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The Official Ex-Habs Thread Part III (All Former Habs Players Discussed Here!)

View Poll Results: Which team is better?
Former Habs 34 44.16%
Current Habs 33 42.86%
It's even 4 5.19%
None 6 7.79%
Voters: 77. You may not vote on this poll

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Old
11-07-2011, 10:28 AM
  #526
Le Tricolore
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Originally Posted by hototogisu View Post
Funnily enough, from what I read on the Caps board, they're not very fond of Hamrlik so far. Slow and poor decision-making are the biggest complaints.
A lot of Hab fans didn't like Hamrlik either. It doesn't mean he was bad in the least, though.

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Old
11-07-2011, 10:29 AM
  #527
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Impressive list. And a proof of really bad assets' management.
Uhh.. I can make a list like this for each and every team in the NHL if I really wanted to. Are you saying every team in the NHL manages assets poorly too?

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11-07-2011, 10:30 AM
  #528
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A lot of Hab fans didn't like Hamrlik either. It doesn't mean he was bad in the least, though.
I just read in another thread how lot's of Habs fans don't like Gionta nor Cammy.

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11-07-2011, 10:56 AM
  #529
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Quote:
Originally Posted by habitue View Post
Impressive list. And a proof of really bad assets' management.
The optimist in me says it's proof of our great scouting and drafting abilities

Quote:
Originally Posted by Le Tricolore View Post
A lot of Hab fans didn't like Hamrlik either. It doesn't mean he was bad in the least, though.
This is true too. Just passing along what I'd noticed though, don't shoot the messenger.

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11-07-2011, 11:06 AM
  #530
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Uhh.. I can make a list like this for each and every team in the NHL if I really wanted to. Are you saying every team in the NHL manages assets poorly too?
Every team in the NHL? I don't think so. I doubt you'd be able to find a team with as many former draftees playing on other clubs, actually.

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11-07-2011, 11:20 AM
  #531
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Every team in the NHL? I don't think so. I doubt you'd be able to find a team with as many former draftees playing on other clubs, actually.
My sense is that you're correct. I don't think there is a single team to match our list, proof our drafting isn't the problem.

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Originally Posted by Mike8 View Post
Maybe so, but Hamrlik's been pretty good for them so far, eating a lot of tough minutes.
I've learned that the average fan doesn't appreciate the types for their tough minute eating, ability to play in every situation type guys until they're no longer on your roster.

Hamrlik was a very valuable player here over the course of his contract and is a valuable player to the caps, the small things he does are harder to appreciate, but I think the results speak for themselves.


Last edited by Habsfan18: 11-07-2011 at 01:31 PM. Reason: merge
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Old
11-07-2011, 12:32 PM
  #532
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Originally Posted by habsjunkie2 View Post
I've learned that the average fan doesn't appreciate the types for their tough minute eating, ability to play in every situation type guys until they're no longer on your roster.

Hamrlik was a very valuable player here over the course of his contract and is a valuable player to the caps, the small things he does are harder to appreciate, but I think the results speak for themselves.
Caps fans are very unhappy with him, they think he's overplayed and overused - directly contradicting your patronizing point.

Hamrlik has veteran savvy, he stick checks and positions himself well, the "minute crunching" you so speak of. That said, he is way below average in many other, much more visible regards: non-physical, doesn't clear the crease, absolutely no-shot, cannot pinch, terrible footspeed, mediocre board play and so far has been way below average in the playoffs.

3.5m/yr for two years is just atrocious.

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Old
11-07-2011, 12:56 PM
  #533
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Originally Posted by WhiskeySeven View Post
Caps fans are very unhappy with him, they think he's overplayed and overused - directly contradicting your patronizing point.

Hamrlik has veteran savvy, he stick checks and positions himself well, the "minute crunching" you so speak of. That said, he is way below average in many other, much more visible regards: non-physical, doesn't clear the crease, absolutely no-shot, cannot pinch, terrible footspeed, mediocre board play and so far has been way below average in the playoffs.

3.5m/yr for two years is just atrocious.
exactly why goat didn't want to resign him for two years.

losing hammer is gonna 'hurt' us the first few months and then we'll move on just fine....

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Old
11-07-2011, 01:30 PM
  #534
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Originally Posted by WhiskeySeven View Post
Caps fans are very unhappy with him, they think he's overplayed and overused - directly contradicting your patronizing point.

Hamrlik has veteran savvy, he stick checks and positions himself well, the "minute crunching" you so speak of. That said, he is way below average in many other, much more visible regards: non-physical, doesn't clear the crease, absolutely no-shot, cannot pinch, terrible footspeed, mediocre board play and so far has been way below average in the playoffs.

3.5m/yr for two years is just atrocious.
just like a lot of habs fans have a misguided negative feeling for A.Kost...

or like a lot of habs fans who wanted to keep Gill over Hamrlik (and not just b/c of the 1 vs 2 year contract difference, many argued flat out that Gill was better/more useful).

fan bases aren't exactly the most reliable.

Fact is that Hamrlik, for all his warts, is 2nd in ice time for one of the top teams in the league through the start of the season.

he gets more toi/game than any habs dman not named PK, despite playing on a team with a much deeper talent pool of NHL dmen (Wideman, Carlson, Alzner, Schultz, Erskine... and Green, who is injured but played in 7 of the caps first 12 games).

That's pretty solid ROI for a veteran earning 3.5M$

Hamrlik, used as a top-pairing dman (which is the case currently in Wash), would be a bit frustrating for any fan base, but put that into context, being able to play a 3.5M$ vet comfortably in your top-pairing, while the team wins, is a very, very good thing.

the extra year is no issue, imo, b/c even if/as Hamrlik's play drops off from this year to the next, he'll still easily be a very good 3-4-5 dman, and that's not bad for a 3.5M$ vet.

conversely, we have spacek, a much less effective player, earning 3.8M$ this year, and signed at a time where the cap was considerably tighter.

Hamrlik was a good signing at 3.5M$, and I wouldn't be surprised in the least if he'd have taken a bit less to stay in Montreal, had we been willing to go 2 years.

choosing Gill, whom our veteran friendly coach is only interested in playing him <19min/game with zero PP time and <15min/g ES minutes, and this despite a rash of injuries to our experienced dmen (Markov, Spacek, Campoli), was a mistake.

Quote:
Originally Posted by MasterDecoy View Post
exactly why goat didn't want to resign him for two years.

losing hammer is gonna 'hurt' us the first few months and then we'll move on just fine....
we've been doing "just fine" for a long time thanks to repeated asset management blunders... at some point we need to be doing "much better", at least if icing a contender is the shared objective.

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Old
11-07-2011, 01:42 PM
  #535
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Originally Posted by WhiskeySeven View Post
Caps fans are very unhappy with him, they think he's overplayed and overused - directly contradicting your patronizing point.

Hamrlik has veteran savvy, he stick checks and positions himself well, the "minute crunching" you so speak of. That said, he is way below average in many other, much more visible regards: non-physical, doesn't clear the crease, absolutely no-shot, cannot pinch, terrible footspeed, mediocre board play and so far has been way below average in the playoffs.

3.5m/yr for two years is just atrocious.
Habs fan said the same things here and they were proven wrong, time and time again. I think the coach that gives him the most ice time and against top opposition might know a little more than most posters on here. Just guessing

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11-07-2011, 02:40 PM
  #536
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Originally Posted by WhiskeySeven View Post
Caps fans are very unhappy with him, they think he's overplayed and overused - directly contradicting your patronizing point.

Hamrlik has veteran savvy, he stick checks and positions himself well, the "minute crunching" you so speak of. That said, he is way below average in many other, much more visible regards: non-physical, doesn't clear the crease, absolutely no-shot, cannot pinch, terrible footspeed, mediocre board play and so far has been way below average in the playoffs.

3.5m/yr for two years is just atrocious.
Actually, the post you responded to made the point that average fans don't appreciate such players. So the fact that Caps fans don't appreciate Hamrlik does not at all contradict what the poster was saying.

What is contradictory, however, is the fact that Hamrlik is #1 in ES minutes for the Caps. Just as he was for Montreal when Markov was out, through multiple coaches. This tells me coaches consistently appreciate him while fans don't. Given that the stats support the belief that Hamrlik's a strong defender, I'm inclined to side with the unanimous consensus of Hamrlik's numerous coaches + stats over popular consensus on message forums.

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Old
11-07-2011, 03:50 PM
  #537
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Here's all the former Hab draft picks that have appeared in an NHL game this year,

Saku Koivu ('93)...................... Gone as a UFA
Tomas Vokoun ('94)................. Claimed in expansion draft
Jose Theodore ('94).................... Traded for David Aebisher
Stephane Robidas ('95)................. Gone as a UFA
Brett Clark ('96)....................... Claimed by Thrashers in expansion draft
Arron Asham ('96)........................ Traded for Czerkawski !!!!!
Mathieu Garon ('96).................. For Bonk and Huet
Mike Ribeiro ('98)...................... For Niinimaa
Francois Beauchemin ('98).......... Lost on waivers because of an admin. mistake
Michael Ryder ('98)................. Gone as a UFA
Matt Carkner ('99).................. Never signed.... UFA
Ron Hainsey ('00)................. Claimed off waivers by Columbus
Mike Komisarek ('01).................... Gone as a UFA
Chris Higgins ('02)...................... involved in the Gomez trade
Andre Deveaux ('02)................. Never signed... UFA
Jaroslav Halak ('03).................. For Eller & Schultz
Mark Flood ('03)....................... Gone as a UFA
Maxim Lapierre ('03)................. For Brett Festerling.............
Ryan O'Byrne ('03)...................... For Michael Bournival
Mark Streit ('04)...................... Gone as a UFA
Mikhail Grabovski ('04).............. For Sundin negociation rights + pick + Pateryn
Kyle Chipchura ('04)..................... For an Anaheim 4th round pick (2011)
Sergei Kostitsyn ('05)................. For Ellis and Boyd........... !!!!!!!
Guillaume Latendresse ('05)............ For Pouliot !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Matt D'Agostini ('05)......................... For Palushaj
Ben Maxwell ('06)......................... Involved in the Sopel trade
Ryan McDonagh ('07)
........... Involved in the Gomez trade



WOW. Great return. We are left with Gomez + Eller and two unknown talents Bournival + Pateryn

And we won't count the 1st round busts David Fischer, Marcel Hossa, Matt Higgins, Jason Ward, Perezhogin and Eric Chouinard + we lost Bouillon, a guy raised in the Habs system.

on a positive note- the only one - Rivet is in the AHL while MaxPac and Gorges are full time NHL players.


Last edited by habitue*: 11-07-2011 at 04:12 PM.
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Old
11-07-2011, 04:01 PM
  #538
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Originally Posted by Le Tricolore View Post
A lot of Hab fans didn't like Hamrlik either. It doesn't mean he was bad in the least, though.
Nobody dislikes Hammergod. They are liars trying to troll because everyone likes Hamrlik.

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Old
11-07-2011, 04:17 PM
  #539
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Originally Posted by montreal View Post
Here's all the former Hab draft picks that have appeared in an NHL game this year,

Saku Koivu ('93)
Tomas Vokoun ('94)
Jose Theodore ('94)
Stephane Robidas ('95)
Brett Clark ('96)
Arron Asham ('96)
Mathieu Garon ('96)
Mike Ribeiro ('98)
Francois Beauchemin ('98)
Michael Ryder ('98)
Matt Carkner ('99)
Ron Hainsey ('00)
Mike Komisarek ('01)
Chris Higgins ('02)
Andre Deveaux ('02)
Jaroslav Halak ('03)
Mark Flood ('03)
Maxim Lapierre ('03)
Ryan O'Byrne ('03)
Mark Streit ('04)
Mikhail Grabovski ('04)
Kyle Chipchura ('04)
Sergei Kostitsyn ('05)
Guillaume Latendresse ('05)
Matt D'Agostini ('05)
Ben Maxwell ('06)
Ryan McDonagh ('07)
CAPGEEK.COM CAP CALCULATOR

FORWARDS
Sergei Kostitsyn ($2.500m) / Mike Ribeiro ($5.000m) / Matt D'Agostini ($1.650m)
Michael Ryder ($3.500m) / Mikhail Grabovski ($2.900m) / Guillaume Latendresse ($2.500m)
Maxim Lapierre ($1.000m) / Saku Koivu ($2.500m) / Chris Higgins ($1.900m)
Arron Asham ($0.775m) / Kyle Chipchura ($0.550m) / Ben Maxwell ($0.715m)

DEFENSEMEN
Stephane Robidas ($3.300m) / Mark Streit ($4.100m)
Francois Beauchemin ($3.800m) / Brett Clark ($1.500m)
Mike Komisarek ($4.500m) / Ryan McDonagh ($1.300m)

GOALTENDERS
Tomas Vokoun ($1.500m) / Jaroslav Halak ($3.750m)

CAPGEEK.COM TOTALS (follow @capgeek on Twitter)
(these totals are compiled without the bonus cushion)
SALARY CAP: $64,300,000; CAP PAYROLL: $49,240,000; BONUSES: $425,000
CAP SPACE (20-man roster): $15,060,000

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11-07-2011, 04:23 PM
  #540
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Originally Posted by donghabs98 View Post
CAPGEEK.COM CAP CALCULATOR

FORWARDS
Sergei Kostitsyn ($2.500m) / Mike Ribeiro ($5.000m) / Matt D'Agostini ($1.650m)
Michael Ryder ($3.500m) / Mikhail Grabovski ($2.900m) / Guillaume Latendresse ($2.500m)
Maxim Lapierre ($1.000m) / Saku Koivu ($2.500m) / Chris Higgins ($1.900m)
Arron Asham ($0.775m) / Kyle Chipchura ($0.550m) / Ben Maxwell ($0.715m)

DEFENSEMEN
Stephane Robidas ($3.300m) / Mark Streit ($4.100m)
Francois Beauchemin ($3.800m) / Brett Clark ($1.500m)
Mike Komisarek ($4.500m) / Ryan McDonagh ($1.300m)

GOALTENDERS
Tomas Vokoun ($1.500m) / Jaroslav Halak ($3.750m)

CAPGEEK.COM TOTALS (follow @capgeek on Twitter)
(these totals are compiled without the bonus cushion)
SALARY CAP: $64,300,000; CAP PAYROLL: $49,240,000; BONUSES: $425,000
CAP SPACE (20-man roster): $15,060,000
I'd take our actual line-up over this one for sure...

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Old
11-07-2011, 04:24 PM
  #541
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Originally Posted by donghabs98 View Post
CAPGEEK.COM CAP CALCULATOR

FORWARDS
Sergei Kostitsyn ($2.500m) / Mike Ribeiro ($5.000m) / Matt D'Agostini ($1.650m)
Michael Ryder ($3.500m) / Mikhail Grabovski ($2.900m) / Guillaume Latendresse ($2.500m)
Maxim Lapierre ($1.000m) / Saku Koivu ($2.500m) / Chris Higgins ($1.900m)
Arron Asham ($0.775m) / Kyle Chipchura ($0.550m) / Ben Maxwell ($0.715m)

DEFENSEMEN
Stephane Robidas ($3.300m) / Mark Streit ($4.100m)
Francois Beauchemin ($3.800m) / Brett Clark ($1.500m)
Mike Komisarek ($4.500m) / Ryan McDonagh ($1.300m)

GOALTENDERS
Tomas Vokoun ($1.500m) / Jaroslav Halak ($3.750m)

CAPGEEK.COM TOTALS (follow @capgeek on Twitter)
(these totals are compiled without the bonus cushion)
SALARY CAP: $64,300,000; CAP PAYROLL: $49,240,000; BONUSES: $425,000
CAP SPACE (20-man roster): $15,060,000
You may add Bouillon and Deveaux as your extras, and you've got a solid competitive team with Boucher or Vigneault as head coach

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11-07-2011, 04:24 PM
  #542
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Originally Posted by donghabs98 View Post
CAPGEEK.COM CAP CALCULATOR

FORWARDS
Sergei Kostitsyn ($2.500m) / Mike Ribeiro ($5.000m) / Matt D'Agostini ($1.650m)
Michael Ryder ($3.500m) / Mikhail Grabovski ($2.900m) / Guillaume Latendresse ($2.500m)
Maxim Lapierre ($1.000m) / Saku Koivu ($2.500m) / Chris Higgins ($1.900m)
Arron Asham ($0.775m) / Kyle Chipchura ($0.550m) / Ben Maxwell ($0.715m)

DEFENSEMEN
Stephane Robidas ($3.300m) / Mark Streit ($4.100m)
Francois Beauchemin ($3.800m) / Brett Clark ($1.500m)
Mike Komisarek ($4.500m) / Ryan McDonagh ($1.300m)

GOALTENDERS
Tomas Vokoun ($1.500m) / Jaroslav Halak ($3.750m)

CAPGEEK.COM TOTALS (follow @capgeek on Twitter)
(these totals are compiled without the bonus cushion)
SALARY CAP: $64,300,000; CAP PAYROLL: $49,240,000; BONUSES: $425,000
CAP SPACE (20-man roster): $15,060,000
that is really painful to look at....

15M$ in cap space, and a team that is as good, or better than what we have.
(not to mention you could easily throw Subban/MaxPac into that group)

scary, and a testament to the poor job of asset management we experienced in the Gainey era.

our team, right now, is as good or perhaps a bit better, but with 15M$ in cap space even the worst GM in the league could make some serious upgrades.

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Old
11-07-2011, 04:37 PM
  #543
donghabs98
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that is really painful to look at....

15M$ in cap space, and a team that is as good, or better than what we have.
(not to mention you could easily throw Subban/MaxPac into that group)

scary, and a testament to the poor job of asset management we experienced in the Gainey era.

our team, right now, is as good or perhaps a bit better, but with 15M$ in cap space even the worst GM in the league could make some serious upgrades.
CAPGEEK.COM CAP CALCULATOR

FORWARDS
Max Pacioretty ($1.625m) / Tomas Plekanec ($5.000m) / Matt D'Agostini ($1.650m)
Michael Ryder ($3.500m) / Mike Ribeiro ($5.000m) / Guillaume Latendresse ($2.500m)
Sergei Kostitsyn ($2.500m) / Lars Eller ($1.270m) / Andrei Kostitsyn ($3.250m)
Arron Asham ($0.775m) / Saku Koivu ($2.500m) / Chris Higgins ($1.900m)
David Desharnais ($0.850m) / Mikhail Grabovski ($2.900m) / Maxim Lapierre ($1.000m)

DEFENSEMEN
Andrei Markov ($5.750m) / Mark Streit ($4.100m)
P.K. Subban ($0.875m) / Josh Gorges ($2.500m)
Stephane Robidas ($3.300m) / Ryan McDonagh ($1.300m)
Brett Clark ($1.500m) / Francis Bouillon ($1.350m)

GOALTENDERS
Carey Price ($2.750m) / Tomas Vokoun ($1.500m)

CAPGEEK.COM TOTALS (follow @capgeek on Twitter)
(these totals are compiled without the bonus cushion)
SALARY CAP: $64,300,000; CAP PAYROLL: $61,145,833; BONUSES: $425,000
CAP SPACE (25-man roster): $3,154,167

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11-07-2011, 04:44 PM
  #544
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Originally Posted by donghabs98 View Post
CAPGEEK.COM CAP CALCULATOR

FORWARDS
Max Pacioretty ($1.625m) / Tomas Plekanec ($5.000m) / Matt D'Agostini ($1.650m)
Michael Ryder ($3.500m) / Mike Ribeiro ($5.000m) / Guillaume Latendresse ($2.500m)
Sergei Kostitsyn ($2.500m) / Lars Eller ($1.270m) / Andrei Kostitsyn ($3.250m)
Arron Asham ($0.775m) / Saku Koivu ($2.500m) / Chris Higgins ($1.900m)
David Desharnais ($0.850m) / Mikhail Grabovski ($2.900m) / Maxim Lapierre ($1.000m)

DEFENSEMEN
Andrei Markov ($5.750m) / Mark Streit ($4.100m)
P.K. Subban ($0.875m) / Josh Gorges ($2.500m)
Stephane Robidas ($3.300m) / Ryan McDonagh ($1.300m)
Brett Clark ($1.500m) / Francis Bouillon ($1.350m)

GOALTENDERS
Carey Price ($2.750m) / Tomas Vokoun ($1.500m)

CAPGEEK.COM TOTALS (follow @capgeek on Twitter)
(these totals are compiled without the bonus cushion)
SALARY CAP: $64,300,000; CAP PAYROLL: $61,145,833; BONUSES: $425,000
CAP SPACE (25-man roster): $3,154,167
haha! dont ever post this in the toughness thread

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Old
11-07-2011, 04:47 PM
  #545
Andy
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Quote:
Originally Posted by donghabs98 View Post
CAPGEEK.COM CAP CALCULATOR

FORWARDS
Max Pacioretty ($1.625m) / Tomas Plekanec ($5.000m) / Matt D'Agostini ($1.650m)
Michael Ryder ($3.500m) / Mike Ribeiro ($5.000m) / Guillaume Latendresse ($2.500m)
Sergei Kostitsyn ($2.500m) / Lars Eller ($1.270m) / Andrei Kostitsyn ($3.250m)
Arron Asham ($0.775m) / Saku Koivu ($2.500m) / Chris Higgins ($1.900m)
David Desharnais ($0.850m) / Mikhail Grabovski ($2.900m) / Maxim Lapierre ($1.000m)

DEFENSEMEN
Andrei Markov ($5.750m) / Mark Streit ($4.100m)
P.K. Subban ($0.875m) / Josh Gorges ($2.500m)
Stephane Robidas ($3.300m) / Ryan McDonagh ($1.300m)
Brett Clark ($1.500m) / Francis Bouillon ($1.350m)

GOALTENDERS
Carey Price ($2.750m) / Tomas Vokoun ($1.500m)

CAPGEEK.COM TOTALS (follow @capgeek on Twitter)
(these totals are compiled without the bonus cushion)
SALARY CAP: $64,300,000; CAP PAYROLL: $61,145,833; BONUSES: $425,000
CAP SPACE (25-man roster): $3,154,167
I doubt Koivu would want to stay to play the role of a 4th line center when he can go else where and play as a number 2. The same goes for Vokoun in the backup role, Clark in a 7th role etc. Also, didn't Grabovski want out because of a lack of playing time and here he is a depth forward.

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Old
11-07-2011, 04:53 PM
  #546
Andy
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You didn't seem to mind trading for a 7.3m center who needed to be well-surrounded to get 50 points.
I think it's two entirely different issues.

That summer we had Lapierre and Metropolit signed, we needed a center. It was a crappy move, but I understand where they were coming from. It turned out to be an awful one, but wtv.

With Subban's development and the return of Markov, I didn't think it would be necessary to give Wisniewski that money. He is more of a luxury than a necessity. There were better defensemen on the market this summer that would have fit the teams needs better than Wisniewski at that price.

Also, i'm glad you agree that Wisniewski wasn't worth it.

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11-07-2011, 06:55 PM
  #547
Andy
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Benny Poo Poo finally scores his first as a Bruin

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11-07-2011, 06:55 PM
  #548
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Georges Laraque is the best period.

I went to the Chapters at Fairview this afternoon and he was there signing autographs for his new book. It was like 7:30 pm and the place was kind of empty, but the guy was there just great with a big smile . We talked a bit, made some jokes...that guy was just awesome.

If your hesitating I encourage you to buy his book, honestly

Go Big George!!

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11-07-2011, 06:57 PM
  #549
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Did you ask him for his 500 K back ?

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11-07-2011, 06:58 PM
  #550
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Did he mention how doomed the locker room was because his contacts said so?

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