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Miikka Kiprusoff

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Old
07-13-2011, 12:23 AM
  #26
Flamesjustwin
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Phion Keneuf View Post
Lmao. Kadri + 1st. Are you high?


Don't get your hopes up when he's traded for either a late first or mid second + a decent prospect.
I don't need to get my hopes up about anything. Feaster already talked about how important a #1 goalie is and how much it hurt TB to see the Bulin wall leave. I highly doubt Kipper will be traded. I do agree though that Kadri plus a 1st is a bit high for Kipper at this stage.

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Old
07-13-2011, 12:33 AM
  #27
ilovetheflyers8
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edit- It was already said.

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Old
07-13-2011, 02:30 AM
  #28
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Originally Posted by showtime8 View Post
I think that people are deeply undervaluing Kipper. I think that he's still a top 5-7 goalie in the league and on a good team he puts up huge numbers.

Keep in mind that he's played over 70 games in the last 6 consecutive seasons. No other goalie in the league can say that they've done that.

The downside is that he's getting up there in age, but durability hasn't been an issue for this guy. He's got 2 solid years left in him and a 3rd year if he can split time with another goalie.


To me, he goes where teams need to win now.


To Calgary:
D Mike Green - they need a guy to play the point and eat up big minutes


To Washington:
G Miikka Kiprusoff - easily makes them the team to beat in the East


Seems like a fair value trade, but there might have to be a couple smaller pieces added.
Make it Kipper and Sarich for Green and Nuewirth and id do it. If flames are getting Green they need to unload one of Sarich or JayBo.

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Old
07-13-2011, 02:48 AM
  #29
ponder
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His value at the deadline? All depends on how he's playing. He's been pretty underwhelming for 3 of the last 4 years, his save percentages for the past 4 years have been 90.6%, 92.0%, 90.3% and 90.6%. He was trash in his last trip to the playoffs too, and just mediocre the trip before that (obviously he's had some great playoff performances, but not since 06/07, which is quite awhile ago). If he's having another sub-par year (like 3 of his last 4), I don't see him returning too much, especially at a $5.83 mil cap hit for the next 3 years.

LOL at some of these trade proposals, you guys are delusional:
- Kadri and a 1st?
- Fowler and a 2nd?
- Gormley, Smith, a 1st and a 3rd?
- Etem and a 1st?
- Mike Green?

These are just brutal, especially those first 3, lay off the crack Calgarians. Chances are we see 10/11 Kipper next year, not 05/06 Kipper, and 10/11 Kipper is not even close to landing one of the above packages at the deadline. It'd be more of a Halak type return.

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07-13-2011, 02:58 AM
  #30
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I think this is not the year to trade kipper, after boston SC win almost every contending team has improved their G position already. and i don't see Kipper giving them any edge over their current goalies + his high salary cap will only cause problems for teams that already has to tinker their rosters to fit under the cap.

Goalie position is hardest to predict and eventho Kipper has sucked for few years now he's still one of the few goalies that have kept number #1(uno) position year after year. Who would have thought that Thomas would play like he did this season after losing his starting job to Rask? Or that roloson could take TB to ECF?

After next season Flames realize franchise current situation and go full rebuild and trade likes of Kipper/Iginla who failed to deliver (its not their fault, but business is business)

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Old
07-13-2011, 03:53 AM
  #31
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ponder View Post
His value at the deadline? All depends on how he's playing. He's been pretty underwhelming for 3 of the last 4 years, his save percentages for the past 4 years have been 90.6%, 92.0%, 90.3% and 90.6%. He was trash in his last trip to the playoffs too, and just mediocre the trip before that (obviously he's had some great playoff performances, but not since 06/07, which is quite awhile ago). If he's having another sub-par year (like 3 of his last 4), I don't see him returning too much, especially at a $5.83 mil cap hit for the next 3 years.

LOL at some of these trade proposals, you guys are delusional:
- Kadri and a 1st?
- Fowler and a 2nd?
- Gormley, Smith, a 1st and a 3rd?
- Etem and a 1st?
- Mike Green?

These are just brutal, especially those first 3, lay off the crack Calgarians. Chances are we see 10/11 Kipper next year, not 05/06 Kipper, and 10/11 Kipper is not even close to landing one of the above packages at the deadline. It'd be more of a Halak type return.
I honestly thought my offer would be quite underwhelming.
Gromley doesn't project to be as good as OEL, and seems more of a long term project prospect, rather than a true blue chipper (imho). So giving up a prospect from a system bursting with them, and a 1st which has been pretty middle of the pack the last couple years.
IMHO, Kipper brings this young but solid team back to the playoffs. Not many major changes from last season except Bryz, but they still posted 100 n 99 point seasons the last two years.

Mike Smith is just a cap dump, giving a platoon in Calgary.

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Old
07-13-2011, 04:00 AM
  #32
mightyquack
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Originally Posted by InfinityIggy View Post
Ducks is a tough one...Fowler and maybe a 2nd. Or Emerson Etem and a 1st.

Toronto...Kadri, 1st.

Calgary would need to send back a 3rd or something in those deals to make it work, they are a little bit favoring Calgary.
As a Ducks fan no to trading Fowler / Etem for Kiprusoff.

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Old
07-13-2011, 04:25 AM
  #33
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kenny Jonsson View Post
Vokoun, Neuvirth and Holtby all say hi.

Lundqvist, Thomas, Price, Luongo, Miller, Vokoun, Brodeur, Bryzgalov > Kipper.

This isn't the Kipper from 2-3 years ago. He's become really average.
Debatable, Stats dont tell the entire story.

It's also nice to know that an elite goaltender can become average after one mediocre season in which his defense was in shambles.

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Old
07-13-2011, 04:27 AM
  #34
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He's still solid. He could fetch a pretty good price I would think. It would depend on who else would be available too.

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Old
07-13-2011, 06:31 AM
  #35
showtime8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kenny Jonsson View Post
Vokoun, Neuvirth and Holtby all say hi.

Lundqvist, Thomas, Price, Luongo, Miller, Vokoun, Brodeur, Bryzgalov > Kipper.

This isn't the Kipper from 2-3 years ago. He's become really average.

Do they still all say hi after their first round exits? Or won't they text back.

And I think that Kippers Vezina counters and says that he's a pretty good goalie?

Brodeur is retiring a devil won't go anywhere. Vokoun is not better than Kipper. The others I can give you though but are all too valuable to their team.

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07-13-2011, 06:35 AM
  #36
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ponder View Post
His value at the deadline? All depends on how he's playing. He's been pretty underwhelming for 3 of the last 4 years, his save percentages for the past 4 years have been 90.6%, 92.0%, 90.3% and 90.6%. He was trash in his last trip to the playoffs too, and just mediocre the trip before that (obviously he's had some great playoff performances, but not since 06/07, which is quite awhile ago). If he's having another sub-par year (like 3 of his last 4), I don't see him returning too much, especially at a $5.83 mil cap hit for the next 3 years.

LOL at some of these trade proposals, you guys are delusional:
- Kadri and a 1st?
- Fowler and a 2nd?
- Gormley, Smith, a 1st and a 3rd?
- Etem and a 1st?
- Mike Green?

These are just brutal, especially those first 3, lay off the crack Calgarians. Chances are we see 10/11 Kipper next year, not 05/06 Kipper, and 10/11 Kipper is not even close to landing one of the above packages at the deadline. It'd be more of a Halak type return.

Halak? Really? Come on now. Halak had one good playoff run. Kipper has had Vezina years and has played on a terrible defensive team in Calgary for the past couple years.

Talk about laying off the crack.

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Old
07-13-2011, 06:35 AM
  #37
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A 1st rounder and either a decent prospect or a forward.

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Old
07-13-2011, 06:53 AM
  #38
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Quote:
Originally Posted by showtime8 View Post
Do they still all say hi after their first round exits? Or won't they text back.

And I think that Kippers Vezina counters and says that he's a pretty good goalie?

Brodeur is retiring a devil won't go anywhere. Vokoun is not better than Kipper. The others I can give you though but are all too valuable to their team.
Have you seen Vokoun's stats compared to Kippers. Voukun has been a much better goalie then Kipper then past 4 seasons. It's not even close. Voukun has played on just as bad of teams also yet all of his numbers are much better then Kipper.

Jose Theodore has a Vezina in 01-02 I don't see teams fighting to sign him at 5.8 million a season....

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Old
07-13-2011, 07:09 AM
  #39
showtime8
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Originally Posted by HooliganX2 View Post
Have you seen Vokoun's stats compared to Kippers. Voukun has been a much better goalie then Kipper then past 4 seasons. It's not even close. Voukun has played on just as bad of teams also yet all of his numbers are much better then Kipper.

Jose Theodore has a Vezina in 01-02 I don't see teams fighting to sign him at 5.8 million a season....

So you would rather have Vokoun than Kipper?

There is no way that Vokoun is anywhere close to the goalie that Kiprusoff is.


There are those years that players come out of nowhere and put up huge numbers, but they aren't consistant. (see Jonathan Cheechoo) As I stated before, no other goalie has played 70 games in the past 6 consecutive seasons.

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07-13-2011, 07:11 AM
  #40
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Quote:
Originally Posted by showtime8 View Post
So you would rather have Vokoun than Kipper?

There is no way that Vokoun is anywhere close to the goalie that Kiprusoff is.


There are those years that players come out of nowhere and put up huge numbers, but they aren't consistant. (see Jonathan Cheechoo) As I stated before, no other goalie has played 70 games in the past 6 consecutive seasons.
Kipper is in the 27-32 range in stats 3 out of the last 4 seasons. Voukun is in the top ten. It's not even close....
Kipper
2007-2008 FLAMES 76 39 26 - 10 2 197 2,096 .906 2.69 4,398
2008-2009 FLAMES 76 45 24 - 5 4 209 2,155 .903 2.84 4,418
2009-2010 FLAMES 73 35 28 - 10 4 163 2,035 .920 2.31 4,235
2009-2010 FINLAND-OLYMPICS 5 3 2 0 1 11 104 2.64 250
2010-2011 FLAMES 71 37 24 - 6 6 182 1,935 .906 2.63 4,156

Voukun
2007-2008 PANTHERS 69 30 29 - 8 4 180 2,213 .919 2.68 4,031
2008-2009 PANTHERS 59 26 23 - 6 6 138 1,855 .926 2.49 3,324
2009-2010 PANTHERS 63 23 28 - 11 7 157 2,081 .925 2.55 3,695
2009-2010 CZECH REPUBLIC-OLYMPICS 5 3 2 0 0 9 140 1.78 304
2009-2010 CZECH REPUBLIC-WC-A 8 7 1 0 0 13 234 1.57 496
2010-2011 PANTHERS 57 22 28 - 5 6 137 1,753 .922 2.55 3,22

I think most people will agree both teams have been equally as bad also.


Last edited by HooliganX2: 07-13-2011 at 07:16 AM.
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Old
07-13-2011, 07:21 AM
  #41
showtime8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by HooliganX2 View Post
Kipper is in the 27-32 range in stats 3 out of the last 4 seasons. Voukun is in the top ten. It's not even close....
Kipper
2007-2008 FLAMES 76 39 26 - 10 2 197 2,096 .906 2.69 4,398
2008-2009 FLAMES 76 45 24 - 5 4 209 2,155 .903 2.84 4,418
2009-2010 FLAMES 73 35 28 - 10 4 163 2,035 .920 2.31 4,235
2009-2010 FINLAND-OLYMPICS 5 3 2 0 1 11 104 2.64 250
2010-2011 FLAMES 71 37 24 - 6 6 182 1,935 .906 2.63 4,156

Voukun
2007-2008 PANTHERS 69 30 29 - 8 4 180 2,213 .919 2.68 4,031
2008-2009 PANTHERS 59 26 23 - 6 6 138 1,855 .926 2.49 3,324
2009-2010 PANTHERS 63 23 28 - 11 7 157 2,081 .925 2.55 3,695
2009-2010 CZECH REPUBLIC-OLYMPICS 5 3 2 0 0 9 140 1.78 304
2009-2010 CZECH REPUBLIC-WC-A 8 7 1 0 0 13 234 1.57 496
2010-2011 PANTHERS 57 22 28 - 5 6 137 1,753 .922 2.55 3,22

I think most people will agree both teams have been equally as bad also.


I'll take the stats that matter. Wins.

Panthers Finish: 15th, 14th, 9th, 11th when Vokoun in net

Flames Finish: 10th, 10th, 5th, 7th when Kipper in net

Panthers made it close once, but didn't make the playoffs.

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Old
07-13-2011, 07:25 AM
  #42
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Originally Posted by showtime8 View Post
I'll take the stats that matter. Wins.

Panthers Finish: 15th, 14th, 9th, 11th when Vokoun in net

Flames Finish: 10th, 10th, 5th, 7th when Kipper in net

Panthers made it close once, but didn't make the playoffs.
You pick the one stat that has a lot more to do with the team then the goalie. Osgood is a top 10 goalie all time if you go by wins....

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Old
07-13-2011, 07:26 AM
  #43
mightyquack
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Quote:
Originally Posted by showtime8 View Post
I'll take the stats that matter. Wins.

Panthers Finish: 15th, 14th, 9th, 11th when Vokoun in net

Flames Finish: 10th, 10th, 5th, 7th when Kipper in net

Panthers made it close once, but didn't make the playoffs.
SV% > wins.

Panthers have had a terrible team for years, the fact he can still post great SV% every year despite poor teams in front of him is very good IMO. Panthers weren't missing the playoffs because of poor play in net, you could argue if Calgary got some better from Kipprusoff last season they would of made the playoffs.

Personally I'd rather have Vokoun then Kiprusoff.

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Old
07-13-2011, 07:34 AM
  #44
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kenny Jonsson View Post
Vokoun, Neuvirth and Holtby all say hi.

Lundqvist, Thomas, Price, Luongo, Miller, Vokoun, Brodeur, Bryzgalov > Kipper.

This isn't the Kipper from 2-3 years ago. He's become really average.

Luongo has little to no value. GM's know that the guy doesn't have what it takes between the ears to win a Cup. He had the best team by a mile in front of him last year and could not get it done. Add in that horrible contract and nobody would touch him with a ten foot pole! Schneider>Luongo and Gillis knows it but his hands are tied with that contract. There was a reason why the top player on Capgeek to be looked at being bought out was Luongo. In no way whatsoever is he better than Kipper, he just has a much better team in front of him.

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07-13-2011, 08:44 AM
  #45
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Wouldnt you think a middle of the line goalie such as Vokoun having little to no interest show us the value of kiprusoff.. essentially there are more goalies then starting jobs and thus making young goalies for rebuilding teams the most valuable. I see him being able to get a Halak type return but still minimal interest until some team desperately needs a goalie

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Old
07-13-2011, 08:48 AM
  #46
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I didn't realise Kipper was this overrated in Calgary. The guy's been average the last few years, and is only going to get worse as the years go by...

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Old
07-13-2011, 08:57 AM
  #47
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After seeing what the Avs gave up, i would expect a pretty good return for a PROVEN goalie

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07-13-2011, 09:18 AM
  #48
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After seeing what the Avs gave up, i would expect a pretty good return for a PROVEN goalie
So why would any team or even one that it would be an upgrade for such as phoenix give you that kind of return to pay a goalie on the decline almost 6mil when they could have just signed vokoun at most likely for 3-5mil per year without giving up the assets?

Unlike Kipper, Varlomov is going to get better at the pace of the young avs team, not worse. And also your not paying as much.

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Old
07-13-2011, 09:29 AM
  #49
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He has not played well the last couple of years. He hasn't been awful, but he certainly hasn't been great either. I can't see a team giving up a ton for him.

He might appeal to some teams looking to hit the cap floor since his real salary tails off in the last couple of years of his contract so a team could claim more against the cap than they actually have to pay him.

I really don't think he'd bring back much in terms of assets.

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07-13-2011, 10:13 AM
  #50
The Gnome
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Originally Posted by HooliganX2 View Post
You pick the one stat that has a lot more to do with the team then the goalie. Osgood is a top 10 goalie all time if you go by wins....
Hey buddy, real hockey fans draw their analysis from actually watching the game. Your perception of Kipper is hilarious, the guy is easily a top 10 goalie in the league.

How do I know this, because I watch hockey. If you have no idea what you're talking about keep it to yourself rather then spewing your vomit on the screen for everyone else to see.

EDIT: Kipper should return a 1st and a decent prospect (not a top 5) if the demand in the market is there.

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