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Old
06-14-2011, 04:49 PM
  #51
Dirtbag59
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Semin for Weber straight up. I'm pretty sure Sasha will feel right at home in Nashville yessir. He will embrace the trade and sign a 22 year contract with the Preds.

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06-14-2011, 04:53 PM
  #52
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Please stop quoting the troll so I have to read it. Next he might ask you to recite the NHL bylaws by memory...

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06-14-2011, 04:54 PM
  #53
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Quote:
Originally Posted by txpd View Post
the caps dont need young players with upside as much as they need right now help.
a young player with upside means another young player in an already young lineup just getting younger....not an improvement in and of itself.
There are PLENTY of young players with upside on NHL rosters or ready to make the jump, who would help the Caps in some capacity.

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06-14-2011, 04:55 PM
  #54
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Originally Posted by Dirtbag59 View Post
Semin for Weber straight up. I'm pretty sure Sasha will feel right at home in Nashville yessir. He will embrace the trade and sign a 22 year contract with the Preds.
Nashville laughs and walks away....as they should.

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06-14-2011, 04:55 PM
  #55
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Originally Posted by txpd View Post
its hard to trade a big salary. at that point you have to choose which is more important. is the return more important or moving the player because you may not get both.
In vacuum you have to trade Semin for somebody and prospect/pick and use cap space left for another solid player. So moving the player is preferable.

But in this very situation I believe we will see something like "Arnott was the only good person who I'd like to pay those dollars Semin left here" (c) McPhee.

Also if we will trade Semin and just hold free money until deadline we can acquire enough ppl of various kinds/quality (remember all those masses of top-4 defenders and so on).

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06-14-2011, 04:57 PM
  #56
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Originally Posted by txpd View Post
There is no assumption. There is, however, a likely hood. A team that has the cap room for a salary like semin's very likely won't have the assets the caps need to get better. its hard to trade a big salary. at that point you have to choose which is more important. is the return more important or moving the player because you may not get both.

Simon Gagne returned Matt Walker and a 4th round pick.
Gagne is a player with a severe concussion history, combined with a team deep in talent and desperate to make a trade....any other 1/2 truths to debunk?

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06-14-2011, 04:57 PM
  #57
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Originally Posted by EroCaps View Post
Really?

I'm not a GM. It's not my day job to know what players are available. I don't know what coaches are up-and-coming either. But I do know that some exist. That good moves are made on both fronts every ****ing year. It doesn't mean that because I'm not in hockey that I don't know anything about it. That's arrogant, delusional crap. Asking me to call exact deals is ridiculous.

The idea that there's not a decent deal out there for Semin is highly unlikely, imo. He's a commodity. But even hypothetically if it were true, then it's an indictment on McPhee for not seeing the writing on the wall with this player years ago.
Are you F-ing kidding me? You constantly rant and rave about how McPhee has built a team of 'losers' and can't name a single 'winner' you would acquire and even a somewhat realistic deal to acquire him?

What the heck are you even doing on these boards besides complaining? Complaining is easy while offering actual solutions is a bit harder. Come on man, don't take the easy way out. Show us you have more to offer than the usual.

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06-14-2011, 05:14 PM
  #58
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Originally Posted by CapitalsCup2012 View Post
Nashville laughs and walks away....as they should.
You mean laugh at how easy it becomes to win the Stanley Cup with Semin.....right?

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06-14-2011, 05:17 PM
  #59
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Originally Posted by Millhaus View Post
Are you F-ing kidding me? You constantly rant and rave about how McPhee has built a team of 'losers' and can't name a single 'winner' you would acquire and even a somewhat realistic deal to acquire him?

What the heck are you even doing on these boards besides complaining? Complaining is easy while offering actual solutions is a bit harder. Come on man, don't take the easy way out. Show us you have more to offer than the usual.
Depends what you call a "winner." Someone who's won a Cup? By that definition, then even someone like Jarome Iginla doesn't qualify, and I would think he'd be a player who would help the Capitals over the hump. Meanwhile, Jason Arnott was supposed to be that guy, and it didn't work.

The thing is that the Capitals don't need a star in return; they need a complimentary player who can (a) contribute on offense and (b) add an element that is at the moment a weakness for the Capitals roster. Trading a talent--no matter how frustrating--like Semin for somebody who's been tabbed a "winner" only works if that guy's as big as a talent. I'd rather get somebody back who addresses the team's weak points. Not every team wins a Cup, and the vast majority of favorites receive disappointment than satisfaction (just ask the Red Wings and, this year, the Bruins).

As for specifics...with Brooks Laich probably leaving (and even if he doesn't), I'd offer Semin to the Sharks for Ryane Clowe and a 2nd rounder. Of course, the Capitals would be sacrificing about 10-15 possible goals of offense and possibly risk becoming a one-line team unless they sign another forward or buy out Kuznetsov's KHL contract and convince him to come over next season. But Clowe is a guy I would love to see on the top two lines.

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06-14-2011, 05:23 PM
  #60
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I doubt any trade will happen because people will be talked out of it because by the looks of it, Semin without Ovechkin is a prime player to go back to Russia just by what we have heard about him being quiet unless Ovechkin gets him involved, so he for sure sounds like hes culture shocked. Which doesn't help he only has a 1 year contract.

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06-14-2011, 05:25 PM
  #61
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Originally Posted by Liberation View Post
I doubt any trade will happen because people will be talked out of it because by the looks of it, Semin without Ovechkin is a prime player to go back to Russia just by what we have heard about him being quiet unless Ovechkin gets him involved, so he for sure sounds like hes culture shocked. Which doesn't help he only has a 1 year contract.
You're avatar is going to confuse me with cc2012

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06-14-2011, 05:33 PM
  #62
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You're avatar is going to confuse me with cc2012
It confused me.....I started reading....and I was like, when did I write this....doh!

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06-14-2011, 05:33 PM
  #63
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Millhaus View Post
Are you F-ing kidding me? You constantly rant and rave about how McPhee has built a team of 'losers' and can't name a single 'winner' you would acquire and even a somewhat realistic deal to acquire him?

What the heck are you even doing on these boards besides complaining? Complaining is easy while offering actual solutions is a bit harder. Come on man, don't take the easy way out. Show us you have more to offer than the usual.


Your first paragraph is just false. The second is more of you asking me to name specific players. Which is pointless and silly. I'm not continuing this.

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Old
06-14-2011, 06:20 PM
  #64
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Originally Posted by CapitalsCup2012 View Post
Gagne is a player with a severe concussion history, combined with a team deep in talent and desperate to make a trade....any other 1/2 truths to debunk?
ok...you win. if he gets traded, we can talk then about the return.

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06-14-2011, 06:32 PM
  #65
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Originally Posted by txpd View Post
ok...you win. if he gets traded, we can talk then about the return.
I don't see you disagreeing with what I said....was that not right about Gagne's and the Flyers circumstances?

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06-14-2011, 09:16 PM
  #66
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Originally Posted by *********** View Post
If Alex Semin is traded to the Ottawa Senators there is no chance that Jason Spezza would be going the other way.
Well thank God for that, I don't think anybody would even ask for Spezza.

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06-14-2011, 09:37 PM
  #67
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Originally Posted by CapitalsCup2012 View Post
I don't see you disagreeing with what I said....was that not right about Gagne's and the Flyers circumstances?
at some point the arguing has to stop. at least for me. if you dont like my analogies, fine. if semin is traded, i bet you are unhappy with the return. lets leave it at that. i am not going to change your mind.

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06-14-2011, 09:46 PM
  #68
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I accept your surrender TXPD....

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06-14-2011, 09:52 PM
  #69
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Gagne had a NTC and was pretty much dead set on going to Tampa Bay. Philadelphia got what they could under the circumstances.

The Caps don't have the replacement horses in place to make that sort of cap dump deal. Until then I wouldn't expect Semin to be moved unless the return is pretty helpful.

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06-14-2011, 10:00 PM
  #70
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Is a 20g scoring wing and 4 mil in cap space not helpful? That's what I would be looking for.

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06-14-2011, 10:39 PM
  #71
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What's the 20g scorer's contract like? Flexibility for flexibility's sake is good but not unless there are a number of suitable and enticing ways of filling that space and improving. I could maybe buy a case of addition by subtraction but not without a coherent post-Semin secondary scoring plan. I have my doubts about offensive strategy to begin so that's a pretty delicate undertaking.

Keeping Semin may be the lazy way to go, though. Just because it's convenient doesn't make it right (that might be the org. in a nutshell).

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06-15-2011, 12:10 AM
  #72
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I'm picking Florida to win the cup this year because they have the most cap space.

Quote:
Originally Posted by CapitalsCup2012 View Post
Yep, I sure would, but I don't believe a trade of Semin means your chances are reduced either. As long as that future success is in the form of one NHL roster player with some youth and upside, I would move Semin and look to shore up the lack of scoring through another trade.
What other trade? What 2nd line scoring players are available for the taking? And what else would we have to trade to obtain them? And why wouldn't the team we traded Semin to go after those players?

You can't trade away a player than fill his void with a mystery player. Especially given that even if you find an available mystery player, they're not going to be free. You have to trade away more assets to get them. This is especially true given the lack of scoring wingers on the free agent market this year. There are only five total UFAs who scored 20 goals last year, and one of them is Selanne.


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Originally Posted by CapitalsCup2012 View Post
Trading Semin for youth doesn't have to mean the Caps have a reduced chance at winning next year unless you believe McPhee can't do his job and find a way to fill the gaps with the recovered salary cap room.
Oh, because having cap room means free agents jump on board and trades magically materialize? McPhee doing his job is making roster moves that don't open new holes in the roster. You're suggesting we plug one leak by unplugging another. Or in the case of trading Semin for a lesser 2nd line winger and a prospect (as you suggested), simply downgrading the roster for futures (aka, rebuilding).

Teams don't win because they have cap space, they win because they have the best team. Having flexibility under the cap helps create the best total team, yes. But the Capitals can make much simpler moves to create some more flexibility than unloading one of three most talented forwards on the team.

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06-15-2011, 12:33 AM
  #73
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Originally Posted by Mystlyfe View Post
I'm picking Florida to win the cup this year because they have the most cap space.



What other trade? What 2nd line scoring players are available for the taking? And what else would we have to trade to obtain them? And why wouldn't the team we traded Semin to go after those players?

You can't trade away a player than fill his void with a mystery player. Especially given that even if you find an available mystery player, they're not going to be free. You have to trade away more assets to get them. This is especially true given the lack of scoring wingers on the free agent market this year. There are only five total UFAs who scored 20 goals last year, and one of them is Selanne.




Oh, because having cap room means free agents jump on board and trades magically materialize? McPhee doing his job is making roster moves that don't open new holes in the roster. You're suggesting we plug one leak by unplugging another. Or in the case of trading Semin for a lesser 2nd line winger and a prospect (as you suggested), simply downgrading the roster for futures (aka, rebuilding).

Teams don't win because they have cap space, they win because they have the best team. Having flexibility under the cap helps create the best total team, yes. But the Capitals can make much simpler moves to create some more flexibility than unloading one of three most talented forwards on the team.
How do you expect someone to name these players when GMs keep them private until deals are made?

I'm convinced the anti-trade Semin fans are either fanboys or generally afraid of ambiguity and would jump right on the bandwagon of almost decent trade once it actually happened and there were new players wearing Caps sweaters.

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Old
06-15-2011, 01:03 AM
  #74
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Originally Posted by EroCaps View Post
How do you expect someone to name these players when GMs keep them private until deals are made?

I'm convinced the anti-trade Semin fans are either fanboys or generally afraid of ambiguity and would jump right on the bandwagon of almost decent trade once it actually happened and there were new players wearing Caps sweaters.
If Semin is traded, what keeps Washington from being a one-line team? We're looking at a potential UFA flight risk in Laich and Johansson on that line, who apparently is about 50/50 with regard to being a 2nd or 3rd line center.

All I hear from you is a bunch of talk and no solutions. Sure you're not required to give one, you're not in the organization, but if you're going to cry and scream and tear into people that don't want Semin gone, why don't you bring some construction with you and enlighten us idiots. I mostly don't want Semin gone because I can't think of any sort of feasible package, and known quantities like Semin aren't really the kind that you dispose of, not for substantially lesser parts and the chance to sign someone who fills a hole.

Anybody who could even hope to grow to fill Semin's spot will be almost impossible to get, especially for Semin in a swap. Anybody else likely won't be able to make anything of his spot on the 2RW, Kuznetsov is inaccessible, the general idea is that even if you want Semin gone more than anything, it needs to be done in a situation that allows the Capitals to improve. This year's laughable free agency pool doesn't really inspire confidence.

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06-15-2011, 01:08 AM
  #75
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Originally Posted by EroCaps View Post
How do you expect someone to name these players when GMs keep them private until deals are made?
Oh, and how has this stopped anyone else on any board from speculating, at the very least? I haven't seen one yet, perhaps you'd care to propose a deal for Semin that isn't all unnamed, hypothetical pieces? I'd like to see what you think he commands in return, which teams would bid for him, and how the team would spend any of his cap space to fill what would then be one of the biggest team needs, scoring forwards. After Ovechkin and Backstrom, Fehr is unreliable, Johansson very young, Laich not guaranteed to stay (and not really an offensive powerhouse), Knuble is ancient, only guys like Kuznetsov and Galiev, that aren't likely to have any sort of impact in the next two years, have any sort of dynamic scoring upside.

You've got to find a good trigger man if you ship Semin out, or that second line is going to fall to bits. Or rather, it'll erode even faster than it did last year.

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