the habs right now.

Giving these minutes to a Eller or a Desharnais is risky but it could also pay big. We won t ever know if they are ready to take those minutes if we are not trying them there and we won t be able to try them there if Gomez is still a habs.

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06-25-2011, 09:14 AM
  #606
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Originally Posted by durojean View Post
You CAN trade Gomez... it s just a big risk because want it or not, the Gomez line is a line that is hard to play against et he is taking te big minutes for the habs right now.

Giving these minutes to a Eller or a Desharnais is risky but it could also pay big. We won t ever know if they are ready to take those minutes if we are not trying them there and we won t be able to try them there if Gomez is still a habs.
Fla acquiring Campbell takes away one destination of a team getting to the cap floor.I can't believe 'Hawks dumped that contract.What a coup for themChicago

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06-25-2011, 09:22 AM
  #607
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Fla acquiring Campbell takes away one destination of a team getting to the cap floor.I can't believe 'Hawks dumped that contract.What a coup for themChicago
Why? Florida gained 4 mil in cap hit...they can still add a lot...and they are a no go for most top UFA's.

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06-25-2011, 09:27 AM
  #608
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on the main board, they are saying the Habs are trying to move Wiz for a 2nd, either Det or Minny?

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06-25-2011, 09:29 AM
  #609
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I think it s also a good deal for Florida. Campbell is a player I always like and I think he is a good comparable to Markov.

There is a reason he had this salary and at the time it didn t look like a bad contract for anyone because he was and I think Campbell is still a premiere defencemen in the league.

Florida will have a good puck moving defencemen and a good veteran presence to surround all the prospect they have

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06-25-2011, 09:57 AM
  #610
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Originally Posted by durojean View Post
I think it s also a good deal for Florida. Campbell is a player I always like and I think he is a good comparable to Markov.

There is a reason he had this salary and at the time it didn t look like a bad contract for anyone because he was and I think Campbell is still a premiere defencemen in the league.

Florida will have a good puck moving defencemen and a good veteran presence to surround all the prospect they have
The one thing I don't understand is why Campbell would agree to the trade. Who cares if it was Tallon who originally gave him his contract. Florida has no chance to win in the next 3 years. I mean Chicago's window has closed quite a bit in terms of winning again but its still better than Florida.

I guess he just wasn't feeling it in Chicago anymore. He really improved his defensive game last year though.

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06-25-2011, 09:59 AM
  #611
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Originally Posted by BLONG7 View Post
on the main board, they are saying the Habs are trying to move Wiz for a 2nd, either Det or Minny?
Again, am I blind but where's Minny's 2nd rounder?

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06-25-2011, 11:16 AM
  #612
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I am not sure why people want to trade Gomez right now. Now, is not the time to trade him, its really a perfect storm for the club. He wants to prove last year was not the norm, and I think he will do it. And if he does, he becomes even more of a trade-able asset for us if we wish to go that avenue. We have Pleks-Gomez-Eller, sign a Talbot, and we have a very strong center corps, which IMO is the most important forward position in the playoffs. This is the time to keep Gomez.

The time to trade Gomez would be next off-season. Two years left on his salary:

$5.5 million
$4.5 million

His cap hit remains $7.3 and change, but who cares? The salary cap is so high right now, there are a number of teams that could take that on. He becomes a viable asset to trade next off-season to a smaller market team, especially if he has a good year this year.

You don't move Gomez unless you have a strong viable replacement ready to come in NOW. Montreal is looking good this season, you don't throw your strong center depth out the window just to get rid of a contract that isn't even really hurting you.

We have a good thing going here, good chemistry, and good balance down the lineup. Use the 15 million we have less to fill in the rest of our lineup and add a piece that will help us this year. This is not the time to make drastic changes.
Agree, a bounce back season this year with a declining salary the Habs should be able to get some assets back for him. The Habs need to give more responsibility to Eller this year, and as the season goes on keep increasing it. Testing him on the PP, and against tougher competition with higher line mates. Will really give the team an idea if he is ready for full time top 6 duty the following season. He showed flashes last year, if he gets stronger I believe he will take another step forward and be ready for top 6 at the end of the season. Hope so anyways.

For this summer, the Habs need another top 4 dman. If they're not going to re-sign Wiz they need to be active on July 1. A short term RW like Vrbata or Miettinen would be good, especially if Laich's price gets too high.

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06-25-2011, 11:49 AM
  #613
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Originally Posted by macavoy View Post
The one thing I don't understand is why Campbell would agree to the trade. Who cares if it was Tallon who originally gave him his contract. Florida has no chance to win in the next 3 years. I mean Chicago's window has closed quite a bit in terms of winning again but its still better than Florida.

I guess he just wasn't feeling it in Chicago anymore. He really improved his defensive game last year though.
Nice weather + No state income tax? He's already got a cup ring so it's not that terrible of a situation for him, I guess.

Either way, the fact that Chicago managed to deal Campbell lends hope that Spacek and Gomez could actually be traded as well!

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06-25-2011, 12:00 PM
  #614
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Either way, the fact that Chicago managed to deal Campbell lends hope that Spacek and Gomez could actually be traded as well!
Your overlooking the fact that Campbell is coming off a great comeback year and Gomez is coming off his worst season ever. Campbell isn't as nearly overpaid as Gomez is either. Gomez is overpaid by at least $3m this year if you consider his stats from last season.

Campbell just had a season where he greatly improved the defensive aspects of his game. He was top 10 for dman in +/- this past season. Spacek is coming off an injury riddled season.

Again my summary is that Campbell basically had a great year and Spacek and Gomez both had awful years comparatively speaking. Spacek has dropped from 45 points to 16.

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06-25-2011, 12:04 PM
  #615
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Your overlooking the fact that Campbell is coming off a great comeback year and Gomez is coming off his worst season ever. Campbell isn't as nearly overpaid as Gomez is either. Gomez is overpaid by at least $3m this year if you consider his stats from last season.

Campbell just had a season where he greatly improved the defensive aspects of his game. He was top 10 for dman in +/- this past season. Spacek is coming off an injury riddled season.

Again my summary is that Campbell basically had a great year and Spacek and Gomez both had awful years comparatively speaking. Spacek has dropped from 45 points to 16.
Gomez should be a more tardeable asset than Campbell...his salary the last 2 years is 5.5 and 4.5 mil plus he only has 3 years left Campbell has 5.

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06-25-2011, 12:05 PM
  #616
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Filatov to Ottawa for the 66th pick...wow

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Old
06-25-2011, 12:12 PM
  #617
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Gomez should be a more tardeable asset than Campbell...his salary the last 2 years is 5.5 and 4.5 mil plus he only has 3 years left Campbell has 5.
Campbell makes perfect sense for Florida though, he is still a serviceable #2 D on any team (not Chicago thanks to Keith/Seabrook tandem). Yes he's overpaid by about 2-2.5M but that's ok because they will need help reaching the cap floor for the forseeable future anyways!

Some teams might take a chance on Gomez next off-season depending how he performs this season, I think.

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06-25-2011, 12:14 PM
  #618
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*********** Hockey Break
The Habs have traded their 3rd to the Winnipeg Jets for the 97th overall and 108th overall pick.

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Old
06-25-2011, 12:27 PM
  #619
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Your overlooking the fact that Campbell is coming off a great comeback year and Gomez is coming off his worst season ever. Campbell isn't as nearly overpaid as Gomez is either. Gomez is overpaid by at least $3m this year if you consider his stats from last season.

Campbell just had a season where he greatly improved the defensive aspects of his game. He was top 10 for dman in +/- this past season. Spacek is coming off an injury riddled season.

Again my summary is that Campbell basically had a great year and Spacek and Gomez both had awful years comparatively speaking. Spacek has dropped from 45 points to 16.
Huh? Great comeback year from being an important part of a cup winning team?

Campbell's production has gone 52 points - 38 points - 27 points the last three years. Fair enough, his plus minus looked great last year, but was hardly shabby the year before at +18 and a lot more than just personal performance goes into that stat.

I'm not seeing the 'great comeback'.

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06-25-2011, 12:27 PM
  #620
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Gomez should be a more tardeable asset than Campbell...his salary the last 2 years is 5.5 and 4.5 mil plus he only has 3 years left Campbell has 5.
Except Campbell is still a $5-6m dman. At 38 points, Gomez isn't a $5m centre (avg of his last two years). Right now, Gomez is no where near a $5.83m dman (his current 3 yr avg).

Campbell just had a great season. Gomez just had a horrible season. On the ice product is MORE important than cap hit.

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06-25-2011, 12:30 PM
  #621
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Huh? Great comeback year from being an important part of a cup winning team?

Campbell's production has gone 52 points - 38 points - 27 points the last three years. Fair enough, his plus minus looked great last year, but was hardly shabby the year before at +18 and a lot more than just personal performance goes into that stat.

I'm not seeing the 'great comeback'.
That's because your looking at his point totals. In previous years, he was a one dimensional player. Now he is actually a defenceman. Players are more than just stats and point totals.

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06-25-2011, 12:35 PM
  #622
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Except Campbell is still a $5-6m dman. At 38 points, Gomez isn't a $5m centre (avg of his last two years). Right now, Gomez is no where near a $5.83m dman (his current 3 yr avg).

Campbell just had a great season. Gomez just had a horrible season. On the ice product is MORE important than cap hit.
I'm pretty sure Tallon knows Gomez will probably rebound to 55-60 points. Plus having 3 years left instead of 5 is a big deal when you are a rebuilding team, they may need the cap room in a few years.

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06-25-2011, 12:37 PM
  #623
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I'm pretty sure Tallon knows Gomez will probably rebound to 55-60 points. Plus having 3 years left instead of 5 is a big deal when you are a rebuilding team, they may need the cap room in a few years.
Let me ask you this, if this were your choice, would you do (A) or (B)

(A) keep Gomez for the life of his contract

(B) trade Gomez for Campbell.

What do you do?

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06-25-2011, 12:42 PM
  #624
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Let me ask you this, if this were your choice, would you do (A) or (B)

(A) keep Gomez for the life of his contract

(B) trade Gomez for Campbell.

What do you do?
Probably keep Gomez.

Shorter contract, Campbell is a player we don't really need, trading Gomez for him opens a hole at centre but doesn't free any extra cap space to fill it.

Even allowing for Gomez not being all that good, that's my main issue in ditching him right now - you have to replace him with something in the immediate term and the options aren't plentiful.

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06-25-2011, 01:10 PM
  #625
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That's because your looking at his point totals. In previous years, he was a one dimensional player. Now he is actually a defenceman. Players are more than just stats and point totals.
Well I was replying to a post where you said "Campbell just had a season where he greatly improved the defensive aspects of his game. He was top 10 for dman in +/- this past season.......Spacek and Gomez both had awful years comparatively speaking. Spacek has dropped from 45 points to 16." So points totals and stats were part of the conversation.

Campbell was good defensively for the Hawks in their cup winning season (has always been underrated in that respect imo), I personally haven't seen him make a huge step forward this year in that respect if we look past his +/- stat. The decline in his production would be a slight concern if you were looking at him as an acquisition I would have thought.

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