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Old
07-14-2011, 11:24 AM
  #51
Jeffrey Lebowski
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Originally Posted by massivegoonery View Post
Nah -- regular IR opens up a roster spot, LTIR lets you exceed the cap. The latter was more important in the last few years, this year the former should be more important.
Gotcha, thank you.

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Old
07-14-2011, 12:10 PM
  #52
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Sharp is effective at wing but he has really only been used as a wing with Toews and Kane. ... Any player with a snipers eye (as Byfuglien proved) would be effective with Toews and Kane.

My hope (don't laugh) is to find that more physical guy who ALSO has some touch for both lines (with Toews/Kane and Sharp/Hossa). Look at (current) a guy like Holmstrom or Cleary in Detroit are they top line or 2nd line talents? Bertuzzi has proven he wasn't really a top line guy in Vancouver he just played a role on a line with 2 guys who were. ... Going back to my day, was Al Secord really ever a 1st liner based on his talents? How about Charlie Simmer?

Again I have to beg (DON"T LAUGH) wouldn't any of you be at least a little bit interested in having Q pull Carcillo aside, ask him to play tough but cut out the stupid **** while getting his ass in front of the net on a line with Toews and Kane or Sharp and Hossa? Carcillo for all the clown antics CAN actually play hockey and has shown he knows how to score. I would like to see what could happen if he put the games aside and played a tough role on a top2 line.
1st paragraph is not laughable. I think that is why so many people hope Beach pans out and that someone like Bickell could get more of a mean streak and consistancy. But finding one let alone 2 is a difficult task

I think that is why Q kept giving Brouwer chance after Chance with Kane/Toews. Cause he was hoping he would be that guy but Brouwer's inconsisant play really hurt.

Honestly Ladd and Buff would have developed into what your looking for but it was impossible to keep them (Even more now if we had kept them at the costs)

As for your 2nd paragraph ,, That is terrible idea

Carcillo is best when under control which means less physical and more focusing on hockey. When he plays more physical he tends to get out of control and do stupid things.

It would be like sticking Eager with Kane/Toews... Not something positive IMO.

And Carcillo's best play in NHL was with Coyotes when Gretzky had him focusing on playing hockey with edge. In Philly he was like a rabid dog

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Old
07-14-2011, 12:16 PM
  #53
Jeffrey Lebowski
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Originally Posted by Blackhawkswincup View Post
1st paragraph is not laughable. I think that is why so many people hope Beach pans out and that someone like Bickell could get more of a mean streak and consistancy. But finding one let alone 2 is a difficult task

I think that is why Q kept giving Brouwer chance after Chance with Kane/Toews. Cause he was hoping he would be that guy but Brouwer's inconsisant play really hurt.

Honestly Ladd and Buff would have developed into what your looking for but it was impossible to keep them (Even more now if we had kept them at the costs)

As for your 2nd paragraph ,, That is terrible idea

Carcillo is best when under control which means less physical and more focusing on hockey. When he plays more physical he tends to get out of control and do stupid things.

It would be like sticking Eager with Kane/Toews... Not something positive IMO.

And Carcillo's best play in NHL was with Coyotes when Gretzky had him focusing on playing hockey with edge. In Philly he was like a rabid dog
I'll agree with this. And I think if Q were to put him on the top line with Kane and Toews, it would be to go out and make sure no one messes with them... not as the guy who compliments their game.

I think Bickell fits the latter mold moreso than Carcillo. If we can just get Carcillo to tow the line and not cross it, he could be a very effective 4th line player.

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Old
07-14-2011, 12:19 PM
  #54
coldsteelonice84
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Carcillo will be fine. I expect to see his play from the Coyotes, which was excellent. Lavi was in over his head with the Flyers and lost the team.

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07-14-2011, 12:22 PM
  #55
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Carcillo is not just a bottom line goon. The guy is actually a skilled player and will likely see time on lines 2-4.

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07-14-2011, 12:24 PM
  #56
coldsteelonice84
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Originally Posted by brtriad View Post
Carcillo is not just a bottom line goon. The guy is actually a skilled player and will likely see time on lines 2-4.
Agreed. I see no reason why he can't be another Steve Downie if he focuses and gets better with this coaching staff.

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07-14-2011, 12:42 PM
  #57
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Agreed from here too. One hope I have for next season, a part from getting the Cup back to Chicago, is that Carcillo would emerge as a solid player that can do much more than just "gooning it up". He's already had two seasons of collecting points in the mid 20s, so it shouldn't be unreasonable to expect him to be able to get 30+ pts if he concentrates on meat and potatoes hockey instead of sideshow antics.

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Old
07-14-2011, 01:20 PM
  #58
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Blackhawkswincup View Post
1st paragraph is not laughable. I think that is why so many people hope Beach pans out and that someone like Bickell could get more of a mean streak and consistancy. But finding one let alone 2 is a difficult task

I think that is why Q kept giving Brouwer chance after Chance with Kane/Toews. Cause he was hoping he would be that guy but Brouwer's inconsisant play really hurt.

Honestly Ladd and Buff would have developed into what your looking for but it was impossible to keep them (Even more now if we had kept them at the costs)

As for your 2nd paragraph ,, That is terrible idea

Carcillo is best when under control which means less physical and more focusing on hockey. When he plays more physical he tends to get out of control and do stupid things.

It would be like sticking Eager with Kane/Toews... Not something positive IMO.

And Carcillo's best play in NHL was with Coyotes when Gretzky had him focusing on playing hockey with edge. In Philly he was like a rabid dog
This is what people need to realize. Just about everyone's view of Carcillo is from afar. It's from seeing him a couple times with Philly and listening to what they hear about his reputation. I saw him a lot with Phoenix because I was living there at the time and even back then I always said to myself "man would I love this guy or someone like him on the Hawks". When kept under control and playing hockey, the guy is extremely effective. He has a lot more talent and ability than he's given credit for and when playing on the right side of the edge he's a son of a ***** to play against. Between Q running the show and the dynamics of that dressing room I think we get Coyote Carcillo, only seemingly maybe a bit better seeing as he was at the start of his career then and maybe has developed a bit since and even though likely a fourth liner will still at times have better players around him. He's got the ability that you can move him up and down the lines a bit in a pinch. I think people who are/were against this will be pleasantly surprised with what they see when they get to see him on a day in day out basis. Especially for his term and cap hit, I think it was a really good move and he's going to be a great fit. Time will tell but I'm on board with it.

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Old
07-14-2011, 01:38 PM
  #59
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Originally Posted by Blue Liner View Post
back then I always said to myself "man would I love this guy or someone like him on the Hawks".
Everytime I watched a Phoenix game, I said the same thing. The guy was a hell of a player there. You always knew when Carcillo was on the ice because he was all over the place.

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Old
07-14-2011, 02:03 PM
  #60
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agree. Carcillo was a great player for the yotes

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Old
07-14-2011, 02:12 PM
  #61
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Originally Posted by coldsteelonice84 View Post
Agreed. I see no reason why he can't be another Steve Downie if he focuses and gets better with this coaching staff.
woah, let's not go overboard here. I like Carcillo, and agree he has some skill to be more than a goon, but another Steve Downie? Isn't Carcillo older? Yeesh, tone down the excitement a little.

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07-14-2011, 02:13 PM
  #62
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agree. Carcillo was a great player for the yotes
Carcillo was a solid player for the Yotes ,, Nothing close to great

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Old
07-14-2011, 02:16 PM
  #63
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Originally Posted by Blackhawkswincup View Post
Carcillo was a solid player for the Yotes ,, Nothing close to great
If you think about his role on the team, he was great

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07-14-2011, 02:56 PM
  #64
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His role on the Coyotes was to run around and act like a jerk, which he was great at.

That seemed to be everybody's role on the Coyotes under TGO.

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07-14-2011, 04:10 PM
  #65
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Knowing Q and the makeup of this team, I expect Carcillo to play on every line but primarily the 4th. I think he'll score about 15G/30PTS.

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Old
07-14-2011, 04:54 PM
  #66
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The odd man out has to be one of

Scott, Stalberg, Smith, or Kruger.

My guess is one of the last two guys.

I think it's Smith for a few reasons..

We don't lack wingers, he is in a contract year.. so I think that is on the back of the Hawks mind, and he can be sent down without the risk of losing him.

If the Hawks keep him up with Kruger, they have to waive someone, and Smith could have a 20/20 season and command 2mil next off season.

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Old
07-14-2011, 08:26 PM
  #67
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Originally Posted by Blue Liner View Post
This is what people need to realize. Just about everyone's view of Carcillo is from afar. It's from seeing him a couple times with Philly and listening to what they hear about his reputation. I saw him a lot with Phoenix because I was living there at the time and even back then I always said to myself "man would I love this guy or someone like him on the Hawks". When kept under control and playing hockey, the guy is extremely effective. He has a lot more talent and ability than he's given credit for and when playing on the right side of the edge he's a son of a ***** to play against. Between Q running the show and the dynamics of that dressing room I think we get Coyote Carcillo, only seemingly maybe a bit better seeing as he was at the start of his career then and maybe has developed a bit since and even though likely a fourth liner will still at times have better players around him. He's got the ability that you can move him up and down the lines a bit in a pinch. I think people who are/were against this will be pleasantly surprised with what they see when they get to see him on a day in day out basis. Especially for his term and cap hit, I think it was a really good move and he's going to be a great fit. Time will tell but I'm on board with it.
Fifthfeather has a very good breakdown of Carcillo and his play this past season. It's in depth, and surprising but a factual analysis and worth a read. I'd like to think that Q can get the best from this player and DC's production should reflect that. Fingers crossed.

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Old
07-14-2011, 08:59 PM
  #68
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O'donnell

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Old
07-14-2011, 09:08 PM
  #69
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O'donnell
Why would O'Donnell be the odd man out? I don't see why we'd sign a FA to a 1 year deal only to trade him, buy him out or dump him in Rockford. It just makes no sense.

At least Stalberg was an RFA, Scott was signed last year to a 2 year deal and Olesz's health and contract make him questionable.

I have no doubt that O'Donnell will be our #7/#8 defenseman at the very least... it would be bad business to sign a FA who could sign with any team only to release him from the team somehow before the season started.

Reaslitically, it's one of Scott/Stalberg/Olesz or we don't re-sign one of Campoli or Frolik. Those are really the only options that make any sense whatsoever considering the comments that Bowman and Quenneville have made this off-season.

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07-14-2011, 09:10 PM
  #70
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O'donnell
O'Donnell would be claimed immediately. Am I the only one who watched Philly last year? That guy was a great signing. He'll end up playing a lot for us and you'll be thankful we have him when someone gets hurt.

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Old
07-14-2011, 09:13 PM
  #71
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If we want more protection for star players, Stalberg will be sent down. If we want to save a lot of cap space, Olesz will be sent down. If we want a better roster in case of injury, Scott will be sent down. It's one of those three. I trust O'Donnell if someone goes down. Scott is a liability.

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07-14-2011, 09:17 PM
  #72
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If we want more protection for star players, Stalberg will be sent down. If we want to save a lot of cap space, Olesz will be sent down. If we want a better roster in case of injury, Scott will be sent down. It's one of those three. I trust O'Donnell if someone goes down. Scott is a liability.
Stalberg is waiver-prone, I believe. I think he would get claimed if put on the waiver wire, IMO. I think Bowman likes Stalberg's potential to much to expose him to that risk.

In my own opinion, I think it's Scott or Olesz... more likely Scott.

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07-14-2011, 09:25 PM
  #73
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Stalberg is waiver-prone, I believe. I think he would get claimed if put on the waiver wire, IMO. I think Bowman likes Stalberg's potential to much to expose him to that risk.

In my own opinion, I think it's Scott or Olesz... more likely Scott.
It's too hard to tell. I know Bowman loves Stalberg, but Scott is a liability, but if Wirtz agrees to pay extra money with Olesz down, it's an enticing thought that the Hawks could have a lot of cap space for Bowman to make big improvements to the team during the year. We could get some extremely talented players right now, but with Olesz in the AHL, man, Sharp coming back is an absolute lock/done deal.

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Old
07-14-2011, 09:30 PM
  #74
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It's too hard to tell. I know Bowman loves Stalberg, but Scott is a liability, but if Wirtz agrees to pay extra money with Olesz down, it's an enticing thought that the Hawks could have a lot of cap space for Bowman to make big improvements to the team during the year. We could get some extremely talented players right now, but with Olesz in the AHL, man, Sharp coming back is an absolute lock/done deal.
I agree, it's hard to speculate exactly what will happen because we really have no idea what Bowman is truly thinking. There are obvious candidates that make sense in some ways, and don't in others. The only thing we know for sure is that someone will have to go unless one of Campoli/Frolik aren't retained.

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07-14-2011, 09:47 PM
  #75
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I'm thinking it's going to be Scott. I don't see a goaltending or defense upgrade at the trade deadline. The only two trades I can come up with are a top-six forward and possibly a fourth line center. With Olesz as an extra forward, we could take on a player or players with cap hits over $9 million at the deadline with Stalberg, Olesz, and O'Donnell as the extra players with Kruger centering the third line. For example, let's say the top-six forward is Doan and we replace Mayers with McClement. With Mayers in Rockford, we still would have room for $3,550,000 of cap hit worth to spend. Olesz doesn't need to be sent down.

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