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Montreal signs Erik Cole - 4 years/$4.5M per Update: Contains NTC

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07-06-2011, 07:55 AM
  #901
Agnostic
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Originally Posted by Plekamaniac View Post
Sounds like Gauthier doled out a 4th year and 6M more than he had to.

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07-06-2011, 07:57 AM
  #902
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Originally Posted by Agnostic View Post
Sounds like Gauthier doled out a 4th year and 6M more than he had to.
You must have missed the part where Cole said he would have stayed in Carolina if the offers were similar.

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07-06-2011, 08:22 AM
  #903
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You must have missed the part where Cole said he would have stayed in Carolina if the offers were similar.
"All things being equal, we were definitely going to stay. I had talked to Paul (Maurice) about that."

Montreal initially offered $12M, Carolina $11M. Those offers are not equal. From the outset Montreal had the stronger pitch. Cole goes on to say that Montreal strengthened their offer (on amount and term) which surprised him.

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07-06-2011, 08:26 AM
  #904
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Originally Posted by Agnostic View Post
"All things being equal, we were definitely going to stay. I had talked to Paul (Maurice) about that."

Montreal initially offered $12M, Carolina $11M. Those offers are not equal. From the outset Montreal had the stronger pitch. Cole goes on to say that Montreal strengthened their offer (on amount and term) which surprised him.
You're right that those offers were not equal. Carolina's offer is actually better, on an after-tax basis, which is what Cole would be evaluating. Montreal had to significantly strengthen their offer to make the Habs offer more appealing after taxes and provide Cole with some kind of incentive to pack up all his family's belonging, sell his house, buy a new house, enroll his kids in new schools, etc.

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07-06-2011, 08:28 AM
  #905
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Originally Posted by Agnostic View Post
"All things being equal, we were definitely going to stay. I had talked to Paul (Maurice) about that."

Montreal initially offered $12M, Carolina $11M. Those offers are not equal. From the outset Montreal had the stronger pitch. Cole goes on to say that Montreal strengthened their offer (on amount and term) which surprised him.
From what I read in that article if the only 2 offers were 12 mil versus 11 mil he would ahve stayed in Carolina, so by going another year and upping the number they got him signed. If you procrastinate and worry about nickels and dimes he goes back to Carolina and then you are scrambling for a similar player and there are very few on the market.

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07-06-2011, 08:28 AM
  #906
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Originally Posted by Agnostic View Post
"All things being equal, we were definitely going to stay. I had talked to Paul (Maurice) about that."

Montreal initially offered $12M, Carolina $11M. Those offers are not equal. From the outset Montreal had the stronger pitch. Cole goes on to say that Montreal strengthened their offer (on amount and term) which surprised him.
That's the way the game goes. General managers don't have perfect information about what all other GMs and agents and players are thinking.

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07-06-2011, 08:42 AM
  #907
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cammi

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He uses an injured player to compare with too. I can say some ****** player produced more than Markov has in 3 seasons too. That isn't hard to do at all. So and so has produced more than Markov in 2 seasons than he has in 3!And Cammi does well come playoff time.

Using an injured player to win a points argument is beyond retarded.
And Cammi does well come playoff time.

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07-06-2011, 08:47 AM
  #908
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Originally Posted by ScopeHockey View Post
You're right that those offers were not equal. Carolina's offer is actually better, on an after-tax basis, which is what Cole would be evaluating. Montreal had to significantly strengthen their offer to make the Habs offer more appealing after taxes and provide Cole with some kind of incentive to pack up all his family's belonging, sell his house, buy a new house, enroll his kids in new schools, etc.
So I guess all those who wish Gauthier would be more aggressive should be satisfied right because this is exactly what he did.

So not only was Gauthier able to identify what we needed, but he went out and acquired it and was aggressive in his endeavors. These are three things many complained about prior to july 1st. Gauthier is doing a pretty good job so far.

note: I'm not saying you(ScopeHockey) have said this, your post merely made me think of what was said earlier and what was done by Gauthier.

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07-06-2011, 09:01 AM
  #909
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Originally Posted by Koseegin View Post
So I guess all those who wish Gauthier would be more aggressive should be satisfied right because this is exactly what he did.

So not only was Gauthier able to identify what we needed, but he went out and acquired it and was aggressive in his endeavors. These are three things many complained about prior to july 1st. Gauthier is doing a pretty good job so far.

note: I'm not saying you(ScopeHockey) have said this, your post merely made me think of what was said earlier and what was done by Gauthier.
There is a continual whine for grit and when grit comes with size and speed and scoring ability Goat has to make a move. EC, MaxPac, AK all play a gritty style and can score and make plays. This move allows AK to move to the third line facilitating a more potent attack. The move is synergistic.

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07-06-2011, 09:12 AM
  #910
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There is a continual whine for grit and when grit comes with size and speed and scoring ability Goat has to make a move. EC, MaxPac, AK all play a gritty style and can score and make plays. This move allows AK to move to the third line facilitating a more potent attack. The move is synergistic.
I agree with what you see. The Canadiens have a lot of depth on the offensive side. They also have 3 physical wingers on three different lines.

Personally I'd like to see Gauthier actually replace Hamrlik's minutes. He offered Hamrlik a contract, so he obviously thought he had a role on this team. Hamrlik refused that contract, but we still haven't filled out the space Gauthier thought Hamrlik could fill.

A responsible minute-eating defensemen is a bigger priority imo.

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07-06-2011, 12:45 PM
  #911
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I agree with what you see. The Canadiens have a lot of depth on the offensive side. They also have 3 physical wingers on three different lines.

Personally I'd like to see Gauthier actually replace Hamrlik's minutes. He offered Hamrlik a contract, so he obviously thought he had a role on this team. Hamrlik refused that contract, but we still haven't filled out the space Gauthier thought Hamrlik could fill.

A responsible minute-eating defensemen is a bigger priority imo.
Agreed, it could turn out to be Yemelin, but I wouldn't bet my house on it. We need another solid D signing. I think the Cole signing will help players like Gionta too, I just have a feeling he could get 30-35 now with Cole here and some of the free space he'll open up. When most of your high end skill guys are smallish it is more difficult to light it up imo. Now with a big power forward in Erik Cole and hopefully a healthy MaxPac, we could see Gionta/Cammy have a really good year. I'm hoping AK breaks out big time too.

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07-06-2011, 01:46 PM
  #912
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As much as I like AK (and that's a lot) we should stop thinking he will have a breakout year. Yes, he is still young (26) and he may be a late-bloomer, but I think that he will stay a 25-25 PWF type of player. Which is very good.

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07-06-2011, 02:15 PM
  #913
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1)
4) I don't think the Crosby lottery was an even league wide lottery. I think some teams had better odds than others.
Yeah, but not by all that much really.

Pittsburgh had the highest chance to win the lottery and it was a 1/16 chance.

The top team (Detroit?) had 1/48.

By contrast in a normal year, the worst team has 1/2 chance to draft first and the other 1/2 the time they draft 2nd.

You still have to be pretty lucky to win the lottery on a 1/16 chance.

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07-06-2011, 03:07 PM
  #914
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Originally Posted by ScopeHockey View Post
You're right that those offers were not equal. Carolina's offer is actually better, on an after-tax basis, which is what Cole would be evaluating. Montreal had to significantly strengthen their offer to make the Habs offer more appealing after taxes and provide Cole with some kind of incentive to pack up all his family's belonging, sell his house, buy a new house, enroll his kids in new schools, etc.
geez I did the math and you are right . it would take a full million per year more to bridge the gap given nominal tax rates in QC. i knew it was bad, but that is crazy.

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07-06-2011, 03:17 PM
  #915
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Yeah, but not by all that much really.

Pittsburgh had the highest chance to win the lottery and it was a 1/16 chance.

The top team (Detroit?) had 1/48.

By contrast in a normal year, the worst team has 1/2 chance to draft first and the other 1/2 the time they draft 2nd.

You still have to be pretty lucky to win the lottery on a 1/16 chance.
Four teams (cbj, nyr, pitts, buff) had a 1/16 chance
ten teams had a 1/24 chance
sixteen teams had a 1/48 chance

Ridiculous the lack of transparency for that lottery and I still have my lingering doubts about its legitimacy.

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07-06-2011, 03:22 PM
  #916
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Originally Posted by Agnostic View Post
Four teams (cbj, nyr, pitts, buff) had a 1/16 chance
ten teams had a 1/24 chance
sixteen teams had a 1/48 chance

Ridiculous the lack of transparency for that lottery and I still have my lingering doubts about its legitimacy.
My thoughts exactly. I have no doubt in my mind that it was fixed.

How ironic is it that Pittsburgh was on the verge of collapse and they just happen to get 1st overall and have Crosby save their franchise....seems extremely fishy to me.

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07-06-2011, 05:21 PM
  #917
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Meh. A thriving Pittsburgh is good for the whole NHL, specially with shared revenues. A bankrupted team there would have been horrible PR event, potentially devastating to the NHL.

Why you care so much about fairness there? We got Price out of it!!

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07-06-2011, 05:39 PM
  #918
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Originally Posted by Koseegin View Post
So I guess all those who wish Gauthier would be more aggressive should be satisfied right because this is exactly what he did.

[I]So not only was Gauthier able to identify what we needed, but he went out and acquired it and was aggressive in his endeavors. These are three things many complained about prior to july 1st. Gauthier is doing a pretty good job so far.[/I]

note: I'm not saying you(ScopeHockey) have said this, your post merely made me think of what was said earlier and what was done by Gauthier.
Our expectations have really gone really low.

4 of our Top 6 forwards are midgets, and now we praise Gauthier as a genius for figuring out that we needed someone more than 6 feet tall on our Top 6!!!

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07-06-2011, 05:46 PM
  #919
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Originally Posted by plafleur10 View Post
Our expectations have really gone really low.

4 of our Top 6 forwards are midgets, and now we praise Gauthier as a genius for figuring out that we needed someone more than 6 feet tall on our Top 6!!!
You obviously have no ****ing clue what a "midget is". Get real.

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07-06-2011, 05:53 PM
  #920
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Originally Posted by plafleur10 View Post
Our expectations have really gone really low.

4 of our Top 6 forwards are midgets, and now we praise Gauthier as a genius for figuring out that we needed someone more than 6 feet tall on our Top 6!!!
Sooo we should bash him for doing exactly what was needed to be done? I'm lost...

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07-06-2011, 05:55 PM
  #921
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Except for Gionta and Cammalleri, who is a "midget" on our top 6? Plekanec and Gomez are both 5'11", the same size as Sidney Crosby, widely considered the best player in hockey.

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07-06-2011, 05:56 PM
  #922
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Heart is measured before height imo.

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07-06-2011, 06:14 PM
  #923
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Originally Posted by FlyingRat View Post
Except for Gionta and Cammalleri, who is a "midget" on our top 6? Plekanec and Gomez are both 5'11", the same size as Sidney Crosby, widely considered the best player in hockey.
Gionta and Cammalleri happen to be damn good goalscorers too.

But hey, they're midgets. **** 'em.

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07-06-2011, 06:21 PM
  #924
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Except for Gionta and Cammalleri, who is a "midget" on our top 6? Plekanec and Gomez are both 5'11", the same size as Sidney Crosby, widely considered the best player in hockey.
Gomez is not 5'11.

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07-06-2011, 06:48 PM
  #925
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Gomez is not 5'11.
Funny considering every hockey pulication or website I have seen lists him as...

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