HFBoards

Go Back   HFBoards > General Hockey Discussion > Trade Rumors and Free Agent Talk
Mobile Hockey's Future Become a Sponsor Site Rules Support Forum vBookie Page 2
Trade Rumors and Free Agent Talk Trade rumors, transactions, and free agent talk. Rumors must contain the word RUMOR in post title. Proposals must contain the word PROPOSAL in post title.

How To Better the SHARKS!!!!

Reply
 
Thread Tools
Old
06-18-2011, 01:53 PM
  #26
Bourne Endeavor
Moderator
HFBoards: Night's Watch
 
Bourne Endeavor's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: Montreal, Quebec
Country: Canada
Posts: 27,990
vCash: 178
Quote:
Originally Posted by exporta View Post
Heatley doesn't fit with the Maple Leafs, and I don't think he can be counted on as a veteran leader. Sure he can score 30-40 goals for us, but is he the type of guy you want around the locker room? The guy complains about not getting 1st line minutes and #1 pp time.

On the other hand, Komisarek is the type of guy you want in the locker room. He is a leader in room. He may be over priced, however in terms of character building I would much rather have Komisarek than Heatley.
Honestly, Heatley biggest complaint was more the coach in general than not getting first line minutes. Apparently quite a few players disliked Clouston. He would be playing on Toronto's first line virtually as a guarantee and could do fairly well. I believe it would insanity to trade him for Komisarek horrid contract for the Sharks but it would be damn good for the Leafs.

Bourne Endeavor is online now   Reply With Quote
Old
06-18-2011, 02:01 PM
  #27
Crazy Joe Divola
Registered User
 
Crazy Joe Divola's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2009
Posts: 1,267
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Phion Keneuf View Post
Dan Boyle for Gardiner, MacArthur, 2nd

Mac could play 3rd or 2nd line wing. He's a huge upgrade over wellwood and goc.
Gardiner is a top D prospect.
2nd allows you to pick up a possible good prospect who will be ready in a couple years and will be cheap.
So a 3rd line winger, prospect and a 2nd lands a #1 dman now?

Crazy Joe Divola is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
06-18-2011, 02:08 PM
  #28
matt trick
Registered User
 
matt trick's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2007
Country: United States
Posts: 7,994
vCash: 500
If Heatley had a 1.6 million buyout cap hit every year, it would be worth considering. However, the buy-out is 6 years, and 2 of them are over 3.6 million. In 2012-13, and 2013-2014, we would incur 3.6 and 4.6 million buy-outs. So for next year, we have 6 million of Heatley's cap to work with, along with Huskins and Wallin's money, you may be able to get something like Pitkanen (5.5) and Leino (3.75), but the following two years, you're looking at having Leino+Heatley's cap hit, in the amount you could just have Heatley. Not to mention having three more years of 2 million in dead space. Would you trade Heatley for Leino+ one year of a top 4 d-man, knowing that you will sustain three additional years of a 2 million cap hit to do so? The guy had a rough year, but for the first half of it, he outplayed Thornton and Marleau (and arguably clowe and Couture). Even if he gets significantly worse (say 50 points, defense degrades), I still don't think buying him out is worth it.

When he has an average of 5.5 salary (in his final two years), he may become a bit more tradable, and if not, he is still one of the top 60 forwards in the league (even if paid like a top 10). This isn't a Drury/Gomez like drop off.

2011-12: $1,611,111
2012-13: $3,611,111
2013-14: $4,611,111
2014-15: $2,111,111
2015-16: $2,111,111
2016-17: $2,111,111

matt trick is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
06-18-2011, 02:14 PM
  #29
Phion Keneuf
Bang Bang
 
Phion Keneuf's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2010
Location: Vaughan, Ontario
Country: Italy
Posts: 29,160
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Crazy Joe Divola View Post
So a 3rd line winger, prospect and a 2nd lands a #1 dman now?
If you plan on signing 2 FA Dmen like the OP stated then why not? You also have Demers who could step in as a PMD

And I could play that game to.
A 26 year old 62 point winger, a top prospect, and a 2nd in a very deep draft for a 34 year old declining Dman

Phion Keneuf is online now   Reply With Quote
Old
06-18-2011, 02:26 PM
  #30
DuckEatinShark
GET ALL THE PPs!!!!
 
DuckEatinShark's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2009
Location: San Jose
Posts: 5,608
vCash: 500
We shouldn't buy out Heatley. He was one of our biggest point producers last year. Not worth $7.5 mil sure, but still an important part of this team.

I think we should re-sign Seto at $3.5 mil per year. Anything more and we'll take the compensation. Seto's speed is needed in our top 9, and he gives us a few more options at the wings.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Phion Keneuf View Post
If you plan on signing 2 FA Dmen like the OP stated then why not? You also have Demers who could step in as a PMD

And I could play that game to.
A 26 year old 62 point winger, a top prospect, and a 2nd in a very deep draft for a 34 year old declining Dman
Our weakness is on defense, not forwards. We have no use for any of those players you're offering, let alone give up our best defenseman for them. Besides, who'll be our #1 defenseman next year? Vlasic? Murray?

And that "declining" defenseman played on Team Canada last year. Not an easy feat considering how many defenseman were left out.

DuckEatinShark is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
06-18-2011, 02:35 PM
  #31
matt trick
Registered User
 
matt trick's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2007
Country: United States
Posts: 7,994
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Phion Keneuf View Post
If you plan on signing 2 FA Dmen like the OP stated then why not? You also have Demers who could step in as a PMD

And I could play that game to.
A 26 year old 62 point winger, a top prospect, and a 2nd in a very deep draft for a 34 year old declining Dman
Except we don't need any of those things. A winger would be nice, but which one of Heatley, Thornton, Marleau, Couture, Pavelski, Clowe, Setoguchi is McArthur knocking out of the top 6? Don't get me wrong, I wanted the general after he became a UFA, but he doesn't fill a desperate need (I'd love to have him on our third line with pavs, but that is an extreme luxury).

Dan Boyle is the single most important player to the Sharks on ice results. Thornton may be more unlikely to be traded, but Marleau-Couture-Pavelski would still be top 10 amongst center groups in the league. UFA-Murray-Demers-Vlasic-Braun-UFA? Not so much. Certainly bottom 10, possibly bottom 5.

Proposing a deal for Boyle is stupid period. If the only roster player we get back is a guy who'd likely be on our third line, its colossally stupid. I don't understand why you come in, make a proposal, which only helps your team, and are put off when its pointed out to you, why it doesn't work. Think about both teams.

matt trick is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
06-18-2011, 02:41 PM
  #32
internetdotcom
11 + 15 + 19 = 666
 
internetdotcom's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2009
Location: Capital O
Country: Canada
Posts: 11,183
vCash: 500
Send a message via MSN to internetdotcom Send a message via Yahoo to internetdotcom
Quote:
Originally Posted by exporta View Post
Burke has no interest in Heatley and you must remember that Heatley has a ntc.

At this point the options on Heatley are limited. He's only 30 years old, so I think you keep him on the roster for one more year in hopes he can be a 40 goal scorer again.

Even if he isn't scoring, he's a known threat on the ice and teams will pay attention to him creating space for other players. 40 goal players are not easily acquired.
What does the bolded have to do with Heatley?

Also, shouldn't this be on the Sharks board?

internetdotcom is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
06-18-2011, 03:08 PM
  #33
matt trick
Registered User
 
matt trick's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2007
Country: United States
Posts: 7,994
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Xoggz22 View Post
did you trade Demers to Columbus? Please, please please! Any interest in moving up the draft to the top 8? I'd love Pavelski and Demers on the CBJ as part of our improvement needs..... 8th overall + what? Please, please, please....already said that! Sorry.
Demers, like Clitsome, provides far too good of play per cap ratio to be moved. I expect he will pass Murray and Vlasic on the depth chart, and become our best two-way defender (of course Boyle's offense will keep him as our number one option). He is the only guy on the roster that provides, offense, defense, and more and more frequently physicality (though this has a way to go), and he does it all for just over a million dollars for the next two years. The only shark who arguably provides better bang for the buck is Couture, but he is only signed for one more year. For a cap strapped team like ours, Demers is critical.

Similarly, Joe Pavelski provides a lot of quality beyond his 50-60 point per year. He scored at will with Wellwood and Mitchell (on pace for 70 points despite an injury) giving us our first third scoring line since Mike Ricci. He is also excellent defensively and on the penalty kill, and is a leader. They were inconsistent in the playoffs, but if we are to win a cup, Thornton-Couture-Pavelski down the center will be a huge part of it. I am really hoping in addition to a top 4 d-man we can grab an upgrade on Mitchell between now and next years trade deadline to really complete that third scoring line.

matt trick is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
06-18-2011, 03:32 PM
  #34
WTFetus
Moderator
Marlov
 
WTFetus's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2009
Location: San Francisco
Country: United States
Posts: 12,413
vCash: 500
Is anyone else annoyed at the constant Cheechoo 2.0 comment when talking about Setoguchi? Its pretty obvious that whoever says that doesn't watch the Sharks play and have no clue about the players.

WTFetus is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
06-18-2011, 03:49 PM
  #35
matt trick
Registered User
 
matt trick's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2007
Country: United States
Posts: 7,994
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by WTFetus View Post
Is anyone else annoyed at the constant Cheechoo 2.0 comment when talking about Setoguchi? Its pretty obvious that whoever says that doesn't watch the Sharks play and have no clue about the players.
They both have good shots, they both had big seasons playing with Thornton. The similarities probably end their. One has significantly more dangle, speed, and physicality. One had more heart, but skated like those bears in the Russian circus, slow and awkwardly. Cheechoo was a much better fit with Thornton and benefited greater from his elite playmaking. Setoguchi certainly benefited, but he has more natural talent.

matt trick is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
06-18-2011, 04:33 PM
  #36
WTFetus
Moderator
Marlov
 
WTFetus's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2009
Location: San Francisco
Country: United States
Posts: 12,413
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by matt trick View Post
They both have good shots, they both had big seasons playing with Thornton. The similarities probably end their. One has significantly more dangle, speed, and physicality. One had more heart, but skated like those bears in the Russian circus, slow and awkwardly. Cheechoo was a much better fit with Thornton and benefited greater from his elite playmaking. Setoguchi certainly benefited, but he has more natural talent.
That's hard to say. Their success was more a product of grinding style hockey and adjusting to the new rules after the lock-out. From purely a stats point of view, that's correct. But in a perfect scenario where both of them are healthy and you in a situation where you have to put one of them with Thornton, I wouldn't be too sure. Depending on their 3rd line-mate, I'd feel Setoguchi would have more success with Thornton as a line since he fits the role of that necessary forechecker.
Which brings me to my initial point and your other point. They really have nothing in common other than a good shot. Their playstyles are completely different.

WTFetus is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
06-18-2011, 04:47 PM
  #37
TheJuxtaposer
#Shorks
 
TheJuxtaposer's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2009
Location: San Diego, CA
Country: United States
Posts: 28,787
vCash: 50
Quote:
Originally Posted by Shanny View Post
If you can't trade Heatley....just buy him out
...your not going to win anything with ****ing allstars on your team.

TheJuxtaposer is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
06-18-2011, 04:56 PM
  #38
New York RKY
Moderator
Let's Go Rangers!
 
New York RKY's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2009
Location: Dirty Jersey
Country: United States
Posts: 12,217
vCash: 500
You better the Sharks in one way, and only one way:

By trading Ryane Clowe to the Rangers!

__________________
New York RKY is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
06-18-2011, 05:00 PM
  #39
Joey Moss
5-14-6-1
 
Joey Moss's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2008
Posts: 24,031
vCash: 815
Quote:
Originally Posted by TehJuxtaposer View Post
This is ****in' idiotic... Goc back but on the third line this time? Buying out Heater? Go to Fear the Fin, they have an excellent article about why they should not buy him out. Trade Demers? Why would we trade a young top 4 puck mover on an ELC? Not re-sign Seto? The only we he goes is if traded and that would have to be in a package for a real top pairing D-man. Wiz and Greene are not upgrades to Demers and White.
I don't see how they wouldn't be..

Joey Moss is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
06-18-2011, 05:20 PM
  #40
Chandrashekhar Limit
BUNGLADEISH
 
Chandrashekhar Limit's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: Waterloo, ON
Country: Bangladesh
Posts: 16,225
vCash: 283
Heatley buyout

It's just been one year. Give him another year before taking any action.

Chandrashekhar Limit is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
06-18-2011, 05:32 PM
  #41
DekeLikeYouMeanIt
RIP
 
DekeLikeYouMeanIt's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2010
Country: Canada
Posts: 9,993
vCash: 500
From an outsider who half-follows the Sharks games... Demers has to stay in the lineup. Cheap, improving pretty damn quick and looks to be solid for a long time. And in the playoffs, he looked too good to "ditch for a better Dman."

Add in Wisniewski and he'd fit like a glove on the 2nd pairing for sure.

DekeLikeYouMeanIt is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
06-18-2011, 05:43 PM
  #42
ShameOnYouZidlicky
Registered User
 
ShameOnYouZidlicky's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2010
Country: Canada
Posts: 1,230
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by SolidSnakeUS View Post
Carle for Doherty and a 4th?
SJS would be stupid to trade Doherty, guys 6 8" and can score too. He put up 53 points on an average Kingston team last year. I think this guy has the tools to be a good player someday.

ShameOnYouZidlicky is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
06-18-2011, 05:48 PM
  #43
TheJuxtaposer
#Shorks
 
TheJuxtaposer's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2009
Location: San Diego, CA
Country: United States
Posts: 28,787
vCash: 50
Quote:
Originally Posted by Joey Moss View Post
I don't see how they wouldn't be..
How many Sharks games have you seen? Demers is a top 4 now and in the future, and he's cheap. Wiz is better that Demers offensively (for now) but severely worse defensively. And White was on a .5 PPG pace in his games with the Sharks. Plus Demers and White would be much cheaper than Green and Wiz.

TheJuxtaposer is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
06-18-2011, 06:22 PM
  #44
CommanderShepard15
Eberle=Clutch
 
CommanderShepard15's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2010
Posts: 4,416
vCash: 500
i guess i just entered the circus cause i read the first post and all i could think of was whys their a clown, making a joke

CommanderShepard15 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
06-18-2011, 06:30 PM
  #45
SuperSaiyanBeastmode
Registered User
 
SuperSaiyanBeastmode's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2010
Location: Ontario
Country: Canada
Posts: 4,958
vCash: 500
don't pay the wiz 5mil... your trying to make your team better right? you need a legit top pairing d.. if you get one within 2 years= strongest team you could possibly ice imo. Just throw all your marbles at a ryan suter package at the deadline(if nashville are not signing him... but probably are).

SuperSaiyanBeastmode is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
06-18-2011, 06:35 PM
  #46
EkLOLund
Registered User
 
Join Date: Nov 2007
Location: Montreal
Country: Canada
Posts: 386
vCash: 500
Heatley for Bouwmeester.

EkLOLund is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
06-18-2011, 06:41 PM
  #47
hockeyball
Registered User
 
hockeyball's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2007
Posts: 18,663
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by EkLOLund View Post
Heatley for Bouwmeester.
Not a fan of JBo, but I'd do it. It makes sense because it addresses both teams needs and swaps a bad contract for a bad contract.

Just the NMC problem.

hockeyball is online now   Reply With Quote
Old
06-19-2011, 04:14 AM
  #48
Ajaton Azer
A small hamster
 
Ajaton Azer's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2005
Location: Spandex
Country: Finland
Posts: 417
vCash: 500
Every team needs a cup winning goalie to build around and Sharks have Niemi. They have all the basic needs covered I think. Maybe add a high scoring winger to help Thornton in the playoffs.

Ajaton Azer is online now   Reply With Quote
Old
06-19-2011, 04:21 AM
  #49
Eaglepride*
#5 in Wotan we trust
 
Join Date: Feb 2010
Location: Promiseland Walhalla
Posts: 3,502
vCash: 500
get them another Boyle type of player big strong and physical.

Eaglepride* is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
06-19-2011, 10:08 AM
  #50
Xoggz22
HFB Partner
 
Xoggz22's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2002
Location: Columbus, Ohio
Country: United States
Posts: 4,491
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by matt trick View Post
Demers, like Clitsome, provides far too good of play per cap ratio to be moved. I expect he will pass Murray and Vlasic on the depth chart, and become our best two-way defender (of course Boyle's offense will keep him as our number one option). He is the only guy on the roster that provides, offense, defense, and more and more frequently physicality (though this has a way to go), and he does it all for just over a million dollars for the next two years. The only shark who arguably provides better bang for the buck is Couture, but he is only signed for one more year. For a cap strapped team like ours, Demers is critical.

Similarly, Joe Pavelski provides a lot of quality beyond his 50-60 point per year. He scored at will with Wellwood and Mitchell (on pace for 70 points despite an injury) giving us our first third scoring line since Mike Ricci. He is also excellent defensively and on the penalty kill, and is a leader. They were inconsistent in the playoffs, but if we are to win a cup, Thornton-Couture-Pavelski down the center will be a huge part of it. I am really hoping in addition to a top 4 d-man we can grab an upgrade on Mitchell between now and next years trade deadline to really complete that third scoring line.
I'm in complete agreement with you. I think Pavelski and Demers would fit perfect in Columbus but know they are part of the Sharks future too. I also like Vlassic who seems similar to Tyutin but a few years younger. I think Demers is going to be a difference maker very soon. I do agree that a guy like Clitsome is a valuable player to have but Clitsome doesn't have the upside that Demers does and is 4 years older.

I know they don't get to Columbus but those are the two in particular I would target on San Jose with Vlassic a close third.....

Xoggz22 is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Forum Jump


Bookmarks

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off



All times are GMT -5. The time now is 11:40 PM.

monitoring_string = "e4251c93e2ba248d29da988d93bf5144"
Contact Us - HFBoards - Archive - Privacy Statement - Terms of Use - Advertise - Top - AdChoices

vBulletin Copyright ©2000 - 2015, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
HFBoards.com is a property of CraveOnline Media, LLC, an Evolve Media, LLC company. 2015 All Rights Reserved.