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If Kovalev called PG and offered him 1Y/1M.. Would you?

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Old
07-18-2011, 12:16 PM
  #176
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Originally Posted by neofury View Post
To be fair when was the last time we had a team with 3 scoring lines? That's right never. (Recently anyways)

So it's unfair to really judge. It looks to me like they're trying to copy the Philly/Boston model of rolling with 3 good scoring lines. Boston had an over-age Recchi so I don't see why we can't do the same thing with Kovalev.
Simple...because Recchi despite his advanced age is still an effective player in alot of different situations. He's also still a very good skater and isn't as predictable as Kovalev.

Totally different situations

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Originally Posted by neofury View Post
So what you're saying is it is in fact possible for a 3rd liner to get decent minutes, which is what people all along have been saying Kovalev wouldn't get on our 3rd line.If we have 3 balanced scoring lines it would be pretty tough not to give the 3rd line minutes, minutes which we all know Kovalev could use to get points.
Robert Lang played pretty much as our shutdown center while he was here, he took at the tough matchups against the oppositions best lines, he took most of the important draws, he played PP and PK.

Are you suggesting that Alex Kovalev, from his wing position mind you, can do the same????

And I get the 3 offensive lines thing...but we have more than enough players as is to make that happen. Where the Habs need help the most, it's at even strength.

And Alex Kovalev is pretty much invisible at even strength...he needs space/time for everything he does and while I agree he could def be a threat on the PP...that's probably the LAST area the Habs need help in.

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Yeah I guess making baseless assumptions about the guy because he had a bad season on a ****** team is proving to know a lot more than the guy wanting him back and thinking he can succeed in a limited 3rd line/PP type role
What baseless assumptions? I actualy WATCH a ton of hockey...I watched Kovalev the last year and a half in Ottawa and especially in Pittsburgh cause I remember here in February debating with the SAME people i'm debating this today as to the merits of acquiring Kovalev at LAST YEAR's deadline as well. How did that work out for Pittsburgh? He was a complete flop.

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Plus just because a player hasn't worked out in the past doesn't mean they can't in the future. Cole didn't work out on Edmonton, are you going to tell me based on this evidence Cole cannot compete on our squad? He's only ever played well in Carolina so... but obviously that isn't the case. Just because Kovalev has yet to succeed under a tight knit system doesn't mean he can't do it here. And same for Cole, he can be a success here. Just basing it on the fact that he's struggled to do it in the past is as silly as somebody assuming he'd put up 65pts here cause he's done it in the past.
Tell me something I dont know...

But that's not what i'm talking about...Kovalev has NEVER in his entire career had success under a structured system. Why do you think that at 38yrs of age, things are going to change? The only time Kovalev had successful seasons worthy of his talent was when he was coached by Ivan Hlnka & Guy Carbonneau, who basically let him do whatever the hell he wanted. For Kovalev to be happy and thus, play to the level of his great talent, he needs the freedom to express himself on the ice...and giving him backchecking assignments (which we all know are pre-requisites for ANY winger playing in JM's system), asking him to dump the puck in when there's no play at the opposite blue line, coming back deep in his zone to be an outlet for his defensmen, etc...these are things that Kovalev has struggled with historically throughout his career. I can't understand that as a Habs fan, a Kovalev fan...you don't realize this???

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But I don't even think it's deniable he could fill a 3rd line role for us. If you don't think so that's okay, but I just find it funny how a lot of the Kovalev bashers are trying to say the Kovalev lovers lack knowledge or logic when they themselves are throwing feces around in circles bringing nothing to the argument. Not saying you but generally speaking
Of course he can...I just don't think that on this particular team, with this particular coach and in this particular system, that he WOULD. It's like fitting a square peg into a round hole.

As for the whole "Kovalev bashers"...i'm a Kovalev fan, always have been. But i'm not a groupie and I also watch a ton of hockey and I realize his limitations as a player and his very "difficult to mesh with" way of playing. I don't care nor am I impressed at the fact he can stickhandle in the phone booth, cause there's no freaking phone booths on the ice lol...

I just don't personally think it would work...just my opinion

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07-18-2011, 02:06 PM
  #177
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07-18-2011, 02:08 PM
  #178
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I was a huge Kovy fan (although I didn't attend the rally ) but I don't think he fits on this team anymore. He's slowed a lot over the last few seasons and I think he'd slow the team down. Not to mention he'd "stand out" from the quasi military system JM imposes and would probably end up being a distraction because of it. I don't think he'd work well with JM. I say Kovy thanks for the memories but no thanks.

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07-18-2011, 02:37 PM
  #179
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Originally Posted by TheBuriedHab View Post
At this point, I wouldn't take him for free.
I'm with you, losing Kovy was addition by substraction

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07-18-2011, 02:43 PM
  #180
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Originally Posted by coolasprICE View Post
Nobody in here is in position to say yes or no unless you are close to Kovy and are aware of his level of motivation to return.

Do you guys know his off season training? Is it daily? has he started? Is it more than past summers? Does Kovy want to try even harder this summer to prove he's got 1 more? Or is he looking past hockey now, turning the page? Does he have something to prove, since he sucked last year???????? Or does he not give a crap?????????

Only Kovy & those close to him would know his motivational level.

If I were GM, I would find out and meet with him if he REALLY wanted to return, if he still wants to play, and is working hard at prepping this summer.

If he is working extra hard this summer in getting ready, and is determined ... I'd do it for 1 million... with his talent, when he really wants to prove critics wrong, he's worth the risk. At the worst case, you keep him away from the team after a handful of games if you see he's more harm than good.

However, if he's flying around in his planes, and is basically enjoying life, and he's simply still ''open to coming back''... i'd most definitely pass as to me that's indicative of a guy who doesn't really want to return that badly.
Just buy his DVD on his training methods..

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07-18-2011, 02:50 PM
  #181
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I love Kovalev. That being said on this particular day I say no to bringing him back. I'd rather just roll with what we have and give some of our young guys experience.

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07-18-2011, 03:03 PM
  #182
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Wo wo.. Some people needs to calm the **** down. I'm all with not bringing Kovy back but that's because I don't think he's good enough anymore. The Kovy we got here was already quite old but still have juice in him to compete and be successful but from what I saw last season, he's nowhere as good anymore.

But some people here is talking like the guy was a poison and didn't do anything for the Habs when he was here. Really, he was pretty good for us despite what people thinks. I would even go as far as hockey passion was reborn in Montreal after the acquisition of Kovalev. Yeah the guy isn't perfect and have a personality that could be sometime hard to deal with but I won't discredit him for what he did for Montreal, the Habs and the fans.

Again, I don't think he could help our team NOW but I won't hate a guy that truthfully love playing here.

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07-18-2011, 03:17 PM
  #183
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If Kovy only wants 1 mil, that means he's serious about playing as he's not doing it for the money. If that's the case, a motivated Kovalev would be hard to say no too. At that price, if I'm PG, I go for it.

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07-18-2011, 03:25 PM
  #184
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Favre4Favre View Post
If Kovy only wants 1 mil, that means he's serious about playing as he's not doing it for the money. If that's the case, a motivated Kovalev would be hard to say no too. At that price, if I'm PG, I go for it.
The argument can be made that he only want 1 million because that's all he can ask for at this point in his career. I am on the fence with kovy because of how he made our pp magical in his stay here.


This season though id rather have a defensive specialist (a la halpern) and cut plekanec pk time by like half.

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07-18-2011, 03:28 PM
  #185
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Forget Kovalev I want Yashin

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07-18-2011, 03:54 PM
  #186
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Originally Posted by shamrun View Post
The argument can be made that he only want 1 million because that's all he can ask for at this point in his career. I am on the fence with kovy because of how he made our pp magical in his stay here.


This season though id rather have a defensive specialist (a la halpern) and cut plekanec pk time by like half.
That's possible, but I highly doubt somebody wouldn't give him 2 million if that's what his asking price was. His name alone would be worth almost that much, for a team looking to add fans.

Hypothetically, if we were spending 1 mil on Kovalev. We'd still have cap space to spend on a defensive specialist.

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Forget Kovalev I want Yashin
Haha nice timing. I just finished reading a rumor that one NHL team has been in talks with him.

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07-18-2011, 11:19 PM
  #187
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Originally Posted by Favre4Favre View Post
If Kovy only wants 1 mil, that means he's serious about playing as he's not doing it for the money. If that's the case, a motivated Kovalev would be hard to say no too. At that price, if I'm PG, I go for it.
Hopefully you arent.

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07-19-2011, 12:49 AM
  #188
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Why not just take the $1M and give it to Nikolai Zherdev...I mean if you are into the whole low-risk medium at best-reward type. He could at least keep up speed wise.

I loved Kovalev when he was here, but he doesn't fit the speed team that is assembled now, and there is no way the media and fans wouldn't allow it to become a distraction in the dressing room, even if Kovalev came here with the best intentions in mind.

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07-19-2011, 01:09 AM
  #189
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Originally Posted by NewHabsEra View Post
Hopefully you arent.
Lucky for you, I'm not.

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Originally Posted by Darz View Post
Why not just take the $1M and give it to Nikolai Zherdev...I mean if you are into the whole low-risk medium at best-reward type. He could at least keep up speed wise.

I loved Kovalev when he was here, but he doesn't fit the speed team that is assembled now, and there is no way the media and fans wouldn't allow it to become a distraction in the dressing room, even if Kovalev came here with the best intentions in mind.
If given the choice, I'd definitely go for Zherdev over Kovalev at 1 mil.

As for being a distraction. That would be a concern on my part, though with our strong group of veteran leaders. I don't think it would be as bad as what some might think. Besides, if he does become a distraction. At 1 mil, we could easily move him out or waive him.

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07-19-2011, 01:15 AM
  #190
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Kovalev is good for Markov too

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07-19-2011, 01:17 AM
  #191
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I like Kovalev. However, he doesn't fit the team anymore. The team now wants to be an up-tempo, fast, fundamentally strong club that closes gaps quickly and pursues the opposing puck carrier. Kovalev cannot do any of the above.

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07-19-2011, 09:24 AM
  #192
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I like Kovalev. However, he doesn't fit the team anymore. The team now wants to be an up-tempo, fast, fundamentally strong club that closes gaps quickly and pursues the opposing puck carrier. Kovalev cannot do any of the above.
You pretty much summed up why Kovalev fitting in with the Habs, would be like trying to fit a square peg, into a round hole.

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07-19-2011, 10:03 AM
  #193
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Originally Posted by Mike8 View Post
I like Kovalev. However, he doesn't fit the team anymore. The team now wants to be an up-tempo, fast, fundamentally strong club that closes gaps quickly and pursues the opposing puck carrier. Kovalev cannot do any of the above.
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You pretty much summed up why Kovalev fitting in with the Habs, would be like trying to fit a square peg, into a round hole.
I agree with both of you, that style of play doesn't quite suit Kovalev. Sometimes you have to bend a little though. As I believe his puck possession style of play can be implemented into Martin's system.

A motivated Kovalev, which I believe he will be if allowed back with Montreal. Can still provide offense, and help to our 2nd PP unit. Two areas that I'm sure both of you will agree we sadly need to improve. The fact that he wouldn't be brought in as a top line player, would also eliminate the need for him to produce every night. Which has been the biggest knock on Kovalev throughout his career.

My only concern would be whether or not he would accept a second tier role when it came to the teams offense. If he'd be willing to accept that fact. I can't see why at that term/salary, PG wouldn't consider adding him.

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07-19-2011, 10:07 AM
  #194
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Remember the teenage girl at the Kovalev rally in 2009? Wonder what she thinks now.

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07-19-2011, 10:08 AM
  #195
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Originally Posted by Favre4Favre View Post
I agree with both of you, that style of play doesn't quite suit Kovalev. Sometimes you have to bend a little though. As I believe his puck possession style of play can be implemented into Martin's system.

A motivated Kovalev, which I believe he will be if allowed back with Montreal. Can still provide offense, and help to our 2nd PP unit. Two areas that I'm sure both of you will agree we sadly need to improve. The fact that he wouldn't be brought in as a top line player, would also eliminate the need for him to produce every night. Which has been the biggest knock on Kovalev throughout his career.

My only concern would be whether or not he would accept a second tier role when it came to the teams offense. If he'd be willing to accept that fact. I can't see why at that term/salary, PG wouldn't consider adding him.
Not sure i agree with that...I don't think the PP is an area of concern for the Habs. They've got a handful of players who can contribute on the PP. I don't think going out and signing Kovalev specifically for that role makes much sense.

I'd rather the habs invest that in 1M in a guy who can pivot the 4th line, take important draws and take some of the PK time that Plekanec has so he can focus on offense a bit more.

Kovalev has historically been a difficult player to mesh with coaches/teamates/linemates...not necessarily because he's a bad guy, but because he plays a game that is difficult to read and he's not easily adaptable.

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07-19-2011, 10:31 AM
  #196
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Not sure i agree with that...I don't think the PP is an area of concern for the Habs. They've got a handful of players who can contribute on the PP. I don't think going out and signing Kovalev specifically for that role makes much sense.

I'd rather the habs invest that in 1M in a guy who can pivot the 4th line, take important draws and take some of the PK time that Plekanec has so he can focus on offense a bit more.

Kovalev has historically been a difficult player to mesh with coaches/teamates/linemates...not necessarily because he's a bad guy, but because he plays a game that is difficult to read and he's not easily adaptable.
Agreed, but he wouldn't be added just for helping the PP. This is only one of the areas he would be used in. Also, what other options for our second PP unit would you consider to be better than Kovalev? Desharnais, Eller, Cole, Darche?

Last year, we had minimal offense coming from our 3rd/4th lines. Adding a player like Kovalev to our third line, would help take some of the offensive pressure off of our top six. As when he is "On", opposing coaches would have to focus more on whatever line he's on, leaving our top six to face lesser opponents.

I'd agree with you if we only had 1mil left to spend. The fact is, the Habs can add Kovalev and a 4th line (Halpern) type player, while still having cap space left over.

I'll agree with you on that. This time around though, he wouldn't be needed to carry the team. He would be a second tier option, who at 1mil would be easy to get rid of if he doesn't work out.

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07-19-2011, 10:38 AM
  #197
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short answer: no
long answer: hellllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllll llllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllll lllll no

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07-19-2011, 10:40 AM
  #198
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Originally Posted by saints96 View Post
short answer: no
long answer: hellllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllll llllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllll lllll no
Thanks for coming out. Reading your well thoughtout opinion has been the highlight of my otherwise boring day so far.

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07-19-2011, 10:41 AM
  #199
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Originally Posted by Favre4Favre View Post
Thanks for coming out. Reading your well thoughtout opinion has been the highlight of my otherwise boring day so far.
oh i can write a book on why i wouldnt want him back. I dont feel its necessary its self explanatory

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07-19-2011, 10:41 AM
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The bottom line is he's worth the risk even if he doesn't work out we have the cap space to take him on even if only a 10% chance he succeeds. If he does succeed here it's a grand slam home run. If he doesn't succeed here we're stacked enough to let him retire here and waste 1 million in cap space.

The positives imo far outweigh the negative but we're all entitled to our opinions. 417 makes some valid points but I just think we'd have to see it for sure to be certain. I don't want to go assuming a guy who has had past success on our team all of the sudden wouldn't just based on a system. I'm also not entirely convinced Kovalev can't play in a defense first system. It's mostly a bunch of speculation based on nothing that people use as "proof" he can't succeed here. He's only proven the opposite and if one thing is true it's that a motivated Kovalev can play hockey regardless of the system, an unmotivated Kovalev will suck no matter how good the situation is for him.

To me it's a matter of motivation not so much whether he would fit. He goes to Ottawa and stinks it up for one season and all of the sudden the haters come out of the wood work (not referring to you 417, you actually came up with valid arguments, but I'm referring to the people in this thread who are clearly just haters and have no validity to their statements)

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