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Now That He's in the HHOF Should Howe's #2 Be Retired

View Poll Results: Should the #2 Be Retired in 2011-12 by the Flyers to Honor Mark Howe?
Yes 35 70.00%
No 9 18.00%
Maybe in a later season 6 12.00%
Voters: 50. You may not vote on this poll

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Old
06-28-2011, 06:20 PM
  #26
FlyerX
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BlackDog13 View Post
I enjoyed WHA hockey, about as freewheeling as it got or gets. My friends and I used to go to MSG to watch the NY Raiders (later Golden Blades) on Sunday afternoons for $2 bucks with our junior high IDs. We saw the Howe trio on their first (and only) trip into New York that season before the team moved to Cherry Hill.
We lived near Cleveland for awhile so I got to see the Aeros, Hull with the Jets, most of the teams in the league, but they were the top attractions.

The league was way ahead of the NHL in the ideas department. Regular season OT, using the underagers, going for Euros and US college players. One thing they did that I thought was cool was they had an all Canadian division. With 7 teams now, I wonder how current Canadian fans would like that. Lots of travel but those divisional games and playoff races would be hot.

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Old
06-28-2011, 06:32 PM
  #27
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BlackDog13 View Post
I enjoyed WHA hockey, about as freewheeling as it got or gets. My friends and I used to go to MSG to watch the NY Raiders (later Golden Blades) on Sunday afternoons for $2 bucks with our junior high IDs. We saw the Howe trio on their first (and only) trip into New York that season before the team moved to Cherry Hill.
I got to see the former Raiders/Golden Blades at the old Cherry Hill Ice House in their half season there as the Jersey Knights... some still sporting the gold colored skate blades.

Rough times for the competition league in those days with many of the less established teams... Funny story on how the Knights got their nickname and shield; in moving the team to the area they needed a new identity and uniform so they sought area suppliers and found the only one that could get them enough in their time-frame had a team's worth of uniforms with a chess knight on the front... So the tail wagged the dog... or so the story goes.

They were interesting games with IIRC Harry Howell as player/coach and metal screens rather than glass around the rink... causing interesting caroms and resulting plays. In a time where Flyers tickets were hard to obtain, most home games were blacked out, and when hockey was white hot in the Delaware Valley the Knights games were fun and families and groups of friends could all attend the same games in adjoining seats... kinda like the Phantoms a few years back.

Sorry for the somewhat off topic post.

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Old
06-28-2011, 06:48 PM
  #28
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I said yes but I get it if they don't. I don't agree with the Stanley Cup requirement, but I understand where the management is coming from. If that's the rule that's the rule (written or otherwise). Some teams go crazy with numbers, some don't.

I think a player's number should be retired if he left a legacy that will last forever. This is why I think Ron Hextall's should be retired. His name is synonymous with Flyers hockey. Arguably Howe didn't have this sort of legacy until today (I know that will piss people off, but the shear fact that a lot of Flyers fans couldn't pick him out of a lineup shows this). Getting into the Hall of Fame should get your number in the rafters IMO.

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Old
06-28-2011, 10:02 PM
  #29
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his legacy is greatest flyer defenseman ever. Umm thats quite a legacy

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06-29-2011, 12:08 AM
  #30
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Originally Posted by Jtown View Post
BSB were before my time, I caught on in the mid 80's and I think anyone who watched the 87 finals holds a special place in their heart for that team.

When i think Flyers , i seriously think of that 87 team, poulin, howe, hexy, propp, tocchet. But to me howe was my favorite.
I agree. The '85-'87 team sticks with me, as that is when I really started watching the Flyers all the time. I can remember vaguely the Flyers winning the Cup, but I was 5 and 6.

I always felt like Howe got the shaft. He should have had one or two Norris' instead of Paul Coffey. The Howe/McCrimmon tandem was awesome. Howe was +85 in 1986 and McCrimmon was +83. Coffey was +61 that year on a monster Edmonton team, and he won the Norris.

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Old
06-29-2011, 02:48 AM
  #31
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Retire it.


Last edited by WeekendAtBernies: 06-29-2011 at 03:14 AM.
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Old
06-29-2011, 02:59 AM
  #32
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DrinkFightFlyers View Post
I think a player's number should be retired if he left a legacy that will last forever. This is why I think Ron Hextall's should be retired. His name is synonymous with Flyers hockey. Arguably Howe didn't have this sort of legacy until today (I know that will piss people off, but the shear fact that a lot of Flyers fans couldn't pick him out of a lineup shows this). Getting into the Hall of Fame should get your number in the rafters IMO.
I think Hextall & Lindbergh have somewhat strong cases to have their numbers retired despite not being in the hall or having a very slim chance to ever be in the hall. That's it though and I doubt it ever happens. Ultimately, you have to make it in the HOF to get your # retired.

And the only reason some of you young guys couldn't pick Howe out of a lineup is because you didn't watch those 80's teams. Hextall bridged two eras - the 80's teams & the LOD. Howe was the centerpiece of those 80's teams.

He was very much our Nick Lidstrom, but it was hard to win Norris against the likes of Ray Bourque and Paul Coffey.

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Old
06-29-2011, 07:15 AM
  #33
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Pantokrator View Post
Howe was +85 in 1986 and McCrimmon was +83.
Not only that, but look at the rest of the defense's plus-minuses that season:

Regulars
Marsh: Even
Crossman: -5
Eriksson: -12
Richter: -2
Stanley: -5

Part-timers/ short-term
Hospodar: Even (17 GP)
Stothers: +1 (6 GP)
McCarthy: Even (4 GP)
Smith: -1 (2 GP)

Also keep in mind, of course, that power play goals aren't included in the plus-minus totals. Howe was also lethal on the power play.

In other words, in the 30-35 minutes per game that Howe and McCrimmon were on the ice, the Flyers were the most dominant team in hockey (Edmonton included). The other 25-30 minutes, the Flyers were just an ordinary team.

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Old
06-29-2011, 07:19 AM
  #34
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Originally Posted by Pantokrator View Post
The Howe/McCrimmon tandem was awesome. Howe was +85 in 1986 and McCrimmon was +83.
A truly amazing achievement.

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06-29-2011, 07:38 AM
  #35
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bill_Meltzer View Post
Not only that, but look at the rest of the defense's plus-minuses that season:

Regulars
Marsh: Even
Crossman: -5
Eriksson: -12
Richter: -2
Stanley: -5

Part-timers/ short-term
Hospodar: Even (17 GP)
Stothers: +1 (6 GP)
McCarthy: Even (4 GP)
Smith: -1 (2 GP)






Also keep in mind, of course, that power play goals aren't included in the plus-minus totals. Howe was also lethal on the power play.

In other words, in the 30-35 minutes per game that Howe and McCrimmon were on the ice, the Flyers were the most dominant team in hockey (Edmonton included). The other 25-30 minutes, the Flyers were just an ordinary team.


That post pretty much puts everything in perspective. So are we all clear on weather or not we should or should not retire this man's number.

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Old
06-29-2011, 09:29 AM
  #36
Protest
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bill_Meltzer View Post
Not only that, but look at the rest of the defense's plus-minuses that season:

Regulars
Marsh: Even
Crossman: -5
Eriksson: -12
Richter: -2
Stanley: -5

Part-timers/ short-term
Hospodar: Even (17 GP)
Stothers: +1 (6 GP)
McCarthy: Even (4 GP)
Smith: -1 (2 GP)

Also keep in mind, of course, that power play goals aren't included in the plus-minus totals. Howe was also lethal on the power play.

In other words, in the 30-35 minutes per game that Howe and McCrimmon were on the ice, the Flyers were the most dominant team in hockey (Edmonton included). The other 25-30 minutes, the Flyers were just an ordinary team.
Wow. That's impressive.

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Old
07-22-2011, 02:56 PM
  #37
Sawdalite
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FWIW... Per the Official Flyers NHL Website, Lilja has changed his number from 2 to 6.

Common sense tells me that they changed it for a reason... and it is too much of a coincidence that Howe was selected to the HHoF and his old number has been pulled off of a player before he got to wear it (and would have to give it up).


Last edited by Sawdalite: 07-22-2011 at 03:02 PM.
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Old
07-22-2011, 04:06 PM
  #38
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sawdalite View Post
FWIW... Per the Official Flyers NHL Website, Lilja has changed his number from 2 to 6.

Common sense tells me that they changed it for a reason... and it is too much of a coincidence that Howe was selected to the HHoF and his old number has been pulled off of a player before he got to wear it (and would have to give it up).
What, I just bought a friggin' Lilja #2 jersey????

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Old
07-22-2011, 04:17 PM
  #39
Sawdalite
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What, I just bought a friggin' Lilja #2 jersey????
So... YOU were the one!

I hid it in the back of the rack and went to the ATM... when I returned it was gone.

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Old
07-23-2011, 06:46 AM
  #40
mja
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This is an interesting development.

But what is Lilja going to do when we retire Chris Therien's 6?

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