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Burke To Have Contract Discussions Today With MacArthur

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Old
07-05-2011, 11:44 AM
  #126
Deebo
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edit: double

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Old
07-05-2011, 11:50 AM
  #127
Epictetus
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Originally Posted by Interactif View Post
When Kessel scored 30 last year, for his 3rd straight 30+ goal year, someone mentioned I think he was only 1 of 7(maybe less but let's say 7 off the top of my head) current NHL players to do this. Consistent 30 goal scorers are a rare breed.
But does that help a team more than a guy who puts up more points?

Individual goals are great and all, but the ability for a player to fit into a line-up to generate goals is what is important.

Pay a little bit extra, by 500k, with regard to the richest nhl team that has cap space and it should be no problem locking a guy who will be a key contributor to the teams post-season drive.

It's not worth the gamble to rely on Kulemin, Grabovski and player X when the line worked amazing with MacArthur.

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Old
07-05-2011, 11:51 AM
  #128
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Originally Posted by Volcanologist View Post
He'll probably get 3.5 or 4 in arbitration, and that's too much. If he was a proven 60 point guy that would be different, but he's not. And look at the deal a guy like Leino got...one decent year and cashed in huge. we can't do a deal like that.

Ideally I'd like him at 2.5 on a 2 year deal, but we won't get him that cheap.
Just so everyone is clear, UFA signings cannot be used as a reference in RFA arbitration hearings. Mac will need to bring up the contracts of other RFAs to prove why he's worth the 3mil+ he is asking.

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Old
07-05-2011, 12:21 PM
  #129
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Originally Posted by Deebo View Post
No they can't.

An SPC signed by a UFA is inadmissable as evidence and cannot be used by the arbitrator when awarding a contract.

It's in the CBA:

(iii) The following categories of evidence are inadmissible and shall not be considered by the Arbitrator:

(1) Any contract the term of which began when the player party to such contract was not a Group II Player;

EDIT: Sorry, misread your post, but what good does comparing yourself to a UFA contract internally do?

It will have no effect on the arbitration
Quote:
Originally Posted by Zrinski View Post
Just so everyone is clear, UFA signings cannot be used as a reference in RFA arbitration hearings. Mac will need to bring up the contracts of other RFAs to prove why he's worth the 3mil+ he is asking.
Guys don't bother ...

Know that you're both right and he is crazy and continue your discussions with others about the real point of the thread.

Accordingly ... lol ... I think Mac will be signed to a 3 year deal for 8.75-9.5 mil total or be awarded a 1 year 3.5 mil contract. I'd much prefer the former to the latter since regardless he's a UFA at the end of whatever deal signed which means, if he does continue his current level of play, we will be paying far more than the ~2.9/yr following that. Also, as I said earlier, at that price, what is our real fear? 2.9 is a price tag for a mid-range third liner if compared to the UFA market and Mac is almost certainly going to exceed that low expectation.


Last edited by Squiffy: 07-05-2011 at 12:40 PM.
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Old
07-05-2011, 12:25 PM
  #130
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We refused to give Antropov 3 million...

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Old
07-05-2011, 12:26 PM
  #131
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Originally Posted by Auliewantsisplayoffs View Post
Guys don't bother ... Volcanologist is clearly either a troll or completely oblivious to both reason and his own statements. He has the honour of being the first person on my ignore list (though I don't know what that does) and doesn't deserve your time and energy.
I'm not sure why he's being stubborn on this point, but clearly you haven't posted here long; Vocanologist is one of the few intelligent posters in these parts.

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Old
07-05-2011, 12:29 PM
  #132
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Mac wants long term, 3-4 years, but no way Burke will give him more than 2. Arbitration will award Mac 3.5-4.5mil for a year. With that said, i can see a compromise as Burke knows no Mac could possibly effect the chemistry by sticking someone else to play wing with Grabo and Khulie so look for 2 years between 2.5-3.3 per, otherwise it will go to arbitration and goodbye Mac, and really does Mac wanna start all over again? Would he be paired up with guys he meshed so well with, somewhere else? Would he even be brought into another team for the top 6??? Mac said after the season in a interview that happiness is more important than money meaning he would take a hometown discount, and i think he meant it, but he also meant a hometown discount for a long term deal (3-4 years) I really dont wanna see Mac leave, he upped both his linemates game as much as he did his own and they can build on that success to become the best 2nd line in all of the NHL this year and yrs to come.
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Originally Posted by Rymistri View Post
What do you guys think is a fair $$/term for Mac?

3.75 x 3?

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Old
07-05-2011, 12:33 PM
  #133
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Originally Posted by Exoma View Post
We refused to give Antropov 3 million...
4 million*

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Old
07-05-2011, 12:33 PM
  #134
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burke = 1-2 years

mac- 3 or more

term is definitely the issue

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Old
07-05-2011, 12:40 PM
  #135
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17000 post troll. Pretty successful. Sly that he hasn't been banned yet.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Auliewantsisplayoffs View Post
Guys don't bother ... Volcanologist is clearly either a troll or completely oblivious to both reason and his own statements. He has the honour of being the first person on my ignore list (though I don't know what that does) and doesn't deserve your time and energy.

Know that you're both right and he is crazy and continue your discussions with others about the real point of the thread.

Accordingly ... lol ... I think Mac will be signed to a 3 year deal for 8.75-9.5 mil total or be awarded a 1 year 3.5 mil contract. I'd much prefer the former to the latter since regardless he's a UFA at the end of whatever deal signed which means, if he does continue his current level of play, we will be paying far more than the ~2.9/yr following that. Also, as I said earlier, at that price, what is our real fear? 2.9 is a price tag for a mid-range third liner if compared to the UFA market and Mac is almost certainly going to exceed that low expectation.

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Old
07-05-2011, 12:45 PM
  #136
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You guys are missing the simplicity of the point Pep is making, that being that Mac and his agent could be looking around at these UFA signings and thinking. "well heck, Mac's better then that, why shouldn't he be worth that much too?", and then going back to Burke/arbitrator with that number.

He's not arguing that it can be used in arbitration, he's got that, but he's right in hypothetically stating that Mac and his agent can cruise into the hearing arguing $4.5 million if they feel like it based on what they've seen UFA's going for. Won't get far, as everyone is so passionately pointing out (everyone read my posts a few days ago regarding this I'll assume from this thread lol..), but they could.

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07-05-2011, 12:48 PM
  #137
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Squiffy View Post
You guys are missing the simplicity of the point Pep is making, that being that Mac and his agent could be looking around at these UFA signings and thinking. "well heck, Mac's better then that, why shouldn't he be worth that much too?", and then going back to Burke/arbitrator with that number.

He's not arguing that it can be used in arbitration, he's got that, but he's right in hypothetically stating that Mac and his agent can cruise into the hearing arguing $4.5 million if they feel like it based on what they've seen UFA's going for. Won't get far, as everyone is so passionately pointing out (everyone read my posts a few days ago I'll assume from this thread lol..), but they could.
Yes they could but then Mac should probably fire his agent.

If they do walk into the hearing like that, its good for us

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Old
07-05-2011, 12:51 PM
  #138
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OMG BUT SOME UFA GUY GOT 4.5 MILLION AND HE SUCKS BLAH BLAH BLAH


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07-05-2011, 12:51 PM
  #139
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Originally Posted by Vexxed14 View Post
Yes they could but then Mac should probably fire his agent.

If they do walk into the hearing like that, its good for us
Sure, but that's all he's saying. Mac and his agent can set any price they feel like, and maybe UFA signings are influencing their proposed price. It's not entirely crazy or anything.

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Old
07-05-2011, 12:52 PM
  #140
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Originally Posted by Gberg View Post
Burke will give him an option, 1 year at 3.5mil, or 3 years at 2.1mil per year.

It'll be Mac's decision.
This makes little sense. At 2.1 he would be getting much less than several mediocre players and contributors on the roster. I think Burke will overpay on this one since there's nothing left on the UFA market. I say 4 years, 16 million and he will regret it.

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07-05-2011, 12:53 PM
  #141
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Originally Posted by Epictetus View Post
How are goals more valuable?
Two assists for every one goal and the most goals, not the most assists wins the game. But not sure about the comp of Kessel to Mac last year. Kessel was so far into the minus column I have a hard time saying he was as valuable as Mac, in spite of the goals. I do hope he is back as I wouldn't mess with the mojo of the number two line, and what is potentially a nice succession plan for working Kadri in, although Lupul has to bring up his game or it will Kadri in his spot rather than Macs one day.

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07-05-2011, 12:53 PM
  #142
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I think his agent is playing hardball. Unfortunately for him he is up against Burke. I bet Mac says "enough" before the deadline today and signs for 3 years at a cheap rate. He doesn't want to leave and at the end of the day (literally ) he will do what it takes to stay on here.

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Old
07-05-2011, 12:54 PM
  #143
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Squiffy View Post
You guys are missing the simplicity of the point Pep is making, that being that Mac and his agent could be looking around at these UFA signings and thinking. "well heck, Mac's better then that, why shouldn't he be worth that much too?", and then going back to Burke/arbitrator with that number.

He's not arguing that it can be used in arbitration, he's got that, but he's right in hypothetically stating that Mac and his agent can cruise into the hearing arguing $4.5 million if they feel like it based on what they've seen UFA's going for. Won't get far, as everyone is so passionately pointing out (everyone read my posts a few days ago regarding this I'll assume from this thread lol..), but they could.
there we go. thx Squiff.

And hey, maybe I'm wrong and that isn't what they do. but it sure makes sense when they're talking among themselves and deciding what number they want to give.

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Old
07-05-2011, 12:54 PM
  #144
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Incidentally, on topic, I'm expecting arbitration to be filed for from the Mac camp, but I still think a deal gets done before the hearing.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Squiffy View Post
Re: Kadri to second line in Mac spot

I'm feeling like there's no urgency to get any deal done because that's a reasonable plan B in quite a lot of ways, like you mention. Then you have Frattin waiting in the wings for a 3rd line wing spot, which is plausible if Mac goes, or you never know, maybe they scare up another 3rd line wing in a trade or signing yet too. If they do, then the cards are on the table for Mac to be gone I'd say.. something to keep an eye out for.

The flip side, I also feel like this is a negotiation process that Burke is really turning the screws on. The above should be obvious to Mac and his agent as well, and adding Lombardi ratchets up the pressure more IMO. I think Burke's counting on the Mac camp caving, in both not wanting to go through the arbitration process again, since that can't have been a good experience last year for Mac, and that Mac ultimately simply does not want to leave, he's had a career year here last year playing on a line he had great chemistry with, and moving to yet another new situation will just leave a lot of uncertainty likely as for his role and fit. He knows he can come back here in a top 6 spot on a line he clicks on, and then cash in in a year or 2 as a UFA from doing so.

I think the second scenario is what's going to shake down if you want my guess, and a shorter contract like Burke wants gets done prior to arbitration. Mac would be nuts to walk from this spot.

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Old
07-05-2011, 12:54 PM
  #145
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Quote:
Originally Posted by crump View Post
I think his agent is playing hardball. Unfortunately for him he is up against Burke. I bet Mac says "enough" before the deadline today and signs for 3 years at a cheap rate. He doesn't want to leave and at the end of the day (literally ) he will do what it takes to stay on here.
I am still betting that burkie only wants a 1-2 year contract.

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Old
07-05-2011, 01:05 PM
  #146
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This deal should have been inked right at the end of last season prior to all the UFA inflation. Unless he was targeting another top 6 player he thought he would sign via free agency.

He is not my fav Leaf but I wouldn't mess with that chemistry or that line. They produced over 80 goals & had a very respectable +/-

Get this done!

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Old
07-05-2011, 01:08 PM
  #147
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Ladd's new contract, now there's one the MacArthur camp can use.

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Old
07-05-2011, 01:10 PM
  #148
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Leafs have to bring back Garbo and Kuly next year, if Mac is signed to a 3+ contract

that will be like 8 forwards making 3+

not that im against that but if you don't move Komi, then Garbo and Kuly take precedence

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Old
07-05-2011, 01:10 PM
  #149
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So with Ladd sign a 5yr deal worth $22 Million, do you think that MacArthur's agent uses this as leverage?

I would really love for MacArthur to stay but not at an inflated price. 3 Yr $10Mil sounds good to me.

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07-05-2011, 01:11 PM
  #150
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Ladd just signed 22/5

4.4M cap hit.

I could see Mac's camp trying to use this one.

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