In 2006-07 playing with a reconstructed shoulder the whole season (a injury that some doctors thought would be career ending for him) he finished with 96 Pts and was 8th in league scoring. That's still considered dominant considering the extent of his injury. During most of that season Jagr couldn't even shoot the puck because of the pain in his shoulder.
I would think being more dominant in the playoffs is more important than the regular season. In 2007-08 Jagr didn't have a full time centerman until the last month of the regular season and he was paired up with a rookie named Dubinksy. Despite only getting 71 Pts (which isn't as bad as some are claiming) he had 15 Pts in 10 playoff games. Led the league in PPG and was leading the league through 2 rounds of the playoffs outplaying Crosby and Malkin in the process in the New York- Pittsburgh head to head match. That's pretty darn dominant.
The thing about people though is they always try to find the negatives instead of the positives when remembering Jagr. If someone like Crosby or Ovechkin had gone out to score 15 Pts in 10 playoff games everyone would be going nuts. So I guess Jagr wasn't dominant the last time he was in the NHL right?
If you don't remember how dominant Jagr was in that playoff, here's a reminder.
I think you need to go back and reread what I said. I said when was the last time Jagr was dominant., in any league? In my opinion it was 05/06. If you want to use the following Season, fine. Were still talking how many years ago? To think at age 40 he's going to come back and be dominant? Honestly, I hope your right. But there's a good chance your going to be dissapointed.
You seem to worship Jagr as a player. So badly that if anyone offers realistic expectations for him in his return to the NHL, that you view it as being negative.
Jagr will be 40 in February. He's closer to 40 than 39. Doesn't change anything.
I think you need to go back and reread what I said. I said when was the last time Jagr was dominant., in any league? In my opinion it was 05/06. If you want to use the following Season, fine. Were still talking how many years ago? To think at age 40 he's going to come back and be dominant? Honestly, I hope your right. But there's a good chance your going to be dissapointed.
You seem to worship Jagr as a player. So badly that if anyone offers realistic expectations for him in his return to the NHL, that you view it as being negative.
Jagr will be 40 in February. He's closer to 40 than 39. Doesn't change anything.
Who decides what the lines are. Claude Giroux or Peter Laviolette?
The key word that your missing in Giroux quote, is possibly
Wrong. The season starts in early October. He would have played the entire month of October, November, December, January and the first half of February before he turns 40. That's 2/3 of the season in which he will be 39 and not 40.
I see that you refuse to consider the 2007-08 playoffs as dominant for Jagr. Can I ask you why? Is it because if you accept the 2008 playoffs as dominant it would show that he was dominant not that long ago? He had 15 Pts in just 10 games playing with Dubinsky. The 1.50 PPG led the playoffs and he outplayed Malkin and Crosby in the second round. Is that not dominant?
Would you have felt better if he had 100 Pts in the regular season and then scored 5 Pts in 10 games in the playoffs?
The playoffs we all know is more intense than the regular season, it's where the big boys come to play. His 1.50 PPG that playoff is more than anything Crosby and Ovechkin have put up in the playoffs in their career so far.
Last edited by livewell68: 09-17-2011 at 03:28 PM.
Wrong. The season starts in early October. He would have played the entire month of October, November, December, January and the first half of February before he turns 40. That's 2/3 of the season in which he will be 39 and not 40.
I see that you refuse to consider the 2007-08 playoffs as dominant for Jagr. Can I ask you why? He had 15 Pts in just 10 games playing with Dubinsky. The 1.50 PPG led the playoffs and he outplayed Malkin and Crosby in the second round. Is that not dominant?
Would you have felt better if he had 100 Pts in the regular season and then scored 5 Pts in 10 games in the playoffs?
The playoffs we all know is more intense than the regular season, it's where the big boys come to play. His 1.50 PPG that playoff is more than anything Crosby and Ovechkin have put up in the playoffs in their career so far.
Wrong? Age doesn't correlate to the Hockey Season. LOL. He turned 39 on Feb 15th. That was 7 months ago. So how is he not closer to 40 than 39? LOL Regardless, that's beyond the point.
I haven't refused to consider anything. You refuse to consider Jagr's dominant days are likely behind him. He hasn't dominated anywhere in a number of years.
I think he's going to be a solid offensive player for this team. I'm hoping for around 25 goals, and the 50-60 pt range. More importantly, I think he's going to give a big boost to the PP that struggled last Season. Playing on the right side as LH shot. That's where I expect him to have the biggest impact.
But I don't expect him to be dominating.
You can take Jagr. I'll take a healthy Crosby or Ovechkin.
Wrong? Age doesn't correlate to the Hockey Season. LOL. He turned 39 on Feb 15th. That was 7 months ago. So how is he not closer to 40 than 39? LOL Regardless, that's beyond the point.
I haven't refused to consider anything. You refuse to consider Jagr's dominant days are likely behind him. He hasn't dominated anywhere in a number of years.
I think he's going to be a solid offensive player for this team. I'm hoping for around 25 goals, and the 50-60 pt range. More importantly, I think he's going to give a big boost to the PP that struggled last Season. Playing on the right side as LH shot. That's where I expect him to have the biggest impact.
But I don't expect him to be dominating.
You can take Jagr. I'll take a healthy Crosby or Ovechkin.
Aren't we discussing hockey though? So in this "hockey" discussion, age in relation to the hockey season becomes relevant. Selanne scored 80 Pts in 73 games at age 40 and was dominant for the first in 3 years. He did it after not even coming close to score PPG or more than 60 games in 2007-08, 2008-09 and 2009-10, so why can't Jagr who is 2 years younger (and who actually did dominate at some point in the last 3 years)
He hasn't dominated anywhere in the last few years? He dominated the 2008 playoffs for one and that was the last time we saw him in the NHL.
He also dominated this year's World Championship being named the tournament's best forward in the process. He outplayed Kovalchuk and Ovechkin (two NHL superstars) in the tournament.
In the 2009-10 KHL season, Jagr started the season on fire, he was leading the league in scoring both in goals and points for the first 1 and a half months until Jagr saw his teammate die in front of him. From that point on Jagr really struggled that season. He did still dominate though until that event (3 hattricks in the first month and a half), a dying teammate will shake anyone up, I mean how do you focus on hockey after that?
Back on topic, I gave you 2 examples of Jagr dominating hockey in the last 3 years.
Selanne didn't dominate for 3 years (didn't score more than 60 Pts) before he scored 80 Pts in 73 games. Then why is it hard for a player who is 2 years younger and who is much healthier to be as successful?
It's very possible for players to have bounce back years, even at ages 37, 38, 39, 40, especially when they are as talented and fit as Jagr.
Last edited by livewell68: 09-17-2011 at 03:53 PM.
Aren't we discussing hockey though? So in this "hockey" discussion, age in relation to the hockey season becomes relevant. Selanne scored 80 Pts in 73 games at age 40 and was dominant for the first in 3 years. He did it after not even coming close to score PPG or more than 60 games in 2007-08, 2008-09 and 2009-10, so why can't Jagr who is 2 years younger (and who actually did dominate at some point in the last 3 years)
He hasn't dominated anywhere in the last few years? He dominated the 2008 playoffs for one and that was the last time we saw him in the NHL.
He also dominated this year's World Championship being named the tournament's best forward in the process. He outplayed Kovalchuk and Ovechkin (two NHL superstars) in the tournament.
In the 2009-10 KHL season, Jagr started the season on fire, he was leading the league in scoring both in goals and points for the first 1 and a half months until Jagr saw his teammate die in front of him. From that point on Jagr really struggled that season. He did still dominate though until that event (3 hattricks in the first month and a half), a dying teammate will shake anyone up, I mean how do you focus on hockey after that?
Back on topic, I gave you 2 examples of Jagr dominating hockey in the last 3 years.
Selanne didn't dominate for 3 years (didn't score more than 60 Pts) before he scored 80 Pts in 73 games. Then why is it hard for a player who is 2 years younger and who is much healthier to be as successful?
It's very possible for players to have bounce back years, even at ages 37, 38, 39, 40, especially when they are as talented and fit as Jagr.
Like I said, in my opinion, Jagr hasn't been a dominating player since 05/06, in my opinion. To expect him to be dominating now, nearing age 40, I don't think is realistic. Possible, sure. Anything is possible.
Selanne had a very good year last year. He wasn't dominating. I think you have a misunderstanding of what dominant is.
No one's talking about a bounce back year. Were talking about Jagr being dominant. Huge difference.
Like I said, in my opinion, Jagr hasn't been a dominating player since 05/06, in my opinion. To expect him to be dominating now, nearing age 40, I don't think is realistic. Possible, sure. Anything is possible.
Selanne had a very good year last year. He wasn't dominating. I think you have a misunderstanding of what dominant is.
No one's talking about a bounce back year. Were talking about Jagr being dominant. Huge difference.
Selanne was 8th in scoring despite only play 73 games. Had he played all 82 games his PPG would have projected him at 90 Pts which would have put him at 6th in scoring, only 1 pt out of the top 5. That's pretty darn dominant.
What do you consider dominant? Scoring 120 Pts? Well the last time anyone reached that number was 2006-07. Jagr is very capable of getting 80-95 pts, with those numbers he would be top 5-10. That is dominant. There can be more than one dominant player in the league. Expecting Jagr to be one of the dominant players is not such a stretch.
I'm not expecting Jagr to score 120 Pts anymore, but I think he is still capable of 30 goals and to hover around 80-95 Pts.
Aren't we discussing hockey though? So in this "hockey" discussion, age in relation to the hockey season becomes relevant. Selanne scored 80 Pts in 73 games at age 40 and was dominant for the first in 3 years. He did it after not even coming close to score PPG or more than 60 games in 2007-08, 2008-09 and 2009-10, so why can't Jagr who is 2 years younger (and who actually did dominate at some point in the last 3 years)
He hasn't dominated anywhere in the last few years? He dominated the 2008 playoffs for one and that was the last time we saw him in the NHL.
He also dominated this year's World Championship being named the tournament's best forward in the process. He outplayed Kovalchuk and Ovechkin (two NHL superstars) in the tournament.
In the 2009-10 KHL season, Jagr started the season on fire, he was leading the league in scoring both in goals and points for the first 1 and a half months until Jagr saw his teammate die in front of him. From that point on Jagr really struggled that season. He did still dominate though until that event (3 hattricks in the first month and a half), a dying teammate will shake anyone up, I mean how do you focus on hockey after that?
Back on topic, I gave you 2 examples of Jagr dominating hockey in the last 3 years.
Selanne didn't dominate for 3 years (didn't score more than 60 Pts) before he scored 80 Pts in 73 games. Then why is it hard for a player who is 2 years younger and who is much healthier to be as successful?
It's very possible for players to have bounce back years, even at ages 37, 38, 39, 40, especially when they are as talented and fit as Jagr.
hey since you're the certified jagr historian can you confirm/deny the rumor that jagr wore 99 in his youth?
Selanne was 8th in scoring despite only play 73 games. Had he played all 82 games his PPG would have projected him at 90 Pts which would have put him at 6th in scoring, only 1 pt out of the top 5. That's pretty darn dominant.
What do you consider dominant? Scoring 120 Pts? Well the last time anyone reached that number was 2006-07. Jagr is very capable of getting 80-95 pts, with those numbers he would be top 5-10. That is dominant. There can be more than one dominant player in the league. Expecting Jagr to be one of the dominant players is not such a stretch.
I'm not expecting Jagr to score 120 Pts anymore, but I think he is still capable of 30 goals and to hover around 80-95 Pts.
No, being in the top 5-10 isn't dominant. Being dominant is taking over games. It's being the best player in the League. It's being in the running for the Hart Trophy. Selanne had a very good year. He was not dominant.
I think your expectations for Jagr are very high. Like I said, I hope your right. But you have Jagr at 80-95 points. You have Giroux at 100 pts. And JVR at 80-90 points. Flyers are going to have a hell of an offensive year! LOL
No, being in the top 5-10 isn't dominant. Being dominant is taking over games. It's being the best player in the League. It's being in the running for the Hart Trophy. Selanne had a very good year. He was not dominant.
I think your expectations for Jagr are very high. Like I said, I hope your right. But you have Jagr at 80-95 points. You have Giroux at 100 pts. And JVR at 80-90 points. Flyers are going to have a hell of an offensive year! LOL
How about Briere? 90 points also? LOL
This is the 11/12 Season. Not 05/06
I know I will get flamed for this but I think Jagr will lead the Flyers in scoring.
Otherwise I'm done with the predictions.
I'm 100% confident that Jagr will get 30 + goals and 80-95 Pts and I will leave it at that.
Let the season begin and let his game do the talking.
No, being in the top 5-10 isn't dominant. Being dominant is taking over games. It's being the best player in the League. It's being in the running for the Hart Trophy. Selanne had a very good year. He was not dominant.
I think your expectations for Jagr are very high. Like I said, I hope your right. But you have Jagr at 80-95 points. You have Giroux at 100 pts. And JVR at 80-90 points. Flyers are going to have a hell of an offensive year! LOL
How about Briere? 90 points also? LOL
This is the 11/12 Season. Not 05/06
Being in the top 5-10 of the league isn't dominant? wow.........
I know I will get flamed for this but I think Jagr will lead the Flyers in scoring.
Otherwise I'm done with the predictions.
I'm 100% confident that Jagr will get 30 + goals and 80-95 Pts and I will leave it at that.
Let the season begin and let his game do the talking.
100%, huh?
In 4 of his last 6 NHL seasons Jagr did not post those numbers. It's at this point that you should just accept that you're a delusional fanboy. 100%...
Selanne was 8th in scoring despite only play 73 games. Had he played all 82 games his PPG would have projected him at 90 Pts which would have put him at 6th in scoring, only 1 pt out of the top 5. That's pretty darn dominant.
What do you consider dominant? Scoring 120 Pts? Well the last time anyone reached that number was 2006-07. Jagr is very capable of getting 80-95 pts, with those numbers he would be top 5-10. That is dominant. There can be more than one dominant player in the league. Expecting Jagr to be one of the dominant players is not such a stretch.
I'm not expecting Jagr to score 120 Pts anymore, but I think he is still capable of 30 goals and to hover around 80-95 Pts.
Well, based off his press conference yesterday... he's not really expecting it.
Ok my official prediction is 100 points in the regular season, and 25 in the playoffs. Lifts the Stanley Cup. His 125 points total will push him 1 point over Mario to give him 1724...
MUAHHAHAHAHAH
Well, based off his press conference yesterday... he's not really expecting it.
What was he going to say? I haven't played in the NHL for 3 years but I'm expecting to dominate?
Had he said that (even if he believed it) don't you think he would get flamed for it and be considered cocky?
If you actually listen to what he said, he didn't say he won't dominate or play good, he said he's not going to talk about it like he was 21. He doesn't need to do that. He's accomplished everything, saying how he expects to play at this stage of his career is pointless.
Go listen to it again, what he really meant to say was that he wasn't going to talk about but rather let his game do the talking.
He didn't want to do the same mistake he did in Washington. When he was signed by them, at his press conference he said he "wanted to be the best player in the world again". We all know how that went. Jagr also had a similar press conference when he was signed by New York, he said "I'm not superman anymore but I can still be an ok player".
We all know how both experiences went. In Washington he didn't play up to his name but in New York for the first 2 seasons (despite the expectations of him scoring 100 Pts were no longer there) he scored 219 Pts. I don't think people realize what a happy, motivated Jagr means even at age 39.
He looks healthy, fit and I doubt he will be playing anything less than 1-2 line minutes and top powerplay minutes. The Flyers have enough offense to surround Jagr the way Selanne has in Anaheim. That's why I think he will far exceed the 75 Pts mark.
Last edited by livewell68: 09-18-2011 at 02:39 PM.
Being in the top 5-10 of the league isn't dominant? wow.........
No it's not. I'll give you some examples of dominant. Lemieux, Gretzky were dominant. Lindros in his prime for a few years was dominant. Forsberg in his prime was dominant. So no, being in the top 5-10 in scoring, isn't dominant.
An example of a couple of players who can be dominant in today's game, if healthy, are Crosby and Ovechkin
Quote:
Originally Posted by jags6868
What was he going to say? I haven't played in the NHL for 3 years but I'm expecting to dominate?
Had he said that (even if he believed it) don't you think he would get flamed for it and be considered cocky?
If you actually listen to what he said, he didn't say he won't dominate or play good, he said he's not going to talk about it like he was 21. He doesn't need to do that. He's accomplished everything, saying how he expects to play at this stage of his career is pointless.
Go listen to it again, what he really meant to say was that he wasn't going to talk about but rather let his game do the talking.
He didn't want to do the same mistake he did in Washington. When he was signed by them, at his press conference he said he "wanted to be the best player in the world again". We all know how that went. Jagr also had a similar press conference when he was signed by New York, he said "I'm not superman anymore but I can still be an ok player".
We all know how both experiences went. In Washington he didn't play up to his name but in New York for the first 2 seasons (despite the expectations of him scoring 100 Pts were no longer there) he scored 219 Pts. I don't think people realize what a happy, motivated Jagr means even at age 39.
He looks healthy, fit and I doubt he will be playing anything less than 1-2 line minutes and top powerplay minutes. The Flyers have enough offense to surround Jagr the way Selanne has in Anaheim. That's why I think he will far exceed the 75 Pts mark.
Jagr, by his comments, is clearly not expecting to be a dominant player. He's clearly more aware that he's 39 than you are that he is. He can be happy and motivated all he wants. Doesn't change that he's 39, and hasn't been a dominant player in any League in a good number of years.
What was he going to say? I haven't played in the NHL for 3 years but I'm expecting to dominate?
Had he said that (even if he believed it) don't you think he would get flamed for it and be considered cocky?
If you actually listen to what he said, he didn't say he won't dominate or play good, he said he's not going to talk about it like he was 21. He doesn't need to do that. He's accomplished everything, saying how he expects to play at this stage of his career is pointless.
Go listen to it again, what he really meant to say was that he wasn't going to talk about but rather let his game do the talking.
He didn't want to do the same mistake he did in Washington. When he was signed by them, at his press conference he said he "wanted to be the best player in the world again". We all know how that went. Jagr also had a similar press conference when he was signed by New York, he said "I'm not superman anymore but I can still be an ok player".
We all know how both experiences went. In Washington he didn't play up to his name but in New York for the first 2 seasons (despite the expectations of him scoring 100 Pts were no longer there) he scored 219 Pts. I don't think people realize what a happy, motivated Jagr means even at age 39.
He looks healthy, fit and I doubt he will be playing anything less than 1-2 line minutes and top powerplay minutes. The Flyers have enough offense to surround Jagr the way Selanne has in Anaheim. That's why I think he will far exceed the 75 Pts mark.
What he said in that press conference, was very candid and very honest... and very realistic.
For all those who think Jagr's dominant years are behind him:
Does this sound like a guy who will be happy with 65 Pts?
Quote:
Also, Jagr comes back on Skate Zone at night to do a separate workout by himself. He told us he wanted to live near the rink because he practices a lot. He wasn’t kidding.
He works out with a 25-pound weight when on his own. Animal.
Poor old Jagr, why aren't his legs giving out yet? He's training way too hard before the season even starts, he's so old he won't have anything left in tank for the regular season if he continues at this rate of training, he will burn himself out.
Last edited by livewell68: 09-19-2011 at 11:33 AM.
