HFBoards

Go Back   HFBoards > General Hockey Discussion > Trade Rumors and Free Agent Talk
Mobile Hockey's Future Become a Sponsor Site Rules Support Forum vBookie Page 2
Trade Rumors and Free Agent Talk Trade rumors, transactions, and free agent talk. Rumors must contain the word RUMOR in post title. Proposals must contain the word PROPOSAL in post title.

Why did Bettman not hassle the Rangers in regards to Brad Richards Contract?

Reply
 
Thread Tools
Old
07-06-2011, 05:36 PM
  #26
Lion Hound
@JoeTucc26
 
Lion Hound's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: NY
Country: United States
Posts: 3,713
vCash: 500
Because "little bit-o-luck" fears Glen Sather!

Lion Hound is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
07-06-2011, 05:38 PM
  #27
Freudian
Clearly deranged
 
Freudian's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2003
Country: Sweden
Posts: 33,549
vCash: 50
What really reeks about the contract is that he is being paid massive signing bonuses the first two years while his 'salary' is only $2M/year and $4M/year. That way they can get away with paying him $1M/year towards the end because that is half of his 'salary' in the first year.

Freudian is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
07-06-2011, 05:40 PM
  #28
mrjimmyg89
'13-'14 East Champs
 
mrjimmyg89's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2010
Posts: 2,933
vCash: 500
The way to stop this: Salary that season = cap hit. Teams will not want to front load any deals UNLESS they have a ton of cap space. It'll hamper teams that already signed these contracts.

There will be some variation like the following:

If the salary for that season is higher than what the average amount is, that salary will be the cap hit.

If the salary is lower for that season, the cap hit will be: amount of money left on the deal x (the remaining years left x 1/3). That number is to remain the cap hit for the remainder of the contract, not done after every season.

So taking the Richards deal into perspective:

The second 12 million dollar season will be his cap hit once that season comes, as well as the 8.5 million and 7 million seasons. Once his 1 million dollar salary season's click in, which is with 3 years remaining, his cap hit would be the following:

3 mil x (3 years remaining x 1/3) = 3 million cap hit for the remaining 3 years of his contract.

mrjimmyg89 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
07-06-2011, 05:43 PM
  #29
DanZ
Registered User
 
Join Date: Mar 2008
Country: United States
Posts: 10,238
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by MilkHarvey View Post
So 4 is absolutely fine. But 6 my gawd in heaven...shock and awe.... That der circumvention!
They have to draw the line somewhere.

DanZ is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
07-06-2011, 05:44 PM
  #30
OlliMackBjugStud
Forever Ferkland
 
OlliMackBjugStud's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2002
Country: Canada
Posts: 4,765
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by f2d View Post
luongo's contract has 3 - 4 blatant cap cheat years (depending on how you look at it), similar to many other contracts

kovy had 6 or 7
it does? says who?

again, how much would you pay a 40 year old back up goalie and why is it cheating that the Canucks are paying fair market salary when he is 40?

would you pay your 40 year old back up more then 1million per season?

OlliMackBjugStud is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
07-06-2011, 05:46 PM
  #31
ponder
Registered User
 
ponder's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2007
Location: Vancouver
Country: Canada
Posts: 12,003
vCash: 500
It's right there in rule 32, section 7 of the CBA:
Quote:
36.7: Circumventing the cap through heavy front loading of contracts is perfect legal unless the team in question is located in Newark, New Jersey, in which case new rules shall be invented post-signing, with harsh draft related punishments to follow.

ponder is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
07-06-2011, 05:46 PM
  #32
Nazzy-19
Registered User
 
Join Date: Mar 2004
Location: Vancouver
Posts: 5,302
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Freudian View Post
What really reeks about the contract is that he is being paid massive signing bonuses the first two years while his 'salary' is only $2M/year and $4M/year. That way they can get away with paying him $1M/year towards the end because that is half of his 'salary' in the first year.
Thats not how it works.

The only impact the signing bonuses have are when he actually receives that money, as far as i know.


Last edited by Nazzy-19: 07-06-2011 at 05:54 PM.
Nazzy-19 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
07-06-2011, 05:48 PM
  #33
gotmonte
Registered User
 
gotmonte's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2010
Location: New York
Country: Italy
Posts: 1,545
vCash: 500
richards will be 40 the day his deal ends.

He is 31 right now.

As that is said, there was no issues with his contract.

And to be honest, I think Bettman wants superstars (or just stars lol) in the Rangers Market.

(pun intended; but I really do think Bettman wants quality players in the "bigger" markets)

gotmonte is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
07-06-2011, 05:54 PM
  #34
ThisYearsModel
Registered User
 
ThisYearsModel's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2004
Country: United States
Posts: 7,395
vCash: 500
Because the Kovalchuk amendment makes Richards' contract legal. The only reason for the severe frontloading is Bettman's intention to lock out the players again to drop the cap, even though the league is making money hand over fist now. The NHL has close to the highest ticket prices in all of pro sports, and overall attendance has increased again year over year. $300 Million paid on the first day of free agency this season. Unreal.

ThisYearsModel is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
07-06-2011, 05:54 PM
  #35
kyle evs48
No words needed
 
kyle evs48's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2008
Location: New Jersey
Country: United States
Posts: 30,039
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by f2d View Post
luongo's contract has 3 - 4 blatant cap cheat years (depending on how you look at it), similar to many other contracts

kovy had 6 or 7
So? It still has them.

Person A killed 6 or 7 people, but Person B only killed 3 or 4.

kyle evs48 is online now   Reply With Quote
Old
07-06-2011, 05:54 PM
  #36
M Moulson Ale
Brockoli
 
M Moulson Ale's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2011
Country: United States
Posts: 2,756
vCash: 500
Gary Bettmen=David Stern

M Moulson Ale is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
07-06-2011, 05:54 PM
  #37
Devilsfan92
4 8 15 16 23 42
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: ON
Country: Canada
Posts: 13,720
vCash: 500
Can some of you at least get the age right? It was 44.

1 year shorter than Luongo's
2 years shorter than Pronger's
2/3 years shorter than Hossa's
Franzen and Zetterbeg run until, what, age 40/41.

All end in their 40's, early 40's, all with bogus years to lower the cap hit, yet only one of them gets a fine, and a hefty one at that.

That's why NJ and their fans get pissed off.

The reason Richard's and Ehrhoff's contracts are fine is because the new rules they put in after the Kovalchuk amendment, if they follow the proper pay decrease scale and ends before 40 it's A-OK..

Devilsfan92 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
07-06-2011, 05:56 PM
  #38
yankeeken
Registered User
 
Join Date: Mar 2010
Posts: 34
vCash: 500
Because with or without Richards, the Rangers won't get passed the 2nd round of the playoffs.

yankeeken is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
07-06-2011, 05:57 PM
  #39
Miller Time NYR
Registered User
 
Miller Time NYR's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2010
Location: Long Island, NY
Country: United States
Posts: 5,568
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by kyle evs48 View Post
So? It still has them.

Person A killed 6 or 7 people, but Person B only killed 3 or 4.
Crosby slewfoots player A, no repercussions. Gillies slewfoots player B and he's suspended for 7 games. That's how the NHL works; all logic out the window.

Miller Time NYR is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
07-06-2011, 05:59 PM
  #40
Burmi
Registered User
 
Burmi's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2011
Location: 905
Posts: 720
vCash: 500
Richards will be 40 when contract his ends, and Kovalchuk ended at 44.

Burmi is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
07-06-2011, 06:00 PM
  #41
Fish on The Sand
Untouchable
 
Fish on The Sand's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2002
Location: Nanaimo
Country: Canada
Posts: 51,540
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by DEVILS ALL THE WAY View Post
If the league had a chart saying "If you do this.... that's your penalty" and so on and so forth, we wouldn't be scratching our heads, wondering what's valid and what's "illegal".

The Flyers circumvented the cap in the Talbot deal, yet, they'll get a "Mutombo finger wave" and walk away scot-free.

That's what pisses me off. The league decides who and when to fine a team and that's pure garbage IMO. Where does it say in the CBA that if a rule is broken when it comes to contracts that a 1st round pick, a 3rd round pick and several millions are the penalty for such actions?
What the Flyers did was more an administrative mistake than cheating the cap.

Fish on The Sand is online now   Reply With Quote
Old
07-06-2011, 06:02 PM
  #42
Hockey Team
Hunger Force
 
Hockey Team's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2009
Location: New York, NY
Country: United States
Posts: 4,485
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by kyle evs48 View Post
So? It still has them.

Person A killed 6 or 7 people, but Person B only killed 3 or 4.
So, kovy's contract STILL has cap cheat years.

I'm not saying it's right, but the fact the league allowed a bunch of contracts with 3 - 4 cap cheat years means they have to keep allowing them under the current CBA. They set a bad precedent so they have to live with it.

Hockey Team is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
07-06-2011, 06:04 PM
  #43
Fish on The Sand
Untouchable
 
Fish on The Sand's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2002
Location: Nanaimo
Country: Canada
Posts: 51,540
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by f2d View Post
So, kovy's contract STILL has cap cheat years.

I'm not saying it's right, but the fact the league allowed a bunch of contracts with 3 - 4 cap cheat years means they have to keep allowing them under the current CBA. They set a bad precedent so they have to live with it.
Actually the league didn't just let them go, they flagged those deals and only dropped their investigation in return for getting an amendment after the Kovalchuk contract.

Fish on The Sand is online now   Reply With Quote
Old
07-06-2011, 06:06 PM
  #44
mouser
Global Moderator
Business of Hockey
 
mouser's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2006
Location: South Mountain
Posts: 12,891
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by f2d View Post
technically kovy's didnt either, but his was just too much for the league to let by. Setting the precedence that putting in like 7 years of a contract that will never be played would be very bad.
Depends on what you mean by "technically". The league said it violated Article 26 of the CBA, and the impartial System Arbitrator agreed with the league that it did so when the NHLPA filed a grievance.

mouser is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
07-06-2011, 06:07 PM
  #45
kdb209
Global Moderator
 
kdb209's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2005
Posts: 13,039
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Freudian View Post
What really reeks about the contract is that he is being paid massive signing bonuses the first two years while his 'salary' is only $2M/year and $4M/year. That way they can get away with paying him $1M/year towards the end because that is half of his 'salary' in the first year.
Nope. Signing Bonuses are treated exactly like Salary w.r.t. the cap.

They are averaged in with salary for the cap hit.
They count against the 20% max salary.
They are included in the "100 Percent Rule" which limits the yr-to-yr increase/decrease in salary.

The drop from $7M to $1M is perfectly legal. Salary can drop up to 50% of the lower of the salaries+bonuses in year 1 & 2 - since Richards earns $12M in those years, his salary can drop by $6M in a year.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Nazzy-19 View Post
Thats not how it works.

The only impact the signing bonuses have are when he actually receives that money, as far as i know.
Yup - the only difference between a Signing Bonus and salary is when it is paid.

Although, the other thing that Richards' (and Ehrhoff's) Signing Bonus is in year 2 - Strike/Lockout/Rollback insurance. They will be paid 7/1/12, before the current CBA expires on 9/15/12 - they will get the $$$ even if tehre is a strike/lockout and the money will not be subject to any future rollback in the next CBA.

kdb209 is online now   Reply With Quote
Old
07-06-2011, 06:09 PM
  #46
Hockey Team
Hunger Force
 
Hockey Team's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2009
Location: New York, NY
Country: United States
Posts: 4,485
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Fish on The Sand View Post
What the Flyers did was more an administrative mistake than cheating the cap.
Yeah, the talbot contract isn't structured to have him retire / be dumped in the minors for the last few years.

Management was just being incompetent when structuring that contract, kind of like how they didnt realize the 35+ rule allowed to pronger.

Hockey Team is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
07-06-2011, 06:11 PM
  #47
Fish on The Sand
Untouchable
 
Fish on The Sand's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2002
Location: Nanaimo
Country: Canada
Posts: 51,540
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by kdb209 View Post
Nope. Signing Bonuses are treated exactly like Salary w.r.t. the cap.

They are averaged in with salary for the cap hit.
They count against the 20% max salary.
They are included in the "100 Percent Rule" which limits the yr-to-yr increase/decrease in salary.

The drop from $7M to $1M is perfectly legal. Salary can drop up to 50% of the lower of the salaries+bonuses in year 1 & 2 - since Richards earns $12M in those years, his salary can drop by $6M in a year.


Yup - the only difference between a Signing Bonus and salary is when it is paid.

Although, the other thing that Richards' (and Ehrhoff's) Signing Bonus is in year 2 - Strike/Lockout/Rollback insurance. They will be paid 7/1/12, before the current CBA expires on 9/15/12 - they will get the $$$ even if tehre is a strike/lockout and the money will not be subject to any future rollback in the next CBA.
The signing bonus does let them play around with the cap though. The final 2 years of the deal cannot pay out less than half of the salary in the first two years. Because in the first two years of Richards' contract only pay him 2 million, he is able to make only 1 million in the last 2 years.

Fish on The Sand is online now   Reply With Quote
Old
07-06-2011, 06:11 PM
  #48
jumptheshark
McDavid Headquarters
 
jumptheshark's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2003
Location: EVIL EMPIRE
Country: United Nations
Posts: 58,879
vCash: 0
I think the rule should be that the last year of the contract can not be less then half of the most expensive year of the contract or less then half of the average of the contract

jumptheshark is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
07-06-2011, 06:13 PM
  #49
Hockey Team
Hunger Force
 
Hockey Team's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2009
Location: New York, NY
Country: United States
Posts: 4,485
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by mouser View Post
Depends on what you mean by "technically". The league said it violated Article 26 of the CBA, and the impartial System Arbitrator agreed with the league that it did so when the NHLPA filed a grievance.
Well the contract didn't violate the letter of the CBA, they ruled that it violated the spirit of the CBA.

Hockey Team is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
07-06-2011, 06:13 PM
  #50
Brewsky
King Of The Ice Mugs
 
Brewsky's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2011
Location: King County
Country: Canada
Posts: 4,276
vCash: 500
Send a message via ICQ to Brewsky Send a message via AIM to Brewsky Send a message via MSN to Brewsky Send a message via Yahoo to Brewsky Send a message via Skype™ to Brewsky
Cause the Rangers make him money and cause Bettman is from NEW YAWK

Brewsky is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Forum Jump


Bookmarks

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off



All times are GMT -5. The time now is 10:03 PM.

monitoring_string = "e4251c93e2ba248d29da988d93bf5144"
Contact Us - HFBoards - Archive - Privacy Statement - Terms of Use - Advertise - Top - AdChoices

vBulletin Copyright ©2000 - 2015, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
HFBoards.com is a property of CraveOnline Media, LLC, an Evolve Media, LLC company. 2015 All Rights Reserved.