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Doughty offered 5 year deal, ~$5.7 per; has not signed

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06-26-2011, 02:32 PM
  #101
Arpeggio
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Oilers should offer 7+ million. I know the Kings will match, but every team should offer that.

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06-26-2011, 02:45 PM
  #102
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Originally Posted by Arpeggio View Post
Oilers should offer 7+ million. I know the Kings will match, but every team should offer that.
I was just thinking the same thing.The Edmonton Oilers are weak on the blue line and need a franchise defenceman.

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06-26-2011, 02:46 PM
  #103
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Originally Posted by fsanford View Post
how many offer sheets did Bobby Ryan get last year?
Quite possibly 29. There's no telling because nobody has to make them public. The only way you actually know is if they SIGN one.

Regardless, there's a huge difference between a top young power forward usually regarded as CURRENTLY a top 30 forward and a young, Norris nominated #1 franchise defenseman, don't you think?

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06-26-2011, 02:47 PM
  #104
TheStranger
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Arpeggio View Post
Oilers should offer 7+ million. I know the Kings will match, but every team should offer that.
Quote:
Originally Posted by oilersfan11 View Post
I was just thinking the same thing.The Edmonton Oilers are weak on the blue line and need a franchise defenceman.
Not sure that Edmonton would want to lose the 2 1st round picks. Could/Will likely both be top 10 picks, that could be another Doughty right there and who knows what else.

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06-26-2011, 02:50 PM
  #105
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Not sure that Edmonton would want to lose the 2 1st round picks. Could/Will likely both be top 10 picks, that could be another Doughty right there and who knows what else.
If Edmonton is still picking in the top-10 with Hall, Eberle, PRV, Gagner, Smyth and RNH up front as well as Doughty and Whitney on the back end then they have some serious problems.

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06-26-2011, 02:52 PM
  #106
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Originally Posted by CloutierForVezina View Post
If Edmonton is still picking in the top-10 with Hall, Eberle, PRV, Gagner, Smyth and RNH up front as well as Doughty and Whitney on the back end then they have some serious problems.
who's in net?

RNH probably won't affect much this year. So the only real addition(s) would be Smyth and Doughty. Is that enough to move up 10+ spots?

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06-26-2011, 02:53 PM
  #107
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who's in net?

RNH probably won't affect much this year. So the only real addition(s) would be Smyth and Doughty. Is that enough to move up 10+ spots?
Another year of development for Hall, Eberle and PRV. Hopefully a healthy Whitney and Hemsky. Hopefully more games for Dubnyk and less games for Khabi.

Plus Doughty? Should be a fringe playoff team, not a top-10 pick.

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06-26-2011, 02:59 PM
  #108
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Originally Posted by markisonfire View Post
If you look at the top 10 cap hits for defensemen, you see some really horrible deals. Campbell, Bouwmeester, Redden, Jovanovski. If Doughty is getting 5.7 per, he has a higher cap hit than Duncan Keith. I don't think that 5.7 is ridiculous at all, he's making more than the player that beat him for the Norris trophy two seasons ago. He would have a higher cap hit than Keith, Pronger, Visnovsky...
Bad comparisons. Keith and Pronger are on (now illegal) retirement contracts (not Pronger's fault Philly screwed up and can't get out of it, they thought they could). And Visnovsky was signed when the cap was 12-15M lower, as a comparison contract it's an embarrassing lowball to Doughty. The cap is huge right now, saying that the guy Kings fans like to say will be taking over Lidstrom's dominant defenseman position should be paid as the #11 cap hit (#10 is actually 5.75M) is insulting to him unless the contract is a long term front loaded contract to get him more cash.

And the Kings have 16M in cap space. An extra 1 to Doughty won't break the bank.

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06-26-2011, 03:00 PM
  #109
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5.7 seems a little low.

6.3 more likely. That's an extra 3M

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06-26-2011, 03:01 PM
  #110
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Doughty will come back with a higher number, all part of the process. Hopefully both sides will meet somewhere in the middle. Kings have space even to take on a little more from an offer sheet not to mention Hickey, Voynov, Muzzin and Drewiske in the pipe ready to step in. We can always move Scuderi, Mitchell, or Greene if needed.

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06-26-2011, 03:04 PM
  #111
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Originally Posted by Ducks DVM View Post
Bad comparisons. Keith and Pronger are on (now illegal) retirement contracts (not Pronger's fault Philly screwed up and can't get out of it, they thought they could). And Visnovsky was signed when the cap was 12-15M lower, as a comparison contract it's an embarrassing lowball to Doughty. The cap is huge right now, saying that the guy Kings fans like to say will be taking over Lidstrom's dominant defenseman position should be paid as the #11 cap hit (#10 is actually 5.75M) is insulting to him unless the contract is a long term front loaded contract to get him more cash.

And the Kings have 16M in cap space. An extra 1 to Doughty won't break the bank.
Well put.

Usually I don't think these offer sheets from other teams make much sense, but in this case, I don't think an offer from someone like Edmonton at $7 mil is that far fetched. Doughty is worth it. Lombardi better loosen the purse strings, before someone forces him to.

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06-26-2011, 03:05 PM
  #112
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No chance it's that low. At least 6+

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06-26-2011, 03:09 PM
  #113
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Something that as a Ducks fan that makes me cringe - Rafalski retired (6M), the cap went up 4M, Lidstrom probably last year, Doughty on a 10 year front loaded contract at 7M wearing that damned red....?

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06-26-2011, 03:37 PM
  #114
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Well put.

Usually I don't think these offer sheets from other teams make much sense, but in this case, I don't think an offer from someone like Edmonton at $7 mil is that far fetched. Doughty is worth it. Lombardi better loosen the purse strings, before someone forces him to.
oh they will .rich teams been subsidizing tampa and LA for a long time .....i hope they start paying for all these low draft picks ....especially tampa

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06-26-2011, 03:43 PM
  #115
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oh they will .rich teams been subsidizing tampa and LA for a long time .....i hope they start paying for all these low draft picks ....especially tampa
Teams with over 2.5 million tv homes don't get revenue sharing. You know, places like LA?

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06-26-2011, 03:47 PM
  #116
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Funny how people here are referring to this offer as "insulting". Do you ever think that maybe, just maybe, players are out for something more than just money? Players take discount contracts all the time, and the Kings were Doughty's favorite team growing up. I think Doughty's contract will be higher than 5.7 per, but it's closer than some of you think.

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06-26-2011, 03:47 PM
  #117
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oh they will .rich teams been subsidizing tampa and LA for a long time .....i hope they start paying for all these low draft picks ....especially tampa
Ummm what? LA doesn't take ANY revenue sharing money and their ownership group is one of the 3 richest ownership groups in the league.

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06-26-2011, 03:51 PM
  #118
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Originally Posted by Ducks DVM View Post
Quite possibly 29. There's no telling because nobody has to make them public. The only way you actually know is if they SIGN one.

Regardless, there's a huge difference between a top young power forward usually regarded as CURRENTLY a top 30 forward and a young, Norris nominated #1 franchise defenseman, don't you think?
In this day and age of electronic media, I highly doubt that if an offer sheet was tendered it would not be made public. Given when Ryan was actually inked (Sept 2010), seems no takers out there.

Comparison, both 2nd picks in the first round. You could argue Ryan actually had a much better season prior to his RFA year, Guy had 35 goals and 29 assists, going into his RFA. Doughty took a step back. Have teams figured out how to get into his head or how to play him. Teams were taking runs at him last year and he did not adjust well.

You mention Ryan is a top 30 player, but he is probably at top 3 left winger and that makes him that much more valuable. And yet what did he sign for? 5 million cap hit.. That seems low for a premier left winger, and yet there it is.

There are reasons teams do not throw ridiculous offer sheets out very often.

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06-26-2011, 04:00 PM
  #119
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In this day and age of electronic media, I highly doubt that if an offer sheet was tendered it would not be made public.
What? No. That guy was right, there was likely 29 teams talking to his agent and seeing what he wanted to sign for. An offer sheet isn't anything special, it's just a contract that an RFA has signed with another team.

The lack of offer sheets going through tells us that Ryan did not sign a contract with any other team - no more, no less. It tells us nothing about the negotiations that went on between his agent any other team.

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You mention Ryan is a top 30 player, but he is probably at top 3 left winger and that makes him that much more valuable.
Top 3 LW? Not yet, Daniel Sedin, Kovalchuk, Ovechkin and Parise are all clearly better. Zetterberg too if you want to consider him a LW. Nash and Marleau are right up there too.

Top 5? You could argue he grabs the #5 spot. Top 10? Definitely.

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06-26-2011, 04:42 PM
  #120
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imo that is low-balling your franchise player..

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06-26-2011, 04:47 PM
  #121
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imo that is low-balling your franchise player..
Nope. Kopitar already signed long term, making good money.

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06-26-2011, 04:49 PM
  #122
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Nope. Kopitar already signed long term, making good money.
hmm interesting.. kopitar is the franchise? i thought the team was built around doughty..

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06-26-2011, 05:04 PM
  #123
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hmm interesting.. kopitar is the franchise? i thought the team was built around doughty..
Doughty had a down season. The defense is built around him, but right now the team is built around Kopitar. This was very clear when Kopitar went down and our announcing team almost killed themselves right there in the booth.

Doughty is a LA guy. He lives on the beach, a young bachelor in a beach house, and was a King fan growing up. I don't think the offer is insulting at all after having a pretty meh year.

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06-26-2011, 05:15 PM
  #124
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Doughty had a down season. The defense is built around him, but right now the team is built around Kopitar. This was very clear when Kopitar went down and our announcing team almost killed themselves right there in the booth.

Doughty is a LA guy. He lives on the beach, a young bachelor in a beach house, and was a King fan growing up. I don't think the offer is insulting at all after having a pretty meh year.
Wasn't that more because they were so decimated by injuries, and that was clearly the one that they couldn't possibly recover from? If the entire team had been healthy when ti happened, i don't think that would have been AS huge a deal. Still very big obviously, but not the absolute end of all hope as it was at that point.

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06-26-2011, 05:17 PM
  #125
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Wasn't that more because they were so decimated by injuries, and that was clearly the one that they couldn't possibly recover from? If the entire team had been healthy when ti happened, i don't think that would have been AS huge a deal. Still very big obviously, but not the absolute end of all hope as it was at that point.
No, Williams was the only other injury at that point, and IIRC, it was known that there was a good chance he would play in the first round anyway.

And Jim Fox was absolutely destroyed emotionally when Kopi want down. You could just tell he wasn't taking it well. He barely even spoke for the rest of that game.

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