HFBoards

Go Back   HFBoards > General Hockey Discussion > Prospects
Mobile Hockey's Future Become a Sponsor Site Rules Support Forum vBookie Page 2
Prospects Discuss hockey prospects from all over the world and the NHL Draft.

LW John Gaudreau - Boston College, HE (2011, 104th overall, Calgary)

Closed Thread
 
Thread Tools
Old
01-20-2013, 05:28 PM
  #726
wej20
Registered User
 
wej20's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2008
Location: Swansea,UK
Country: Wales
Posts: 24,190
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hardyvan123 View Post
Overall this is probably true, although a top team like Portland or Halifax would do quite well agasint most NCAA Div 1 teams.

But I think the point was to get him used to the longer pro schedule and I'm not sure if staying in college is the ebst route for his development.

That being said I don't think he would be ready for the AHL next year either so it's a tough situation.

My bet is that he stays at BC.
it would be a longer schedule but he'd be playing against 16 and 17 year old defenders, to prepare him for the NHL he needs to be playing against defenders who are stronger than him. If he wants a longer pro schedule he should go to the AHL, rather than dropping down a level.

wej20 is offline  
Old
01-20-2013, 05:36 PM
  #727
UvBnDatsyuked
Registered User
 
UvBnDatsyuked's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2005
Posts: 2,167
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by wej20 View Post
it would be a longer schedule but he'd be playing against 16 and 17 year old defenders, to prepare him for the NHL he needs to be playing against defenders who are stronger than him. If he wants a longer pro schedule he should go to the AHL, rather than dropping down a level.
Agree. No reason at all to go the CHL route. Scoring at almost a two point a game average in a less offensive league.

I really like the glide path of his development. Moves to a new league and takes a couple months to figure things out and then becomes the top player. Did it in the USHL and now in the NCAA.

UvBnDatsyuked is offline  
Old
01-20-2013, 06:09 PM
  #728
Xokkeu
Registered User
 
Xokkeu's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2012
Location: Frozen
Country: Antarctica
Posts: 4,714
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by wej20 View Post
it would be a longer schedule but he'd be playing against 16 and 17 year old defenders, to prepare him for the NHL he needs to be playing against defenders who are stronger than him. If he wants a longer pro schedule he should go to the AHL, rather than dropping down a level.
Bingo. If you are scoring at a point per game in the NCAA, you are generally ready to play in the AHL. If you are scoring almost two points per game? Yeah I think he'd be okay.

Xokkeu is offline  
Old
01-20-2013, 06:12 PM
  #729
Xokkeu
Registered User
 
Xokkeu's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2012
Location: Frozen
Country: Antarctica
Posts: 4,714
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hardyvan123 View Post
John might look like Kane out there but let's slow down the hype train a bit here.

At the same point in their development and age Kane was enjoying the middle of his 2nd .88 PPG season in the NHL.

John had a great world junior tourney on a large ice surface and is dominating HE.

There is a world of difference here and it's more likely that John ends up being more like (insert small US College superstar who doesn't make it) than Patrick Kane.

I always love when a little guy makes it, like Gallagher making the Habs this year but fan bases tend to ignore the realities and likelihood of the odds as well at times and then hater when pretty objective analysis is brought forward.

As a Canuck fan I was happy to see Schroeder drop but it looks like he will be thrown on the bin of really good fast little guys in the lower tiers that didn't make it (which is where most of them end up).

Schroeder actually regressed his sophmore season for Minnesota. He was under a point per game. Granted the team was a mess, but Gaudreau has only gotten better.

Xokkeu is offline  
Old
01-20-2013, 07:36 PM
  #730
Hardyvan123
tweet@HardyintheWack
 
Join Date: Jul 2010
Location: Vancouver
Country: Canada
Posts: 14,285
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by wej20 View Post
it would be a longer schedule but he'd be playing against 16 and 17 year old defenders, to prepare him for the NHL he needs to be playing against defenders who are stronger than him. If he wants a longer pro schedule he should go to the AHL, rather than dropping down a level.
Probably 70% of the playing time in the CHL is taken by 18-20 year olds and Johnny would be seeing top pairing Dmen against him at least 80% of the time.

I think the time for that move was this year not next year anyways, IMO he probably stays at BC.

It depends on how much muscle he can add to his body but right now I don't see him being physically ready to play and develop in the AHL, time will tell.

Hardyvan123 is offline  
Old
01-20-2013, 07:39 PM
  #731
Hardyvan123
tweet@HardyintheWack
 
Join Date: Jul 2010
Location: Vancouver
Country: Canada
Posts: 14,285
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Xokkeu View Post
Schroeder actually regressed his sophmore season for Minnesota. He was under a point per game. Granted the team was a mess, but Gaudreau has only gotten better.
this is true he regressed in his 2nd year and didn't look as good at the WJC as well. Some guys just peak early and don't develop as much as other guys.

Maybe he can have a decent career as a pro but he is basically done with the Canucks IMO.

Hardyvan123 is offline  
Old
01-20-2013, 07:52 PM
  #732
UvBnDatsyuked
Registered User
 
UvBnDatsyuked's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2005
Posts: 2,167
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Xokkeu View Post
Schroeder actually regressed his sophmore season for Minnesota. He was under a point per game. Granted the team was a mess, but Gaudreau has only gotten better.


I do not know a ton about Schroeder but it seems that his game was built around his speed and stickhandling. Both great things to have but looking over past scouting reports from back in 2009, there doesnt seem to be much else mentioned except for speed and puck handling. I read two and no mentions of hockey sense. (Hate to go only by two scouting reports, so if anyone feels that his hockey sense was an asset, please chime in)
I have always been a fan of the "off the chart" intelligent type hockey players so a bit bias with Gaudreau. I just feel that hockey IQ is the key to continuous development from one level to another.

UvBnDatsyuked is offline  
Old
01-20-2013, 10:21 PM
  #733
theIceWookie
#LeafHysteriaAlert
 
theIceWookie's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2010
Location: Canada
Posts: 7,280
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hardyvan123 View Post
John might look like Kane out there but let's slow down the hype train a bit here.

At the same point in their development and age Kane was enjoying the middle of his 2nd .88 PPG season in the NHL.

John had a great world junior tourney on a large ice surface and is dominating HE.

There is a world of difference here and it's more likely that John ends up being more like (insert small US College superstar who doesn't make it) than Patrick Kane.

I always love when a little guy makes it, like Gallagher making the Habs this year but fan bases tend to ignore the realities and likelihood of the odds as well at times and then hater when pretty objective analysis is brought forward.

As a Canuck fan I was happy to see Schroeder drop but it looks like he will be thrown on the bin of really good fast little guys in the lower tiers that didn't make it (which is where most of them end up).
Players listed as 5 foot 10 or under that are regular NHLers (and even some really good ones) - Ian White, Brian Campbell, Jack Hillen, Andrew Cogliano, Zach Boychuk, JM Liles, Matt Read, M Perraeult, Saku Koivu, Kyle Wellwood, Chad LaRose, Tobias Enstrom, Ray Whitney, Andrew Shaw, Kris Russell, Mark Olver, Jordan Tootoo, MA Bergeron, Mike Cammalleri, Derek Roy, Brad Marchand, Scott Nichol, Steve Sullivan, Martin St Louis, Tyler Ennis, Brain Gionta, David Desharnais

High Potential Rookies under 5 foot 10 and likely NHLers (Komarov/Calvert aren't high end but I digress) - Sven Baertshi, Markus Granlund, Damien Brunner, Leo Komarov, Matt Calvert, Ryan Ellis. Jaden Schwartz, Cory Conacher, Cam Atkinson

Tell me again how this is impossible for a small player?

theIceWookie is offline  
Old
01-20-2013, 10:32 PM
  #734
Hardyvan123
tweet@HardyintheWack
 
Join Date: Jul 2010
Location: Vancouver
Country: Canada
Posts: 14,285
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by TheFinnishKulemin View Post
Players listed as 5 foot 10 or under that are regular NHLers (and even some really good ones) - Ian White, Brian Campbell, Jack Hillen, Andrew Cogliano, Zach Boychuk, JM Liles, Matt Read, M Perraeult, Saku Koivu, Kyle Wellwood, Chad LaRose, Tobias Enstrom, Ray Whitney, Andrew Shaw, Kris Russell, Mark Olver, Jordan Tootoo, MA Bergeron, Mike Cammalleri, Derek Roy, Brad Marchand, Scott Nichol, Steve Sullivan, Martin St Louis, Tyler Ennis, Brain Gionta, David Desharnais

High Potential Rookies under 5 foot 10 and likely NHLers (Komarov/Calvert aren't high end but I digress) - Sven Baertshi, Markus Granlund, Damien Brunner, Leo Komarov, Matt Calvert, Ryan Ellis. Jaden Schwartz, Cory Conacher, Cam Atkinson

Tell me again how this is impossible for a small player?

I love responses like this which misquote what I said (like I never said it was impossible for starters).

Most of the guys you list are 5' 10" and over 180 lbs as well.
5' 10" is quite a bit taller than 5'7" 150-155 lbs (that Johnny is listed at).

The most common traits for a "little guy" to make and star in the NHL is a thick body, like 175lbs plus and plus plus skating skills to compensate for their small stature.

Hardyvan123 is offline  
Old
01-20-2013, 10:35 PM
  #735
Szechwan
Plug Life.
 
Szechwan's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2006
Country: Lord Howe Island
Posts: 2,578
vCash: 500
Schroeder essentially made the Canucks out of camp, and was only sent down because of waiver eligibility- as stated by Gillis. MG also said he'd be up with the big club shortly. Not sure how you figure he's "done with the Canucks."

Szechwan is offline  
Old
01-20-2013, 11:47 PM
  #736
Hardyvan123
tweet@HardyintheWack
 
Join Date: Jul 2010
Location: Vancouver
Country: Canada
Posts: 14,285
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Szechwan View Post
Schroeder essentially made the Canucks out of camp, and was only sent down because of waiver eligibility- as stated by Gillis. MG also said he'd be up with the big club shortly. Not sure how you figure he's "done with the Canucks."
Of course they are going to say that.

More importantly Viggy when asked during the off season...er lockout about Schroeder said that "he needs to dominate down in the AHL".

The 30-9-10-19 pace in his 3rd full year in the AHL has been a step backwards and it wasn't like he was close after his 76-21-23-44 season last year either.

Maybe a change of scenery will help but he isn't progressing and unless he steps it up considerably in Chicago with his demotion , his chance with the Canucks is over IMO.

It's too bad, I was really excited when he dropped to the Canucks in the 09 draft but it looks like the teams that passed on him were right.

Hardyvan123 is offline  
Old
01-20-2013, 11:50 PM
  #737
Szechwan
Plug Life.
 
Szechwan's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2006
Country: Lord Howe Island
Posts: 2,578
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hardyvan123 View Post
Of course they are going to say that.

More importantly Viggy when asked during the off season...er lockout about Schroeder said that "he needs to dominate down in the AHL".

The 30-9-10-19 pace in his 3rd full year in the AHL has been a step backwards and it wasn't like he was close after his 76-21-23-44 season last year either.

Maybe a change of scenery will help but he isn't progressing and unless he steps it up considerably in Chicago with his demotion , his chance with the Canucks is over IMO.

It's too bad, I was really excited when he dropped to the Canucks in the 09 draft but it looks like the teams that passed on him were right.
So when he gets called up shortly, I trust you'll be back to explain yourself? The guy looked ready during camp, who cares if he's been hot and cold in the AHL, Hodgson was the same and look how he did with NHL talent.

Szechwan is offline  
Old
01-20-2013, 11:59 PM
  #738
Hardyvan123
tweet@HardyintheWack
 
Join Date: Jul 2010
Location: Vancouver
Country: Canada
Posts: 14,285
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Szechwan View Post
So when he gets called up shortly, I trust you'll be back to explain yourself? The guy looked ready during camp, who cares if he's been hot and cold in the AHL, Hodgson was the same and look how he did with NHL talent.
sure if they are stubborn and keep Lou (they are actively trying to get a 2nd line Center with Kess out) he "could" get called up but I'm betting he has less than 40 games in him with the Canucks, with very little production

Hardyvan123 is offline  
Old
01-21-2013, 12:27 AM
  #739
Szechwan
Plug Life.
 
Szechwan's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2006
Country: Lord Howe Island
Posts: 2,578
vCash: 500
Very bold statement- a prospect with 0 NHL games played as of yet only playing 87% of the remaining (shortened) season. And that's assuming he's recalled tomorrow, which admittedly is unlikely.


edit: but enough derailing the thread. Are Flames fans optimistic of him playing pro soon?

Szechwan is offline  
Old
01-21-2013, 01:44 AM
  #740
Xokkeu
Registered User
 
Xokkeu's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2012
Location: Frozen
Country: Antarctica
Posts: 4,714
vCash: 500
I think Gaudreau will be back at BC next year. From everything I've heard about BC's program it's a place guys want to stick around for awhile. No rush to run off to a remote outpost of the AHL.

Xokkeu is offline  
Old
01-21-2013, 01:50 AM
  #741
Tiranis
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jun 2009
Location: Toronto, ON
Country: Czech_ Republic
Posts: 22,105
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Noori View Post
I know time in the weight room is important, but I think Gaudreau's development would stagnate were he to play another year in the NCAA. He would still have the offseason to hit the gym and the Heat barely play Monday through Thursday, so he would have an opportunity then as well. Players need to be challenged; you can't have them playing at a level where it all comes too easy. If Gaudreau is meant to be an NHL'er, he'll do regardless of when he turns pro.
To bring up a counter example, Martin St Louis is a similarly small player who took full 4 years of college and then still needed some time in the AHL and even NHL time to finally get up to full speed.

I don't think spending more time in college is going to hurt Gaudreau. And it's certainly a lot easier to put on muscle at college, not just because there's more breaks but because there's less games. With the AHL schedule it's hard enough to keep your weight and muscle mass, let alone add to it. Even if you have lots of breaks to work out. It's the number of games, not the exact schedule that's an issue.

Tiranis is offline  
Old
01-21-2013, 02:21 AM
  #742
bennitez7
Registered User
 
Join Date: Oct 2011
Location: Vienna
Country: Austria
Posts: 61
vCash: 500
I'm rooting for him. I really want him to succed. I was very impressed with what he did during the WJC (espacially when it counted the most).

bennitez7 is offline  
Old
01-21-2013, 09:59 AM
  #743
F l a m e s
#winitforgio
 
F l a m e s's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2011
Location: Moose Jaw
Country: Canada
Posts: 6,832
vCash: 50
I doubt we see him leave BC next year.... potentially the year after that though. Despite him dominating the NCAA it's still a good league! I don't think it would stunt his growth dominating one more year. He will make use of the gym, diets, etc, and put on the lean muscle he needs to be better prepared for pro.

F l a m e s is online now  
Old
01-21-2013, 10:10 AM
  #744
InfinityIggy
No Longer Flammable
 
InfinityIggy's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2011
Location: Calgary, AB
Country: Canada
Posts: 19,923
vCash: 150
Quote:
Originally Posted by The Sweetness View Post
I agree he has nothing else to prove. However, I think he could use the lighter college schedule to build up his body. Did you even read my post or just jump to your own conclusion?
Totally agree with this. Johnny won't be able to dominate the AHL at his current weight and especially strength. The best thing for him to do is use the NCAA next year as a chance to do lots of weight training and build up his mass, while still playing a high level of hockey.

InfinityIggy is online now  
Old
01-21-2013, 10:16 AM
  #745
Xokkeu
Registered User
 
Xokkeu's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2012
Location: Frozen
Country: Antarctica
Posts: 4,714
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by wally31 View Post
I doubt we see him leave BC next year.... potentially the year after that though. Despite him dominating the NCAA it's still a good league! I don't think it would stunt his growth dominating one more year. He will make use of the gym, diets, etc, and put on the lean muscle he needs to be better prepared for pro.
I'd say this is realistic. Three years at BC and then try his hand in the AHL.

Xokkeu is offline  
Old
01-21-2013, 10:21 AM
  #746
GetThePuckOut
Registered User
 
Join Date: Mar 2010
Location: Calgary
Country: Canada
Posts: 6,412
vCash: 50
I think he should do what Okposo did, and leave halfway into next year. It'll give him a little more time in the weight room, but also a taste of pro hockey so he doesn't stagnate in college, and not quite enough pro hockey for it to overwhelm him. It's a safe way for him to wet his feet while still getting in some physical development.

GetThePuckOut is offline  
Old
01-21-2013, 11:20 AM
  #747
UvBnDatsyuked
Registered User
 
UvBnDatsyuked's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2005
Posts: 2,167
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by NightBlazer View Post
I think he should do what Okposo did, and leave halfway into next year. It'll give him a little more time in the weight room, but also a taste of pro hockey so he doesn't stagnate in college, and not quite enough pro hockey for it to overwhelm him. It's a safe way for him to wet his feet while still getting in some physical development.
I think that kind of decision is only done when the development has been disappointing by both the NHL team who drafted him and the player. It is not done as a "plan".


Last edited by UvBnDatsyuked: 01-21-2013 at 11:32 AM.
UvBnDatsyuked is offline  
Old
01-21-2013, 11:28 AM
  #748
TheShoe82
No Diving!
 
TheShoe82's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2007
Location: Norwood, MA
Country: United States
Posts: 1,352
vCash: 500
I saw him play the other night against Northeastern. While he is very fast, he has the body of a 13 year old. He needs to add mass and muscle to have any hope of making it, I think.

Dave Mansons kid abused him in front of the net throughout the game, and he started whining to the refs looking for calls most of the game. If the person you are playing against has 12 inches and 50 pounds on you, you are going to get tossed around, its just a part of the game.

TheShoe82 is offline  
Old
01-21-2013, 12:51 PM
  #749
Ashasx
Registered User
 
Ashasx's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2010
Posts: 3,891
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by TheShoe82 View Post
I saw him play the other night against Northeastern. While he is very fast, he has the body of a 13 year old. He needs to add mass and muscle to have any hope of making it, I think.

Dave Mansons kid abused him in front of the net throughout the game, and he started whining to the refs looking for calls most of the game. If the person you are playing against has 12 inches and 50 pounds on you, you are going to get tossed around, its just a part of the game.
Apparently Manson didn't do a very good job, considering Gaudreau had 4 points.

Ashasx is offline  
Old
01-21-2013, 12:55 PM
  #750
InfinityIggy
No Longer Flammable
 
InfinityIggy's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2011
Location: Calgary, AB
Country: Canada
Posts: 19,923
vCash: 150
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ashasx View Post
Apparently Manson didn't do a very good job, considering Gaudreau had 4 points.
Lol. But he got bullied !!!

InfinityIggy is online now  
Closed Thread

Forum Jump


Bookmarks

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off



All times are GMT -5. The time now is 12:42 AM.

monitoring_string = "e4251c93e2ba248d29da988d93bf5144"
Contact Us - HFBoards - Archive - Privacy Statement - Terms of Use - Advertise - Top - AdChoices

vBulletin Copyright ©2000 - 2015, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
HFBoards.com is a property of CraveOnline Media, LLC, an Evolve Media, LLC company. 2015 All Rights Reserved.