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Old
07-07-2011, 12:13 PM
  #26
mrjimmyg89
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Quote:
Originally Posted by OnlyTheBrave View Post
Frolik has a more proven track record than Boyle, I get it, you are a Rangers fan and you like the guy but 1 pretty decent year and you think he's worth more than Frolik?

Frolik had a down year, but that's not enough where the Hawks would have to add to get Boyle.

How well did Boyle do in the playoffs? How many of his 0pts helped his team? Consider that as well, a 21 goal scorer suddenly disappears in the playoffs, an enormous task for a 6'7" W/C.

Value wise, the Rangers need Boyle more like Thadd said. So it's skewed.
He has a proven track record as being a 40 point player. His career high in points is 45, his rookie season. Last season he scored 39 poiints in 80 games, pretty much his average. To me, Frolik is the next Andrew Cogliano. A guy with a lot of skill in the CHL, but can't put it together in the NHL. He's not someone with size like a Boyle that needed time to put it together. Boyle being a 25-30 point, 3rd/4th line center, killing penalties, wearing down defenders, and winning faceoffs at about a 55% clip would be more valuable to the Rangers than a winger that will put up 40-45 points. They already have Wolski, and he's bigger and has the ability to play better in a Torts system than Frolik.

In what should have been Frolik's year to put it together, he put up less points. Playing on Florida, he should have put up around 50-55 points playing the minutes he was receiving. Even in Chicago, they were playing him with Hossa at points, and he still didn't produce to the level he should have.

Even besides this trade, Chicago and NY aren't good trading partners.

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07-07-2011, 12:27 PM
  #27
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Seriously?

Frolik for Brian frickin Boyle?

No way. Boyle had 0 points in the playoffs. Yeah, what a great help he would be. On the other side, Frolik had a great playoffs. 5 points in 7 games and a +3.

Maybe give some draft picks or prospects for him but why would we give a 22 year old with a ton of potential, is good for 40+ points and has a chance to break out. Sorry, not buying into Brian Boyle who has had 1 good year as an NHL player.

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Old
07-07-2011, 12:47 PM
  #28
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I actually like this deal. I'm also not entirely sold on Boyle repeating last year.

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07-07-2011, 12:56 PM
  #29
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Originally Posted by RomersWorld View Post
Seriously?

Frolik for Brian frickin Boyle?

No way. Boyle had 0 points in the playoffs. Yeah, what a great help he would be. On the other side, Frolik had a great playoffs. 5 points in 7 games and a +3.

Maybe give some draft picks or prospects for him but why would we give a 22 year old with a ton of potential, is good for 40+ points and has a chance to break out. Sorry, not buying into Brian Boyle who has had 1 good year as an NHL player.
Well, so did Lundqvist.

I'm just saying, you don't know what role we asked him to play that series. When you're put up against the Ovechkin-Backstrom line, you're expected to play D well, not produce points.

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07-07-2011, 01:05 PM
  #30
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I think this is a solid deal and from an outsiders perspective, I see some benefits of this trade for both clubs. The Rangers need more skill and offensive prowess while the Hawks could certainly use a big body in the bottom six who does all the little things right.

Boyle - Bolland - Hossa would be a great PK line.

Frolik would give the Rangers some natural talent to work with in their top-6 LW slot.

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Old
07-07-2011, 01:21 PM
  #31
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Originally Posted by ostrichsized View Post
So what you're saying is that you or I look at Skille and see Skille, while Tallon looks at Skille and sees skill?
yes he does
Quote:
Originally Posted by mrjimmyg89 View Post
He has a proven track record as being a 40 point player. His career high in points is 45, his rookie season. Last season he scored 39 poiints in 80 games, pretty much his average. To me, Frolik is the next Andrew Cogliano. A guy with a lot of skill in the CHL, but can't put it together in the NHL. He's not someone with size like a Boyle that needed time to put it together. Boyle being a 25-30 point, 3rd/4th line center, killing penalties, wearing down defenders, and winning faceoffs at about a 55% clip would be more valuable to the Rangers than a winger that will put up 40-45 points. They already have Wolski, and he's bigger and has the ability to play better in a Torts system than Frolik.

In what should have been Frolik's year to put it together, he put up less points. Playing on Florida, he should have put up around 50-55 points playing the minutes he was receiving. Even in Chicago, they were playing him with Hossa at points, and he still didn't produce to the level he should have.

Even besides this trade, Chicago and NY aren't good trading partners.
you take a 20-30 Point Bottom 6 player over a 40 point Top6 Player who still has enough potential to get better?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Anton Volchenkov View Post
I think this is a solid deal and from an outsiders perspective, I see some benefits of this trade for both clubs. The Rangers need more skill and offensive prowess while the Hawks could certainly use a big body in the bottom six who does all the little things right.

Boyle - Bolland - Hossa would be a great PK line.

Frolik would give the Rangers some natural talent to work with in their top-6 LW slot.
3 Forwards on the PK?

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Old
07-07-2011, 01:26 PM
  #32
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Originally Posted by Bubba88 View Post
yes he does


you take a 20-30 Point Bottom 6 player over a 40 point Top6 Player who still has enough potential to get better?



3 Forwards on the PK?
hurr durr I'm a little tired. You get my drift though.

I forgot to mention that I think the Rangers would have to add something for the Hawks to consider it.

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Old
07-07-2011, 02:09 PM
  #33
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bubba88 View Post
you take a 20-30 Point Bottom 6 player over a 40 point Top6 Player who still has enough potential to get better?
Thing is, he isn't getting better. He has declined in points every season. Boyle got better last season. Frolik doesn't provide much outside of points. When you have a player who can put up 30 points, play the PK, and play a shutdown role on a 3rd or 4th line, as a center, that guy is more valuable than a player that puts up 40 points, on the wing, and can possibly play PK.

Size is also key in this. Frolik cannot grow to be 6'7. Boyle's physical presence adds to his value. Also, he provides someone to put in front of the net on the PP. You know, like the Hawks did with Byfuglein when he was on the team. Remember how much trouble he gave opposing goalies from planting himself right in front of them?

If anything Boyle is on the up trend while Frolik is the player moving downward in their careers. The numbers are telling the truth here. I wouldn't trade Boyle unless he's a piece in acquiring a 50-60 pt left winger. Frolik is not that player.

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Old
07-07-2011, 02:18 PM
  #34
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Quote:
Originally Posted by OnlyTheBrave View Post
Frolik has a more proven track record than Boyle, I get it, you are a Rangers fan and you like the guy but 1 pretty decent year and you think he's worth more than Frolik?

Frolik had a down year, but that's not enough where the Hawks would have to add to get Boyle.

How well did Boyle do in the playoffs? How many of his 0pts helped his team? Consider that as well, a 21 goal scorer suddenly disappears in the playoffs, an enormous task for a 6'7" W/C.

Value wise, the Rangers need Boyle more like Thadd said. So it's skewed.
Boyle didn't score in the playoffs but he played very well anyway. Had lots of chances. Over the 5 games playoff games he led the team in the in shots on goal-25. He had 20 hits--6 blocked shots. Won 43 faceoffs-lost 44 (on our team that's good). Was 3rd among the forwards in time on ice averaging over 21 minutes a game. Torts wouldn't haven't played him that much if he was disappointed in his play. If you think differently then you don't know Torts. Boyle has rounded out his game and plays in all situations--though not all that much pwp. He is a key penalty killer and right now he's working on his skating (which improved a lot last year) again this summer.

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Old
07-07-2011, 02:19 PM
  #35
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People don't realize Boyle has only played 2 full years in the NHL.

He improved drastically over last season and right now I'd prefer to keep him and see what he has instead of trading him for Frolik.

I just don't see Frolik being a fit here.

And if Chicago fans think so highly of Frolik then why are they so adamant on trading him?

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Old
07-07-2011, 02:25 PM
  #36
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No thank you

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Old
07-07-2011, 02:51 PM
  #37
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Originally Posted by Puckface NYR View Post
And if Chicago fans think so highly of Frolik then why are they so adamant on trading him?
We just realize you have to give something to get something...

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07-07-2011, 03:21 PM
  #38
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Originally Posted by coldsteelonice84 View Post
We just realize you have to give something to get something...
Which still means you want Boyle more than you want Frolik, yet are trying to convince Ranger fans that we should want Frolik more than we want Boyle.

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07-07-2011, 03:25 PM
  #39
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I do this deal. I'm no Frolik fan, but I think it's worth the gamble.

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Old
07-07-2011, 03:26 PM
  #40
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Originally Posted by coldsteelonice84 View Post
We just realize you have to give something to get something...
And what we are trying to say is Frolik doesn't fit our system. He is clearly more offensively talented than Boyle, but Boyle is literally the definition of this new Rangers identity.

He scored 20 goals last year in his second full NHL season and literally did everything else perfectly. He is a big body who might move to the wing and is great to put in front of the net on our 2nd pp unit (which was done towards the end of the season).

It would take an overpayment to get him. I feel like Frolik would be gone pretty quickly after we picked him up and i highly doubt Sather or Torts would give up Boyle for him.

Furthermore, Sather has made it fairly clear that he will not pursue a top 6 forward and will likely wait for our farm to develop while giving Wolski and Dubi a chance to fill those slots.

If anything, I'd do Wolski for Frolik, that's about it.

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07-07-2011, 03:30 PM
  #41
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Originally Posted by GAGLine View Post
Which still means you want Boyle more than you want Frolik, yet are trying to convince Ranger fans that we should want Frolik more than we want Boyle.
We have a bunch of good wingers. You guys have a bunch of good centers. That's all there is to it. Every team/fan wants to have as balanced of a roster as possible.

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Old
07-07-2011, 06:08 PM
  #42
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you need a Top6 LW, Hawks need C depth

you have enough C depth and Hawks have enough Winger depth


we give you the better player and we fill a need on our Roster.

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Old
07-07-2011, 06:32 PM
  #43
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Originally Posted by Bubba88 View Post
you need a Top6 LW, Hawks need C depth

you have enough C depth and Hawks have enough Winger depth


we give you the better player and we fill a need on our Roster.
Rather move Boyle to the wing than put Frolik there. Once again, he doesn't fit our teams identity, Boyle does to a T.

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Old
07-07-2011, 06:56 PM
  #44
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This is actually a very fair deal for both sides involved.

I wouldn't do it because I'd hate to lose the size, defensive presence, and physical play of Boyle.

On the other end, I'd do it because of Frolik's potential (which will probably never be realized - he'll end up as a middling 2nd liner who scores 20-25 goals and 50-60 points instead of being a 30+ goal point per game player like he should be one day) and the Rangers need for potential top line talent.

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