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Old
07-13-2011, 09:33 PM
  #26
Recoil
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Originally Posted by Judrix View Post
you also have to take into consideration that if Kruger is the #3 C then that moves Sharp to the first line LW. He is most comfortable on the wing and our first line will be absolutely nasty. Our 2nd line of Brunette-Bolland-Hossa is also sick. If Kruger can be at least average (I think he'll do better) then Bickell-Kruger-Frolik is not a bad 3rd line at all. Spots open for the wings of the 4th line, which is perfect. Also have a couple of guys in Morin and Smith who proved they can play in the NHL, last season. The forward group will be damn good, imo.
Smith seems like a guy to me whose ceiling may be 3rd / 4th line overall. I wonder if he doesn't get some time on the 4th line depending on who is producing and who isn't. He has a toughness and edge to his game that would play well there.

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07-13-2011, 10:16 PM
  #27
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Originally Posted by Judrix View Post
you also have to take into consideration that if Kruger is the #3 C then that moves Sharp to the first line LW. He is most comfortable on the wing and our first line will be absolutely nasty. Our 2nd line of Brunette-Bolland-Hossa is also sick. If Kruger can be at least average (I think he'll do better) then Bickell-Kruger-Frolik is not a bad 3rd line at all. Spots open for the wings of the 4th line, which is perfect. Also have a couple of guys in Morin and Smith who proved they can play in the NHL, last season. The forward group will be damn good, imo.
Where do people keep getting this? He spent his entire pre NHL career as a center. Much of the reason he was traded to Chicago was he was displeased at being forced to play winger in Philly so he was moved for a natural winger (Matt Ellison). I think the falacy comes from a statement he made 2 years ago. Some were concerned he wasn't happy when moved back to wing and he said he enjoyed playing with Toews and Kane and didn't mind being a winger there.

Find me something where Sharp says he prefers playing wing to center.

Other than that this team is simply better if they can manage to find a pair of third wheels. One for Kane/Toews and the other matched with Hossa and Sharp.

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07-13-2011, 10:28 PM
  #28
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Originally Posted by brevard View Post
Where do people keep getting this? He spent his entire pre NHL career as a center. Much of the reason he was traded to Chicago was he was displeased at being forced to play winger in Philly so he was moved for a natural winger (Matt Ellison). I think the falacy comes from a statement he made 2 years ago. Some were concerned he wasn't happy when moved back to wing and he said he enjoyed playing with Toews and Kane and didn't mind being a winger there.

Find me something where Sharp says he prefers playing wing to center.

Other than that this team is simply better if they can manage to find a pair of third wheels. One for Kane/Toews and the other matched with Hossa and Sharp.
True that Sharp has no preference

http://espn.go.com/blog/chicago/blac...p-and-san-jose

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07-13-2011, 10:49 PM
  #29
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Well, I think we'll either see Scott, Olesz or Stalberg gone by the time the season starts.

O'Donnell was just signed and is on a near league-minimum contract, no way we trade him

Carcillo, Mayers and Smith are all but guaranteed a spot

Stalberg was just signed and Bowman sounds like he believes in him

Scott has one more year on his contract, both Q and Bowman stated they want him to see more ice-time

Olesz was said to need a fresh start and a buy-out or being dumped in Rockford seems unlikely, at this point. Not sure a trade is likely. Could be a good bottom 6er if he can be healthy and find his game.

Out of the 3, I'd say Scott is the most likely to go. Either way, Bowman is fibbing about something unless we don't re-sign Frolik or Campoli... I doubt we let either of them go though.

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07-13-2011, 10:51 PM
  #30
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I think it'll ultimately be Scott. We have O'Donnell for defense and Stalberg and Olesz are more useful than him at forward.

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Old
07-13-2011, 11:18 PM
  #31
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Originally Posted by LandofLincoln View Post
Zero what are you talking about? Are you talking about having 8 defenseman.....

Honestly I don't count Scott as a defenseman any more than I do a forward. He can be listed as either D/F. It doesn't even really matter. He has 3 minutes of ice time.

Zero means a lot wtf is the point you were making?
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Originally Posted by LandofLincoln View Post
Healthy scratch they did it all the time with Burish. He traveled with the team, but wouldn't play when Eager did and if the Hawks dressed Boyton sometimes he didn't play either. There will be a lot of games the Hawks only dress 7 d-men.
Pretty sure he was making a comment about the dressing 7 dmen for a lot of the games.

That would mean they only dress 11 forwards. Seems unlikely that will ever happen since we are carrying extra forwards and dmen. Thus, it will happen "zero" times.

FYI, you can only dress 18 skaters. Usually that means 12 forwards, 6 defensemen.

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07-13-2011, 11:46 PM
  #32
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Scott was pretty important in the playoffs last year. Along with Bolland, I think he was one of the reasons for our comeback.

Ask the boys on the team if they want Scott out there or not.

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07-13-2011, 11:47 PM
  #33
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Scott was pretty important in the playoffs last year. Along with Bolland, I think he was one of the reasons for our comeback.

Ask the boys on the team if they want Scott out there or not.
Yes, his three minutes and minor penalty in Game 3 really helped.

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07-13-2011, 11:49 PM
  #34
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Originally Posted by stingo View Post
Scott was pretty important in the playoffs last year. Along with Bolland, I think he was one of the reasons for our comeback.

Ask the boys on the team if they want Scott out there or not.
I'm not sure Scott goes either because Q was quoted as liking having 8 defenseman... but we already have O'Donnell and Carcillo as our designated tough-guys. Scott has some competition in the regard and both OD and Carcillo can play hockey better than Scott.

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07-13-2011, 11:53 PM
  #35
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Originally Posted by Blackhawkswincup View Post
This.

Sharp has never given any indication that he prefers wing, it's just that he's far more effective as a winger.

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Old
07-14-2011, 12:19 AM
  #36
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Quote:
Originally Posted by stingo View Post
Scott was pretty important in the playoffs last year. Along with Bolland, I think he was one of the reasons for our comeback.

Ask the boys on the team if they want Scott out there or not.
1) Scott played an embarrassing 5 minutes of icetime at wing before being benched for making an idiotic turnover in his own zone. His "hits" wouldn't have knocked Barbara Walters on her ass.

2) The team would probably give each other awkward looks then shrug and go "...uh, yeah...sure..."

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07-14-2011, 01:33 AM
  #37
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It will be Krüger or Smith because they don't have to go thru waivers
or what I would prefer Scott


Scott will play all AHL games and Bowman was right when he said he wants to give Scott more icetime

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Old
07-14-2011, 03:15 AM
  #38
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most likely kruger, would like to see him up but no real spot for him right now, also keep scott in rockford or healthy scratch and dress him on games you may need to send a message like in vancouver or something, even though last years regular season games were pretty tame. its still nice to have a guy like that on your team have him hop off the bench after someone like kane gets punched in the back of the head by someone like gillies or cooke and beat on someone take the 10 game suspension and divide up the fine between the team, rather have him out 10 than carcillo or mayers, atleast they can play(hopefully lol)

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07-14-2011, 03:57 AM
  #39
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The way the blackhawks brass is talking up Kruger there's no way in hell he's sent down unless he absolutely fails out of the box.

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07-14-2011, 07:44 AM
  #40
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MadhouseOnMadison View Post
This.

Sharp has never given any indication that he prefers wing, it's just that he's far more effective as a winger.
"Far more effective"? Eh, its close, I do think he is better at wing than center, but its not a huge gap. Sharp is a very good center.

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07-14-2011, 08:48 AM
  #41
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Sharp is effective at wing but he has really only been used as a wing with Toews and Kane. ... Any player with a snipers eye (as Byfuglien proved) would be effective with Toews and Kane.

My hope (don't laugh) is to find that more physical guy who ALSO has some touch for both lines (with Toews/Kane and Sharp/Hossa). Look at (current) a guy like Holmstrom or Cleary in Detroit are they top line or 2nd line talents? Bertuzzi has proven he wasn't really a top line guy in Vancouver he just played a role on a line with 2 guys who were. ... Going back to my day, was Al Secord really ever a 1st liner based on his talents? How about Charlie Simmer?

Again I have to beg (DON"T LAUGH) wouldn't any of you be at least a little bit interested in having Q pull Carcillo aside, ask him to play tough but cut out the stupid **** while getting his ass in front of the net on a line with Toews and Kane or Sharp and Hossa? Carcillo for all the clown antics CAN actually play hockey and has shown he knows how to score. I would like to see what could happen if he put the games aside and played a tough role on a top2 line.

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07-14-2011, 09:15 AM
  #42
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alright Sharp has no preference, but him moving to the 1st line would make the 1st line much, much stronger. Brunette-Bolland-Hossa has some good scoring potential (I think Bolland will have a career year) and is also very aware defensively.

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07-14-2011, 09:44 AM
  #43
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Who would I drop? Scott, obviously.

Who will be dropped? Not Scott. Probably O'Donnell, he's not fast enough for this team and has the fewest ties to our coaches and management. Smith or Kruger (Kruger more due to management's mancrush on him) need to write their own tickets to Rockford.

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07-14-2011, 09:53 AM
  #44
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Originally Posted by Blackhawkswincup View Post
Add to that very few actual are willing to fight him
Right, thats the problem with Scott. He's probably one of the toughest 3 guys in the league but no one will fight him which renders him useless.

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07-14-2011, 09:56 AM
  #45
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Who would I drop? Scott, obviously.

Probably O'Donnell, he's not fast enough for this team and has the fewest ties to our coaches and management.
I disagree. I thought picking up O'Donnell was a great move by Bowman. He isn't very fast, but he's still a really good shutdown D-man. He was the best #7 in the league last year and I see no reason why that would change. He's hard to play against, even at his age. Not only that, he's a good leader and calls people out.

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07-14-2011, 10:07 AM
  #46
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The answer to this question is Olesz or Kruger. If Olesz cannot be bought out, you better believe Bowman is going to say, "Alright, not healthy enough to be bought out, not healthy enough for the active roster." Olesz goes on IR for the first month of the season at least. Kruger gets his chance and if he does well, we deal with the situation at that time. Most likely someone else will be banged up by then.

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07-14-2011, 10:42 AM
  #47
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Originally Posted by coldsteelonice84 View Post
The answer to this question is Olesz or Kruger. If Olesz cannot be bought out, you better believe Bowman is going to say, "Alright, not healthy enough to be bought out, not healthy enough for the active roster." Olesz goes on IR for the first month of the season at least. Kruger gets his chance and if he does well, we deal with the situation at that time. Most likely someone else will be banged up by then.
Correct me if I'm wrong... but I thought you could only exceed the 23-man roster limit if a player is placed on LTIR. I don't think just IR would allow us to hold 24 or more players.

So we cannot go into the season with both Olesz and Kruger along with the rest of our roster unless Olesz is placed on LTIR before the season starts.

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07-14-2011, 11:17 AM
  #48
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Here are my two possibilities. These assume Olesz does not get bought out, and is given his shot on the roster opening day. One assumes Kruger starts with the club, the other assumes he starts the year in Rockford.

With Kruger

FORWARDS
Patrick Sharp ($3.900m) / Jonathan Toews ($6.300m) / Patrick Kane ($6.300m)
Andrew Brunette ($2.000m) / Dave Bolland ($3.375m) / Marian Hossa ($5.275m)
Bryan Bickell ($0.541m) / Marcus Kruger ($0.900m) / Michael Frolik ($2.375m)
Viktor Stalberg ($0.875m) / Jamal Mayers ($0.550m) / Daniel Carcillo ($0.775m)

HEALTHY SCRATCH (F)
Rostislav Olesz ($3.125m) / Ben Smith ($0.812m)

DEFENSEMEN
Brent Seabrook ($5.800m) / Duncan Keith ($5.538m)
Niklas Hjalmarsson ($3.500m) / Steve Montador ($2.750m)
Nick Leddy ($1.116m) / Chris Campoli ($2.200m)

HEALTHY SCRATCH (D)
Sean O'Donnell ($0.850m)

GOALTENDERS
Corey Crawford ($2.666m) / Alexander Salak ($0.612m)

CAPGEEK.COM TOTALS
SALARY CAP: $64,300,000; CAP PAYROLL: $62,138,462; BONUSES: $730,000
CAP SPACE (23-man roster): $2,161,538

Without Kruger

FORWARDS
Andrew Brunette ($2.000m) / Jonathan Toews ($6.300m) / Patrick Kane ($6.300m)
Ben Smith ($0.812m) / Patrick Sharp ($3.900m) / Marian Hossa ($5.275m)
Bryan Bickell ($0.541m) / Dave Bolland ($3.375m) / Michael Frolik ($2.375m)
Viktor Stalberg ($0.875m) / Jamal Mayers ($0.550m) / Daniel Carcillo ($0.775m)

HEALTHY SCRATCH (F)
Rostislav Olesz ($3.125m)

DEFENSEMEN
Brent Seabrook ($5.800m) / Duncan Keith ($5.538m)
Niklas Hjalmarsson ($3.500m) / Steve Montador ($2.750m)
Nick Leddy ($1.116m) / Chris Campoli ($2.200m)

HEALTHY SCRATCH (D)
Sean O'Donnell ($0.850m) / John Scott ($0.512m)

GOALTENDERS
Corey Crawford ($2.666m) / Alexander Salak ($0.612m)

CAPGEEK.COM TOTALS
SALARY CAP: $64,300,000; CAP PAYROLL: $61,750,962; BONUSES: $545,000
CAP SPACE (23-man roster): $2,549,038

-----------------------

Either way, it's tough to see Morin on this team to start the year, but given his concussion, starting him in Rockford is the smart play. I'd LOVE to see him make the team by the all-star game and work his way up to that second line.

Also, as you can see, things are REALLY tight. Ben Smith may be a healthy scratch on some nights --- where do you fit him in?

As tight as this looks, I do feel that some sort of move is coming by the start of the season. Whether it's Olesz getting bought or buried, a 2 for 1 trade, something. While there is merit on having folks try out for a roster spot, they are challenged by only having a couple of people this year that are not waiver eligible, so it may not be as open of a tryout as they make it sound unless they clear some room.

It's going to be a long wait till training camp, and there will be tons of speculation between now and then I'm sure.
Good points are made here...and I like both scenarios with Sharp & Bolland moving up on the occasion. I think the same way...I agree with the second lineup you have to start the season....

I think the first line-up is more likely later on in the season.

Kruger could use a brush up just for a few months in AHL...

Smith & Olesz almost every Blackhawk fan has Smith ahead of Olesz. Smith playoff goal game winner!!! Hero last year....last year...

Management wants Olesz to succeed because of all the $$$ he is making. Plus he needs to have success to have any trade value. I think Smith has to have an awesome camp. I have Olesz ahead of him not because he is better, but because he needs to get playing time to have any trade value.

Olesz will wear a Blackhawk sweater for 2 months and then be traded making room for Smith or Morin. Even if Olesz has the best first half of hockey ever...well he just upped his trade value.

It wouldn't surprise me if he was moved before the season starts, but I think they tried that and would eat to much of the contract.

Worse case scenario he plays 40-50 games this year 5 minutes a game, and gets buried next year if there are no takers. That is just to much cash to bury this year.

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Old
07-14-2011, 11:18 AM
  #49
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Nah -- regular IR opens up a roster spot, LTIR lets you exceed the cap. The latter was more important in the last few years, this year the former should be more important.

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07-14-2011, 11:24 AM
  #50
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Sharp-Toews-Kane
Brunette-Bolland-Hossa
Bickell-Kruger-Frolik
Carcillo-Mayers-Smith
*Olesz, Stalberg

Keith-Seabrook
Hjalmarsson-Campoli
Leddy-Montador
*O'Donnell

Crawford
Salak

This is what we'll start the season with IMO. Scott's gotta be the man out... moving Olesz around is too tricky and he seems like he's got decent potential if he can stay healthy. Stalberg has 2 years on his deal and it sounds like Bowman wants to see if he can play to his 'potential'. O'Donnell is better than Scott.

I guess an Olesz buy-out or put in the minors on a 'conditioning stint', could work out? Gives us a bit more time to figure out what the hell we're gonna do but I'm not sure if he qualifies for it. Still don't see it as very likely.

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