HFBoards

Go Back   HFBoards > NHL Eastern Conference > Atlantic Division > Montreal Canadiens
Mobile Hockey's Future Become a Sponsor Site Rules Support Forum vBookie Page 2
Notices

Why do we need Kovalev when we have Andrei Kostsitsyn.

Closed Thread
 
Thread Tools
Old
08-03-2004, 03:10 PM
  #1
Jean Beliveau
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jul 2004
Posts: 282
vCash: 500
Why do we need Kovalev when we have Andrei Kostsitsyn.

Andrei Kostsitsyn is younger, cheaper and would most likely score as many goals as Kovalev would this year if Julien provides him the icetime.

Kostsitsyn is probably the most talented player in the organization right now so why not give him the opportunity to play with Koivu and Zednik on the 1st line and PP.

Ilya Kovalchuk was given the chance to prove himself at the age of 18 and look at the results since.

Jean Beliveau is offline  
Old
08-03-2004, 03:14 PM
  #2
Fan
 
Join Date: Mar 2004
Location: London Ontario
Country: Canada
Posts: 204
vCash: 500
WHY?????????????????
bECAUSE HE HAS NOT PLAYED one second of North Amercan pro hockey for one thing and 2 he cannot speak English so he cannot even talk to the other players.

Fan is offline  
Old
08-03-2004, 03:15 PM
  #3
CH Wizard
 
Join Date: Apr 2004
Location: preparin for 09 cup
Country: Afghanistan
Posts: 11,690
vCash: 500
Send a message via MSN to CH Wizard
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jean Beliveau
Andrei Kostsitsyn is younger, cheaper and would most likely score as many goals as Kovalev would this year if Julien provides him the icetime.

Kostsitsyn is probably the most talented player in the organization right now so why not give him the opportunity to play with Koivu and Zednik on the 1st line and PP.

Ilya Kovalchuk was given the chance to prove himself at the age of 18 and look at the results since.
I am probably the only poster here who gonna agree with you.I know he isn't ready but why not give him a chance.If he won't respond just return him to Hamilton that's it but I still think Hossa ,Higgins are more ready.I want to try him just like 2 games with Koivu and Zed just to watch what he gonna do.If he can't play well in this level just return him in the AHL.(if he's signed)

I know he has to adapt to the N.A style.We never know ,Kovalchuk is more a mature player and he was more ready.I will try him just two games if he don't just return him to Hamilton.

The most here think that it will be better for him to go to Hamilton.It's true and We can call him later in the season.

Markov can help him because we all know he can't talk english.

CH Wizard is offline  
Old
08-03-2004, 03:27 PM
  #4
G Man 77
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jan 2003
Posts: 433
vCash: 500
Kostitsyn would benefit from a year or two in the AHL so he can adapt to NA on & off the ice, abd so Jarvis can teach him our system.

There he'll get tons of ice-time and will continue to develop.

In the meantime Kovy combines scoring ability with size, he'd be a welcomed addition for the next 2-3 years.

When Kostitsyn is ready, don't forget we need a 2nd line winger as well... and IMO Zednik will be very expendable when the time comes that Perezhogin, Higgins & Kostitsyn will all need a roster spot.

Not to mention Sundstrom on that 3rd line...

(Higgins) Zednik-Koivu-Kovalev
Ryder-Ribeiro-Dagenais (Kostitsyn)
Bulis-Bonk-Sundstrom (Perezhogin)
???-Begin-Ward

No reason to rush Kostitsyn up right away, and don't worry about Kovalev taking his spot... they won't have any problems making room for him when he's ready.

G Man 77 is offline  
Old
08-03-2004, 03:33 PM
  #5
eddy
Registered User
 
eddy's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2003
Location: Nova Scotia, Canada
Country: Canada
Posts: 3,673
vCash: 500
Kostsitsyn would really benefit from starting off his NA carear in the AHL, though it's been done succesfully from some of the best players a lot of highly touted players who were started off to young in the NHL ended up not turning out to be as good as expected. Have patience with him it'll be better in the long run, and safer.

eddy is offline  
Old
08-03-2004, 03:36 PM
  #6
montreal
Moderator
Go Habs Go
 
montreal's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2002
Country: Sark
Posts: 25,366
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jean Beliveau
Andrei Kostsitsyn is younger, cheaper and would most likely score as many goals as Kovalev would this year if Julien provides him the icetime.

Kostsitsyn is probably the most talented player in the organization right now so why not give him the opportunity to play with Koivu and Zednik on the 1st line and PP.

Ilya Kovalchuk was given the chance to prove himself at the age of 18 and look at the results since.

We don't need Kovalev, we were a playoff bound team without him, and will continue to be as long as they stay true to Julien's system and Theodore is solid again.

Kostitsyn imo is not NHL ready due to the fact that he has no idea how to play defensive hockey. But if the Habs feel they can overlook that and want to give him a roster spot, I'd love to see it. I would guess he will start the year with Hamilton, but perhaps at some point he will see some time with the Habs (say 4-5 games) as we dont seem to rush our prospects eventhough Timins says he's NHL ready, Gainey/Julien may think other wise.

Kostitsyn could learn a lot from Jarvis playing on the top line in Hamilton. Too bad Perezhogin won't be there, that would be wicked to see them on a line together, ouch!

As for Kovalchuk, it's a different situation. The Thrashers were not a playoff bound team, and the Habs are, they need to do what's best for the team in terms of making the playoffs, if that's having Kostitsyn in Hamilton or the NHL is up to them, as long as we make the playoffs (if there's even going to be a season, I already cancelled my NHL center ice since I don't think there will be any hockey this year)

montreal is offline  
Old
08-03-2004, 03:39 PM
  #7
eddy
Registered User
 
eddy's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2003
Location: Nova Scotia, Canada
Country: Canada
Posts: 3,673
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by montreal
We don't need Kovalev, we were a playoff bound team without him, and will continue to be as long as they stay true to Julien's system and Theodore is solid again.
I think we do, or some other good winger for the first line, sure we can make the playoffs without him, but how far in the playoffs can we get without him or another good scoring UFA winger for the 1st line is another thing.


Last edited by eddy: 08-03-2004 at 03:44 PM.
eddy is offline  
Old
08-03-2004, 03:41 PM
  #8
jacklours
Registered User
 
Join Date: Mar 2003
Location: Magog
Country: Canada
Posts: 1,222
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by thegreatone
I am probably the only poster here who gonna agree with you.I know he isn't ready but why not give him a chance.If he won't respond just return him to Hamilton that's it but I still think Hossa ,Higgins are more ready.I want to try him just like 2 games with Koivu and Zed just to watch what he gonna do.If he can't play well in this level just return him in the AHL.(if he's signed)

I know he has to adapt to the N.A style.We never know ,Kovalchuk is more a mature player and he was more ready.I will try him just two games if he don't just return him to Hamilton.

The most here think that it will be better for him to go to Hamilton.It's true and We can call him later in the season.

Markov can help him because we all know he can't talk english.
Your contradicting yourself. You want to give him a chance at what. You said yourself ''I know he isn't ready''. So what kind of chance will you give him?? There you go kosty, show us how not ready you are, geez, I wish I could have a chance like that. Your making no sense at all.

jacklours is offline  
Old
08-03-2004, 03:51 PM
  #9
6 String Benny
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jul 2003
Location: Kenora On.
Posts: 137
vCash: 500
What message does that send to our young guys in Hamilton who are busting their a****.And also we should probably sign him before we throw him on the ice.

6 String Benny is offline  
Old
08-03-2004, 03:51 PM
  #10
Crusher20
Registered User
 
Crusher20's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2002
Location: Montreal
Country: Ecuador
Posts: 4,645
vCash: 500
Send a message via AIM to Crusher20 Send a message via Yahoo to Crusher20
I think anyone who is 18 and goes straight to the NHL could have benefit from 1-2 even 3 years in the AHL, but you also gotta think, those players are special, they got incredible skills and despite having some grey or even black areas in their game they are giving a shot. So why Kostsitsyn would need 1-2 years in the AHL??? why?? he need to be tested just like Zherdev, Kovalchuk, Ribeiro etc.

Kovalchuk as been consider terrible in defense, so what. if he can put the puck in the net so be it, he will learn with great nhlers. there is no problem with this.


Last edited by Crusher20: 08-03-2004 at 04:25 PM.
Crusher20 is offline  
Old
08-03-2004, 04:03 PM
  #11
Habfansincebirth
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jul 2003
Location: Montreal
Country: Canada
Posts: 126
vCash: 500
We should sign Kovy to 3 years not only to have a front line veteran RW, but also to help with the young Russian prospects (Kost and Perez). I think that having a mentor like Kovy will help their developement and feel less homesick by aclimating them to North America.

Habfansincebirth is offline  
Old
08-03-2004, 04:13 PM
  #12
prevail
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jan 2004
Location: Montreal
Country: Canada
Posts: 1,852
vCash: 500
I found it pretty funny since when Markov came to Montreal he didn't speak english and even now his english is pretty bad, without Kovalev there's no one else he could really talk to and the first game Kovy came to play for MTL they showed a pic of Markov and Kovalev walking outside the arena and talking...anyways sorry

I'm sure if Kast plays for MTL he'll be inseperable with Marky

prevail is offline  
Old
08-03-2004, 04:42 PM
  #13
Crusher20
Registered User
 
Crusher20's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2002
Location: Montreal
Country: Ecuador
Posts: 4,645
vCash: 500
Send a message via AIM to Crusher20 Send a message via Yahoo to Crusher20
Quote:
Originally Posted by 6 String Benny
What message does that send to our young guys in Hamilton who are busting their a****.And also we should probably sign him before we throw him on the ice.
the message? perform well in training camp and thats it. they got theyre chance to proove theyre skill in the past. I say lets test Kost but only if he perform well in camp. just like other 18-19 year old kids achieved in the past.. it might not be a good message to the kids but why would a team would be so stupid not to make a kid play if he is something special. now the question is, is he something special. training camp will tell.. just like it will for Higgins, PLeks, Perezhogin.

Crusher20 is offline  
Old
08-03-2004, 04:54 PM
  #14
Pax Macioretty
Registered User
 
Pax Macioretty's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2003
Location: hockey city
Posts: 15,207
vCash: 500
Kastytsin needs more time to learn the north-american hockey way, why not give Alexander Perezhogin a chance, isin't he the same type of player that kastytsin is, an Alexander Moginly type player + he was playing really well at the end of last season + he cant even play in the AHL! So why not give it a shot

Pax Macioretty is offline  
Old
08-03-2004, 04:54 PM
  #15
FF de Mars
Registered User
 
Join Date: Mar 2002
Location: 42 rue Fontaine
Country: Martinique
Posts: 6,778
vCash: 50
Well, Kast will have to earn his NHL spot, no way we give it to him. If he comes and impress us at training camp, he will be part of the line up. Same goes for any prospect. However, we need a player to pair with Koivu, and Kovalev fits the bill.

FF de Mars is offline  
Old
08-03-2004, 05:17 PM
  #16
Habs4Life
Registered User
 
Habs4Life's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2003
Posts: 1,453
vCash: 500
Because he's not a proven NHL star????????????

Habs4Life is offline  
Old
08-03-2004, 06:28 PM
  #17
Beakermania*
 
Beakermania*'s Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2004
Location: Kingston or Hamilton
Country: Canada
Posts: 17,964
vCash: 500
1) He has to learn how to play defensive hockey before he can make this team. We are a playoff team that doesn't need a liability on the ice going -30 for us. And what better teacher is there for him than Doug Jarvis??

2) He is not used to the language or the culture of North America, as well as the more physical North American style of hockey. Why not let him get acclimated in Hamilton, away from the bright lights of the media in Montreal??

3) Even in one year when he is ready why not use Kostitsyn-Koivu-Kovalev?? or keep Zednick on the first line and use Ryder - Ribeiro- Kostitsyn?? The more weapons you have as a team the better you are!! Look at Tampa Bay.

Beakermania* is offline  
Old
08-03-2004, 06:39 PM
  #18
lilpouchon6969
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jul 2004
Location: Montreal
Posts: 25
vCash: 500
kovalev is more old than this young player so he has more experience !!!

lilpouchon6969 is offline  
Old
08-03-2004, 08:24 PM
  #19
BLNY
Registered User
 
Join Date: Aug 2004
Location: Dartmouth, NS
Country: Canada
Posts: 1,190
vCash: 500
Send a message via MSN to BLNY Send a message via Yahoo to BLNY
The kid hasn't been signed yet, and you're talking about having him in the lineup instead of AK27. That just doesn't compute with me. Andrei has a lot to learn, and one develop camp isn't enough. He needs to be signed before anything regarding where he'll play can really be discussed.

The possibility that Andrei won't be signed in 2004 is very real. With the current labour climate, and the lack of an agreement between the NHL and IIHF, he could very well remain in Russia with the CSKA system. That isn't what I want though. I expect a deal to be signed before the end of August. With that out of the way, I think he'll be Hamilton bound.

Montreal hasn't got a history of rushing prospects. I don't think they will in this case either. Playing in Hamilton will allow Andrei to play under a great coach in Jarvis. He won't be thrown to the wolves. Hamilton is the best place for him for at least the next year.

BLNY is offline  
Old
08-03-2004, 08:49 PM
  #20
Jean Beliveau
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jul 2004
Posts: 282
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by BLNY
The kid hasn't been signed yet, and you're talking about having him in the lineup instead of AK27. That just doesn't compute with me. Andrei has a lot to learn, and one develop camp isn't enough. He needs to be signed before anything regarding where he'll play can really be discussed.

The possibility that Andrei won't be signed in 2004 is very real. With the current labour climate, and the lack of an agreement between the NHL and IIHF, he could very well remain in Russia with the CSKA system. That isn't what I want though. I expect a deal to be signed before the end of August. With that out of the way, I think he'll be Hamilton bound.

Montreal hasn't got a history of rushing prospects. I don't think they will in this case either. Playing in Hamilton will allow Andrei to play under a great coach in Jarvis. He won't be thrown to the wolves. Hamilton is the best place for him for at least the next year.
When was the last time Montreal had a rookie with the talent level of Andrei Kostsitsyn. If the kid has got the skillset to play in the NHL right away then I say just do it. He might not be able to play defense as well as he should in the beginning but he was not drafted to play defense he was drafted to score goals.
I really believe that he can bypass the AHL this year and play in the NHL.

Fortune favors the bold.

Jean Beliveau is offline  
Old
08-03-2004, 09:03 PM
  #21
Duff88
Registered User
 
Join Date: May 2002
Country: Canada
Posts: 5,029
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jean Beliveau
When was the last time Montreal had a rookie with the talent level of Andrei Kostsitsyn. If the kid has got the skillset to play in the NHL right away then I say just do it. He might not be able to play defense as well as he should in the beginning but he was not drafted to play defense he was drafted to score goals.
I really believe that he can bypass the AHL this year and play in the NHL.

Fortune favors the bold.
The guy doesn't speak a word of english, and when the season will start he'll have been in america for less than 4 months. It's extremely difficult for a guy his age to dominate when confronted with such a big change. Look at Markov, his first year he had a tough time with the language issue, and he was lucky that Petrov was with the team.

Duff88 is offline  
Old
08-03-2004, 09:31 PM
  #22
BLNY
Registered User
 
Join Date: Aug 2004
Location: Dartmouth, NS
Country: Canada
Posts: 1,190
vCash: 500
Send a message via MSN to BLNY Send a message via Yahoo to BLNY
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jean Beliveau
When was the last time Montreal had a rookie with the talent level of Andrei Kostsitsyn. If the kid has got the skillset to play in the NHL right away then I say just do it. He might not be able to play defense as well as he should in the beginning but he was not drafted to play defense he was drafted to score goals.
I really believe that he can bypass the AHL this year and play in the NHL.

Fortune favors the bold.
I would say Saku Koivu is the last. He didn't spend time in the NHL because he was 21 in his first season, not 19. Saku had three seasons of legitimate pro hockey under his belt. Andrei has less than 20 games in the last two seasons. Saku could speak English, and had a much more talent laiden lineup in front of him.

Chelios - spent most of 1983-84 with the US National team. His first season was 1984-85 in which he turned 23.

Robinson - spent parts of 2 seasons with the Voyageurs.

Lafleur - didn't join the team until he was 20.

Carboneau - spent a full year in Halifax where he was molded into one of the finest defensive forwards of the last 20 years.

Roy - really the only prospect to be thrown to the wolves. This was out of necessity. With Andrei it isn't.

Andrei wasn't drafted to play defense, but it would be nice if he learned about playing within a defense-first system. In Hamilton he can do that with less pressure.

BLNY is offline  
Old
08-03-2004, 11:11 PM
  #23
db23
 
Join Date: Mar 2004
Posts: 1,272
vCash: 500
If they don't sign Kovalev they will sign someone else to fill thie role. If they can't sign someone else, there are half a dozen forwards in the system who are more NHL ready than Kostitsyn. He is pretty far down the list. I would bet that Hossa, Plekanec, Higgins, Milroy, Ferland, Thinel, Locke and Chipchura are more likely to play this year than Kostitsyn.

db23 is offline  
Old
08-03-2004, 11:30 PM
  #24
prevail
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jan 2004
Location: Montreal
Country: Canada
Posts: 1,852
vCash: 500
I say put him on Farm for about a yr like Komi

prevail is offline  
Old
08-03-2004, 11:46 PM
  #25
EaGLE1
Registered User
 
Join Date: Feb 2004
Location: Quebec City
Country: Canada
Posts: 3,442
vCash: 500
With all that happened with Kostsitsyn last year, i think he need a good year in Hamilton. Rushing him in NHL would be a bad idea IMO. No need to rush, we are not a terrible team, we'll make the playoffs...

EaGLE1 is offline  
Closed Thread

Forum Jump


Bookmarks

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off



All times are GMT -5. The time now is 01:04 AM.

monitoring_string = "e4251c93e2ba248d29da988d93bf5144"
Contact Us - HFBoards - Archive - Privacy Statement - Terms of Use - Advertise - Top - AdChoices

vBulletin Copyright ©2000 - 2015, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
HFBoards.com is a property of CraveOnline Media, LLC, an Evolve Media, LLC company. 2015 All Rights Reserved.