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Old
06-24-2011, 07:04 AM
  #126
Duke33
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Originally Posted by Mystlyfe View Post
I'm still trying to wrap my head around this trade and understand exactly what Holmgren was thinking. The best I can do is coming back to the whole locker room aspect. I'm not convinced they were a "cancer" or even a "problem" in the locker room so much as they didn't match the culture and the personalities that Holmgren and management wanted them to. They weren't sure if they were still the direction they wanted to bring the Flyers going forward.

It was an abrupt change of plan, certainly. But I guess they felt handing the burden to their next crop of forwards. The team still has Briere, Giroux, JVR, and now they added Schenn, Voracek, and Simmonds. That's a strong core. Is it as strong as having Richards and Carter on lifetime deals? Hell no, but Flyers management apparently felt it was more well rounded and facilitated better depth I guess.

I'm still not entirely sure. It's pretty ****ing crazy.
That's those wacky Flyers for you. Of course people around here elevate them to some kind of dynasty for some reason. Given their lack of Cup success in forty years I'm not sure why.

I'm not sure their goaltending woes are solved either. Given that Bryzgalov has been shelled his last two postseasons.

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06-24-2011, 07:07 AM
  #127
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That's those wacky Flyers for you. Of course people around here elevate them to some kind of dynasty for some reason. Given their lack of Cup success in forty years I'm not sure why.

I'm not sure their goaltending woes are solved either. Given that Bryzgalov has been shelled his last two postseasons.
How many cups do we have in 20 some years?

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Old
06-24-2011, 07:27 AM
  #128
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Up comes Homes to address the media, and pulls out his huge set of balls, and walks away.

You may not see things Homes's way. He wanted new blood, not happy with yet another playoff loss. Their cup drought is as long as ours, and I think Homes saw something from Boston. Highly paid players have to earn their contract and lead the way to a cup. Bottom line. So he rocked the core. Now its Bryz's turn to give it a try, be their tool man. I bet he slept well last night. George was staring at the ceiling debating if he should trade back and get 2 2's.

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Old
06-24-2011, 07:28 AM
  #129
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the question is, how many cups might the flyers have scored by now if they were not so prone to this wild thrashing after they fail almost every season?

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Old
06-24-2011, 07:41 AM
  #130
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I thought the league was putting a stop to BS contracts like that? All they are doing is stretching it out to keep the cap hit down. I wish GMGM jumped on that train with the OV contract.
They got it in just under the limit. It only takes him to age 40, and there's no years under $1 mil. If either of those had been in this contract then there would have been two sets of cap hits to compensate for the shenanigans, IINM.

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06-24-2011, 07:49 AM
  #131
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They got it in just under the limit. It only takes him to age 40, and there's no years under $1 mil. If either of those had been in this contract then there would have been two sets of cap hits to compensate for the shenanigans, IINM.
It's pretty much a 7 year deal at $48M when all is said and done.

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Old
06-24-2011, 07:58 AM
  #132
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I can't believe the moves they made. Just absurd. I know they got good value, but sheesh.

Talk about throwing the baby out with the bath water.

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06-24-2011, 08:17 AM
  #133
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I can't believe the moves they made. Just absurd. I know they got good value, but sheesh.

Talk about throwing the baby out with the bath water.
I'm sure these were tough decisions and were talked about at great lengths. Tough for us to judge because we don't "really" know what was going on in that Philly dressing room.

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06-24-2011, 08:23 AM
  #134
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thats true of the capitals as well. we dont know.

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Old
06-24-2011, 08:40 AM
  #135
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I knew Holmgren would be praised by the same old crew on here, even though GMGM would be eviscerated if he made the same moves.

Move Versteeg and Carle and he'd have been able to sign Bryzgalov.

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06-24-2011, 08:42 AM
  #136
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I knew posters would be harassed by the same old crew on here, simply trying to rationalize what Holmes was thinking shaking up his core like that. Even though GMGM would get a free pass for anything he does.

Every other GM is wrong, and GM is always right. Is that you George?

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06-24-2011, 08:49 AM
  #137
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Originally Posted by NobodyBeatsTheWiz View Post
I knew Holmgren would be praised by the same old crew on here, even though GMGM would be eviscerated if he made the same moves.

Move Versteeg and Carle and he'd have been able to sign Bryzgalov.
It obviously goes beyond that. Flyers organization deemed Carter and Richards as "trouble" and they had to go in order for the team to move forward.

I'm neither praising nor hating. Just looking at the big picture.

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06-24-2011, 08:50 AM
  #138
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Originally Posted by RandyHolt View Post
I knew posters would be harassed by the same old crew on here, simply trying to rationalize what Holmes was thinking shaking up his core like that. Even though GMGM would get a free pass for anything he does.

Every other GM is wrong, and GM is always right. Is that you George?
Tell me, what had to change in the lockerroom on a team that almost won a Cup last season?

Your shtick has been the same since the season ended: everything GMGM does is ****. Everything other GMs do is gold and should be emulated.

Change for the sake of change is moronic. Would you have seriously been happy if Ovechkin and Backstrom were traded for a similar package just for the sake of a 'culture change'?

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Old
06-24-2011, 08:51 AM
  #139
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Originally Posted by NobodyBeatsTheWiz View Post
I knew Holmgren would be praised by the same old crew on here, even though GMGM would be eviscerated if he made the same moves.

Move Versteeg and Carle and he'd have been able to sign Bryzgalov.
You're smart enough to know that he elected to move Carter and Richards. Whether it was done for hockey reasons or personal reasons, we'll likely never know. It was not done to make room for Bryzgalov.

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Old
06-24-2011, 08:55 AM
  #140
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Originally Posted by ForzaItalia View Post
It obviously goes beyond that. Flyers organization deemed Carter and Richards as "trouble" and they had to go in order for the team to move forward.

I'm neither praising nor hating. Just looking at the big picture.
If Carter was so much 'trouble', why sign him to an 11 year extension less than a year ago?

If the pair was so much 'trouble', how'd the team manage to overcome them and win the Conference last season?

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Old
06-24-2011, 08:59 AM
  #141
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Originally Posted by BrooklynCapsFan View Post
You're smart enough to know that he elected to move Carter and Richards. Whether it was done for hockey reasons or personal reasons, we'll likely never know. It was not done to make room for Bryzgalov.
I can't see any justification for moving the two for hockey reasons.

My theory is the same as yesterday: it was the result of ownership meddling. Moves made completely for personal reasons.

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Old
06-24-2011, 09:00 AM
  #142
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Sign Carter to a long term, low cap hit deal because it maximizes his trade value. This is the opposite tack from signing Semin to a 1 year market deal -who I'd estimate is virtually worthless on the trade market given his contract.

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06-24-2011, 09:00 AM
  #143
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Originally Posted by NobodyBeatsTheWiz View Post
If Carter was so much 'trouble', why sign him to an 11 year extension less than a year ago?

If the pair was so much 'trouble', how'd the team manage to overcome them and win the Conference last season?
It's possible the organization thought they're young and will change. It might have gotten worse from then to now.

Guys like Pronger and his leadership probably played a great role in answering your last question.

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Old
06-24-2011, 09:03 AM
  #144
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Originally Posted by NobodyBeatsTheWiz View Post
I can't see any justification for moving the two for hockey reasons.

My theory is the same as yesterday: it was the result of ownership meddling. Moves made completely for personal reasons.
With Snider, anything is possible.

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Old
06-24-2011, 09:44 AM
  #145
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lost in all this is the fact that Carter & Umberger are reunited.... and it feels so gooood!

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Old
06-24-2011, 09:50 AM
  #146
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Another thing lost in this: does the Richards acquisition make Stoll available?

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Old
06-24-2011, 09:52 AM
  #147
HSHS
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How many cups do we have in 20 some years?
Its 30 some genuis...



sorry I had to join the fun.

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Old
06-24-2011, 09:54 AM
  #148
brs03
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Originally Posted by NobodyBeatsTheWiz View Post
Another thing lost in this: does the Richards acquisition make Stoll available?
With Handzus leaving though? I mean I'm not up to date on what the Kings were using as a lineup (was Handzus playing wing once in awhile? etc.) but maybe...

I'd be lying if I said the thought hadn't crossed my mind several times.

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06-24-2011, 09:59 AM
  #149
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I think LA wants to maintain its strength down the middle now that it just got an elite #2. Richards + Stoll gives them a strong defensive middle ES and PK.

edit: Zeus has been a mess since they brought him in. All throughout that lineup.

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06-24-2011, 09:59 AM
  #150
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Originally Posted by NobodyBeatsTheWiz View Post
Another thing lost in this: does the Richards acquisition make Stoll available?
He's less valuable now than he was but I think they'll keep him so as to be able to match up with San Jose's center depth (and other top WC teams).

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