Vick is not as good as Rivers or even Roethlisberger (god, is this guy underrated).
This is another case of Vick being overrated, he had a very good year last year but 12 good games is not enough for me to place him in an elite category.
Got you on the Roethlisberger is underrated part fully agree. I said yesterday I throw Roethlisberger in a different category of elite hes in that subcategory hes almost like in the Dave Anderychuk of no respect category (if you want to use hockey as a comparison) a guy who has over 600 goals, yet all you ever heard couldn't skate, slowed his linemates down, ect, ect.
In no way, am I saying Vick is elite, I still have the criteria that the player needs to win the big games. Vick is enigmatic to say the least, so I put him behind those guys because I think a guy who comes back like he did last season after a few years of not playing and doing what he did is outstanding. Really football has maybe 3-4 guys in the league that are elite. We don't need throw out the word before it doesn't mean anything.
I remember watching him play for Atlanta and, while he could dominate, his inconsistency was maddening. Simply put, he was one of the more inaccurate passers in the league. Heck, in his first go-around the league, his best completion percentage in a season was around 55%.
Seriously, 55% sucks. For the most part, if your QB isn't hitting 60% of his passes the rest of your team has to be pretty freaking amazing for your team to do well.
Last year, when he took over for Kolb and played lights out, I remember thinking "here we go again". One special game, then 3 or 4 games where he misfires, looks to scramble (which, granted, he was fantastic at) or makes boneheaded decisions.
Only last year he didn't. He really was one of the better passers in the league.
Still, at this point I'd put him behind Peyton Manning, Tom Brady, Philip Rivers, Aaron Rodgers and Drew Brees and roughly in the same category as Matt Ryan, Tony Romo, Ben Roethlisberger and (when he's protected) Eli Manning - Josh Freeman and Sam Bradford could join this group this year.
It'll be interesting to see this year if he can be as consistent as last year or if he reverts back to being inconsistent.
Excellent post,
For the record I will go on record I haven't seen enough of Rivers to have an opinion I miss many of the west coast teams games; (Oakland, Seattle, San Francisco, San Diego, Arizona)
I think Vick is a great QB. However last year his biggest games were against some of the worst defences. They lost to the Bears and Packers with Vick starting (playoff teams). The only other playoff team they beat were the Colts by 2 points. They did beat the Falcons but Kolb played that game. Some of his biggest yardage games were against the Jaguars, Redskins, and Texas.
He likely will be a top 5 I think but look at the quality of teams he did it against last year......
He beat the Giants twice as well and racked up 300 yards passing against the bears so I don't see how you can say he cant play against good defenses.
Who do you guys have as your division winners + wildcard?
Can we add a poll? I read an interesting one on the main board. Which 5 playoff teams from last year don't make it this year. Apparently the last 10 or 15 years there has been 5 teams not make it.
Can we add a poll? I read an interesting one on the main board. Which 5 playoff teams from last year don't make it this year. Apparently the last 10 or 15 years there has been 5 teams not make it.
Seahawks for one , Kansas City as well those are cliffhangers imo
Seahawks for one , Kansas City as well those are cliffhangers imo
Well the Seahawks actually got WAY better(except for at quarterback) so they actually might make the playoffs as opposed to every other team in their division who did nothing.
Well the Seahawks actually got WAY better(except for at quarterback) so they actually might make the playoffs as opposed to every other team in their division who did nothing.
EDIT: Oh yeah I forgot they got rid of Tatupu.
You have uncovered a huge bias. Love this Sam Bradford I felt he had a breakout last year (considering first year) hes gotta be the best QB in the division right now
New England
Indianapolis
Pittsburgh
San Diego
Baltimore
Jacksonville
Nfc
Green Bay
Philadelphia
New Orleans
St Louis
Chicago
Atlanta
Edit: Jacksonville gets the edge over Jets, based on besides the Colts within the division they won't get to beaten up plus if they don't **** the bed like last year right at the end there in in no problem.
Can we add a poll? I read an interesting one on the main board. Which 5 playoff teams from last year don't make it this year. Apparently the last 10 or 15 years there has been 5 teams not make it.
I'm not sure how we would be able to go about that.
It's like 15 options a poll, so half the teams would be out heh.
Any ideas?
Quote:
Originally Posted by BlowbyBlow
Seahawks for one , Kansas City as well those are cliffhangers imo
Seahawks
KC
Chicago
are locks in my opinion.
Another team that I have in mind is Indy if Manning's nerve damage is more severe than first thought. That and they haven't really made much improvement in other facets of the game.
Lastly, I think the Jets will miss due to a number of reasons.
Can we add a poll? I read an interesting one on the main board. Which 5 playoff teams from last year don't make it this year. Apparently the last 10 or 15 years there has been 5 teams not make it.
Is that an average? Or a crazy statistical anomaly?
I'll play.
I think the 5 teams that don't make it to the playoffs this year (that made it last year) will be... (drum roll)...
- Kansas City - tougher schedule, I think San Diego reclaims the AFC West and I think they miss Charlie Weis this year.
- Chicago Bears - Green Bay will win the division and Detroit will be tougher this year, the offensive line has titanic-sized holes and their defence is getting old.
- (My go out on a limb prediction) Philadelphia Eagles - With the exception of the 49ers and the Cowboys in the 90s, every other time I've seen a "free agent all-star team" (aka the Washington Redskins until Shanahan showed up ) it's blown up in the face of the team. Too many egos, too many new players that have to be integrated (especially with a short training camp) and they're in tough with the Cowboys and Giants. And both of those teams will be motivated to beat the Eagles.
- Seattle Seahawks - shouldn't have made it last year. Arizona and St. Louis should be harder to beat this year, and really, how much can you win with Tarvaris as your starter?
- (Out on a limb projection #2) New York Jets - too many teams are gunning for them, they're the second best team in the division (after the Pats), they had a lot of roster turnover, they have little to no pass rush and I'm not sure Mark "Dirty" Sanchez can lead this team to wins on his own.
Replacing the above 5 teams:
- San Diego Chargers - they have Jackson and Floyd back, their QB is elite, their defence is good and most of their top players are in their prime.
- St. Louis Rams - good coach, franchise QB in the making, easy schedule and a solid draft.
- Tennessee Titans (this is only valid if Chris Johnson doesn't hold out, if he does, change this projection to Jacksonville) - solid QB, good defence, easy schedule, and Chris Johnson.
- Dallas Cowboys - because they're my team and I still can't believe how badly they stunk up the joint last year.
- Tampa Bay Buccaneers - Josh Freeman, a young group of improving players, a middle of the road schedule (although they're in a tough division) and I still think if his knee checks out, Da'Quan Bowers will be a force on the pass rush.
Is that an average? Or a crazy statistical anomaly?
I'll play.
I think the 5 teams that don't make it to the playoffs this year (that made it last year) will be... (drum roll)...
- Kansas City - tougher schedule, I think San Diego reclaims the AFC West and I think they miss Charlie Weis this year.
- Chicago Bears - Green Bay will win the division and Detroit will be tougher this year, the offensive line has titanic-sized holes and their defence is getting old.
- (My go out on a limb prediction) Philadelphia Eagles - With the exception of the 49ers and the Cowboys in the 90s, every other time I've seen a "free agent all-star team" (aka the Washington Redskins until Shanahan showed up ) it's blown up in the face of the team. Too many egos, too many new players that have to be integrated (especially with a short training camp) and they're in tough with the Cowboys and Giants. And both of those teams will be motivated to beat the Eagles.
- Seattle Seahawks - shouldn't have made it last year. Arizona and St. Louis should be harder to beat this year, and really, how much can you win with Tarvaris as your starter?
- (Out on a limb projection #2) New York Jets - too many teams are gunning for them, they're the second best team in the division (after the Pats), they had a lot of roster turnover, they have little to no pass rush and I'm not sure Mark "Dirty" Sanchez can lead this team to wins on his own.
Replacing the above 5 teams:
- San Diego Chargers - they have Jackson and Floyd back, their QB is elite, their defence is good and most of their top players are in their prime.
- St. Louis Rams - good coach, franchise QB in the making, easy schedule and a solid draft.
- Tennessee Titans (this is only valid if Chris Johnson doesn't hold out, if he does, change this projection to Jacksonville) - solid QB, good defence, easy schedule, and Chris Johnson.
- Dallas Cowboys - because they're my team and I still can't believe how badly they stunk up the joint last year.
- Tampa Bay Buccaneers - Josh Freeman, a young group of improving players, a middle of the road schedule (although they're in a tough division) and I still think if his knee checks out, Da'Quan Bowers will be a force on the pass rush.
Love when a guy explains his choices I like the San Diego & St. Louis picks, both very underrated not being picked
Michael Turner seems to be slowing down, and on a team who is so dependent on their RB to set up their offense, and on a team ranked 31st in the NFL in plays over 20 yards, a declining Turner could lead to trouble.
Add in Tony G being on his last toes, and Matt Ryan's troubles with accuracy post 20 yards, It'll be interesting to see how their offense copes.
He beat the Giants twice as well and racked up 300 yards passing against the bears so I don't see how you can say he cant play against good defenses.
Also the ravens got Lee Evans.
Jackson beat the Giants one game. And yeah they beat the Giants twice, but they werent a playoff team and not nearly as good as the were in previous years last years.
I said hes good, and he can play. But the majority of his games last year were against weaker teams. And his huge performances (mainly his MNF vs the Redskins that had everyone ******** their pants over) were against some of the worst secondaries/defences.
Michael Turner seems to be slowing down, and on a team who is so dependent on their RB to set up their offense, and on a team ranked 31st in the NFL in plays over 20 yards, a declining Turner could lead to trouble.
Add in Tony G being on his last toes, and Matt Ryan's troubles with accuracy post 20 yards, It'll be interesting to see how their offense copes.
Well, Turner is definitely getting into the age range where guys tend to really fall off, but I'm not sure we have seen signs of him slowing down as of yet. He was still top 3 in rushing yards and put up double digit TD's, so I think he will be alright this year. That being said, their window to win with him and Tony G is very small.
The benefit Turner has is he really can't catch the ball very well, so he gets a TON of carries on 1st and 2nd downs and then gets nearly every 3rd down off, so that will help him stay fresh throughout the year.
Their offense is definitely built for shorter gains, but with Ryan, RW, and Julio Jones as part of the core, it really is their best bet. Jones and White are both physical receviers with size, so they don't really have tons of deep threats, other than the few spots those guys run deep routes.
Well, Turner is definitely getting into the age range where guys tend to really fall off, but I'm not sure we have seen signs of him slowing down as of yet. He was still top 3 in rushing yards and put up double digit TD's, so I think he will be alright this year. That being said, their window to win with him and Tony G is very small.
The benefit Turner has is he really can't catch the ball very well, so he gets a TON of carries on 1st and 2nd downs and then gets nearly every 3rd down off, so that will help him stay fresh throughout the year.
Their offense is definitely built for shorter gains, but with Ryan, RW, and Julio Jones as part of the core, it really is their best bet. Jones and White are both physical receviers with size, so they don't really have tons of deep threats, other than the few spots those guys run deep routes.
The problem with Turner is his play really went down towards the end of the season.
IIRC, in the last 5 games of the regular season he faced mediocre run D's and posted a 3.58 yds/carry. You also have to factor in he had the most rushing attempts in the NFL. His 21 carries/game were second only to MJD in the NFL. He's definitely money in red zone situations, so those TDs are legit, but he definitely sets up your offense like you said, in the 1st two downs.
If his play from the latter part of last season keeps deteriorating, it could be trouble for an offense which in the past hasn't had much success over 20 yards, and depended heavily on the run to set it up.
Football outsiders (NFL's version of behindthenet) ranked Turner as the 16th most effective RB with atleast 100 carries for the past 2 seasons, down from I think top-5 3 seasons ago. If the end of the season is any indication, that should go down more.
If he can't churn out the yards he did in the past for the Falcons, and Ryan can't improve on his accuracy on throws past 20 yards, It really limits to how effective their offense can be overall.
Mr. Push off and Julio Jones is a damn good WR duo, but you have to question how good it can be without Turner churning out those yards on 1st and 2nd down, and Ryan not being very accurate on a throw over 20 yards. I mean ranking 31st in plays over 20 yards is pretty bad you have to admit.
<-- Credit goes to The Nemesis.
, Kansas City as well those are cliffhangers imo
