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Zherdev signs with KHL's Atlant Mytishchi (updated Aug 3)

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Old
07-25-2011, 09:55 PM
  #76
Inflict
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Honestly, if the Jets can sign him to a one or two year contract for around 1 mil. or less I say go for it. It never hurts to sign a player of Zherdev's caliber. Sure he never lived up to his potential but Winnipeg needs more offensive weapons in the forward position.

Many posters have already pointed out the past relationships he's had with Claude and I think it is a good fit.

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07-25-2011, 09:55 PM
  #77
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Originally Posted by Running Riot View Post
Claude Noel seems to be able to get the best out of Russian players.

As mentioned, Zherdev's best season (26 goals, 61 points) was under Noel when he was in Columbus.

Even last year, when Noel had Hodgson, Schroeder and Shirokov playing as rookies for the Moose, Hodgson and Schroeder only had ~30 points each while Shirokov lead the team with 22 goals and 58 points.
That was for two reasons...

1) We lost 300 man games due to injuries and call ups this past season which means the landscape from each line was changing on a weekly level. Sometimes even game-to-game. 2) Also, the fact that two of the three are rookies and the other was a sophomore. Also keep in mind Cody Hodgson was set back a year because he was hurt. He lost a year of development, which is very crucial for a guy at his age. The team's depth was depleted 20+ games in. There was a lot of factors that hindered their performance and the overall production of the team.

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07-25-2011, 10:00 PM
  #78
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Originally Posted by Inflict View Post
Honestly, if the Jets can sign him to a one or two year contract for around 1 mil. or less I say go for it. It never hurts to sign a player of Zherdev's caliber. Sure he never lived up to his potential but Winnipeg needs more offensive weapons in the forward position.

Many posters have already pointed out the past relationships he's had with Claude and I think it is a good fit.
I would love to sign him for that little, but there is no way I can see him signing a deal that would be worth less than Randy Jones. And in no way is that an insult to Jones, but Zherdev has way more value.

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07-25-2011, 10:16 PM
  #79
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Originally Posted by PensFan6687 View Post
That was for two reasons...

1) We lost 300 man games due to injuries and call ups this past season which means the landscape from each line was changing on a weekly level. Sometimes even game-to-game. 2) Also, the fact that two of the three are rookies and the other was a sophomore. Also keep in mind Cody Hodgson was set back a year because he was hurt. He lost a year of development, which is very crucial for a guy at his age. The team's depth was depleted 20+ games in. There was a lot of factors that hindered their performance and the overall production of the team.
I honestly think Scroder (I can't spell tonight) is a bust. You're right about Hodgson though. However, Noel did work with Shirokov and helped him increase his defensive game.

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07-26-2011, 01:51 AM
  #80
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sign zherdev to a 1 year 1.5 and keep him on a short leash we are weak on the right side

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07-26-2011, 01:54 AM
  #81
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Originally Posted by CanucksnWpg View Post
I honestly think Scroder (I can't spell tonight) is a bust. You're right about Hodgson though. However, Noel did work with Shirokov and helped him increase his defensive game.
Jordan Schroeder is a bust?! We're at that point already??? Hmmm, sounds pretty lame. I remember a few years back people calling Michael Grabner a bust because he didn't perform to people's expectations right away during his rookie season. Yet here he was a Calder finalist just this past year. 34 goals in 76 NHL games. Really?! Not saying Schroeder will follow suit, but it's just too early to throw that word around.

I remember people also calling Cory Schneider a bust, because he was, I admit it, slow to the pro game, and posted some rather lack luster numbers in his first 15-or-so games. Later on that same season, he would dominate. I said he would turn it around and he did. My bud Jaffray15 who posts on here will stand by my words. Like I stood behind those guys and said let father time dictate their worth. Patience. They'll come around. Not everyone explodes on the scene right away. Now look where both of them are. I have gamers of all 3 players, and I don't get gamers for players unless I believe in their game, because, well, it's expensive.

Or better yet, give a guy a few years to prove himself before calling him a bust. Calling out anyone as a bust over one year of pro hockey is premature and ignorant.

Edit: In fact anything Jaffray15 and I say has been archived on the Manitoba Moose forums.


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07-26-2011, 02:11 AM
  #82
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I don't believe in this Nikolay (with a y, oi!) Zherdev rumour simply because he's not a community guy, a character or team player. A guy that Chevy and Zinger have both expressed they want out of their player. It's not about flash to them. This whole rumor (is it rumour in Canada?) is silly because it simply goes against everything TNSE is trying to build here. The only sensible reason for getting him as the aforementioned posters have said, that he is cheap and he's good friends with Nikolai Antropov.

If we can get him at a bargain price he's a low risk, high reward player. But how often does someone have to say that about Nik Z before that sentiment becomes tired and old?

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07-26-2011, 02:16 AM
  #83
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Would definatly like to see him come here! IMO he could definatly be a 30+ goal scorer on the second line with Antropov and Kane.

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07-26-2011, 01:42 PM
  #84
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A one year deal can't hurt, low risk high reward.

If he starts showing out let him watch from the press box.

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07-26-2011, 01:45 PM
  #85
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On a 1-year, 2-way contract there'd be little risk. AHL maximum vs NHL minimum for $ amounts. Add in a team option for a 2nd year at a decent pay increase.

If he's really interested, this might work. If he's just fishing for one last payday, the KHL would give him more probably.

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07-26-2011, 01:49 PM
  #86
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Sweet avatar Thashers94. You put some work into that one.

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07-26-2011, 01:53 PM
  #87
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Originally Posted by JDz View Post
On a 1-year, 2-way contract there'd be little risk. AHL maximum vs NHL minimum for $ amounts. Add in a team option for a 2nd year at a decent pay increase.

If he's really interested, this might work. If he's just fishing for one last payday, the KHL would give him more probably.
I think his agent would hang up the phone immediately if he was offered a two-way.

If he gets an offer it will definately be a one-way. and definately over $1.5mil.

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07-26-2011, 02:49 PM
  #88
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Originally Posted by smitty10 View Post
I think his agent would hang up the phone immediately if he was offered a two-way.

If he gets an offer it will definately be a one-way. and definately over $1.5mil.
I'd give him one year, one way 2 mil contract with some bonuses for goals scored, games played, plus minus.

If he sucks, you cut bait. You might even get something for him at the deadline from a playoff team who wants some scoring depth.

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07-26-2011, 02:58 PM
  #89
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I'd also like to be the sort of team that is willing to give guys a chance, depending on the circumstances, of course. I'd never give Sean Avery a chance because I personally think he's a goof. Or i'd never want Alexei "I play when I want to" Kovalev on my team because I have no use for lazy. But in Zherdev's case, i'd like to give him a chance. I know he can be lazy and has his downfalls, but I think he can be worked with, I really do. I think Claude Noel and our coaching staff and management team could be a good fit for Zherdev. That sort of thing can go a long way in building a reputation with players and such.

Carolina is notorious for this. Picked Jussi Jokinen up when it appeared perhaps he wasn't cut out for the NHL, same goes for Sergei Samsonov when his NHL career appeared all but over, Joni Pitkanen is another who has blossomed in Carolina after poor endings in Philly and Edmonton, Tuomo Ruutu was given a grand opportunity and is now a damn good power forward, they brought Erik Cole back when he fell short in Edmonton, he now he's on his highest paid contract of his career in Montreal, Joe Corvo was a whipping boy in Ottawa but he really came around in Carolina as a solid top 4 defenceman, etc.

Sometimes, when a guy appears to be in a downward swirl in his career, if you can be the team that'll give him your hand, help him up and give him an opportunity, it can work out for both sides.

Of course it doesn't always work out, but i'm all for giving someone an opportunity if I feel they're worthy of one.

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07-26-2011, 03:17 PM
  #90
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Originally Posted by Guerzy View Post
I'd also like to be the sort of team that is willing to give guys a chance, depending on the circumstances, of course. I'd never give Sean Avery a chance because I personally think he's a goof. Or i'd never want Alexei "I play when I want to" Kovalev on my team because I have no use for lazy. But in Zherdev's case, i'd like to give him a chance. I know he can be lazy and has his downfalls, but I think he can be worked with, I really do. I think Claude Noel and our coaching staff and management team could be a good fit for Zherdev. That sort of thing can go a long way in building a reputation with players and such.

Carolina is notorious for this. Picked Jussi Jokinen up when it appeared perhaps he wasn't cut out for the NHL, same goes for Sergei Samsonov when his NHL career appeared all but over, Joni Pitkanen is another who has blossomed in Carolina after poor endings in Philly and Edmonton, Tuomo Ruutu was given a grand opportunity and is now a damn good power forward, they brought Erik Cole back when he fell short in Edmonton, he now he's on his highest paid contract of his career in Montreal, Joe Corvo was a whipping boy in Ottawa but he really came around in Carolina as a solid top 4 defenceman, etc.

Sometimes, when a guy appears to be in a downward swirl in his career, if you can be the team that'll give him your hand, help him up and give him an opportunity, it can work out for both sides.

Of course it doesn't always work out, but i'm all for giving someone an opportunity if I feel they're worthy of one.
also builds up a good reputation for the team, and makes players want to play in the peg.

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07-26-2011, 03:44 PM
  #91
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I'd give him one year, one way 2 mil contract with some bonuses for goals scored, games played, plus minus.

If he sucks, you cut bait. You might even get something for him at the deadline from a playoff team who wants some scoring depth.

Completely agree with this... There is no real downside to this.

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07-26-2011, 05:45 PM
  #92
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Would definatly like to see him come here! IMO he could definatly be a 30+ goal scorer on the second line with Antropov and Kane.
First he has to score 30 goals to be looked as a 30 goal scorer. Going with the thought process he hasn't done it yet, and with his lack of passion, consistency and commitment to the game, I doubt we'll ever see that happen. Be happy if he scores 20 goals again, and who knows if he's a NHLer 3 years from now.

Quote:
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I'd give him one year, one way 2 mil contract with some bonuses for goals scored, games played, plus minus.

If he sucks, you cut bait. You might even get something for him at the deadline from a playoff team who wants some scoring depth.
I would take him on at 1. something million. If that can get it done, then we're not meant to have him, and i can live with that. 2 million is even too much. I simply do not like this player. And I agree, have him earn his contract through bonuses. Say sure you can max out at some good money here, but you have to reach said goals. 2 million is too much if he gives us crap, which if he isn't producing offensively, he doesn't bring much to the table.

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07-27-2011, 02:27 AM
  #93
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We're aware of his alleged minuses. The plus is if we get him for a year at $1.75 million, we could take a run at a playoff spot this season WITHOUT GIVING AWAY A STARTER OR A DRAFT CHOICE. The free agent market isn't that great this summer. He's about as good as we're gonna get. If he's a bust (yes, it's possible), the Jets lost some money, but not another player (or draft choice) in exchange.

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07-27-2011, 03:04 AM
  #94
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If we get him at a good price then why not. Seems like theres 3 outcomes to this

1. he helps us get to the playoffs
2. he plays fairly well but we miss the playoffs - deal him at deadline get SOMETHING in return
3. hes a total bust but if we get him at a good price its not a major loss - maybe package him with someone at the deadline if were gonna miss the playoffs.

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07-27-2011, 06:59 AM
  #95
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If it's cheap, why not?

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07-27-2011, 09:52 AM
  #96
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I would sign Zherdov but only as a bottom six rather than a top six. He has talent but, as another poster said, "he gives 100% about 10% of the time", and I do not think it's completely related to how he was coached. His value has to be based on his overall performance not what he is capable of.

Zherdov is considered inconsistent but I am beginning to think he is very consistent in terms of his play ... a low goal scorer (not greater than 20) who needs to improve his defensive play (and according to some posts, in Philly, he was getting better defensively). I can live with 10% of realized 'potential' and 90% of low end play (or underachievement) for this year in exchange for 10 to 15 goals and hopefully, a low minus rating.

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07-27-2011, 10:25 AM
  #97
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Feel free to call me on this, but isn't Laviolette the kind of coach players seem to but heads with?? Not that I am making excuses for Zherdev, the guy should make the best of the sittuation regardless, but I could see him laking the motivation he needs.
Lavvy is a coach who expects players to play his system. Some guys really excel under his system (like Powe,Giroux,Briere and Cole), while others refuse to buy into the system and get sent packing. Players who excessively dangle but heads with Lavvy. Players like Giroux who dangle, but are still agressive on the forecheck and drive without the puck are given an increase in ice time.

Z will come with some issues, but is still IMO worth the risk. BTW if he is signed be ready for him to wow in camp and then drop off when the season starts. He is famous for that.

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07-27-2011, 10:25 AM
  #98
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I would sign Zherdov but only as a bottom six rather than a top six. He has talent but, as another poster said, "he gives 100% about 10% of the time", and I do not think it's completely related to how he was coached. His value has to be based on his overall performance not what he is capable of.

Zherdov is considered inconsistent but I am beginning to think he is very consistent in terms of his play ... a low goal scorer (not greater than 20) who needs to improve his defensive play (and according to some posts, in Philly, he was getting better defensively). I can live with 10% of realized 'potential' and 90% of low end play (or underachievement) for this year in exchange for 10 to 15 goals and hopefully, a low minus rating.
I don't disagree with what you are saying that he is "consistent in being inconsistent"; however, Zherdev last season only avg 12 mins of ice per game playing behind a stacked Flyers team, and only played in 58 games. If he could ever get 18 mins of ice and play 75-82 games, I think he's a 30 goal scorer and perhaps much more ... just my opinion though ... but I've been a big fan of Zherdev since the "young guns" game he was invited to while in Columbus. The guy is truly a top end puck handler (think Zhamnov, Datsuik, Hemsky, Patrick Kane) - you just can't teach that kind of skill. Will he ever live up to his potential? Nobody really knows; however, if your going to take a chance on someone, why not take a chance on a young guy who's dripping with high end skill?

You can teach a highly skilled player work ethic and defensive responsibility (although based on Zherdev's plus/minus stats, I'm not so sure the labels placed on him are even true) - but you can't teach a plumber to score.


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07-27-2011, 10:28 AM
  #99
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I would sign Zherdov but only as a bottom six rather than a top six. He has talent but, as another poster said, "he gives 100% about 10% of the time", and I do not think it's completely related to how he was coached. His value has to be based on his overall performance not what he is capable of.

Zherdov is considered inconsistent but I am beginning to think he is very consistent in terms of his play ... a low goal scorer (not greater than 20) who needs to improve his defensive play (and according to some posts, in Philly, he was getting better defensively). I can live with 10% of realized 'potential' and 90% of low end play (or underachievement) for this year in exchange for 10 to 15 goals and hopefully, a low minus rating.
It was me that posted that but IMO I'd never put him on a 3rd or 4th line. He needs to be on a scoring line to be productive. Just because he isn't a huge def liability doesn't mean he is a checker. He isn't a checker at all.

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07-27-2011, 10:29 AM
  #100
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If I Hear Claude Noel go to bat for him then Yes im totally down for it.

Claude is a players coach and could be perfect for Zherdev and if we get him for the right price and not give up anything there is no reason not too

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