HFBoards

Go Back   HFBoards > NHL Eastern Conference > Atlantic Division > Montreal Canadiens
Mobile Hockey's Future Become a Sponsor Site Rules Support Forum vBookie Page 2
Notices

Sergei Kostitsyn on the Habs - Russian

Closed Thread
 
Thread Tools
Old
07-20-2011, 07:59 AM
  #126
Canadian_Brewtality
Registered User
 
Canadian_Brewtality's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2005
Country: Canada
Posts: 3,812
vCash: 500
we should sticky these threads, so it doesnt have to be brought up all the time.

The Sergei debate
The Gomez contract is bad but is a playoff performer
Huet trade cost us the cup

what am i missing?

Canadian_Brewtality is offline  
Old
07-20-2011, 08:00 AM
  #127
DAChampion
Registered User
 
DAChampion's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2011
Location: Canberra, Australia
Country: Australia
Posts: 6,463
vCash: 500
OK, let's try it again.

Step 1: Take all players drafted in the first three rounds of 2005 NHL entry draft.
Step 2: Remove all dmen and goalies
Step 3: Sort by goals per game.

1) Crosby
2) Ryan
3) Petr Kalus with 4 goals in 11 games, so doesn't count.
3) Anze Kopitar
4) Devin Setoguchi
5) James Neal
6) Paul Statsny
7) Guillaume Latendresse

Ahead of Oshie, Raymond, Bergfors, Downie, Pouliot, Cogliano, Hanzal, and then there's not much left.

With Minnesota he scored 25 goals in 55 games. How is that "good, not great". There isn't a single player on the Habs who can score 25 goals in 55 games. I don't think any player has done so since Vincent Damphousse.

DAChampion is offline  
Old
07-20-2011, 08:07 AM
  #128
DAChampion
Registered User
 
DAChampion's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2011
Location: Canberra, Australia
Country: Australia
Posts: 6,463
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ozymandias View Post
All the players you named are marginal. SK was a brat, bad for team spirit. Lats was a primadona of the media's making, with an abysmal dedication to training. Lapierre was a brat who tried to live off his media reputation but like his friend, didn't put in the effort. O'Byrne's confidence was 0, and that has more to do with the enviornment. He just wasn't strong enough between the ears to succeed here. And Pouliot was the same as OB.
I don't really care, not remotely, about who the media (Journal de Montreal, Pierre McGuire, etc.) characterizes as a "brat". I just hear a bunch of rumours over the years about Kovalev fighting with Koivu for alpha dog status , Latendresse being a primma donna, etc, and I don't really care. What matters is on-ice performance.

Latendresse will have many seasons as a 30 goal power forward. We'll be missing that. But hey, he didn't want to go score a zillion goals in the Q, what an evil prima donna.

DAChampion is offline  
Old
07-20-2011, 08:08 AM
  #129
Ozymandias
#firetherrien
 
Ozymandias's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2007
Location: Hockey Mecca
Country: Canada
Posts: 13,441
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by DAChampion View Post
OK, let's try it again.

Step 1: Take all players drafted in the first three rounds of 2005 NHL entry draft.
Step 2: Remove all dmen and goalies
Step 3: Sort by goals per game.

1) Crosby
2) Ryan
3) Petr Kalus with 4 goals in 11 games, so doesn't count.
3) Anze Kopitar
4) Devin Setoguchi
5) James Neal
6) Paul Statsny
7) Guillaume Latendresse

Ahead of Oshie, Raymond, Bergfors, Downie, Pouliot, Cogliano, Hanzal, and then there's not much left.

With Minnesota he scored 25 goals in 55 games. How is that "good, not great". There isn't a single player on the Habs who can score 25 goals in 55 games. I don't think any player has done so since Vincent Damphousse.
And Latendresse is still the worst defensively in the whole bunch.

Your wake-up call should be to realize that everybody knows Lats can score. What has always been his problem is dedication and effort, which would translate to a much better defensive game.

Ozymandias is offline  
Old
07-20-2011, 08:10 AM
  #130
Ozymandias
#firetherrien
 
Ozymandias's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2007
Location: Hockey Mecca
Country: Canada
Posts: 13,441
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by DAChampion View Post
I don't really care, not remotely, about who the media (Journal de Montreal, Pierre McGuire, etc.) characterizes as a "brat". I just hear a bunch of rumours over the years about Kovalev fighting with Koivu for alpha dog status , Latendresse being a primma donna, etc, and I don't really care. What matters is on-ice performance.

Latendresse will have many seasons as a 30 goal power forward. We'll be missing that. But hey, he didn't want to go score a zillion goals in the Q, what an evil prima donna.
NO we won't.

Max Pac will exceed Lats in overall performance and close for the # of goals. Only a Lats fanboy would chose Lats over Pac.

As for the rest... the RDS clip I'm talking about is an interview with LATS HIMSELF. As for SK, it's been widely reported throughout Montreal. It's not one or two isolated cases.

Ozymandias is offline  
Old
07-20-2011, 08:11 AM
  #131
DAChampion
Registered User
 
DAChampion's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2011
Location: Canberra, Australia
Country: Australia
Posts: 6,463
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ozymandias View Post
And Latendresse is still the worst defensively in the whole bunch.

Your wake-up call should be to realize that everybody knows Lats can score. What has always been his problem is dedication and effort, which would translate to a much better defensive game.
Defense comes with time and is harder to teach than offense.

We're a fantastic defensive team, and a horrible offensive one. I think we were the 2nd worst team last year at even strength scoring. Adding an even strength goal scorer who is mediocre defensively would have improved the overall situation.

DAChampion is offline  
Old
07-20-2011, 08:13 AM
  #132
Ozymandias
#firetherrien
 
Ozymandias's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2007
Location: Hockey Mecca
Country: Canada
Posts: 13,441
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Canadian_Brewtality View Post
we should sticky these threads, so it doesnt have to be brought up all the time.

The Sergei debate
The Gomez contract is bad but is a playoff performer
Huet trade cost us the cup

what am i missing?
The Lats/Pouliot trade.....

Ozymandias is offline  
Old
07-20-2011, 08:13 AM
  #133
Monctonscout
Monctonscout
 
Monctonscout's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Posts: 30,408
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ozymandias View Post
And Latendresse is still the worst defensively in the whole bunch.

Your wake-up call should be to realize that everybody knows Lats can score. What has always been his problem is dedication and effort, which would translate to a much better defensive game.
Latendresse is as good or better defensively than guys like Neal Setogucchi Ryan Bergfors etc

Monctonscout is offline  
Old
07-20-2011, 08:14 AM
  #134
neofury*
 
Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: Montreal, PQ
Country: Canada
Posts: 20,277
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by DAChampion View Post
So many misconceptions about Latendresse ...

Latendresse scored 32 goals in his first two NHL seasons getting third line minutes and virtually no PP. He did this by scoring 16 goals, and then scoring 16 goals again, very consistent. In his third season, the debacle of 2008-09, he played at a 21 goal pace, and the Lapierre-Latendresse-Kostopoulos line was our best line for many nights. He had spectacular puck control, and was able to go up and down the boards. The following year he had 27 goals and 40 points over 78 games. He was 100% ready for the NHL style of play, he played at a high pace, and if you go look at the 2005 NHL draft selections he is one of the most successful players. He is 6th in goals scored despite 8th in games played. If he was as bad as he is made out to be, his 8th place ranking in games played would make him no higher than 20th for goals scored.

There would have been no benefit to leaving him in the Q for a year where he would have scored a zillion goals playing with one hand tied behind his back. 16 goals in the NHL with third line minutes == how many goals in the Q? I'm not interested, those performances should never be observed in junior leagues it's bad for development. In any case, the Habs needed the even strength scoring Latendresse excelled at, they were not going to get it from the Brian Smolinski type players Gainey preferred to play.

Latendresse, D'Agostini, O'Byrne, SK74 are players who have gone on to great sucecss elsewhere. Pouliot is going on to great success in Boston. I bet AK46 will do so in 14 months as well. Lapierre, a former 15 goal scorer who was elite for drawing penalties which we care about as a collection of PP specialists, was replaced by... Ryan White. Chipchura is the only recent ex-Hab who has not gone on to greater success elsewhere.

I don't blame Martin. I mostly blame Gainey. O'Byrne would be preferable to Spacek right now, and a line of Latendresse-Plekanec-Cammalleri would look great in our top-6. Instead, we're paying 4.5 million to an aging Cole to produce the same 20-25 goals that a prime-entering Latendresse would produce for 3 million.
Sorry but if you actually think Gui Latendresse brings everything to a team Erik Cole brings you're sadly mistaking. Latendresse has always had questionable conditioning/work ethic. He's a good player but he's no Erik Cole. Erik Cole changes the dynamic of our team Latendresse doesn't do anything but add more offensive depth.

People complain that Kovalev isn't a fit for our team, well Gui isn't either. Cole is a much better fit than Latendresse is on paper. Time will tell if he really is a fit but one things for sure, there really is no comparison Latendresse is no Erik Cole.

I mean that's like saying "We traded O'Byrne and now we're stuck paying Josh Gorges 3 mil a season".

Yeah sure you can look at it that way, but we have the better player in Gorges. I don't care if OB is still a good player and would come cheaper. Gorges is the better player and given the context of a leadership role on our team, the better fit.

It's the same thing for Cole vs Latendresse.

Sure Lats would have come cheaper but Lats isn't a young Cole. Considering even after Gorges the cap space we'll have is around 5 million still I think the price difference / production value of Cole versus Lats is a moot point for us anyways, and we all know it isn't entirely about either players production. Cole is a legit power forward.

neofury* is offline  
Old
07-20-2011, 08:14 AM
  #135
DAChampion
Registered User
 
DAChampion's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2011
Location: Canberra, Australia
Country: Australia
Posts: 6,463
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ozymandias View Post
NO we won't.

Max Pac will exceed Lats in overall performance and close for the # of goals. Only a Lats fanboy would chose Lats over Pac.
1) There are 4 slots for top-6 wingers.
2) Right now it's not at all clear which of the two will have a better career. They have similar injury histories, and similar offensive histories.
3) Yes, I'm a fan of Latendresse. Is it meant to be an insult, that I like some players?

To help you: I also like Koivu, SK74, Higgins; among our former players, so ATTACK !!!

DAChampion is offline  
Old
07-20-2011, 08:14 AM
  #136
Monctonscout
Monctonscout
 
Monctonscout's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Posts: 30,408
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ozymandias View Post
NO we won't.

Max Pac will exceed Lats in overall performance and close for the # of goals. Only a Lats fanboy would chose Lats over Pac.

As for the rest... the RDS clip I'm talking about is an interview with LATS HIMSELF. As for SK, it's been widely reported throughout Montreal. It's not one or two isolated cases.
Hvaing Latendresse here for 3 mil/year would still be a MASSIVE upgrade on Pouliot not being here.

Monctonscout is offline  
Old
07-20-2011, 08:16 AM
  #137
DAChampion
Registered User
 
DAChampion's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2011
Location: Canberra, Australia
Country: Australia
Posts: 6,463
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ozymandias View Post

As for the rest... the RDS clip I'm talking about is an interview with LATS HIMSELF.
In my experience, it's a near-universal characteristic of successful people that they always think they could have worked harder. That he himself thinks he could have worked harder does not at all mean he wasn't working hard.

DAChampion is offline  
Old
07-20-2011, 08:19 AM
  #138
Kriss E
Registered User
 
Join Date: May 2007
Posts: 23,259
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Carey Price View Post
What did you expect Boucher to say? On the record coaches rarely have anything to say unless you are a Keenan or Tortorella.

It has nothing to do with JM liking or not liking SK, if JM hated anybody it was Latendresse, he had him in the doghouse from day 1. SK was sent to Hamilton primarily because he showed up to camp out of shape and had a couple of incidents on top of that and the front office had enough. SK doesn't have the skill level to play in the NHL with a poor work ethic and conditionning, he isn't Kovalchuk or Ovechkin. He needs to step it up in Nashville or end up in the doghouse there.
Boucher could have said anything he wanted. If Sk was a problem maker, he could have said he's got a lot of things to work on. But he didn't say that, not even his AHL teammates say anything bad.
Also, you have no idea why JM sent SK down, neither have I. The reason for that is because nobody actually gave a reason for his demotion.
We can suspect a lot of things. But at the end of the day, we lost another skilled prospect for nothing. Can you imagine what our forward group would look like with Lats scoring 25-30G and SK racking up 50pts?
We were unable to deal with these troubled youngsters.
One thing has become excessively clear over this past decade. We do not like to work with troubled prospects unless we they have superstar potential, like Price and PK. That attitude has made us end up on the losing side of plenty of trades.

Kriss E is offline  
Old
07-20-2011, 08:21 AM
  #139
beowulf
Poster of the Year!
 
beowulf's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: Ottawa
Country: Canada
Posts: 35,388
vCash: 500
Send a message via MSN to beowulf
Quote:
Originally Posted by Carey Price View Post
Hvaing Latendresse here for 3 mil/year would still be a MASSIVE upgrade on Pouliot not being here.
Let's see how he comes back first. He missed most of last season with a groin injury which is not something good to see with a player that is already a week skater. Saying he will be a consistent 30 goal scorer as someone else mentioned is a bit much I think. Again I think he is a good offensive player and a poor defensive player that will never be a star in this league. He might be only 24 but he has been in the league five seasons now and nothing he has done has shown me he has the drive and dedication to be an elite player or even an top end power forward.

beowulf is offline  
Old
07-20-2011, 08:21 AM
  #140
Ozymandias
#firetherrien
 
Ozymandias's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2007
Location: Hockey Mecca
Country: Canada
Posts: 13,441
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by DAChampion View Post
Defense comes with time and is harder to teach than offense.

We're a fantastic defensive team, and a horrible offensive one. I think we were the 2nd worst team last year at even strength scoring. Adding an even strength goal scorer who is mediocre defensively would have improved the overall situation.
Get your head out of the sand.

Even at 24 Lats still didn't train hard enough and came into camp in bad shape for the 10-11 season. That came from Minny's own coach.

Habs weren't gonna wait around for him to get a clue. After over 3 years he still didn't get it. After 4 years he still didn't get it...

As for the offense, that's a whole other story. Check Mathman and Baseballcoach shooting % stats to see what I mean. Coincidently, we had one of the worst LTIR when it came to overall talent. Our MVP missing the whole season might have something to do with that too, as he's one of the best Ds in the league when it comes to overall goals for per game (per 60 minutes played). Only Green, Lidstrom, Keith and Doughty have shown as good GFPG than Markov in the last two seasons, and they all played with arguably better ES players than the Habs had. That's a huge hole for any team's offense.

And as far as even-strenght scoring went, our ES +/- was better than years passed (close to top 10), so even if Lats scored 5-10 goals more than what Pouliot brought, it's probably 5-10 goals more we would've allowed with Lats in the lineup...

Ozymandias is offline  
Old
07-20-2011, 08:23 AM
  #141
neofury*
 
Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: Montreal, PQ
Country: Canada
Posts: 20,277
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Carey Price View Post
Regardless of what you think of Latendresse, that trade was a horrible one.

You don't trade a young(21 or 22 year old) up and coming power forward with 30-35 goal potential for a guy who looks like a complete bust and had not even established himself as a full time NHLer at the same stage.
For one Pouliot was still really young at the time and had shown flashes of brilliance too. In fact a lot of people seem to forget how Pouliot-Gomez-Gionta clicked nicely for a time.

For two Lats isn't a power forward. To be a real power forward you need to dedicate to training and work hard on your foot speed and explosiveness. Lats has none of this, just because he's big doesn't make him a "power forward". He's a forward with size but hardly a power forward like some projected him to be. Maybe he can still become a true power forward but I have my doubts. For now he's a young forward with size and skill who hasn't put it together fully yet. For me to label him a power forward he'd need to first actually be one and not show up to camp 40lbs over weight.

neofury* is offline  
Old
07-20-2011, 08:26 AM
  #142
neofury*
 
Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: Montreal, PQ
Country: Canada
Posts: 20,277
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by DAChampion View Post
OK, let's try it again.

Step 1: Take all players drafted in the first three rounds of 2005 NHL entry draft.
Step 2: Remove all dmen and goalies
Step 3: Sort by goals per game.

1) Crosby
2) Ryan
3) Petr Kalus with 4 goals in 11 games, so doesn't count.
3) Anze Kopitar
4) Devin Setoguchi
5) James Neal
6) Paul Statsny
7) Guillaume Latendresse

Ahead of Oshie, Raymond, Bergfors, Downie, Pouliot, Cogliano, Hanzal, and then there's not much left.

With Minnesota he scored 25 goals in 55 games. How is that "good, not great". There isn't a single player on the Habs who can score 25 goals in 55 games. I don't think any player has done so since Vincent Damphousse.
You're assuming based on a 55 game sample and that fact that no **** Gui was brought into the NHL and skipped the AHL (thus played more and developed more) that he's a godly power forward better. That simply isn't the case. If he puts up 30 this year and stays healthy and improves his speed/explosiveness maybe I'd change my opinion. From what I've seen so far it's a kid benefiting from a change of scenery and playing above his level like a lot of players do when they get traded. He's going to come back down to earth and all the people with Lats hard on's are going to be wondering what they were thinking here today.

Obviously it's my opinion but I'll gladly come back and eat crow if I'm wrong. I don't see Lats ever being more than an inconsistent player with talent who doesn't back it up with hard work.

neofury* is offline  
Old
07-20-2011, 08:28 AM
  #143
Monctonscout
Monctonscout
 
Monctonscout's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Posts: 30,408
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kriss E View Post
Boucher could have said anything he wanted. If Sk was a problem maker, he could have said he's got a lot of things to work on. But he didn't say that, not even his AHL teammates say anything bad.
Also, you have no idea why JM sent SK down, neither have I. The reason for that is because nobody actually gave a reason for his demotion.
We can suspect a lot of things. But at the end of the day, we lost another skilled prospect for nothing. Can you imagine what our forward group would look like with Lats scoring 25-30G and SK racking up 50pts?
We were unable to deal with these troubled youngsters.
One thing has become excessively clear over this past decade. We do not like to work with troubled prospects unless we they have superstar potential, like Price and PK. That attitude has made us end up on the losing side of plenty of trades.
I wouldn't put Latendresse and SK in the same boat. Latendresse was a bit the victim of the local kid getting tons of media attention before he actually "arrived", he never made any waves in the room like SK did(his teammates wanted him off the team during the playoffs in 09-10). Latendresse was pretty much exclusively used in a 3rd line role until JM arrived and had him in the doghouse pretty much from day 1, instead of giving him a shot with guys like Gomez and Gionta instead of using Moen. SK on the other hand got numerous shots in the top 6 and never really did much with the opportunity other than his first 20-25 games.

SK would not put up those numbers here, simply because he is inferior to guys like Gionta, Cammy, AK so he wouldn't get the quantity or quality of ice time he got in Nashville.

Monctonscout is offline  
Old
07-20-2011, 08:31 AM
  #144
beowulf
Poster of the Year!
 
beowulf's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: Ottawa
Country: Canada
Posts: 35,388
vCash: 500
Send a message via MSN to beowulf
Quote:
Originally Posted by neofury View Post
You're assuming based on a 55 game sample and that fact that no **** Gui was brought into the NHL and skipped the AHL (thus played more and developed more) that he's a godly power forward better. That simply isn't the case. If he puts up 30 this year and stays healthy and improves his speed/explosiveness maybe I'd change my opinion. From what I've seen so far it's a kid benefiting from a change of scenery and playing above his level like a lot of players do when they get traded. He's going to come back down to earth and all the people with Lats hard on's are going to be wondering what they were thinking here today.

Obviously it's my opinion but I'll gladly come back and eat crow if I'm wrong. I don't see Lats ever being more than an inconsistent player with talent who doesn't back it up with hard work.
Amen brother. Let's not forget he started last year with all of 3 goals in the first 11 games not an auspicious start to the season.

beowulf is offline  
Old
07-20-2011, 08:33 AM
  #145
DAChampion
Registered User
 
DAChampion's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2011
Location: Canberra, Australia
Country: Australia
Posts: 6,463
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by beowulf View Post
Amen brother. Let's not forget he started last year with all of 3 goals in the first 11 games not an auspicious start to the season.
Umm...

That's a 22 goal pace ... with a 13 goal margin of error due to the small sample size.

DAChampion is offline  
Old
07-20-2011, 08:36 AM
  #146
Monctonscout
Monctonscout
 
Monctonscout's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Posts: 30,408
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by neofury View Post
For one Pouliot was still really young at the time and had shown flashes of brilliance too. In fact a lot of people seem to forget how Pouliot-Gomez-Gionta clicked nicely for a time.

For two Lats isn't a power forward. To be a real power forward you need to dedicate to training and work hard on your foot speed and explosiveness. Lats has none of this, just because he's big doesn't make him a "power forward". He's a forward with size but hardly a power forward like some projected him to be. Maybe he can still become a true power forward but I have my doubts. For now he's a young forward with size and skill who hasn't put it together fully yet. For me to label him a power forward he'd need to first actually be one and not show up to camp 40lbs over weight.
Pouliot was 23 and so was Latendresse...one had 48 NHL goals at the time and the other had 9. That alone makes it an uneven trade. Why trade a guy with 3 full years under his belt for another who has never established himself as a full time NHLer. If they wanted to take a chance on Pouliot then trade a 2nd or 3rd rounder for him and keep Lats. In terms of value is was a horrible trade the day it was made and hasn't really gotten better.

You don't need footspeed to be a power forward...Cam Neely was slow as molasses but he had a deadly shot, Clowe might be the slowest player in the NHL, Bertuzzi was hauling around a piano, Tkachuk and Shanahan were never known for their speed, neither was Lindros.

Latendresse is a power forward now that the scoring(given an opportunity) has caught up to his physical game.

The thing that rEALLY irks me is people crap on him yet he was one of our better 5 on 5 players the 2 years before the trade despite playing with the likes of Lapierre, Kostopoulos and co 95% of the time.


Last edited by Monctonscout: 07-20-2011 at 08:41 AM.
Monctonscout is offline  
Old
07-20-2011, 08:37 AM
  #147
DAChampion
Registered User
 
DAChampion's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2011
Location: Canberra, Australia
Country: Australia
Posts: 6,463
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ozymandias View Post
Get your head out of the sand.

Even at 24 Lats still didn't train hard enough and came into camp in bad shape for the 10-11 season. That came from Minny's own coach.

Habs weren't gonna wait around for him to get a clue. After over 3 years he still didn't get it. After 4 years he still didn't get it...

As for the offense, that's a whole other story. Check Mathman and Baseballcoach shooting % stats to see what I mean. Coincidently, we had one of the worst LTIR when it came to overall talent. Our MVP missing the whole season might have something to do with that too, as he's one of the best Ds in the league when it comes to overall goals for per game (per 60 minutes played). Only Green, Lidstrom, Keith and Doughty have shown as good GFPG than Markov in the last two seasons, and they all played with arguably better ES players than the Habs had. That's a huge hole for any team's offense.

And as far as even-strenght scoring went, our ES +/- was better than years passed (close to top 10), so even if Lats scored 5-10 goals more than what Pouliot brought, it's probably 5-10 goals more we would've allowed with Lats in the lineup...
Your point about Markov is mathematically correct, but first of all it's dampened by the acquisition of Wisniewski,let's say cut by one half.

Second, every year (almost), Habs fans say "if only we hadn't had so many injuries". Some people have argued with me it's pure coincidence. I don't know what the problem is, but I'm not jumping on bandwagon "this year we have MaxPac and Markov coming back and we're going to rock". Whatever the problem with this team is, it needs depth.

DAChampion is offline  
Old
07-20-2011, 08:39 AM
  #148
Ozymandias
#firetherrien
 
Ozymandias's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2007
Location: Hockey Mecca
Country: Canada
Posts: 13,441
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by DAChampion View Post
1) There are 4 slots for top-6 wingers.
You said "we will miss that"

No we won't. We have Pac. We have Cole.

Argument refuted. Move on.

Quote:
2) Right now it's not at all clear which of the two will have a better career. They have similar injury histories, and similar offensive histories.
Oh it is clear to anyone with an eye for talent. Pac has way more tools than Lats. Do a poll to see which player people would want. I'm pretty sure most would chose Pac (although there's merry clique here who'll just select otherwise just to spite me if they read this post).


Quote:
3) Yes, I'm a fan of Latendresse. Is it meant to be an insult, that I like some players?
Ever heard of cognitive dissonance?

You made that conclusion all by yourself. I only said, "only a Lats fanboy would chose Lats over Pac". You made-up the rest yourself. I didn't actually know if you'd pick him over Pac... Guess I was aiming right.

Quote:
To help you: I also like Koivu, SK74, Higgins; among our former players, so ATTACK !!!
What age are you?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Carey Price View Post
Hvaing Latendresse here for 3 mil/year would still be a MASSIVE upgrade on Pouliot not being here.
HE said "We will miss that" (30 goal powerforward)

Will we? The obvious answer is no. Anything else you say is inconsequential to that argument or my counter-argument.


Quote:
Originally Posted by DAChampion View Post
In my experience, it's a near-universal characteristic of successful people that they always think they could have worked harder. That he himself thinks he could have worked harder does not at all mean he wasn't working hard.
Go look at the clip will ya... Just to see Lats look on his face when he talks of his past lack of commitment to training is worth a 1000 words.... and that was just 1-2 months before coming out of shape into Wild camp for the 10-11 season...

Ozymandias is offline  
Old
07-20-2011, 08:45 AM
  #149
Monctonscout
Monctonscout
 
Monctonscout's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Posts: 30,408
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by DAChampion View Post
Your point about Markov is mathematically correct, but first of all it's dampened by the acquisition of Wisniewski,let's say cut by one half.

Second, every year (almost), Habs fans say "if only we hadn't had so many injuries". Some people have argued with me it's pure coincidence. I don't know what the problem is, but I'm not jumping on bandwagon "this year we have MaxPac and Markov coming back and we're going to rock". Whatever the problem with this team is, it needs depth.
Nobody has enough depth to lose their best players and not suffer, just look at pIttsburgh, they were not the same team with Crosby and Malkin out.

Monctonscout is offline  
Old
07-20-2011, 08:46 AM
  #150
DAChampion
Registered User
 
DAChampion's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2011
Location: Canberra, Australia
Country: Australia
Posts: 6,463
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ozymandias View Post
Oh it is clear to anyone with an eye for talent. Pac has way more tools than Lats. Do a poll to see which player people would want. I'm pretty sure most would chose Pac (although there's merry clique here who'll just select otherwise just to spite me if they read this post).
I don't think polls matter. Maybe if you could get a poll of NHL GMs, but you don't have that kind of access.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ozymandias View Post
I didn't actually know if you'd pick him over Pac...
I did not say I'd pick Lats over Max Pac, I said it's hard to project who will have a better career due to comparable offensive and injury histories. Right now, Max is further away from being UFA, he has a cheaper contract, so I'd pick Max to have on my team. If I were constructing a fantasy team I would pick whoever costs less.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ozymandias View Post
HE said "We will miss that" (30 goal powerforward)
It depends on how Cole ages.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ozymandias View Post
Go look at the clip will ya... Just to see Lats look on his face when he talks of his past lack of commitment to training is worth a 1000 words.... and that was just 1-2 months before coming out of shape into Wild camp for the 10-11 season...
Like I said, it's a universal characteristic of successful people that they think they could have worked harder.

DAChampion is offline  
Closed Thread

Forum Jump


Bookmarks

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off



All times are GMT -5. The time now is 04:28 AM.

monitoring_string = "e4251c93e2ba248d29da988d93bf5144"
Contact Us - HFBoards - Archive - Privacy Statement - Terms of Use - Advertise - Top - AdChoices

vBulletin Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
HFBoards.com is a property of CraveOnline Media, LLC, an Evolve Media, LLC company. 2014 All Rights Reserved.